No Guard Galaxy

[I like donkeys]

Whimsicott is definitely a viable mon but i haven't actually seen any importable sample sets for newer players, so I guess i'll post some here. (Feel free to correct these if i made a silly mistake).

the sets cuz

[Utility]
Whimsicott @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Encore
- Grass Whistle
- Moonblast/Hurricane
- U-turn / Stun Spore

This is probably the better set.
Encore is to check setup sweepers even after something else has been put to sleep. Grass Whistle - you all know the drill. Moonblast or Hurricane are your offensive options. Moonblast is probably the better option because it lets you better handle threats like Keldeo, Garchomp, Lopunny, Landog-T, TTar, Mega Ampharos (to an extent), and deal decent chip damage to many switch-ins. But Hurricane is a decent option if you hate grass types and the 30% confusion chance can come in handy. The last slot is basically filler but still useful. U-turn provides momentum for yo team which is incredibly handy for offense, and stun spore allows Whimsi to cripple fast threats which is, again, incredibly handy for offense. You could also throw taunt in there to block opposing sleep and other status moves.

[SubSeed]
Whimsicott @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 Def / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
Bold / Calm Nature
IVs: 0 HP
- Grass Whistle
- Leech Seed
- Substitute
- Protect / Encore / Toxic / U-turn / Moonblast / Taunt / filler

The EVs are quite fruity so let me explain. In standard it was important that Whimsicott have as much bulk as possible, but in NGG setting up SubSeed is much safer thanks to Whimsicott's access to grass whistle. You see, when a Pokemon has lower HP stat it recovers proportionately more HP from leech seed than a Pokemon with a higher HP stat. This reduces or eradicates the passive damage Whimsicott suffers from continually using Substitute. Whimsicott's bulk still allow it to switch into threats like Keldeo with relative safety.

 

[Manchamp]

Although I do agree with most of what you said, I'd like to stop you at Durant. That core does seem good on paper, but it straight up loses to LO and rock polish sets. For example check out these calcs.

252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Stone Edge vs. 248 HP / 64 Def Zapdos: 398-471 (103.9 - 122.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
Zapdos gets trashed by stone edge, oh no better switch in my Slowbro to take the hit...

252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Slowbro: 129-152 (32.7 - 38.5%) -- 3.9% chance to 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Slowbro: 307-367 (77.9 - 93.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
Even after leftovers recovery, X-Scissor a guaranteed OHKO after stone edge.

And don't even get me started on the rock polish sets...

252+ Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Slowbro: 338-400 (85.7 - 101.5%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
Geez settle down Durant :o

I think Durant is fine in S rank. It can perform a variety of roles extremely well (LO, scarf, RP) and thus is a dominating force in NGG.

That's a fine point about that the Life orb set, I guess I had ignored it because everyone seemed to be talking about its scarf set and that's all I've seen in battling. You've changed me, Mr Donkey, I agree with promoting Durant to S :)

 

[Ghoul King]

Durant

I've been running Physically Defensive Mega Scizor, personally.

252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Scizor: 161-191 (46.8 - 55.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

And then I Mega Evolve and Roost.

252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant Superpower vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Scizor: 129-152 (37.5 - 44.1%) -- 1.2% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock

In actuality, they'll be hitting with Stone Edge, which is weaker than the above numbers. If Scizor is at full health, Durant has to be Banded, predict it correctly, and have Stealth Rock up to successfully 2HKO it on the switchin. Durant has no Fire moves, so this is as good as it gets, because Scizor resists both of its STABs.

Life Orb Durant running Rock Smash can break through it with some luck, but it takes a hit to its ability to deal with other stuff.

I've found Durant to usually be a liability for my opponents, honestly. I've struggled a lot more to deal with newly powerful Physical Dragons like Dragonite and Tyrantrum.

Mega Medicham needs to at least be ranked in A-, maybe even A. High Jump Kick not missing any more really helps it, and also Zen Headbutt too. One of the best balance breakers in the meta, and has nice Bullet Punch for Whimsicott. Needs to at least be ranked imo.

I'm not sure why you consider Bullet Punch relevant against Whimsicott. With its Speed and Prankster access, it's not going to let you Bullet Punch it before it puts you to Sleep or puts up a Substitute or whatever.

Might not be broken but still very metagame defining, sleep is the meta. Whimsicott is also unpredictable, you're not even sure it'll be running Prankster. And come on, Whimsicott isn't walled by anything, you can tweak it moveset to virtually handle anything. Moonblast, Hurricane, Giga drain, Encore, Taunt, U-turn, Leech seed, Substitute combined with Grass whistle with tons of item options; Life orb, Leech seed, Lum ect should ensure that nothing wants to really switch in. Tbh I still want a suspect test, but not a quickban. Even if it's nothing new, it's still really restricting too teambuilding.

It's walled by literally any Steel type. Thanks to Whimsicott's sub-par Special Attack, they don't even need decent Special Defense.

252 SpA Life Orb Whimsicott Hurricane vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Scizor: 110-131 (31.9 - 38%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Whimsicott Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Skarmory: 95-113 (28.4 - 33.8%) -- 97.9% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock

252 SpA Life Orb Whimsicott Hurricane vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Heatran: 52-62 (13.4 - 16%) -- possible 9HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery

This is max investment with fucking Life Orb which no one is going to run in NGG, and the damage is still godawful against generic bulky Steel choices. If for some godawful reason you're running Hidden Power Ground, Skarmory and Scizor still ignore you, while if you're running Hidden Power Fire Heatran appreciates the boost, and if you're running that kind of coverage exactly how much room do you have left on your moveset to do the things Whimsicott is actually halfway competent at?

"You can tweak its moveset to handle virtually anything" is blatantly false.

This bit here

Might not be broken but still very metagame defining, sleep is the meta.

doesn't even logically follow. Sleep-inducing is "the meta", so a specific Sleep inducer is metagame defining? No, that means anti-Sleep measures are rising up in relevance. In fact, the ability to run a wide array of other Sleep inducers whom are, again, actually threatening in their own right, reduces the relevance of Whimsicott.

Also, since when is Leech Seed an item?

I'd nominate Tyrantrum to B-. I've been using it to moderate success on the ladder. An unboosted Head Smash hits harder than Life Orb Durant's STABs:

252 Atk Tyrantrum Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Mega Venusaur: 147-174 (40.3 - 47.8%)

252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Durant X-Scissor vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Mega Venusaur: 142-168 (39 - 46.1%)

With a Dragon Dance or Choice Scarf, it outspeeds and OHKOs a huge number of things. It is certainly held back by its lack of special Bulk and weakness to priority, but with proper team support in the form of Light Screen, Webs, or Tail Wind, the payout is phenomenal.

I completely agree with Tyrantrum deserving a decent rank. Given a chance to setup, it basically demands the right kind of priority or Quagsire, and it's not that hard for it to get that chance thanks to its nifty typing. it just hits incredibly hard, so much so that it's not all that much of a problem that its coverage moves are weak.

 

[Jaguar360]

Noms:
Porygon2 unranked to B - P2 is so godly with accurate Zap Cannon, Blizzard and Toxic. It checks a good portion of the metagame (notably Flash Fire Chandy, Mega Alt, Starmie, T-tar, etc) and just having that powerful coverage is so helpful for it, with Zap Cannon allowing it to run Toxic freely since it no longer competes for Thunder Wave. It's vulnerability to status and weakness to a lot of the threats at the very top keep it from the A ranks, but it should definitely be ranked somewhere in the B ranks.
Magmortar from C to B - I agree with xJownage on this one. It's probably the best Whimsicott counter and it does a great job at fulfilling the roles of Chandelure/Zard Y check, Sun check, (Mega) Venusaur check, Scizor check, etc. It has good versatility too. I've only used AV so far, but Scarf and Specs/LO/EB seem good. It should move up for sure...C rank does not suit it well.

Lucario unranked to C+ - Having perfectly accurate HJK is a pretty big deal for it and its newly accurate Iron Tail and Stone Edge provide good coverage for it (Stone Edge is good in this meta with Chandelure and Zapdos running rampant). It also has the freedom to feasibly run Focus Blast on its Special set now too. Extreme Speed is also a huge niche and Dragonite is the only ranked mon that shares that currently. Its frailty and vulnerability to status cripple it though and make C or C+ more appropriate than B or something.

Durant A+ to S - I think S is appropriate for it. The Life Orb set's damage output is really good and has nearly no counters. Scarf gives offense more trouble while still packing a punch. It doesn't really have any defensive synergy, but its offense presence is outstanding enough to make it S rank imo.

 

[MK]

I'd like to nominate Mega Houndoom for somewhere in the B ranks.

It's the center of my team, and I love it. It's super high Special Attack allows it to fire off high-powered Infernos (which we all love). I use Dark Pulse / Inferno / Destiny Bond / Protect, Dark Pulse is for coverage and Fire resists, Destiny Bond can get surprise KOs against mons like Tyranitar, non-Scarf Keldeo, etc. Protect allows me to Mega Evolve safely and scout for moves (also stalls Perish Song turns!). I'll elaborate more later.

 

[Ghoul King]

I'm starting to feel like Charizardite X might need a suspect.

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 192-226 (48.7 - 57.3%) -- 47.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 252-297 (64.1 - 75.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

If you're not running Unaware, there's no good switch-in on Mega Charizard X. If you are running Unaware, there's still no good switch-in on Mega Charizard X. (In addition to the nearly 2HKO chance against Quagsire, it has a 30% chance per hit to Flinch Quagsire: Quagsire cannot stall it out, and Mega Charizard X can tank an uninvested Earthquake and has no fear of Scald, so Quagsire is just all-around screwed) It's too bulky to be reliably revenged with priority, especially since it's not weak to any priority moves and even resists Bullet Punch, and it can either run Roost for longevity or Earthquake to beat Heatran, which otherwise is an acceptable check, though far from perfect even then.

+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 170-201 (44.1 - 52.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Revenging it with a Scarf demands that your Scarf is 100+ base Speed itself, and further demands it's actually competent at fighting Mega Charizard X. (I'm running Scarf Mismagius, for instance, and the best it can do is hope to Paralyze X with Thunder)

As if that isn't enough, you have no way of knowing until it Mega Evolves whether it's X or Y, which demand completely different answers. Chansey is a reliable hard stop to Y, but is flatly terrified of X.

+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 570-672 (88.7 - 104.6%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO

Even staying in to hit it with Thunder Wave is risking being OHKOed before you accomplish anything.

Meanwhile switching in Quagsire on Y is going to result in it hitting you with Inferno.

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Inferno vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Quagsire in Sun: 201-237 (51 - 60.1%) -- 89.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Which, thanks to the Burn it always inflicts, is a 2HKO right there, resist or no resist.

Initially I thought maybe my team was just unusually weak to Mega Charizard X, but every time I think something might be a usable check against Mega Charizard X it turns out that it isn't, not really, even if I pretend Mega Charizard Y doesn't exist.

Whimsicott is literally the only priority Sleep to exist at all, and frankly its SubSeed set is one of the only things both Charizards are equally ineffectual against/is capable of reliably taking down Mega Charizard X at all, and it still can't switch in directly for fear of Flare Blitz, demanding either a slow switch move or sacrificing another Pokemon to get Whimsicott in.

About Mega Charizard X's only meaningful flaw is that it's weak to Stealth Rock, doubly so before Mega Evolution, but sets that run Roost instead of Earthquake -which it doesn't even actually need to beat Heatran anymore!- can shrug it off in practice.

I dunno, maybe I'm just overlooking some relevant walls... but I'm doubting it.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 210-247 (50 - 58.8%) -- 72.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Recoil-less way to kill it. Earthquake on Hippowdon?

4 Atk Hippowdon Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 218-258 (73.4 - 86.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage

Not good enough, assuming you don't Flinch and miss out on hitting it entirely.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 444-524 (132.9 - 156.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

No.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cofagrigus: 217-256 (67.8 - 80%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Not a chance.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Shuckle: 126-148 (51.6 - 60.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Nope, and no recovery or anything either.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Omastar: 201-237 (58.4 - 68.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Not sure why you're running Physically Defensive Omastar, but it's not good enough regardless.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Slowbro: 223-264 (56.5 - 67%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

One of the best Water types for sheer Physical bulk, and it's 2HKOed by Dragon Rush, no need for a Flinch. Goddamn.

Did you know Carbink and Diancie are the only Fairies that aren't a Mega or Arceus to have 100 or more Defense? And then Mega Charizard X runs Earthquake.

+1 252 Atk Mega Charizard X Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Diancie: 178-210 (58.5 - 69%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Yeah. This is about as good at it gets for checking/countering Mega Charizard X with bulk.

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Granbull: 226-267 (59 - 69.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

0 Atk Granbull Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 154-182 (51.8 - 61.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

:(

I literally don't see a reliable way to handle Mega Charizard X before it gets to take advantage of the "X or Y?" question. Even stacking priority is unreliable if it's running Roost.

 

[I like donkeys]

Since we're all nominating shit, I guess I'll nominate Heliolisk for C rank. I've seen it in action on sun teams and boy does it look fun, Solar Power combined with a perfectly accurate thunder is devastating. When under the sun you basically get a free +1 SpA and Spe boost or 2+ SpA boost (depending on choice item). It has the perk of revenge-killing threats like scarf Keldeo and Zard X at +1, along with speed-tieing scarf Durant. Seems like a great addition to any sun team (or a team that happens to have Zard Y or something lel).

I'm starting to feel like Charizardite X might need a suspect.

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Quagsire: 192-226 (48.7 - 57.3%) -- 47.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 252-297 (64.1 - 75.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

If you're not running Unaware, there's no good switch-in on Mega Charizard X. If you are running Unaware, there's still no good switch-in on Mega Charizard X. (In addition to the nearly 2HKO chance against Quagsire, it has a 30% chance per hit to Flinch Quagsire: Quagsire cannot stall it out, and Mega Charizard X can tank an uninvested Earthquake and has no fear of Scald, so Quagsire is just all-around screwed) It's too bulky to be reliably revenged with priority, especially since it's not weak to any priority moves and even resists Bullet Punch, and it can either run Roost for longevity or Earthquake to beat Heatron, which otherwise is an acceptable check, though far from perfect even then.

+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heatran: 170-201 (44.1 - 52.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Revenging it with a Scarf demands that your Scarf is 100+ base Speed itself, and further demands it's actually competent at fighting Mega Charizard X. (I'm running Scarf Mismagius, for instance, and the best it can do is hope to Paralyze X with Thunder)

As if that isn't enough, you have no way of knowing until it Mega Evolves whether it's X or Y, which demand completely different answers. Chansey is a reliable hard stop to Y, but is flatly terrified of X.

+1 252+ Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 4 HP / 252+ Def Eviolite Chansey: 570-672 (88.7 - 104.6%) -- 31.3% chance to OHKO

Even staying in to hit it with Thunder Wave is risking being OHKOed before you accomplish anything.

Meanwhile switching in Quagsire on Y is going to result in it hitting you with Inferno.

252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Inferno vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Quagsire in Sun: 201-237 (51 - 60.1%) -- 89.1% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Which, thanks to the Burn it always inflicts, is a 2HKO right there, resist or no resist.

Initially I thought maybe my team was just unusually weak to Mega Charizard X, but every time I think something might be a usable check against Mega Charizard X it turns out that it isn't, not really, even if I pretend Mega Charizard Y doesn't exist.

Whimsicott is literally the only priority Sleep to exist at all, and frankly its SubSeed set is one of the only things both Charizards are equally ineffectual against/is capable of reliably taking down Mega Charizard X at all, and it still can't switch in directly for fear of Flare Blitz, demanding either a slow switch move or sacrificing another Pokemon to get Whimsicott in.

About Mega Charizard X's only meaningful flaw is that it's weak to Stealth Rock, doubly so before Mega Evolution, but sets that run Roost instead of Earthquake -which it doesn't even actually need to beat Heatran anymore!- can shrug it off in practice.

I dunno, maybe I'm just overlooking some relevant walls... but I'm doubting it.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Hippowdon: 210-247 (50 - 58.8%) -- 72.7% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Recoil-less way to kill it. Earthquake on Hippowdon?

4 Atk Hippowdon Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 218-258 (73.4 - 86.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after sandstorm damage

Not good enough, assuming you don't Flinch and miss out on hitting it entirely.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 444-524 (132.9 - 156.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

No.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Cofagrigus: 217-256 (67.8 - 80%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Not a chance.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Shuckle: 126-148 (51.6 - 60.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Nope, and no recovery or anything either.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Omastar: 201-237 (58.4 - 68.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Not sure why you're running Physically Defensive Omastar, but it's not good enough regardless.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 232+ Def Slowbro: 223-264 (56.5 - 67%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

One of the best Water types for sheer Physical bulk, and it's 2HKOed by Dragon Rush, no need for a Flinch. Goddamn.

Did you know Carbink and Diancie are the only Fairies that aren't a Mega or Arceus to have 100 or more Defense? And then Mega Charizard X runs Earthquake.

+1 252 Atk Mega Charizard X Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Diancie: 178-210 (58.5 - 69%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

Yeah. This is about as good at it gets for checking/countering Mega Charizard X with bulk.

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Granbull: 226-267 (59 - 69.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

0 Atk Granbull Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 154-182 (51.8 - 61.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

:(

I literally don't see a reliable way to handle Mega Charizard X before it gets to take advantage of the "X or Y?" question. Even stacking priority is unreliable if it's running Roost.

At first i was in slight disbelief, I thought "surely the BULKIEST walls in the game are capable or stomaching Zard X" well...

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Slowbro: 153-181 (38.8 - 45.9%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

Nope.

The only mon i could possibly find that could stomach something at +1 and retaliate back is physically defensive mega Altaria, which is a good mon, but the EV spread is something you should NEVER run.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Mega Altaria: 132-156 (37.2 - 44%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
4 Atk Pixilate Mega Altaria Return vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 144-169 (48.4 - 56.9%) -- 90.6% chance to 2HKO

Like Ghoul said you are limited only to offensive scarfers and Whimsicott to handle Zard X at +1 speed. I'm happy for this monster to be suspected.

 

[Manchamp]

Scarf Garchomp can revenge MegaZardX after 1 dragon dance, always OHKOing with either 100BP STAB

252 Atk Garchomp Dragon Rush vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mega Charizard X: 300-354 (101 - 119.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

He can even switch in on a Flare Blitz and then factoring in recoil + Rough Skin he can KO with Stone Edge if that move is preferable against the rest of the team. Also, well, just that he can switch in on Flare Blitz means you don't need something to die first. If your expecting ZardY and ZardX sets up a DD while you do whatever with your fire-weak defensive mon, just run to Chompy and he'll force it out or KO. Besides Garchomp the only scarfers who can hope to outspend at +1 and OHKO are Terrakion, Latios, Noivern, Aerodactyl (12.5% chance with stoneEdge), and Salamence (ties). Most of those prefer a life orb or something but at least can get the job done. Other than that and the option of focus sashes (which require lots of maintenance and spinning), MegaZardX is gonna kill something and as Ghoul King said, is a huge threat.

 

[Aasgier]

Yeah, a good number of Scarfers can revenge Zard X.

Zard X is probably part of the reason why Scarf Durant is fairly common, because Durant can revenge Zard safely at +1 with Stone Edge.
However, even if Zard X got the banhammer, Scarf Durant remains extremely splashable on offensive teams.

I'm not opposing Durant to S rank, in that regard, but I am not certain if I should nominate it.

 

[Chopin Alkaninoff]

I'm probably just repeating other people's arguments at this point, but I don't see why Whimsicott is ranked S. I haven't played this meta yet but i have seen replays of it, and it just seems, well, underwhelming - especially for a Pokemon that's in freaking S rank!
Let's see what Pokemon require to be placed in the pivotal S rank:
"Reserved for Pokemon that are amazing in the metagame. These Pokemon are usually able to perform a variety of roles effectively, or can just do one extremely well. Their use has low risk involved and high reward exerted. Pokemon in this rank have very few flaws that are patched up by numerous positive traits."
Let's look at a Pokemon that is always consistently high in most viability rankings - Thundurus-I. Thundy is very good because he is quite unpredictable and has fantastic offensive presence - and prankster to boot. Whimsicott on the other hand is a different story. I will admit Whimsicott does do it's job extremely well, but that's about where the good news ends. Whimsicott does not have very few flaws that are patched up by numerous positive traits. It has basically no offensive presence, is incredibly predictable and has little utility outside of putting something to sleep, in fact it's actually worse off since (once something is put to sleep) it essentially only has 3 moves instead of 4. It's walled by grass types, magic bounce, sap sippers, checked by lum berry, sound moves, most special attackers, taunt, regen cores, infiltrator, it has no room for reliable recovery so it's easily worn down, and the list goes on. Whimsicott does not have "low risk involved and high reward exerted" due to what i said in the previous part. An S ranked mon should not have all these flaws.
Some say it's a good check to setup sweepers (which it is), but why not just use something like Talonflame or Ditto or even Unawares to check setup, and instead give sleep moves to other offensive mons like Gengar or Mega Altaria? Sure Whimsicott has the fastest priority, but at least other mons like Mega Sceptile or even Crobat can put things to sleep and actually DO anything.

Of course I'm not saying Whimsicott is bad or outclassed, it just doesn't seems as horrible as everyone is making it out to be :P

This is actually what I've been thinking when making the Viability Rankings. I mean, is Whimsicott really S rank worthy? Based on previous discussions, many things can handle it and it lacks the definition of S rank. Tbh, I don't agree putting it even in A+, but others want it in S rank simply because it defines the meta.

Also, a fun pair that I've been trying out.

Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Ability : Blaze
Evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Inferno
- Solar Beam
- Focus Blast
- Roost

Durant 2.0 (Heliolisk) @ Choice Scarf
Ability : Solar Power
Evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Thunder
- Hyper Voice
- Volt Switch
- Focus Blast

Funny thing about this pair is, it works. Because I love Durant so much in this meta, I'm trying to replicate another Durant, and Heliolisk perfectly fits this criteria. It has the same SpA and Speed as Durant's Attack and Speed. Solar Power makes this poke have Durant's power. It also got nice moves. Thunder and Focus Blast hits extremely hard in Sun and Hyper Voice says "fak Whimsicott". Pair this with Durant and you've got yourself "Double Durant" core. I can't deny that it's inferior to original Durant but be creative sometimes, eh?

Don't ban Durant or I'll quit playing this meta >:[

 

[LightningLord2]

Has anyone mentioned Gengar yet? It also has a fast sleep move that, while lacking priority, comes from a still high speed tier. It also has three immunities, far more offensive presence and a good amount of other disruptive moves.

 

[Imperator Romanum]

Yeah no, I don't think Zard X should be suspected. It was never counterable in OU. The strongest checks are Mega Slowbro, Quagsire and Hippowdown. But individually these pokemon beat all of Zard X sets except the newest one SD/TW which is basically just rape versus everything, it's really good and new, which is why it rose to S in OU. But I don't thin enough changes for Zard to be suspected here, infact it's a lot more difficult in such a fast offensive metagame riddled with priority sleep, zap cannon ect. With SRs up you're losing 50% of your health upon switching, that's a huggeee deal. It basically prevents you from functioning effectively with SRs up as setting up a DD is significantly more difficult.

A lot of things are uncounterable, but Zard x has factors that prevent it from being broken, like lack of priority, SR weak and unreliable stabs, which are either to weak or with some downsides, except Dragon rush tho, so that's nice.

 

[xJownage]

Yeah no, I don't think Zard X should be suspected. It was never counterable in OU. The strongest checks are Mega Slowbro, Quagsire and Hippowdown. But individually these pokemon beat all of Zard X sets except the newest one SD/TW which is basically just rape versus everything, it's really good and new, which is why it rose to S in OU. But I don't thin enough changes for Zard to be suspected here, infact it's a lot more difficult in such a fast offensive metagame riddled with priority sleep, zap cannon ect. With SRs up you're losing 50% of your health upon switching, that's a huggeee deal. It basically prevents you from functioning effectively with SRs up as setting up a DD is significantly more difficult.

A lot of things are uncounterable, but Zard x has factors that prevent it from being broken, like lack of priority, SR weak and unreliable stabs, which are either to weak or with some downsides, except Dragon rush tho, so that's nice.

Compared to OU, it beats a couple of major checks it didn't before - namely Quagsire, Heatran, and several typical fire resists it couldn't quite net kills on before it can now, such as ttar with rocks, keldeo 100%, victini, etc. Furthermore, the ability to get OHKOs on common semi-bulky mons such as mew without having to take a ton of recoil is very useful and helps it more easily sweep teams.

And you are forgetting those checks are no longer checks either, which is the main problem - its gone from impossible to counter to damn hard to check.

 

[Imperator Romanum]

Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 40 HP / 252 Atk / 216 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Swords Dance
- Tailwind
- Outrage

This set ha no counters either, so what's the difference? Charizard is a wallbreaker & sweeper, it never had trouble breaking things. Zard X was always pretty hard to counter/check that's what made it S. What prevented it from being suspected was that there are still some solid checks to it; azu, altaria, lando, chomp, thundurus ect. If the metagame solved its SR problem, the biggest issue with zard x then it probably be suspected.

 

[jordanthejq12]

Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 40 HP / 252 Atk / 216 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Swords Dance
- Tailwind
- Outrage

This set ha no counters either, so what's the difference? Charizard is a wallbreaker & sweeper, it never had trouble breaking things. Zard X was always pretty hard to counter/check that's what made it S. What prevented it from being suspected was that there are still some solid checks to it; azu, altaria, lando, chomp, thundurus ect. If the metagame solved its SR problem, the biggest issue with zard x then it probably be suspected.

It's not so much that the metagame has solved its SR problem. The thing that changed was that Zard got access to a perfectly-accurate Dragon Rush, which is only marginally less powerful than Outrage, doesn't lock it in and confuse it, and has a flinch chance to boot.

 

[Imperator Romanum]

It's not so much that the metagame has solved its SR problem. The thing that changed was that Zard got access to a perfectly-accurate Dragon Rush, which is only marginally less powerful than Outrage, doesn't lock it in and confuse it, and has a flinch chance to boot.

Completely missing my point, i'm saying Dragon rush doesn't solve its biggest problem, which is SR, lack of priority ect. A lot of things get a boost, dragon rush isn't that big

 

[Chopin Alkaninoff]

Disagree with Zard X ban. This poke may be stronger here, but it's also HARDER to set up and sweep in this meta because of the amount of crippling moves. I mean, in standard, it doesn't have to worry about Thunderbolts because it resists it, but now it HAS to worry about Zap Cannons because even it resists, it WILL be crippled. It also has to worry about sleeps.

Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 40 HP / 252 Atk / 216 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Swords Dance
- Tailwind
- Outrage

This set ha no counters either, so what's the difference? Charizard is a wallbreaker & sweeper, it never had trouble breaking things. Zard X was always pretty hard to counter/check that's what made it S. What prevented it from being suspected was that there are still some solid checks to it; azu, altaria, lando, chomp, thundurus ect. If the metagame solved its SR problem, the biggest issue with zard x then it probably be suspected.

This. Also I want to add that Altaria doesn't have to run Draco Meteor to kill Zard X now because it can just Sing here, which means it can check Zard X better. Plus, it now has Scarf Durant and Zap Cannons to worry about, unlike in standard OU.

 

[Jaguar360]

All this Zard X discussion and no mention of Iron Tail...OK.

I think a Zard X suspect would be pretty interesting. I'm not quite on the ban train, but Zard X has become notably more threatening in NGG now that its checks are much less reliable with it being capable or running Dragon Rush and Iron Tail with no fear of missing. Suddenly it becomes fully capable of OHKOing Clefable, Mega Alt and Diancie and checks like Slowbro and Quagsire become more shaky. SD + Tailwind is not the same since it is incapable of running Roost or the Iron Tail coverage that Zard appreciates for Alt and Diancie and requires two turns of setup to get going (unless facing a team where it outspeeds everything of course).

That said, it is manageable at least. Offense has some Scarfers like Garchomp, Durant, Keldeo and Lando-T to revenge kill it along with priority sleep and paralysis with Whimsi and Thundurus to cripple it and, while shakier, Quagsire, (Mega) Slowbro and Hippodown do decent jobs of stopping it defensively. Despite this though, I think a suspect would be good or at least a good discussion on it.

 

[Schpoonman]

The idea behind Zard's "double dance" set is that it only uses one of its given set-up moves against a particular team. Against stall, you Swords Dance. Against offense, Tailwind. Really, that's the idea behind every Double Dance set.

 

[eviolite goomy]

time to post something relevant
I'm nominating Kyurem-black from unranked to A-
scarf kyurem-b puts in a ton of work in this offensive meta. It can easily ohko revenge kill almost any of the top tier threats with one of his coverage moves.
It also greatly benefits from no guard mechanics as it now gets more powerful coverage moves such as stone edge and focus blast and it can run blizzard over ice beam. With these extra options you're not as forced to run an awkward mixed attacking set anymore.

 

[Martin]

Ghoul King in your post about M-Scizor, Stone Edge would do more over the course of 2 attacks due to the attack drop from Superpower. Either way you live, but I'm just pointing it out.

 

[Physical Tyranitar]

Zweilous To C or B Rank
Zweilous can now use Hustle to great use, raising it's attack to a staggering Base 150, along with a usable physical movepool. Dragon Rush, Head Smash, and many others, it can be a decent attacker.

 

[Lcass4919]

Loppunny-mega to S rank
Lop is S ranked in regular ou, and that shows you how scary it can be, from using and facing loppuny, its just as scary here, as high jump kick no longer has that horrid chance to miss. it outspeeds literally everything relevant in the tier, including some common scarfers, and fighting/normal coverage is incredibly scary, and hits suprisingly hard. and from my experience using it, its just as scary in this meta as it is in OU, and none of the meta trends really scares it off, and in fact, due to the offensive curve the meta has, means the meta trend actually helps lop quite a bit. definitely a S ranked threat. try it out and see if you agree.

edit: oh wait, lop dropped recently...still...i feel like it could be S ranked.

 

[Ghoul King]

Ghoul King in your post about M-Scizor, Stone Edge would do more over the course of 2 attacks due to the attack drop from Superpower. Either way you live, but I'm just pointing it out.

Fully aware. My point was that the calc given is stronger than Stone Edge would actually be, and insufficient to take out Mega Scizor, showing how solid it is. The only caveat I should add is that a well-timed crit from Stone Edge can potentially let it KO Mega Scizor, though that also applies to Superpower... and has actually happened to me... ugh...

Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 40 HP / 252 Atk / 216 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Swords Dance
- Tailwind
- Outrage

This set ha no counters either, so what's the difference? Charizard is a wallbreaker & sweeper, it never had trouble breaking things. Zard X was always pretty hard to counter/check that's what made it S. What prevented it from being suspected was that there are still some solid checks to it; azu, altaria, lando, chomp, thundurus ect. If the metagame solved its SR problem, the biggest issue with zard x then it probably be suspected.

NGG Mega Charizard X has almost no checks. There are tons of things it can flat-out OHKO with Dragon Rush with no flaw or disadvantage to exploit that can survive a +1 Dragon Claw and successfully revenge in Standard, making it considerably more difficult to revenge it in NGG without leaning on Scarfs or Whimsicott revenging it, and it no longer needs to run Earthquake to have a shot at dealing with Heatran, making Roost sets considerably less risky, which mitigates its vulnerability to Stealth Rock and makes Roar/Whirlwind-based checks shaky before it causes a Flinch with Dragon Rush, as the next time it comes in it may simply Roost as your Roar/Whirlwind check comes in, shrugging off the Stealth Rock damage from being Roar/Whirlwinded around.

Quagsire is a hard stop to Standard Mega Charizard X unless it runs Outrage, in which case Quagsire can then switch out to a Fairy or Steel type which then has a shot at screwing with Mega Charizard X in some fashion or another and forces Mega Charizard X to choose between taking recoil damage from Flare Blitz or get locked in and ultimately Confused by Outrage, rendering it less flexible and reliable at killing things. Here, Mega Charizard X just smacks it with Dragon Rush until it's dead.

Some examples

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Keldeo: 354-417 (109.5 - 129.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Claw vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Keldeo: 282-333 (87.3 - 103%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Mega Charizard X: 306-361 (103 - 121.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

In Standard, Keldeo can fairly reliably switch into Mega Charizard X setting up and then one shot it. Here, it would never miss... but it will also never survive, so who cares?

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Tyranitar: 298-352 (87.3 - 103.2%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO

252 Atk Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 306-362 (103 - 121.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Has a chance of one-shotting Tyranitar even without Stealth Rock support and ignoring the Flinch chance. With Stealth Rock it's nearly guaranteed. In standard, Tyranitar can revenge it or get a good prediction-switch and then OHKO it, barring missing Stone Edge.

+1 252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Victini: 324-382 (95 - 112%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

No need for Stealth Rock, you'll usually get the OHKO anyway. 30% of the time you don't, Victini will Flinch anyway.

---

And the list just goes on.

When I said you need Scarfed Pokemon or priority to revenge it, I meant it. You can't bring in a full health Fire resist on the Dragon Dance or revenge after a KO and expect the Fire resist to survive a +1 Dragon Rush and retaliate. You can't even sacrifice 2 Pokemon to take down Mega Charizard X reliably! It is entirely possible for Mega Charizard X to 6-0 a good team all by itself, especially if it gets a crucially timed Flinch, which it has decent odds of happening.

Even Landorus-Therian is shaky!

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Dragon Rush vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Landorus-T: 169-199 (44.2 - 52%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

252 Atk Tough Claws Mega Charizard X Flare Blitz vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Landorus-T: 202-238 (52.8 - 62.3%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

So, hit with Dragon Rush, get the Flinch, finish it with Flare Blitz. You don't even necessarily need Stealth Rock to soften up Landorus-Therian! This can actually happen, albeit it's a particularly extreme example of luck. (I'm pretty sure Charizard would also need high-ish damage rolls)

Bonus points: as pointed out by Jaguar360, 100% accurate Iron Tail lets Mega Charizard X murder Fairies outright. And here's food for thought:

252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Azumarill Play Rough vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 246-289 (82.8 - 97.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

That's right. Banded Azumarill can't necessarily revenge Mega Charizard X without prior damage: Earthquake or Iron Tail is a clean 2HKO at +1. Un-Band it and you get this...

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Play Rough vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 163-193 (54.8 - 64.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Charizard X: 73-87 (24.5 - 29.2%) -- 99.8% chance to 4HKO

... which the best case scenario is about 95% of Mega Charizard's health gone. Again, without prior damage, you're not getting the KO. Mega Charizard X 2HKOs Azumarill.

Sitrus Berry Belly Drum Aqua Jet can scare it out one time, as +6 Aqua Jet is usually a OHKO and Mega Charizard doesn't hit hard enough at +1 to prevent it from getting the Belly Drum when backed by Sitrus Berry, but Azumarill is very fragile at that point. It can't repeat this either, so if Unaware is waiting in the wings to be switched into and then kill/drive out Azumarill, this is a win for Mega Charizard X, even with Stealth Rock.

This being one of the only Pokemon in the entire game that is resistant-or-better to both of Mega Charizard X's STABs. I already showed how much less reliable Heatran is even if Earthquake is not being carried, no Fairy/Fire exists (And would have to fear Earthquake if it wasn't Levitating anyway), Mega Altaria is the only Fairy/Dragon, and the Fairy/Rock cases have to fear Iron Tail or just plain ol' Earthquake.

You can't switch in anything, you can't revenge it without basically dedicated revengers, and the one Unaware Pokemon that hard stops it in Standard is now useless. This is not the situation in Standard.

It's certainly more meta-warping than Whimsicott, which you keep trying to push for a Suspect on even though it has tons of counters and checks and isn't that threatening by itself anyway and isn't even all that good of team support. I cannot imagine why you think Whimsicott deserves a suspect but Mega Charizard X should be left alone.

That said, it is manageable at least. Offense has some Scarfers like Garchomp, Durant, Keldeo and Lando-T to revenge kill it along with priority sleep and paralysis with Whimsi and Thundurus to cripple it and, while shakier, Quagsire, (Mega) Slowbro and Hippodown do decent jobs of stopping it defensively. Despite this though, I think a suspect would be good or at least a good discussion on it.

Hippowdon can revenge it and then Whirlwind it out, assuming it doesn't Flinch, but Quagsire isn't a "shaky" check, it's just plain doomed, and Slowbro/Mega Slowbro... what, chips it a little? Scald caps out at just under 40% from regular Slowbro, and Mega Slowbro only gets just under 50%, and they're both 2HKOed by Dragon Rush, which means unless Mega Charizard X has taken prior damage and doesn't get the Flinch and isn't carrying Roost this, at best, opens the way for something else to actually revenge it.

Scarfed Keldeo doesn't hit hard enough to OHKO Mega Charizard X. Specs Keldeo can get the KO, but isn't tough enough to survive +1 Dragon Rush.

The others work OK, though personally I haven't seen a Landorus-Therian and Thundurus-Incarnate/Therian isn't that popular in my experience. They don't get enough out of the meta, and the ability to lob Blizzard and the like hurts them a lot more than reliable Stone Edge/Focus Blast+Thunder helps them, at least in my experience.

Disagree with Zard X ban. This poke may be stronger here, but it's also HARDER to set up and sweep in this meta because of the amount of crippling moves. I mean, in standard, it doesn't have to worry about Thunderbolts because it resists it, but now it HAS to worry about Zap Cannons because even it resists, it WILL be crippled. It also has to worry about sleeps.

This. Also I want to add that Altaria doesn't have to run Draco Meteor to kill Zard X now because it can just Sing here, which means it can check Zard X better. Plus, it now has Scarf Durant and Zap Cannons to worry about, unlike in standard OU.

Scarf Raikou and Porygon2 are the only Zap Cannons that can either reliably tank a hit and retaliate (Porygon2 is bulky enough that it would need to Flinch twice in the face of Dragon Rush, or Flinch once and X gets the 25% shot at two high enough damage rolls, to actually fail, barring prior damage) or outspeed it to then hit it with Zap Cannon for the Paralysis.

Mew is OHKOed more than 80% of the time by +1 Flare Blitz, 100% with hazard support, silly crap like Physically Defensive Magnezone still takes more than 150% from +1 Flare Blitz let alone Earthquake, Scarfed Porygon-Z is too slow and OHKOed by Dragon Rush, Physically Defensive Registeel takes a minimum of 115% from +1 Flare Blitz, Physically Defensive Zapdos has a 25% chance of being OHKOed by +1 Flare Blitz without Stealth Rock, Ampharos is OHKOed unless it is Physically Defensive and doesn't Mega and didn't have to switch into hazards or refuses to Mega because it successfully predicts a Dragon Rush and doesn't Flinch... well. Regirock can tank anything it tosses out, but I've never seen Regirock, let alone Zap Cannon Regirock.

Zap Cannon is a lot less of a concern than you're making it out to be. Sleep has to deal with Sleep clause. Mega Charizard X is immune to Burn. You can't get reliable Freeze, period. Toxic -such as from Prankster- is too slow, given how insanely difficult it is to actually slow Mega Charizard X down. Trick-choice (Or Iron Ball or whatever you think would cripple it best) fails because Mega.

Mega Charizard X is hard to actually cripple, and Scarf Raikou has to deal with the danger that Flare Blitz is a OHKO at +0, meaning it's only reliable at revenging Mega Charizard X -switching in to Zap Cannon it has to fear a prediction netting a OHKO, even if Mega Charizard X isn't running Earthquake! (Actually, Earthquake doesn't even hit Raikou as hard, thanks to Tough Claws: a Raikou with 32 HP EVs will never be KOed by +0 Earthquake barring hazards)

 

[Jaguar360]

Ghoul King Slowbro would T-Wave Zard X, but I think boosted Zard X outspeeds Slowbro when paralyzed. It ends the sweep at least though, assuming that it doesn't get flinched to death by Dragon Rush of course.

Zweilous To C or B Rank
Zweilous can now use Hustle to great use, raising it's attack to a staggering Base 150, along with a usable physical movepool. Dragon Rush, Head Smash, and many others, it can be a decent attacker.

I've been meaning to try Zwelious out. On paper, however, I don't see how it's going to come in on anything. It loses to every Pokemon in S and A+ on the viability rankings aside from Heatran and Hammer Arm/Ice Punch-less Mega Metagross and it's slow. It would be a great Chandelure check, but it needs RestTalk or else it just gets burned by Inferno. I'll test it like I've been meaning to, but I don't see a good reason for it to be ranked despite its obvious improvements with its accuracy.