New and 'creative' moveset/EV spread thread Mk. 5

[Chillarmy]

In my most recent RMT, I posted a somewhat new LeadTran set. This one utilizes Heatran's bulkier side, great offensive prowess, decent typing and decent movepool. I decided to post this one since it's doing quite well on my upcoming, "Dresses are better than Bells" team.
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Heatran (M) @ Lum Berry
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP/20 Spd/236 SAtk
Modest nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Magma Storm
- Earth Power / Explosion
- Stealth Rock
- Will-o-wisp
---

Heatran is a great Pokemon to lead off the game, we all know that; however, this set allows Heatran to KO an even wider variety of leads without much effort. Magma Storm beats most Focus Sash leads, namely Roserade and Smeargle, that make an attempt to setup on Heatran. Though the 70% accuracy is a bit off putting, it pays off when the opposing lead can't harm Heatran, or setup its entry hazard. If the accuracy is too much of a problem, Fire Blast is a great alternative if you have a trapper that can revenge the opposing lead - Flamethrower can be used as well if you're really paranoid about a miss, but the drop on power usually isn't work it.

Earth Power is one of Heatran's bread-and-butter moves, as it covers a lot of what its Fire STAB can't hit. Explosion on the other hand works nicely with Magma Storm if something along the lines of Blissey decides to switch in to sponge Heatran's attacks. Explosion also helps ease the prediction when switching another Pokemon in. Will-o-Wisp is another great move on Heatran, allowing it to cripple powerhouses such as Swampert, Hippowdon, Tyranitar, and Kingdra for the rest of the game. Toxic is a decent option if you don't fear Heatran getting beaten by Earthquakes from opposing leads.

The EVs allow Heatran to survive a decent amount of attacks, namely Superpowers from Jolly Breloom, and Adamant (unboosted) Scizor. Heatran outplaces LeadGross with 20 EVs in Speed, as well as any Tyranitar, Scizor, or Breloom that doesn't invest much in Speed. The can be raised to Speed EVs to 136 in order to outspeed Adamant Tyranitar, and the "Standard" Swords Dance Scizor spread, though the loss in bulk gives Life Orb Gengar a decent chance (44% as opposed to 0%) of OHKOing Heatran from full health (an uncommon lead, but a common revenge killer). Honestly, I haven't found much use for the extra Speed since I run Scizor and Magnezone as revenge killers for both Tyranitar and Scizor respectively.

If anyone decides to use this Heatran, it's recommended that you pair it with Tyranitar, as it can remove most of what tries to revenge Heatran from play, or setup on it; however, Heatran and Tyranitar share a Fighting and Ground weakness. For this reason, Gyarados and Celebi are great partners for Heatran - Celebi and Heatran can for the [defensive] CeleTran combo while Gyarados can setup a Dragon Dance or two on what kills off Heatran. Zapdos can also become a problem since Heatran lacks Leftovers recovery, which makes Flygon and Dragonite great options due to the drop in usage of Hidden Power Ice on Zapdos (the latter can handle Hidden Power Ice variants with ease thanks to Light Screen, Roost and Specially defensive side). With Metagross leads, you'll almost always have to worry about Explosion decimating your switch in. Bronzong actually does a nice job at sponging hits directed at Heatran. Dual Screen Bronzong can help setup another sweeper, and it can setup on most of what Heatran can't handle.
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[Stagnant]

Zoom Lens might be a option for that heatran as it boosts his Accuarcy by 20%.

 

[Chillarmy]

Zoom Lens hasn't been implemented into Shoddy last time I checked.

 

[wildfire393]

I actually ran a very similar Heatran as my lead for the longest time, it worked very well when there were a lot of Sash Azelf around. These days, you're more likely to see ShucaTran and Metagross, both of which this doesn't do amazingly well against. By the way, the item I used was Wide Lens, but Lum Berry makes sense since the common Sashers these days are sleep leads.

 

[cim]

Are those Heatran EVs optimized, or did you just dump Max HP and decide it was adequate defensively? Are the Special Attack EVs set to get KOs?

How often does the set not accomplish anything? I say that because Magma Storm has this awful tendency to not hit twice in a row or anything, and leading with a trap move is probably not the best idea (you're trapping your counter...)

 

[Kachalski]

I am also woundering on how this Heatran was decided on that. It does look quite interesting though.

 

[Chillarmy]

Are those Heatran EVs optimized, or did you just dump Max HP and decide it was adequate defensively? Are the Special Attack EVs set to get KOs?

In all honesty, I forgot why I even invested that much into Special Attack. Though, I'm pretty sure that I assumed that Heatran was "bulky enough", and it would enjoy the extra power for Magma Storm.

How often does the set not accomplish anything? I say that because Magma Storm has this awful tendency to not hit twice in a row or anything,

It's not meant to hits twice in a row on Focus Sash leads. The damage from Magma Storm kills them on the same turn. What Magma Storm has to hit twice against to KO is usually outsped and crippled by Will-o-Wisp.

and leading with a trap move is probably not the best idea (you're trapping your counter...)

Since Heatran calls out for Latias, and Blissey to switch in, Explosion is an already mentioned option.

 

[broodjekebab]

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP/248 Def/8 SDef
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt
- Icy Wind
- Wish

This is a CMJirachi I really like. I don't know if it's been thought of before, or even deemed crappy. I thought it up during early DP, when Garchomp was running rampant. It focuses on physical defense, boosts its special defense slowly with CM while restoring hp with Wish. The odd but effective move is Icy Wind, which especially raped Garchomp switchins. Salamence isn't as likely to switch in on Jirachi, but it might be locked into outrage or something similar. Icy Wind is useful in general for slowing down faster pokemon that want to kill Jirachi, but can't take a hit from it after some CMs. Thunderbolt provides awesome coverage in combination with Icy Wind.

 

[Chillarmy]

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP/248 Def/8 SDef
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt
- Icy Wind
- Wish

This is a CMJirachi I really like. I don't know if it's been thought of before, or even deemed crappy. I thought it up during early DP, when Garchomp was running rampant. It focuses on physical defense, boosts its special defense slowly with CM while restoring hp with Wish. The odd but effective move is Icy Wind, which especially raped Garchomp switchins. Salamence isn't as likely to switch in on Jirachi, but it might be locked into outrage or something similar. Icy Wind is useful in general for slowing down faster pokemon that want to kill Jirachi, but can't take a hit from it after some CMs. Thunderbolt provides awesome coverage in combination with Icy Wind.

This set falls victim to Magnezone and Tyranitar. Flash Cannon and Thunderbolt gave much better coverage on the Calm Mind set; without STAB, Jirachi will fail to beat a good amount of Pokemon 1 on 1. I also don't see the point in investing that much into Defense since the Pokemon that Jirachi will be taking hits better from are already beaten by the Sub-Calm Mind set (That, or they still beat Jirachi).

If you want a Calm Mind user that's more Defense oriented, try Suicune and Latias out. Suicune is bulky enough to take hits from Pokemon like Gyarados and Metagross while Latias has Reflect and a great base 110 Speed.

FYI- when your opponent sees Leftovers recovery, it's safe to assume that Jirachi is running Calm Mind. In that case, any Pokemon that doesn't fall to Flash Cannon, or Thunderbolt will be switching in to beat it. This includes Salamence, Dragonite, Magnezone, Lanturn (lol), Jolteon, Kingdra, Latias, and Heatran.

 

[panamaxis]

Calm Mind wish Jirachi's beat magnezone, I might consider using that in suspect where garchomp is present but otherwise I'd probably rather use psychic.

 

[Neblim]

Generaly this set is known as my signiture pkmn, im tired of standard so i thought id show it off.


Smeargle@ Own Tempo
jolly@choice scarf
252speed, 252 attack, 4def
-Spore
trick
stealth rock/ transform
Explosion


Dont let the EV spread fool you into thinking this doesnt have an art (pun not intended) behind the method.

It begins as a lead, sporing anything without a lumberry (which metagross has traded for his resistance berries)

As it switches out it still has full health, Now the beauty sets in, with a scarf he outruns everything with unboosted speed. this allows him to cripple walls with trick, set up a hasty SR, spectacularly revenge kill with explosion (calcs are included)

ive only needed to use trnsform once and it worked for just the purpose i needed, i assumed i would set up SR at some other stage during the match and so i discounted it, spikes and toxic spikes included as this set began on my first attempt at semi stall, Transform was chosen as i thought that paired with choice scarf i could revengekill anything that would not lose to explosion by transforming on thier STABed yet mostly resisted attack and KOed with whatever was in thier arsenal. It saved me the one time i needed it, but that is the only drive for posting it as an option.

Heres my calcs

Damage Results
Min: Avg: Max:
Raw damage: 228 246 268
Percentages: 56.44% 60.89% 66.34%

139 Atk vs 164 Def & 404 HP (250 Base Power): 228 - 268 (56.44% - 66.34%)

From a max attack smeargle with jolly against max hp + max def celebi
as explosion drops the defence by half, my sig lead smeargle can actualy be used to scarf revengekill with the best of them


now against non EVed hp and def, as celebi has naturaly exceeding average stats at a smooth 100 total apiece, this gives off a good example

Damage Results
Min: Avg: Max:
Raw damage: 316 343 373
Percentages: 92.67% 100.59% 109.38%

OHKO odds
Normal: Leftovers: Sandstorm Stealth Rock Stealth Rock+ Leftovers
OHKO: 53.85% 53.85% 92.31% 100.00% 100.00%

 

[Age of Kings]

Explosion's effectiveness on Smeargle has been known for quite some time now, and according to the stats 8.3% of them used Explosion last month. It's a standard, effective set.

 

[knobfire]

Shiftry @ Focus Sash
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SpAtk)
- Swords Dance/Sunny Day/Subsititute
- Seed Bomb
- Sucker Punch
- Explosion

Right so I've actually tried this set, it was awesome in the battle tower and on PBR and it completely annihalated anything in it's path. this shiftry is a force to be reckoned with. However i feel this set lacks something special (no pun intended), if you guys have any suggestions, be my guest!

 

[Yehom]

Azelf @ Life Orb/Expert Belt
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 4 HP/252 SAtk/252 Spe
Timed nature (+Spe, -Atk)
- Grass Knot
- Flamethrower/Fire Blast
- Thunderbolt
- Shadow Ball

This is a set that I created as a anti-lead Pokemon, packing attacks to counter the most common leads. I have used a Life Orb to garantee a OHKO, but an Expert Belt is also a good option, since Life Orb recoil can slowy put Azelf in KO range for priorty users/scarfed Pokemon.

Well the concept is rather simple: score a KO against the most common OU leads. Grass Knot is for Swampert leads, who never have a Focus Sash and therefore will be KO'ed by Azelf. Flamethrower is for Metagross leads, although most of them carrie a Occa Berry with means that Flamethrower is a 2HKO, and the popular Roserade leads. Fire Blast is also an option, but this is the power vs accurracy discussion. Thunderbolt gets rid of Aerodactyl leads, although most of them carrie a Focus Sash. Most Aerodactyl do Taunt Azelf, so they mostly go down without touching Azelf. Finally Shadow Ball is for opposing Azelf leads. Again most of these Azelfs have a Focus Sash, but mostly they either Taunt or set up Stealth Rocks, which means they mostly go down without harming Azelf to much.

 

[haunter]

If you give up taunt and SR, then there's no point in using Azelf over Starmie, as the latter works as a way better anti-lead thanks to rapid spin and the ability to beat Metagross and Heatran 1 vs 1.

 

[Yehom]

If you give up taunt and SR, then there's no point in using Azelf over Starmie, as the latter works as a way better anti-lead thanks to rapid spin and the ability to beat Metagross and Heatran 1 vs 1.

You know, most player expected that Azelf will set up Stealth Rocks and therefore will try to do the same. This Azelf set has an element of suprise to it. Metagross is 2HKO'ed by Flamethrower, calculating the Occa Berry. The only real problem is Heatran, which I haven't seen as a lead in quite a while

 

[blasphemy1]

You know, most player expected that Azelf will set up Stealth Rocks and therefore will try to do the same. This Azelf set has an element of suprise to it. Metagross is 2HKO'ed by Flamethrower, calculating the Occa Berry. The only real problem is Heatran, which I haven't seen as a lead in quite a while

Even Infernape beats him. I agree, I'd rather use Starmie > Azelf, as it has Rapid Spin and STAB water to work with.

 

[haunter]

You know, most player expected that Azelf will set up Stealth Rocks and therefore will try to do the same. This Azelf set has an element of suprise to it. Metagross is 2HKO'ed by Flamethrower, calculating the Occa Berry. The only real problem is Heatran, which I haven't seen as a lead in quite a while

Metagross will almost always meteor mash on the first turn, expecting taunt, and will finish you off with bullet punch. And the point stands: why would you use that Azelf over Starmie?

 

[boredomisbliss]

i have already used a very similar set to that one:

Azelf@Expert Belt
Levitate
140 HP/116 SpA/252 Spe
Naive Nature
Flamethrower
Grass Knot
Taunt
U-turn

other options include explosion and HP ice/ground
there are only enough special attack EVs to guarantee ohko on pert 100% of the time with expert belt

 

[Bribery]

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP/248 Def/8 SDef
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt
- Icy Wind
- Wish

This is a CMJirachi I really like. I don't know if it's been thought of before, or even deemed crappy. I thought it up during early DP, when Garchomp was running rampant. It focuses on physical defense, boosts its special defense slowly with CM while restoring hp with Wish. The odd but effective move is Icy Wind, which especially raped Garchomp switchins. Salamence isn't as likely to switch in on Jirachi, but it might be locked into outrage or something similar. Icy Wind is useful in general for slowing down faster pokemon that want to kill Jirachi, but can't take a hit from it after some CMs. Thunderbolt provides awesome coverage in combination with Icy Wind.

I would probably use this if Garchomp comes back to OU. Otherwise, I think Psychic or Flash Cannon are better options.

 

[Sei]

lead/utility smeargle sees no love? =(

What other sort of utility are you thinking about? The analysis covered the Spiker/Stealth Rocker Lead, and the Anti-Lead with Scarf Trick. Besides the lead position, there are the Baton Passer sets.

Please elaborate what other mean of "utility" are you trying to refer to.

 

[Neblim]

Well by utility i meant that he is capable of dishing out other forms of crippling, maybe that would have worked better. I mean because of the variety of his moves, he can revenge kill/ remove pretty much any threat that doesnt have a speed boost

 

[Sei]

Well by utility i meant that he is capable of dishing out other forms of crippling, maybe that would have worked better. I mean because of the variety of his moves, he can revenge kill/ remove pretty much any threat that doesnt have a speed boost

Status utility sounds possible, but his defensive stats are simply too low to allow him the use of any other status outside of Spore. And as a revenge killer, Smeargle is simply too unfit for such a job. His offensive stats are almost as low as a Shuckle's.

I'm not sure if there would be any other such utility role that Smeargle can fulfill due to his mediocre stats, with exception of speed. The reason you're only seeing Spore as being the only option for status is b/c he truly need the 100% accuracy of sleep inducing on the opponent, or else he's good as being a dead weight on the team.

 

[Neblim]

Did you look at the set I listed on the prevous page?

What im mentioning is, how effective he can be with his speed to revenge (Explosion, calcs are already listeds with my OP, Transform can situationly be used to also accomplish this),
cripple (Trick, walls in particular and set-upers)
and immobilize (spore)

 

[Sei]

Did you look at the set I listed on the prevous page?

Ah, so it's way up in the page 5. Why didn't you say so earlier. My apology for such a confusion.

That original set there is fairly creative. I believe that set's usage is very viable. The less people know about it, the more effective it'll be. I think there was already someone who has appreciated your set on the very same page, just below your post.