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Gen 5 NU Viability Rankings 2.0

Discussion in 'Ruins of Alph' started by Raseri, May 26, 2013.

  1. Nozzle

    Nozzle

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    I checked the whole NU list and the ones unranked (and thus E-rank) are:

    Ariados, Banette, Beautifly, Beedrill, Bibarel, Bellossom, Carnivine, Chatot, Cherrim, Chimecho, Corsola, Delcatty, Delibird, Dewgong, Dunsparce, Dustox, Emolga, Farfetch'd, Fearow, Furret, Girafarig, Glailie, Granbull, Kecleon, Kricketune, Leavanny, Ledian, Lopunny, Lumineon, Lunatone, Machoke, Magcargo, Maractus, Mightyena, Minun, Mothim, Noctowl, Pachirisu, Persian, Parasect, Phione, Pikachu, Plusle, Purugly, Raticate, Regigigas, Seadra, Seaking, Shedinja, Shuckle, Slaking, Sudowoodo, Spinda, Sunflora, Swalot, Togetic, Unfezant, Unown, Vanniluxe, Vespiquen, Walrein, Watchog, Whirlipede, Whiscash, Wigglytuff, Wormadam, Wormadam-Trash, Wormadam-Sand.


    Of these, I think some of them should move up to D rank. Banette because of his TR lead set and TR is very anti meta atm. Bibarel because of Simple giving him a niche even though he is easily walled. Leavanny because it's great as a offensive supporter or an all out attacker due to forcing switches, even though it's speed it just below what you wanted it to be. Lopunny for Klutz and Switcheroo shenanigans, fake out and speed. Lunatone because Solrock is in D and i don't see why Lunatone is inferior. Machoke for No Guard DynamicPunch and good bulk. Magcargo has a very underrated lead SS set to catch opponents off guard. It's faster than you would imagine. Mightyena has Moxie and i guess it could make nice use of that. Sunflora could potentially be a TR attacker. Whirlipede is still pretty good at hazard setting and Swalot for being awesome.
  2. Shuckleking87

    Shuckleking87 "Assault vest makes everything better" AV Seaking, BT
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    If I wanted to make a serious team that can get me wins, I would "maybe" consider Machoke or Seadra (and of course, Shuckle). For all those other pokes, except Shedinja, there either is a poke that is way superior in the job, or the purpose for using said poke is pointless (fake out leads for example). Trick room can work, but it is difficult to actually set with negative priority, and imo, Mandibuzz is an excellent check to alot of TR abusers. Bibarel has 2 convenient ability, but cannot really do anything without alot of boosts. Leavanny has almost no benefits over a scolipede except a couple support moves and grass stab. Solrock over lunatone for the higher physical defense, though I guess lunatone might deserve a mention. Macargo is flat out awful, extrememly slow, and weak to every S.R. lead. Mightyena has moxie, but it is easy to play around and not that strong until 2 boosts (wouldn't be against mightyena on the list though). Sunflora and Whirlipede lol. Muk awesomeness>Swalot awesomeness
  3. Aasgier

    Aasgier

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    I tried Leavanny on my Sun team again. It replaced Sawsbuck, because I missed those vital OHKO's all too often, and it has better coverage than Leafeon. In the Sun, it is also pretty damn fast, outspeeding every Scarfer unlike other common Sun Sweepers, outside of the aforemented Sawsbuck that is. Also, Heal Bell on a Sun team proved to be useful, something Sawsbuck cannot provide, as well as just having a better typing than Leafeon imho.

    Leavanny is a blend of a Grass-type and a Bug-type, you should never threat it as only one of those types because it will be outclassed if you do so. It has the benefits - and the flaws - of both, though it is worth noting Leavanny is the only Bug-type in the tier with Heal Bell, as well as the only one with STAB X-Scissor alongside Chlorophyll. Then again, using Swarm nowadays on Leavanny is pointless since you reach Scolipede territory if you do.
  4. No Luck Involved

    No Luck Involved

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    Seadra is actually pretty usable in my experience. Surprising power and just about usable speed make it a threat, and that bulk means it can do a few jobs for the team. I enjoyed using offensive Seadra a lot, haven't had as much success with a defensive set despite it looking amazing on paper, but it definitely has a niche over special Samurott and special Simipour thanks to its bulk. That's the one out of that lot that I'd put on the list, probably in D but could be C at a stretch of the imagination...
  5. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    KK time to respond to some of the individual nominations so far.

    Glaceon to E is something that I strongly disagree with. It isn't a bad pokemon by any means, it is heavily outclassed by Jynx, but if you were to want to use 2 Ice-types, Glaceon is good competition for the second one. It is also far stronger than Jynx, and has more physical bulk. Though that doesn't give it a huge niche, it is enough to keep it out of E tier. E is reserved for Pokemon that you should never use ever unless its a joke team. Glaceon for D

    Gardevoir for C is another one I'm not sure about. It seems to have good company in B-rank. Sure she used to be a top-tier psychic type and has taken a huge fall, but S - C seems a bit to much. Trace is where she can stand out from Jynx, which is enough of a niche to stay out of C. When I look at B-rank, I see Pokemon of equal viability to Gardevoir. At least in this tier list, C-rank is reserved for pretty niche Pokemon. B-rank is holding a lot of the good but not great ones (Beheeyem, Shiftry, Gardy, Camerupt)

    Gabite is a really interesting mon, I wrote the analysis for it :). It's super cool typing is why I really like it, and D-rank is pretty low for it. The issue with Gabite is that it competes so heavily with Piloswine it isn't even funny. Both are bulky ground types with cool secondary coverage. Dragon doesn't offer amazing coverage in NU, and lots of the stuff youre using it on won't be hit to hard anyways. But it has a lot of great resists and is like the best counter to HP Grass electrics ever. So I'm really torn on this one, leaning towards C for it, but can be persuaded either way.

    Banette has such a small niche I barely find it worth mentioning, it was considered for D, but it just sucks. Trick Room is a rare strategy in NU because its wrecked by Kanga, Banette is super wrecked by kanga. It might be D if trick room was better, but until that becomes a great strategy I think its E.

    Bibarel is also just kinda bad. I love me some Bibarel, and Simple and Unaware are great abilities. But even boosted, its quite weak and its not like it can find a time to boost anyways. Unaware also struggles because there arent many things it can actually wall (SD Samurott). Bibarel has a cool movepool, and used to be D, but with Sawk everywhere its hard to justify using it at all.

    Leavanny I'm indifferent about, its not bad but struggles with Scolipede, Sawsbuck, Leafeon, Pinsir all having one of its STABs and being stronger,

    Lopunny is bad.

    Lunatone is something that I like, but was voted E when we made the list. RP is cool, especially because Rock STAB beats Scoli and Jynx, while psychic beats Ape. Solrock is better though because Morning Sun :)

    Machoke is just heavily outclassed by every other Fighter in the tier. Give it Drain Punch and id use it though.

    Magcargo is outclassed by Torkoal, who can also spin. Rock STAB is cool, but the extra speed doesnt do much.

    Mightyena, Sunflora, and Whirlipede are all bad.

    Seadra has a cool SubDisable set, but thats the only reason id ever use it with Mola in the tier. If people like that set Im fine with moving it to D though.


    Also, ive read everyones posts and made a revised list of A-rank. Everything is still debatable, this is just with everyones thoughts put in so far.


    Top A
    Golurk
    Ludicolo

    Misdreavus
    Musharna
    Primeape
    Sawk
    Mid A
    Alomomola
    Eelektross
    Charizard
    Golem
    Gurdurr
    Serperior
    Swellow
    Tauros

    The rest of them I don't think a lot of people will complain about, im just to lazy to post anymore.

    Low A
    Braviary
    Haunter
    Garbodor
    Metang
    Piloswine
    Regirock
    Zangoose


    I moved Haunter down, i overrated it a lot.

    Things that I think are debatable:
    Braviary from low - mid
    Metang from low - mid
    Piloswine from low - mid
    Swellow from mid - low


    for reference

  6. FLCL

    FLCL
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    walrein and regigigias should be moved into d rank simply because they have so much bulk. walrein can run a specially defensive set and wall the likes of jynx and charizard with the help of thick fat. regigigas is a decent spreader of paralysis and can be really tough to take down without a fighting-type attack. both can do damage to the opposing team as well, as walrein has a decent 95 special attack stat while regigigas can become extremely dangerous after five turns.

    another pokemon that deserves to be looked at is wormadam-s, which has a niche role in being able to set up stealth rocks and take on jynx as well as certain normal-types such as kangaskhan or tauros. it's defensive stats are passable and it lacks the earthquake weakness that metang possess and is also able to regain hp with leftovers. i think these qualities make it good enough to be moved out of e rank.
  7. Dracoyoshi8

    Dracoyoshi8 weapon of mass seduction
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    Regigigas is also the second best (worst?) Parafusion user in NU. Unlike Liepard, who dies when you hit it, Regigigas sits there like you threw tissue paper at it.
  8. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    but do we really want to encourage regigigas usage? :(
    wiitle, JoshuaMunoz and Shuckleking87 like this.
  9. Worldtour

    Worldtour aka Swamp-Rocket
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    I would think Serperior is more of a Low A Pokemon than a Mid A. Its SubCM set is really good, but it is one of those Pokemon that absolutely requires a boost if it wants to hit hard. This is because its a weak Pokemon that depends on a weak STAB move and an even weaker coverage move. It can be extremely devastating after a while, but it takes a while to set up and start hurting the foe. It is, however, supposed to be a late game sweeper, so I guess this issue becomes much less of an issue later on, and it can be really hard to break through, but I think its closer to Low than Mid overall.

    About the actual debatable thing Braviary I think may have a shot at Mid A. Sub + Bulk Up is such a great set as its always been, especially with the prevalence of defensive Seismitoad, and to an extent, Scolipede, both of whom can be set up on (the former is if Scolipede is not running Rock Slide, which is over half the time). There are also the other things it can set up on, including even Rock types. However, Braviary is also effective at Choice items, and because it can go the slow set up route as well as the revenge killing/wall breaking route, it is still somewhat hard to deal with (for instance, Jynx loses to Scarf variants whereas it could outpace the other sets), so I think Mid is more fitting than Low.

    Otherwise I'm fine with the list!

    EDIT: Lunatone gets Moonlight so Solrock doesn't outclass it in that it has recovery.
  10. Harbinger of Peace

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    I agree with Regigigas being moved up upto D-Rank, because it has fantastic bulk, and is a great paralysis spreader, and with T-Wave and Sub, Regi can be a nuisance to deal with, especially for stall teams. Regi can dodge status with a sub, and take hits all day from most defensive mons. Regi's typing isn't the best in NU, though. Normal gives Regigigas only one type resist (which is ghost, but Regi gets walled by ghost types so lol), and a weakness to the ever-so-common fighting type. Also, with T-Wave and Sub, Regi can stall out Slow Start. Regi has some major flaws (Slow Start, Meh typing, Moveslot syndrome), but it's immense bulk and decent T-Wave set justifies it as D-Rank in my opinion.
  11. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
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    [​IMG]

    I really love Sub Bulk Up Braviary right now. It's probably my favorite Pokemon to use right now, and I think it's pretty underrated. It can set up on almost every defensive Pokemon in the tier, and if it gets up a free Substitute or Bulk Up, it can even set up on some things that you might not think it would be able to otherwise. But Sub Bulk Up Braviary is just one of its sets. I still like Scarf Braviary; even if it can't outpace pretty much any other Choice Scarf user, if you don't rely on it as your only way to beat Choice Scarf Pokemon (you use stallier/bulkier teams in general, you have Kangaskhan or other priority users, etc), it makes for an awesome scout and late-game cleaner. I haven't used Choice Band in a long time, but I'd imagine it's still a pretty effective wallbreaker. There are other miscellaneous sets that work out well in addition to these; Raseri has used defensive Braviary which I quite liked, and Cherub Agent, our resident Tailwind lover, has used a set with that. It's pretty versatile for a more offensive Pokemon, and it's definitely deserving of Mid A-Rank in my opinion.

    [​IMG]

    Swellow wrecks, Swellow rules. It's still the same thing it always has been, and it's still one of my favorite Pokemon. My main issue with it is how matchup reliant it can be; if the opponent has a good Flying and Normal check, it's not going to be doing much until that check is gone. In fact, if Stealth Rock is up on your side and the opponent has a check to it, it's either going to sit and wait for the check to die (which it may not at all) or get worn down really quickly with Stealth Rock and Poison damage (as well as the occasional Rocky Helmet :0). Of course, against offensive teams, it does really, really well. U-turn is a sick move to have on any offensive team, and it helps against offensive teams and defensive teams alike, giving you the chance to gather offensive momentum and rack up hazard damage against your opponent. It's also strong as hell after its Toxic Orb has triggered. As much as it pains me to say it, the faults of Swellow probably hold it back enough that it should go Low A-Rank. It does an incredible job against a good number of teams, but it also struggles to beat enough Pokemon that it really isn't quite Mid A-Rank. If we were splitting up rankings even further, it would be Top-Low-A-Rank. :V

    [​IMG]

    I don't have very strong feelings on Serperior either way, but Swamp-Rocket makes a really good point about it. It's probably closer to Low A-Rank than Mid. I've played with it quite a bit, and some games it can do really well while others it can do jack. The biggest issue I have with it is its coverage. If, say, it was a Grass/Poison type and could run dual STAB, I think it would be better. Additionally, if it just got a good coverage move, like Heat Wave (obviously it wouldn't make sense, but there's no denying it would be helpful), it would be better. But relying on a good STAB and a weak Hidden Power sucks. Some games I wish I would have run HP Rock, and others I wish I'd run HP Fire. There are too many things that beat it, in my opinion—if HP Rock, Metang, Klang, Bastiodon, etc and if HP Fire, Charizard, Altaria, Torkoal, etc and either way, specially defensive Camerupt, Zweilous, Miltank, Muk, etc). And then if you are running Taunt, you are more prone to passive statuses and crits while Sub makes you super prone to phazing. It's a great Pokemon with awesome Speed, but I think it was a bit overrated after Scolipede and Jynx dropped, since it can outspeed them both. Its coverage and lack of immediate power holds it back to much, to me, to be Mid A-Rank, but I wouldn't mind too much if it was.

    Metang and Piloswine are fine where they are at, in my opinion.

    I was also considering Charizard for Top A-Rank. It's really powerful and incredibly difficult to wall outside of niche Pokemon (like Grumpig). I realize that Stealth Rock holds it back a lot though, so I'd like to hear more about it from other people. I can say it's the Pokemon I usually struggle the most with when I face it. Both SD and special Life Orb sets are really hard to wall, and Scarf sets are both super fast and really powerful. Do you think its major Stealth Rock weakness (which makes it more prone to revenge killing from priority like Fake Out from Kangaskhan and Sucker Punch from everything that runs it) is enough to hold it back from Top A?
  12. Punchshroom

    Punchshroom para is worse than sleep
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    On the subject of Walrein, I don't see much of what else it can do. It doesn't even shine in the resistances department, since a pure-Water type boasts the same resists and much less crippling weaknesses. While it has Encore to deter setup, it doesn't have Scald, which greatly reduces its utility, meaning you're using Walrein purely for its better bulk and Encore, which isn't usually worth an Ice-type's weaknesses. Also, it needs to forgo a moveslot if it wants to actually touch Substitute Jynx with a move other than Toxic.

    Regigigas is too much of a hassle to bother with. Usually it does 2 things: status things left and right or trying to wait out the 5 turns to sweep. Obviously you aren't using Gigas to wall stuff due to no recovery. Normal-type Thunder Wave users are of great abundance in NU, ranging from Stoutland, Granbull, Audino, and Miltank, and they all have utility outside of that role. Sweeping Gigas cannot make use of its wide (but not necessarily good) offensive movepool with the dedication to outlast the 5 turns it needs just to get ready, but lack of boosting options and anti-Ghost move would still hold it back even then. It wouldn't be so bad if its Speed was untouched, as it is more than fast enough to Substitute before a wall's status attempt, but hey presto GF! Good job stunting the master of the Regis this badly~

    I've said this more than once and I'll say it again: why even bother with Wormadam-T over literally every other Steel-type in NU? It's not like its Ground neutrality matters when it still loses to them anyway. Its movepool is also trash (get it~) because it has nothing worth of note over other Steels. Its STAB options, its only means of fighting back, are piss weak, relying on Gyro Ball or Iron Head, which is weaker than Bronzong's, to do....some damage at best. But hey, Bug STAB is cool right? Too bad its stronger STAB, Signal Beam, is inferior to Bug Bite against targets like Jynx, Gardevoir and CM Serperior, and let's not forget that it has 60 base power. Overall, a pokemon that has no chance of OHKOing a Jynx with a super effective 60 BP STAB physical attack does not warrant my respect. At all.

    Edit: Charizard I feel is a strong contender for Top-A. High power, great coverage, crucial speed, acceptable bulk, reliable recovery? What's not to love? Stealth Rocks, which are pretty much Zard's Achilles heel. However, even Blaze can turn this giant handicap into a deadly counter-weapon, since the opponent still isn't in the clear quite yet. Solar Power sets can raze near everything into dust as long as it stays alive, while SD sets can shit its regular counters' pants. Definitely a force to be reckoned with, it honestly shocks me how few teams have a remotely solid switch-in for even the regular special Zard, much less surprise Zards.
  13. Aasgier

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    That's because only Grumpig and Munchlax can switch into any variant of the Special Zard more than once, and Regirock is the only one that can switch into Physical Zards (Even Alomo cannot because of Swords Dance, or god forbid, Belly Drum + ThunderPunch hurts). Altaria can switch into most Zard's too but needs to be very wary of Dragon-type coverage many people run on Charizard.

    Edit@Raseri: Leavanny has a harder-hitting Grass-STAB than Sawsbuck. Sawsbuck weak Grass-STAB when unboosted can be incredibly annoying. Leavanny - as well as Leafeon - don't have that problem. Leavanny also saves you on a teamslot if you need both a Grass- and a Bug-type. You should never ever see Leavanny as just a Grass-type, or just a Bug-type. It is both, and should be threated as such, and as such should always and without exception run its Dual STAB. (unlike the aforemented Charizard above, which is predominantly a Fire-type, and quite a few forget Flying STAB in favour of Dragon Pulse/Claw).
    Nozzle likes this.
  14. scorpdestroyer

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    To add on to Punchshroom's post, Zard's reliable recovery allows it to switch in on SR and because it's so scary, take advantage of the switches it causes to heal up and continue to blast away.

    I agree with FLCL about moving Walrein to D-rank tho. I don't think it's useless-Stealth Rock weakness and Ice-typing sure hurts, but it has a decent niche as a specially defensive Water-type. Most other defensive waters in NU are physically defensive and Walrein can do a specially defensive set. Its special attack is decent, and Encore is a great move to have. In fact, Encore helps it to beat Jynx without Focus Blast thanks to the 8x resistance to Ice, lol.

    I also agree with Serperior for Low-A. It does have blazing speed, decent setup move and good utility moves, but usually I find that Serperior is just too weak without setting up, especially against neutral targets. It also has kinda 4MSS in the sense that it has to choose between Taunt, Sub and Dtail. It did a lot of work when it worked, but it isn't the kind of amazing force that wins games every time.
  15. No Luck Involved

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    I have always gotten a lot of mileage out of Serperior, hitting hard unboosted isn't really much of a consideration when it's billing is a boosting sweeper and it gets a hell of a lot of OHKOes at +1. It's all the more dangerous cos of decent bulk, defensive typing and recovery.

    @Treeko: Klang isn't common at all, while Bastiodon can't do anything if Serp carries Taunt. I tend to use HP Rock because it has so much utility in hitting Scoli, Jynx and Flying and Fire types. But it's not just a case of choosing a hidden power, Serp is well capable of going all out with CM + 3 attacks (namely Giga Drain, Dragon Pulse and HP Fire):

    +1 252 SpA Life Orb Serperior Dragon Pulse vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Altaria: 255-302 (87.62 - 103.78%) -- 25% chance to OHKO
    +1 252 SpA Life Orb Serperior Dragon Pulse vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Charizard: 152-179 (51.17 - 60.26%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    252 SpA Life Orb Serperior Hidden Power Fire vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Scolipede: 190-224 (72.51 - 85.49%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    Jynx is of course an OHKO and Metang, Grass types and Dragons are taken care of.

    As an aside, 4 SpA Camerupt Lava Plume vs. +1 0 HP / 0 SpD Serperior: 126-150 (43.29 - 51.54%) -- 5.08% chance to 2HKO
    while Serp does +1 252 SpA Life Orb Overgrow Serperior Giga Drain vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Camerupt: 235-278 (68.31 - 80.81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
    so basically Camerupt can't switch in to a CM because it can't take 2 hits from Serp.

    Serp does have a few hard counters: Regice, Sap Sipper Miltank, Skuntank, Golbat, Weezing and most Poison types but only a few of them are ever seen regularly. It's mob rule out here but I just wanted to point out Serp has options to outspeed and sweep nearly all the top Pokémon in NU, and it is certainly not easy to switch into or take advantage of thanks to its power and utility. It is one of my favourite and most consistent match winners throughout NU.
  16. Smoker016

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    Lapras should be moved up from C to B rank. Despite its unfortunate Stealth Rock weakness, Lapras is easily the best check to any water type in the tier, having the infamous BoltBeam combo and even having Heal Bell for Alomomola's Toxic.
  17. Manectrifier

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    +2 252 Atk Life Orb Samurott Megahorn vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Lapras: 341-402 (73.65 - 86.82%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock

    Carracosta OHKO's with Stone Edge even without a boost.

    These are the two main water types in the tier, and Lapras loses to them. Besides Alomomola, almost every water type in the tier carries something that can hit Lapras hard. Ludicolo 2HKO's with Giga Drain, CB Floatzel 2HKO's with Return, and Simipour 2HKO's with Grass Knot, or can even set up Nasty plot on the switch and OHKO. Agreed, Seismitoad can't do much with its special attacks, but it's easy to stall out Heal bells PP (if Lapras even carries Heal bell) with Toxic, while it is immune to Thunderbolt and Surf and can take Ice beams for a while.

    I say Lapras stays in C.
  18. Infernis

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    Are we still splitting each rank into thirds? I noticed that S-Rank no longer has the three divisions in the OP. (It might not have been added there to begin with...?)
  19. NfskMjmMal

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    Yes, the rankings are being split into high, middle, and low, denoted A+, A, and A- for example.
  20. Lasagne

    Lasagne "The light that stands out from the darkness"
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    I'm not going to repeat what has already been said, so I'll make this post short and sweet.
    While gardevoir is certainly outclassed by mushy and jynx, gardevoir can do a lot, and that unpredictability is mostly what makes it B Rank in my eyes.
  21. FLCL

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    while jynx does most things better than gardevoir, it does have some significant niches which include will-o-wisp, destiny bond, memento, healing wish, and encore. it can also run a sub-par specially defensive set which can be annoying at times and a dual screens support set. trace allows gardevoir to perform better against rain teams than jynx and is useful in many occasions. it also lacks the stealth rock weakness. i'm not trying to say that gardevoir is better than jynx, but it is not entirely outclassed either. it is still rather unpredictable and can hit extremely hard, which makes it b rank.
  22. DTC

    DTC ˢᵉʳᶦᵒᵘˢ
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    musharna for s rank

    i'm not exactly sure why musharna was moved down from s rank; she's still the same solid pkmn she's always been. because of how solid musharna is and the utility she provides, the only way she can really get worse is a playstyle that completely destroys her (hail), something comes down that provides more utility than her, or there is a significant shift in the balance of power in nu. the only set that really got worse for her was sweeping with cm, but cm mushy is more of a mix between utility walling and sweeping anyways.

    musharna provides a ton of utility to any team, and can wall many top threats like sawk. in addition, she can also do a ton of damage on her own. musharna can do pretty much whatever you want her to do on your team. for offensive teams, she can switch in to mons trying to revenge your pokemon like kangaskhan. then she can either cripple the incoming pokemon or baton pass out in order to gain momentum for your team. this utility is incredibly useful, especially when you consider most pokemon on offensive teams are frail. you can even baton pass a cm boost or two to something like scarf charizard and rip through the opposing team with ease. she also fits very well on bulky offense teams with the utility and monstrous bulk she has. it's incredibly hard to break through musharna, and ohko'ing her without being a boosted pokemon like scolipede is pretty much impossible. she's amazing at taking away momentum from the other team and giving it to her own.

    otr musharna is also very good right now. musharna hits quite hard with a life orb and can easily sweep a weakened offensive team. unlike other sweepers, musharna is super durable from moonlight and bulk, even though she has a life orb.

    you pretty much never go wrong with putting a musharna on your team. she's really that good, and can help your team in numerous ways.

    :toast:
    Raseri likes this.
  23. FLCL

    FLCL
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    i'll support musharna for s rank since it is really good as a defensive pivot with its slow baton pass and ability to wall most physical attackers. the calm mind set isn't as effective anymore but it can still do a lot of work once certain threats are out of the picture. the offensive sets can also take a lot of teams off guard. like dtc said it's really easy to slap on any team regardless of playstyle due to its sheer versatility and the amount of threats it checks just by being there.
  24. ScraftyIsTheBest

    ScraftyIsTheBest Screw Water Druddigon
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    Hopping on the Musharna train, since while it got a little worse, it's still insanely good in this metagame. I've used Baton Pass Musharna (with CM too), and it's pretty good to pass onto stuff, which is pretty awesome. I've also used CMPass Musharna, and just passing it onto strong special attackers like Samurott and the likes is pretty fun. I still use it and it still functions well as a catch all defensive pivot, walling stuff like Sawk and the like. Musharna has a pretty awesome support movepool so it can support its team rather well. Also, as said, the LO sets are pretty good that have reasonable power as well as to a lesser extent some surprise factor. Yeah, I support Musharna for S for these reasons along with the reasons stated above.
  25. No Luck Involved

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    I don't see any problem with Mushy in S rank, it's really solid and easy to use and can do a lot for its team and threaten to sweep. The top Dark types really keep its offences on a leash but that's about the only bad thing to say about it.

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