Its_A_Random
A distant memory
This thread will be moderated to keep discussion focused.
Near-Universal Moves
Basically, there apparently is a common belief that outside of UC spamming, most Pokémon in general take "too many matches" in order to become good, assuming the Pokémon was fresh. Usually, it can take a good 5-6 battles on average from my count to get some 3-Stage Pokémon from fresh to fully evolved with DW Ability Unlocked, & by then it is not uncommon to see such Pokémon only have a movepool count to be roughly 9-10 more moves on average than what it had fresh. One of these factors mainly comes down to the fact that you can usually only have enough MC to buy 1-4 moves a battle with each of your Pokémon, & then you have the choice of either buying important attacking/non-attacking moves to boost your fire-power, or invest in staples such as Protect, Substitute, etc. to give your Pokémon some sort of defence & the ability to screw up plays. This is a dilemma that needlessly contributes to slow development, & not everyone has the UC, or wants to ref battles, just to accelerate development.
Deck Knight came in during the first of the many counter-farming debates on #capasb, & was more struck by this argument about Pokémon taking too many matches to become good. He drafted up a solution to this problem:
There were mixed views on this proposal, but if there was anything that would be agreed on, that was that this proposal needed a discussion. That is why we are here — To discuss this proposal as to whether this is a good idea or not, any alternatives, any improvements, etc.I was more struck by the argument that it takes mons far too many matches to be good. I was talking in IRC and came up with a solution to that, so that new players can jump in with at least some semblance of a tool box. When I think of "good" or "battle-ready" Pokemon, I think of Pokemon that have the proper defensive skillset to evade or mitigate incoming attacks that have at least a few options against if put to Sleep or Disabled.
Basically the proposal is to add a portion of the "always available" BW TMs and Tutors to the starting moveset of each Pokemon (provided they learn the attacks). This list would consist of the following:
Near-Universal BW TMs:
Double Team
Frustration
Protect
Return
Round
Substitute
Near-Universal BW Tutors:
Sleep Talk
Snore
For reference the following moves have been excluded:
Facade: Extremely easy to abuse for several Pokemon.
Hidden Power: The idea behind this proposal is to give a basic skeleton of fallback attacks. Hidden Power is an integral coverage move and would bias towards special attackers a great deal.
Rest: Combined with Sleep Talk on every Pokemon would prolong a great deal of matches. You can certainly use Rest as a starting selected TM for the combo.
Swagger: While a minor status, it is also sufficiently powerful and disruptive.
Toxic: Major status, very powerful.
Attached to this I might also change the Rarity Cost of anything that doesn't get these TMs/Tutors from two (2) to one (1) to compensate, and also increase the power of Sleep because pretty much every Pokemon will be able to attack during it to some extent, but those are not yet resolved, I want feedback on this.
Discussion should focus on the following questions:
- Would the idea of giving Pokémon near-universal moves for free be a good idea?
- Could this proposal be improved? How?
- What moves should or should not be given away for free & why?
- Is there a better way to help accelerate development other than this idea?
- Any other issues in a similar vein to this proposal that can be raised?
At any rate, keep on topic & keep discussion civil. Otherwise, time to discuss this proposal.