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Offensive Gen 5 Uber Team (Dream World Ubers RMT)

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by j99ubers, Dec 15, 2010.

  1. j99ubers

    j99ubers

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2010
    Messages:
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    Introduction: As a primarily offensive player through most of Gen 4, when Gen 5 rolled around I decided that this would be no different. However a new threat to offensive teams emerged this gen, the auto-sashed Forry, and bringing the bane of any offensive team with him, Toxic Spikes. So I decided to build a team that was able to cope with Toxic Spikes without losing any offensive power. It has done quite well so far, peaking at #3 on the Smogon PO server with a ranking of 1493. So, now on to the actual team itself:

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Credit to Arkies for the animated sprites and Veekun for the rest.

    [​IMG]

    Darkrai@Life Orb
    Trait:Bad Dreams
    EVs:4HP/252SpA/252Spe
    Timid Nature (+Spe,-Atk)
    -Dark Void
    -Nasty Plot
    -Dark Pulse
    -Focus Blast

    The first half of my offensive core that more often than not also acts as the lead. In the absence of a pokemon to set hazards on the team, Darkrai is vital in minimising the opponents hazards. With its blistering 125 base speed its outrun by very few non-scarf pokemon that are commonly seen in the uber metagame, the only ones that can being Mewtwo,Shaymin-S, and the Deoxys formes. It also can easily incapacitate any potential counter that may switch in on it with its Dark Void,one of the key stallbreaking tools in Darkrai's arsenal. It also sets up incredibly quickly with access to Dark Void allowing it to 2HKO even Evolution Stone Chansey with Focus Blast after a Nasty Plot.

    [​IMG]

    Arceus@Toxic Plate
    Trait: Multitype
    EVs:252HP/4SpD/252Spe
    Timid Nature (+Spe,-Atk)
    -Will-O-Wisp
    -Thunder Wave
    -Stealth Rock
    -Recover

    After alot of recommendation I decided to include SR in my team since it let me weaken threats that I would struggle to beat otherwise. Since Poison Arceus was subpar as a sweeper I decided a full-on supporter set was probably the way to go. This allows to me to spread paralysis to the opponents team. Since this thing is bulky as hell it helps take some of the burden from wobb when it comes to revenging scarfers since this can often paralyse them or the next incoming poke. Although Will-o-Wisp an Thunder Wave may seem excessive it allows me to slow down Kyogre, Palkia,Dialga, Rayquaza and Shandera among others while still allowing me to cripple SD Arceus, Groudon and Zekrom. I've generally found this to be much more successful than the other set although the lack of attacking move can often be a pain. But overall I feel with SR and the ability to spread status this adds a greater degree of consistency to my team.

    [​IMG]

    Mewtwo@Life Orb
    Trait:Anxiety
    EVs:4HP/252SpA/252Spe
    Timid Nature (+Spe,-Atk)
    -Calm Mind
    -Psycho Break
    -Aura Sphere
    -Ice Beam

    The second half of my offensive core and posseses the raw power to tear through teams by itself after a single Calm Mind. This gen it gained the addition of Psycho Break, an incredible move that allows Mewtwo to ease past its previous counters, such as Kyogre, Blissey, and Ho-Oh. The normal set for Mewtwo includes Fire Blast but with Kyogre being on this team, Ice Beam seemed like the more appropriate choice. This also functions as a fantastic revenger for virtually any non-scarfed pokemon with the speed to hit them first and the power to KO them.

    [​IMG]

    Zekrom@Choice Scarf
    Trait: Teravolt
    EVs:4HP/252Atk/252Spe
    Naive Nature(+Spe,-SpD)
    -Lightning Strike
    -Outrage
    -Volt Change
    -Draco Meteor

    This functions as the general revenger for the team and can often power through teams with Lightning Strike alone after Groudon is gone. STAB physical Electric is incredible in the Uber Metagame as it allows you too blast through Kyogre with ease and destroy other walls in the uber metagame such as Blissey,Chansey, Skarmory, Lugia and Ho-Oh. Compliment this with a Dragon STAB and very little can switch into this. Unfortunately Groudon is pretty much a full stop to Zekrom with its massive physical defense and immunity to Lightning Strike. However the standard Groudon is still taking around 50% from Draco Meteor so will be anxious about continually switching into Zekrom. Volt Change allows you to switch threaten switch ins such as Nattorei and Dialga, who can normally threaten Zekrom. By switching to Darkai or Mewtwo you can immediatly threaten these pokemon and keep the momentum on your side.

    [​IMG]
    Kyogre@Leftovers
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 252HP/252Def/4SpD
    Bold Nature (+Def,-Atk)
    -Calm Mind
    -Rest
    -Sleep Talk
    -Boil Over

    The fourth and final stallbreaker in the team and the second bulky Calm Minder. After a single Calm Mind this thing becomes almost impossible to revenge on the special side and the only real checks to this are CM Lati@s, Zekrom(although it can't switch in on Boil Over for fear of a burn) and some variants of CM Arceus. It functions as the teams status absorber and destroys teams who rely on Palkia to stop Kyogre since Palkia struggles to 2HKO after a single CM with Thunder and after 2 Calm Minds it requires a critical hit to beat Kyogre. It helps slow down Ho-Oh since it takes away the eternal sunlight that Ho-Oh thrives on, it can provide a full stop to many physical sweepers if it burns them with Boil Over and even without a burn has the raw bulk to take strong physical attacks.

    [​IMG]

    Tyranitar@Choice Band
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs:252HP/252Atk/4SpD
    Adamant Nature (+Atk,-SpAtk)
    -Pursuit
    -Crunch
    -Superpower
    -Stone Edge

    OK, so as good as Wobbuffet was I noticed while laddering that I had both a large Shandera and CM Latias weakness (thanks trickroom) and that most games if i could get rid of Latias, most opponents had no defence against CM Kyogre. So, this thing does Wobbuffets job (not quite as well but still...) whilst also meaning I can immediatly remove any Latias thanks to his massive Special Defense in a sandstorm and his pursuit. This thing also prevents me from being destroyed by rain sweepers by removing their speed and Rain power boost. In addition to all of this, with a Choice Band, it hits like a Truck and gives my team alot more power on the physical side. It can beat an Arceus that hasnt SD'ed yet since it wont be KO'ed by an unboosted EQ, and it can OHKO Arceus with Superpower, alowing it to slightly check it but the new Poison Arceus set does this better anyway. This whole set leaves me slightly weaker against most choice scarfers (although there aren't many Choice Scarfers who actually do much to Tyranitar, since the majority of choice scarfers are Special Attackers and generally do little damage to Tyranitar who hits them back much harder with Pursuit.)

    Threat List (I'm only going to list the pokemon who are actual threats to the team rather than just any common Uber threat.)



    [​IMG]

    Okay this is difficult to work around due to its raw speed and power but Kyogre can stand up to the commonly seen attacks on the lead version and Zekrom can revenge the Life Orb version.

    [​IMG]

    All of the Calm Mind variants can be stopped by Darkrai's Dark Void and generally aren't too threatening. However the Normal typed Swords Dance version is a huge problem if it gets set up and is the reason for Zekroms nature not being -Def. Since a +2 Extremespeed won't OHKO Zekrom. Thankfully though this thing can set up on very little in the team as it usually takes >50% from any pokemon it faces and is threatened by a burn from Kyogre. Its also often checked by Poison Arceus who can burn it with Will-O-Wisp.

    [​IMG]

    Thankfully this is very uncommon since if it gets a chance to set up it can easily tear through this team with only Kyogre and Tyranitar sometimes able to stop it. Though with the majority of this team being Specially attacking and Zekrom having STAB Electric to deal with it it shouldn't be able to set up too easily.

    The majority of threats listed are OU pokemon and thats since this team is designed in a tier where these pokemon are not incredibly common and therefore less of a threat. However should these pokemon become common in the Uber tier then big changes will have to be made to this team.

    OK, rate away.
  2. trickroom

    trickroom
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    This is a great team. Congratulations on the achievement you had with this team in the leaderboard.

    Poison Arceus isn't helping much for your team against offense as they rarely pack Toxic spikes users. However, his bulkiness does help you probably to set up on weaker pokemon such as Chansey.

    Groudon is going to give the team issues, since he can switch in on Zekrom usually and change the weather to sunny.

    After a Dragon Dance, Rayquaza will be problematic to your team as he OHKOes your entire team with Outrage. Even Kyogre and Wobbuffet are OHKoed. You must not let Rayquaza set up on you or it will end in a disaster.

    Latios can give the team problems too as he can threaten anyone in your team. Zekrom can probably kill him and Mewtwo can Ice beam i guess but it won't OHKO.

    About Sazandora, he is rarely used in Ubers. If you see one, Arceus can set up on him as Sazandora has pretty average Attack stat by Uber standards.

    Offense is still the most common play style in ubers. It's just that most offense teams chose to use Forretress as lead these days.

    Deoxys-S will get at least one layer against you though but he is rare now due to the popularity of Custap berry Forretress
  3. Anachronism

    Anachronism

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    Hello J99. Congrats on your ladder success with this team. Now, onto the rate.

    I think that the basic strategy of abusing the blistering speed stats and powerful attacks of Darkrai + Mewtwo while removing scarfers with wob is good, however I think that the potential of the team is partially wasted by the lack of entry hazards. I used a similar team in Pre-Arceus Gen 4 Ubers to some success that utilized a Deoxys A lead. This lead might serve you well on this team, as it could give you the early hazards your team would like.

    One of my main criticisms with this team is that your Arceus is Forry setup bait all day. There is not much to do about this however, as changing your moveset would open you up to other problems.

    I think that it is rather interesting how little your team worries about opposing threats. I think that it is a testament to the power of your offensive duo that a team like this is possible, as you put very little effort into countering and focus most of your attention to offense.

    I think that trickroom is right when he says that your team is weak to setup sweeps, although it seems like there are very few places for such a setup sweep to occur, which is exactly the mentality that a team like this is based upon. Have you experimented with other scarfers that could potentially revenge kill Rayquaza?
  4. j99ubers

    j99ubers

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    Thanks for both the rates. I might try out an Arceus set that includes Stealth Rock, maybe run an all-out support set with something like Thunder Wave, Will-O-Wisp,Stealth Rock and recover. As for trying out a different scarfer I'm not really sure who could slot into the team in Zekroms place. I was considering Scarf Genosect but that makes my team completely reliant on Kyogre to absorb any Water or Fire attacks and it may give me more headaches against Scarf Shandera. I might have a think about some other scarfers though. Thanks for the suggestions.
  5. trickroom

    trickroom
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    I dont recommend Scarf Genosect over Zekrom. You will lose your weapon to scare out and kill opposing Kyogre easily then. For the Arceus set, it is good to cripple Groudon and Latias but you will be vulnerable to taunters and those that dont mind status too much.
    Scarf Terakion helps you against almost every set up boosters but you don't want to lose Zekrom's power.
  6. j99ubers

    j99ubers

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    Well I'd like to keep at least one status move on Arceus, preferably Thunder Wave. What would you suggest over Will-O-Wisp?
  7. trickroom

    trickroom
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    You need will-o-wisps to Cripple Groudon though. It's up to the team and your preference. Poison has sucky offensive typing but if Judgement impress you it's ok. Ice beam does help you against Rayquaza, Garchomp and prevents Groudon from coming in if you lack Will-o-wisps. Ice beam probably wont save you from Shandera unfortunately.
  8. min min

    min min

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    I usually find max speed scarf Zekrom is just asking for you to be haxed out by speed ties, for that kind of mixed set outspeeding neutral Deo-A with Scarf should be enough. The leftover Evs can go into SAtk for 2HKOing Groudon with Draco Meteor or HP to survive Extremespeeds better.
  9. pokeboss9

    pokeboss9

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    I would call this team simple and effective.
    Especially the trio Darkrai-Mewtwo-Arceus guarantee your sucess. About the the three other team teammebers i m skeptic.
    Lacking a ground resistence and Stealth Rock are your main weak points.

    Your lead Darkrai is ok. I think Darkrai leads are underrated now. Forcing the opposite lead to run Lum or Chesto Berry and destroing their sahes are good reasons to chose Darkrai. The problem is more the item, without life orb it lacks some power to get some important kos.

    Your Mewtwo set is good, one of the bests now. Of ourse you can try out something creative here but it can be fast a gimnick set.

    Poison Arceus absorbs toxic spikes, yeah thats cool, but thats all about it. Poor typing, you relay on its coverage moves. For your team it still works as good as it can. Altough i think Darkrai alone checks Forry leads so i think you are bit overpreparing against t-spikes.
    I like people who are thinking of a support Arceus set, they are wasting their Arceus with playing it like Girantina. Normal takes no skill to use, Ghost and Steel are for pros. About the rest i m not sure, they must born for a special team where they can shine.

    Zekrom was never the poke i like, one 0815 uber-STAB and one non spamable-STAB coupled with a medicore speed stat. Lati@s are much better than him on the Special side and Rayquaza on the physical. Although i have nothing against a slow CB Wallbreaker. Or a Claw Sharpen set with Haban/Yache or Shuca(?!) Berry.

    Ah Kyogre, also a good poke in gen 5. Although its more a wall now. Its the pimped Resttalker you are using here, nothing wrong about it, although i hate the luck with Rest-Talk. Also your Kyogre works only as a wall here, doing very little for the rest of your team. (No Thunder or Swift Swim abusers , nothing weak to Fire. Almost everything can come in when it sleeps and starting to set up, but thats a general risk when using sleeptalkers.

    Wobby is outdated, hard to say but true. The 2 turns less encore really makes this wobb weaker. I would use Nattorei instead of him here. He can get you Spikes or SR and has almost no weaknesses in ubers. Dizzle halves fire attacks, Mewtwo and Darkrai are checked by your Zekrom. It can also annoy the extreme Killer with leech seed and protect. Watch out for Shandera.

    But all in all a nice team.
  10. calze6

    calze6

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    Because you have no switch-in to kyogre, I recommend latias on your team over something, perhaps wobbuffet. You also have no dragon resist so you should consider adding something like jirachi or arceus steel. Since you have extra immunities to toxic spikes, you no longer need to absorb it.
  11. j99ubers

    j99ubers

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    Thanks for the rate. About Stealth Rock I've decided to start using a support set on Arceus that includes Stealth Rock and I can say it helps alot since otherwise this team has real trouble with Lugia if Darkrai has already slept someone. I'm also running Thunder Wave + Will-O-Wisp on it so its now a full support set. The reason I prefer using Zekrom over Rayquaza is that Zekrom is significantly more bulky and has two usable STABS. Its also my only way to stop CM Kyogre from destroying this team if it begins to set up. About Darkrai I do run Life Orb on it simply because its main role is to sweep it simply ends up being used as a lead most games thanks to the Wi-Fi clause. The main reason that Poison Arceus is required is that most smart players using Forretress will end up getting Toxic Spikes down one way or another and if that happens Mewtwo and Darkrai have 5 attacks to use each so will get walled far to easily. I can't see myself getting rid of Wobbuffet. As good as Nattorei would be, as it would provide me with loads of resistances, Wobb allows me to get rid of any opposing scarfer meaning most teams usually lack a way to outrun and kill Mewtwo and Darkrai and Wobb has really been the reason for this team's success. The thing about Kyogre is that without it I become incredibly weak to Reshiram and Shandera. It also functions well as a status absorber for the team since it can rest off the status later. Finally, many teams simply cannot beat CM Kyogre as many try to bring in Palkia anticipating SpecsOgre or Scarf Ogre and without a Crit Palkia will always lose to CMOgre once it gets a single Calm Mind up. To Calze6, the problem is that even with added immunities to Toxic Spikes as long as they are down the Mewtwo Darkrai core dies incredibly quickly and Poison Arceus allows these two to do their job sweeping the opponents team. Like I've stated earlier I really can't afford to get rid of Wobbuffet since he really is the backbone of this team. If I had one more slot to use Lati@s would almost certainly be my choice but I'm really not sure what I can give up to use it, maybe Kyogre but without a weather changer, both Sun and Sand Sweepers can completely destroy me, although it may be something to consider adding to the team. I'll definitely consider Latias if I can find a spot for it.
  12. calze6

    calze6

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    But if you don't put in a dragon resist, then stuff like rayquaza can come in and 2HKO anything.
  13. Meru

    Meru
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    This is a hyper offensive team. Rayquaza has absolutely no room to set up anywhere on this team.
  14. ZetoTarken

    ZetoTarken

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    Um... MixQuaza? 1/2hkos everything except Arceus with Draco Meteorx2 or Draco Meteor+Extreme Speed. Arceus can only survive Draco Meteor+Extreme Speed after SR if it rolls low damage both times.
  15. j99ubers

    j99ubers

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    But it can't outspeed anything on this team to hit it with Draco Meteor and non-STAB extremespeed won't be doing major damage anytime soon. So any Rayquaza that aren't scarfed (lol) don't pose too much of a threat to this team.
  16. j99ubers

    j99ubers

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    Bump for major changes, change of Arceus set, and change of Wobbuffet to Tyranitar.
  17. calze6

    calze6

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    What about scizor over tyranitar? It can trap shandera locked on shadowball with pursuit and it finally gives you a dragon resist.
  18. j99ubers

    j99ubers

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    The problem with that is most of my team that shandera revenges are generally revenged by a fire move, Tyranitar absolutely guarantees that Shandera will be killed. Tyranitar also provides a massive check to Ho-Oh and Reshiram who can still cause massive problems despite Kyogre's presence. Also as I stated Tyranitar really helps me by having two weather changers to stop Rain sweepers from wrecking this team. And although lacking a Dragon resist can be problematic Max HP Poison Arceus can take virtually every Dragon attack and recover off the damage and Burn the Dragon if its locked into Outrage. Tyranitar also provides a Pseudo-resistance to most Special Dragon attacks due to his massive defenses in Sandstorm (equivelant to base 150).

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