Offline Battle Tower teams

DougJustDoug

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Re: Lucathegreat's loss

I'm not the best battle strategist, but I've been playing Jumpman's team in the tower for quite a while. I've gotten screwed a lot, and I've made some bad plays. My earlier post is an example. BTW, I ran up the tower again, and happened to run into the exact Togekiss, Licklicky, Snorlax team in battle 43 (wonder if it's hard-coded or something). Anyway, it went down a little differently, but I came out on top this time. Currently at 60 wins and counting. (Side note: Jumpman's team completely owns Palmer in battle 49!)

On to your loss - I think you made a couple of mistakes. If I'm wrong, I'll let someone else correct me and we'll both learn something.

First, I think I would've switched Starmie at the start. Two Bronzongs carry Shadow Ball, and anything Bronzong would throw at Starmie, won't hurt TTar. Depending on which Bronzong you get, Tar might be able to set up with DD. However, leaving Starmie in wasn't a completely horrible move, since an unstabbed Shadow Ball probably won't kill Starmie (I'm not sure here). After that first move, you have a better idea of what you're facing and Surf puts a dent in all Bronzongs.

After the Trick Room, I would have just kept surfing on Bronzong. Since he used Trick Room, you knew he didn't have Shadow Ball, so he wasn't going to KO you on the next hit, unless he exploded, which the AI usually doesn't do unless it's "cornered". You also knew this wasn't a SpDef EV's version, and you saw that first Surf put Zong in the yellow. Another surf would have killed it. Switching to a neutral non-STAB move (t-bolt) was a bad decision and cost you a KO.

Even though Starmie would be at low health after the KO, it's still a very effective pokemon because of it's speed and movepool. This was the big lesson I learned from Jumpman's advice to me earlier - don't sacrifice Starmie just because it's banged up. Switch in Tyranitar and let it take some hits and bring back Starmie to finish. Once I started "protecting" my low-health Starmie (I was sacrificing it too often), I've had better results against the tougher teams.

Another point on switching in Tyranitar to protect a battered Starmie -- getting sandstream up is a huge boon for Garchomp. Many times, Tar will draw a Focus Blast from the opponent. In those cases, a switch to Garchomp is almost a "free" switch. With SS evasion, and the low accuracy of Focus Blast, it will miss much of the time on Chomp. I've had this happen four times since battle 42 -- keep it in mind.

As for the Ice Fang from Luxray, that looked like a chicken-shit move by the AI. But, it really wasn't. You probably got the Swagger Luxray. The AI is not going to lay status (T-wave) on a Natural Cure Starmie, it can't Attract a genderless pokemon, and it won't Swagger a special attacker like Starmie. It's only logical move was to Ice Fang you.

Now, what should you have done? You didn't know which Luxray you faced, but you did know the possibilities. You knew that two Luxray's carried Ice Fang, so I don't know if I would have switched Chomp into a trick-roomed Luxray in the first place. Even if you would have gotten a free switch on an electric move, there was a 50% chance you would have to switch right back out again anyway. Tyranitar can take all forms of Luxray in the BT. One of them has Iron Tail, which will hurt but not KO. The Swagger Luxray kinda sucks, and I've gotten it before. It's annoying for DDTar, but beatable unless the AI keeps haxing you, which can't ever be beat by any team.

With Luxray out of the way, you've got three pokes against Gardevoir. If Trick Room was still up, she's toast against a Tyranitar Crunch. If not, she's toast against Garchomp's Crunch (or Outrage or EQ for that matter). See my earlier comment regarding SS evasion vs the Focus Blast she used on you.

I don't think you got haxed in that matchup. The Ice Fang from Luxray was subtle but could have been accounted for, if you looked at the BT threat list. This opposing team shouldn't have caused you too many problems.
 
Hey, thanks a lot man! ;-)
BTW, my Starmie unluckily hasn't Natural Cure... I barely managed to get a Modest one with great IV in both SpAtk and Speed, so well... that's the price to pay.
But for what I've seen, a lot of pokès used Thunder Wave against it, even if they had another good attack move... that's why I thought Luxray would've used it.

Now I managed to arrive at 36.
A Jynx, a single Jynx, killed ALL of my pokès. This one should surely be listed in the Jumpman's team threats...

From Starmie, I changed into Tyranitar trying to Crunch it.
At the second turn (after an obvious Shadow Ball) she used Focus Blast.
Tyra KOed.
Ok... now go Garchomp!
Jynx was quicker again and used Ice Beam.
Garchomp KOed.
Go Starmie!
I used Surf but obviously I didn't kill her.
She used Shadow Ball.
Starmie dead.

Damn, why is it so hard? I can't even imagine when the legendaries will start to pop up, after Palmer! I really doubt I will ever go THAT far.
I hate the BT.

BTW, I was thinking... What if I replace Starmie for the classic Electivire (Cross Chop, TBolt, Ice Punch, EQ)? Do you think it will be better?
The bad about Starmie is that it doesn't have any fight and ground move, which seems to help a lot against the first pokès...

Oh, and another thing. I was thinking... on Starmie woulnd't be better Wise Glasses instead of Expertbelt? I mean, EB raises the power of just SE moves, while WG of every kind of Special Moves (including SE ones too)...
 
I'm using this team:
Starmie @ ChoiceSpecs/ Focus Sash
Modest nature not Timid T_T
252spd, 252sp.atk, 6hp,
~TBolt,
~Surf,
~Ice Beam,
~Psychic / Grass Knot,
----------------------
Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Adamant nature
252spd, 252atk, 6hp,
~Spore,
~Seed Bomb,
~Focus Punch,
~Substitute / Mach Punch,
---------------------
Weavile @ Choice Band
Naughty nature
252spd, 252atk, 6hp,
~Ice Punch,
~Night Slash,
~Pursuit,
~Brick Break,
--------------------
Metagross @ Leftovers
Adamant nature or Naughty (I have to check it)
252atk, 128def, 128sp def,
~EQ,
~Meteor Mash,
~Explosion,
~Agility,
Agiligross BTW

These four pokés are the pokés I mostly use in the Battle Tower.
 

DougJustDoug

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From where you were, you should have gone to Chomp and KO'd with Fire Fang.

Ok... now go Garchomp!
Jynx was quicker again and used Ice Beam.
How was she quicker? Unless you really didn't spend any time breeding your Chomp, he outspeeds her. If you're running a Choice Scarf (like you should), it's not even close. No BT Jynx's run with a Quick Claw. Easy kill for Chomp.

Why did you switch your Starmie in the first place? Starmie 2HKO's Jynx with Surf. Only one Jynx has Shadow Ball and it doesn't KO Starmie. Same goes for the Energy Ball Jynx. Starmie's faster. This Jynx is not too bad. The LK Jynx's are a moderate pain in the ass.
 
hbdragon88 what if you ran energyball or grass knot on latios to handle the watergrounds
Well, I decided to dust off my Latias, and I gave her Dragon Pulse and Grass Knot over Boltbeam w/ a Draco Plate to simulate the Expert Belt boost, but only for Dragon Pulse (whcih will be the most used move when I have to call on her). I now venture back into the Tower with more confidence.
 

Lee

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Sure, why not.

Blaziken @ Salac Berry
Trait: Blaze
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 188 Atk, 96 Def, 224 spd
31/31/31/26/31/30 (speed last)
- Bulk Up
- Blaze Kick
- Baton Pass
- Substitute

Swellow @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Guts
Nature: Jolly
EV's: 4 HP, 252 Att, 252 spd
30/31/25/9/26/31 (speed last)
- Protect
- Brave Bird
- U-Turn
- Facade

Suicune @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
Nature: Bold
EV's: 252 HP, 168 Def, 88 SpA
24/7/30/23/19/17 (speed last)
- Calm Mind
- Surf
- Ice Beam
- Roar

Currently at 56 and going strong.

Blaziken bulks up against physical leads, eventually subs into a Blaze/Salac and sweeps with boosted Blaze Kick. Substitute is a great move on a lead in order to avoid OHKO attacks and just for scouting purposes.

If a Pokemon who resists Blaze Kick arrives, I Baton Pass the boosts to Swellow or Suicune. A Swellow with attack boosts does a LOT of damage with Guts boosted Facades. The defence from Bulk Up helps him to get in as well.

If it's not suitable for Swellow, I Baton Pass the defence boosts to Suicune who begins to Calm Mind. I used to have Rest until I was put out by a Dragon Dancing Lapras, then once again by a BrightPower Nasty Plot Slowking. I find Roar to be far better.

It has been a pleasure to play with this squad as they are my three favourite Pokemon. Thankfully they work quite well in tandem...there are a few Pokemon who I'm weak to however. If faced by Starmie, I may have to sacrifice a Pokemon in order to get Swellow in for the OHKO. Anyway, wish me luck.
 
Salamence@Choice Specs
Timid nature
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spd/6 HP
- Draco Meteor
- Dragon Pulse
- Hydro Pump
- Flamethrower

Weavile@Choice Band
Jolly nature
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spd/6 HP
- Ice Punch
- Pursuit
- Night Slash
- Brick Break

Heracross@Choice Scarf
Adamant nature
EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spd/6 HP
Ability: Guts
- Close Combat
- Stone Edge
- Pursuit
- Megahorn

IVs were 31 Atk/Spd (Hera and Weavile) or 31 SAtk/Spd (Salamence). The rest I don't recall, though I do remember Hera having 31 HP.

Got to battle 86 and lost thanks to a trick room team; in fact, it was 1-0, and if I had let Heracross get killed (Gengar's) by Sludge Bomb (ie, remembering that there was a Trick Room there), Salamence could've easily come in and won me the battle. However, I switched in Salamence for some obscure reason and ended up losing. I think it was because I was locked to Close Combat and thought that I may as well sacrifice something.

As for this team, it's gotten me through fast. My reasoning for using an all-out offensive team dealt with the fact that my belief towards the Battle Tower was to beat it by using fast approach, seeing as the AI is... just an AI, and is not fun to fuck around with when using an annoyer or tank.

I lead with Salamence to KO the first Pokemon with Draco Meteor, or lure Ice Beams to get Weavile in safely, seeing as it takes about 35-40% from the average ice beam, allowing it to counter with Brick Break back.

Heracross is mainly there for being able to go first and do massive damage while it's there; 200+ speed, two moves at 120 STAB power, one move at 100 unSTABbed power, and finally 185+ effective attack is very deadly in the battle tower, and does loads to enemies; Close Combat OH and 2HKOs many things in the battle tower.

Weavile is mainly a revenge killer for me (seeing as it's never OHKO'd anything without a weakness), and Salamence makes roast out of anything that comes in its way really, mainly due to the coverage it receives from that moveset and the large amounts of power it gets from the Specs as well as Draco Meteor, STAB Dragon Pulse, Hydro Pump, and Flamethrower's decent coverage.
 
....ok, I got to 48 wins (lost to Palmer #2) with this team, but I know that I screwed up though

Heatran@ Expert Belt
TImid
CS Set
Flamethrower
Earth Power
Dragon Pulse
Explosion

Starmie@ Focus Sash
Timid
252 sp.atk, 212 spd, 40 hp
Surf
Ice Beam
T-bolt
Rapid Spin...(this is my Wi-fi starmie)

Ludicolo@ Damp Rock
Calm
124 sp.atk, 76 sp.atk, 104 spd, rest in hp
Surf
Ice Beam
Leech Seed
Energy Ball/Rain Dance

ok, Palmer screwed me up......

I started Heatran, and he sent out Cressilia

Heatran-Flamethrower(was 4HKO I think)
Cressilia-Calm Mind

ok, I panicked, exploded and lost myself the match when that happened

Heatran -Explosion
Cressilia-Calm Mind(at like 25-30%(

yeah, it lived. so I sent out Colo, and Leech Seeded it, then 2HKOed with Surf(it just hit me with 2 Psychics......)

Heatran was next, finished off Ludi with Magma Storm

Starmie OHKOed it,

basically, I should have ran my Machamp here instead of Colo, but didn't and while starmie was about 5-10% from OHKOing, I found that Giga's Crush Grip would have OHKOed it without the savior of focus sash.

I really think that I need a physical poke, was thinking of CBape, or my Machamp but I really don't know, if I had switched to Colo instead of exploding I would've won I think- but I like this team, I can literally count the number of times I've gotten hit by OHKO moves on 1 hand, and starmie was saved by focus sash twice on those. also DT doesn't seem to screw me over, just need to get a leech seed off before too much damage is done, But at least I've increased my streak some.
 
I just lost at 72... holy s**t.
I hate Medicham. It OHKOed both Garchomp and Tyra.
But I had to switch Starmie, if it was a TPunch or Shadow Ball one it would have OHKOed me...
BT is damn impossible to complete, and now I have to start all over again...
 
Well, i am currently at 105. Maybe i try to get further^^

Lol, i'm one of many persons who uses the team designed by jumpman (Starmie, Tyranitar, Garchomp) ;) Greez, its really awsome. I find it myself very easy to get to 105 wins actually, based on the genius that jumpman is. Oh and i think i'm pretty lucky with the posts of DougJustDoug and Lucathegreat in mind: I became no victim of any crucial Quick Claw Hax or CHs or freeze and para. I also faced problematic threads like Weavile only once or twice and get lucky with DTs and OHKO users.

When i read the thread, i ask myself what IVs jumpmans pokes have. I thinks they have flawless IVs in the stats that matters most (31 in Spd and Atk/Sp.Atk). If anyone is interested, i post my IVs to get you an orientation:

Starmie -> 29 / 21 / 29 / 30 / 17 / 30 (Spd last)
Tyranitar -> 17 / 30 / 21 / 28 / 19 / 30 (Spd last)
Garchomp -> 25 / 30 / 22 / 21 / 28 / 30 (Spd last)

As you can see, you do not need perfect IVs if luck is on your side*gg* I just need to what out for the Base 100 Spd Pokes that uses + natures in Spd with 255 EVs (Salamence, Staraptor, etc.), because they are actually one point faster than Starmie. I also put 100 EVs in Garchomps Spd Stat to reach 396 at Lvl 100 xD
The team does not have many problems, maybe you need to be careful when facing Starmie, Ludi and Weavile like the others said. When i first try to reach 100 wins, i got beaten down by a Reversal Lucario with a salac berry. I was not prepared and my Starmie was dead :( Don't let your Starmie die!!!

The thread is really a help for anyone who tries his luck in the BT. So, thanks for your good teams and strategies. Maybe thats the reason why most people uses jumps team: He explains very detailed how it functions and the discussions about it helps a lot too :) Hm, not much more about it to say ^.^ Ah, i find the Lum Berry on Tyranitar to be extremly helpful: It protects you from the nasty side effects (ie, freeze from Icebeam, etc.), helps you to get him in and set up. And one more thing: I read a lot about scarifing Tyranitar, not to sweep and let him take a hit ... Thats of course absolutly right, but remember: If your Tyranitar gets like 2 or 3 DDs in, the battle is more than often over. Well, guard all your pokes good ;)

Good luck to Lucathegreat, DougJustDoug and all the others. Its absolutly possible with the great team from jumpman to get 100+ wins, just try again!!!

lg
[-Ac-]
 
The team does not have many problems, maybe you need to be careful when facing Starmie, Ludi and Weavile like the others said. When i first try to reach 100 wins, i got beaten down by a Reversal Lucario with a salac berry. I was not prepared and my Starmie was dead :( Don't let your Starmie die!!!
Yeah, I agree. Ludi is pretty annoying, expecially if it's the first one... I usually change to Garchomp and Outrage him. Weavile not so much, I usually change to Tyra and use Stone Edge.

Congratulations and thanks for the good luck, man, we'll surely need it. ;P

BTW, what to you guys think is the best way to deal with Medicham? He's like my nemesis, and I really don't know what to do when I meet him as the first pokè... If I keep Starmie I surely got the first hit but in case of the Salac Berry one it's a bad idea, 'cause for the rest of the battle he'll be quicker than anything, Scarfchomp included.
If it has Thunderpunch he'll use it and OHKO my Starmie, (not sure about Shadowball, but it will surely make a lot of damages) but if I change to Garchomp is just a matter of luck: TPunch or SBall won't do anything, but if it's the Focus Punch one he'll surely use it and hit if I change, OHKOing Garchomp. And of course changing to Tyra is the worst idea, since as soon he appears he'll be OHKOed by any fight move Medicham has...
 
My record's 92, before I switched teams and got to 111

Gyarados @ Life Orb
Adamant
Waterfall
Ice Fang
Earthquake
Dragon Dance

Porygon-Z @ Focus Sash
Timid
Tri-Attack
Thunderbolt
Ice Beam
Nasty Plot

Spiritomb @ Leftovers
Bold
Dark Pulse
Calm Mind
Will-o-Wisp
Rest

The only thing that's trouble apart from quick claw/sheer cold/whatever shenanigans is gardevoir or starmie leads with thunderbolt. I might switch to a modest/choice scarf porygon, it could save me a lot. Or maybe an electivire to combat the thunderbolt.
 
I don't really like this team now as it's just my usual physical sweeper/special sweeper/mixed wall format. I've made a better one that hasn't had a chance to get far because the power ran out.

Died Battle 59 (Articuno is gay)

Infernape @ Life Orb
Trait: Blaze
EVs: 56 Atk / 252 Spd / 200 SAtk (iirc)
Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def)
-Close Combat
-Nasty Plot
-Grass Knot
-Flamethrower

Just to beat Palmer's Heatran and Regigigas, really.

Gyarados @ Focus Sash
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 76 HP / 252 Atk / 180 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
-Dragon Dance
-Earthquake
-Ice Fang
-Waterfall

Just for the sake of it. Focus Sash could beat the item clause and give me an automatic Dragon Dance.

Spiritomb @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 144 SDef
Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
-Dark Pulse
-Hypnosis
-Will-o-Wisp
-Pain Split

I now permanently have this in my team to beat Palmer's Cresselia.

EDIT: Just realised how similar this is to the above poster's.
 
I'm using this team:
Died battle 49 (damn hax)

Starmie @ ChoiceSpecs/ Focus Sash
Modest nature not Timid T_T
252spd, 252sp.atk, 6hp,
~TBolt,
~Surf,
~Ice Beam,
~Psychic / Grass Knot,

Great type coverage and a good standard sweeper.
----------------------
Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Adamant nature
252spd, 252atk, 6hp,
~Spore,
~Seed Bomb,
~Focus Punch,
~Substitute / Mach Punch,

I like spore subpunch so I'm using it often
---------------------
Weavile @ Choice Band
Naughty nature
252spd, 252atk, 6hp,
~Ice Punch,
~Night Slash,
~Pursuit,
~Brick Break,

Regular Weavile
I changed my post. The fat words are new.
 

DougJustDoug

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BTW, what to you guys think is the best way to deal with Medicham? He's like my nemesis, and I really don't know what to do when I meet him as the first pokè... If I keep Starmie I surely got the first hit but in case of the Salac Berry one it's a bad idea, 'cause for the rest of the battle he'll be quicker than anything, Scarfchomp included.
On Medicham, I would switch to Tyranitar and see what I'm up against. You have a 25% chance of of eating a Fighting move, in which case, TTar is toast. You have a 75% chance of getting a Thunderpuch or Shadow Ball. Either way, TTar can take it. If you get the Shadow Ball, you can kill Cham with TTar. If you get a Thunderpunch or TTar dies to a fighting move -- either way, your next move is to Garchomp, who OHKO's all four Medicham's with Outrage (you could also KO with Earthquake and a little SS damage), but it's not guaranteed. If it holds on with Focus Band, it's killed by sandstream. No matter what, you've still got a healthy Garchomp under SS, and a full-health Starmie waiting in the wings.
 
On paper, Medicham looks like a tough thread, but when you factor in the AI ;) I only faced it once, so this guy does not have much experience :D

Lets see, their are 4 different Medichams:

Medicham 1 Jolly Focus Band 135 112 95 72 95 145 Force Palm Thunderpunch Rock Slide Reversal Atk/Speed
Medicham 2 Jolly Salac Berry135 112 95 72 95 145 Endure Reversal Psycho Cut Thunderpunch Atk/Speed
Medicham 3 Lonely Brightpowder 135 123 85 80 95 132 Attract Focus Punch Drain Punch Ice Punch Atk/Speed
Medicham 4 Modest Wise Glasses 135 72 95 123 95 132 Calm Mind Focus Blast Psychic Shadow Ball Sp. Atk/Speed

The first two are faster than Tyranitar. The Salac Sweeper outspeeds Garchomp with Scarf and Starmie after the boost. Tyranitar and Garchomp can not take a fully powered Reversal. Maybe Starmie survives a hit, i don't know...*Damage Caluculator^^*

Lets say Medicham starts and you have all your pokes healthy. Well, knowing your opponent is the best thing, so a switch to Tyranitar is the way to go like DougJustDoug said. I guess No. 1/2/4 will not hurt your Tyranitar. If it uses SB, you know that it is No. 4 and you can Crunch it (OHKO? -> Damage Calculator).
If you get hit by RS (unrealistic) its No. 1 and faster than Tyranitar. Switch to Garchomp, pray that Force Palm doesn't paralyzes you or Focus Band kicks in, SS will kill it in that case anyway, and OHKO it with Outrage or EQ. Again, use a Damage Caculator to check if you can KO.
Than their is Thunder Punch. It can be either No. 1 or No. 2. Switch to Garchomp and attack: If its No. 2 and uses Endure, SS will kill it.
When you face No. 3 things get a little bit difficult: It will not use Ice Punch and Attract against your Starmie. So you will get hit by a fighting attack. No good if you switch to Tyranitar. At least you can bring back your Starmie or use Grachomp and KO it.

I guess you need to do some calculations if you want to be on the save side: Is your Tyranitar faster than No. 3/4 (regarding the IVs)? Does Reversal kill Starmie (only necessary if it sets up, in which case you are very unlucky xD) and if you can kill Medicham in one hit witch either Crunch or Outrage/EQ (i think so)?

Well, DougJustDoug explanis it already^^ Medicham is actually pretty easy to defeat when all your Pokes are healthy. It can become quiet problematic if they are injured.

lg
[-AC-]

edit: Max Spd Tyranitar rocks :)
 
I hate leet hax'd OHKO moves. Anyways..

Weavile @ Focus Sash
Jolly | 252Atk/252Spd/6Hp
- Ice Punch
- Swords Dance
- Brick Break
- Pursuit

Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
Adamant | 252Atk/252Spd/6Hp
- Dragon Claw
- Crunch
- Fire Blast
- Earthquake

Togekiss @ Leftovers
Calm | Some spread that made it bulky which I made up myself oO"
- Air Slash
- Aura Sphere
- Thunder Wave
- Roost

I lost at Room 51 from Sheer Cold Articuno. -_- It sheer colded my Weavile which I sword danced first turn then I used Ice punch which did half. He then used ice beam to finish me off. I sent out Togekiss, he goes first Sheer Cold! I die -__-" I send out Garchomp and used Fire Blast and I didn't kill it xD. He uses Ice Beam I die. Basically my team sucks and I'm thinking.. sandstorm team?
 
Thanks a lot guys :)
In fact, my Tyra has just 17 of Speed IV (but I had to keep it... it has 25-30 at all the others), so it won't outspeed Medi at any time...

Now I'm at 70 again, let's hope to reach 100 this time... with a bit luck, maybe. :P


EDIT: Nevermind. Lost again at 77. A Meganium OHKOed my Garchomp with a Frenzy Plant critical hit. Yeah, sure...
I'm about to give up, I'm not lucky enough to finish the BT...
 

Jumpman16

np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
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personally i think that those of you using rapid spin starmies and your average speed pokemon are kinda doing yourselves a disservice in the long run but i won't pretend that actual biking and stat-matching isn't about the least "productive" thing you can do with your life, even if the end product is a great poke for the BT. so if you're a TV watcher you may want to entertain the thought of breeding at that time, as it will do your efforts in the BT wonders in the long run.
 

DougJustDoug

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personally i think that those of you using rapid spin starmies and your average speed pokemon are kinda doing yourselves a disservice in the long run but i won't pretend that actual biking and stat-matching isn't about the least "productive" thing you can do with your life, even if the end product is a great poke for the BT. so if you're a TV watcher you may want to entertain the thought of breeding at that time, as it will do your efforts in the BT wonders in the long run.
I agree completely. Although, my battle tower results aren't giving me much hope. I've bred my Starmie, Tyranitar and Garchomp to be almost perfect. Before I decided to run with your team, I already had the Starmie and TTar from Emerald. That's one of the main reasons I decided to go with your squad. All I had to breed was the Garchomp. All of them have perfect speeds and near-perfect attacks and HP. All have high 20's in defenses.

I'm still getting jobbed in the Battle Tower.

My latest defeat was at 65. Here's the warstory:

I send out Starmie.
Opponent sends out Venusaur.

This is gonna be easy. I normally hate grass leads against Starmie, because it means I have to Ice Beam without STAB and hope it KO's. But since Venusaur is poison, it will get a big STAB SE Psychic right up it's grass-ass. I don't even need to check the threat list on this one. Bye bye Venusaur.

Venusaur used Seed Bomb!
(Starmie fainted)

Fuck me! A goddamn Quick Claw. What a ripoff. This just went from easy to very hard in one move. I don't want to switch to Garchomp, which might get locked into a bad move (like Fire Fang) or will need two hits to KO with Outrage. With two hits of Outrage, I'm confused and screwed for the next two pokemon. So, I'll switch to Tyranitar, who can dent the Venusaur with Crunch, and will likely die to another Seed Bomb.

I sent out Tyranitar.
Sandstream started.
Tyranitar used Crunch.
(~55% damage to Venusaur)
Venusaur used Curse!
Venusaur gets Attack and Defense boosts, Speed drops.

Lucky break. With a little luck I might actually KO this thing with TTar!

Tyranitar used Crunch!
(~44% damage to Venusaur)
Damn. Left it with one freaking percent...
Venusaur used Seed Bomb!
(Tyranitar fainted)
Sandstream damage to Venusaur
(Venusaur fainted)

Oh well. At least Venusaur is gone. Hopefully, Garchomp can handle the next two, but it doesn't look too good.

I send in Garchomp.
Opponent sends in Ludicolo.

I'm totally hosed. Two of these carry Ice Beam. Even if it doesn't, it will take two hits to KO it. Only choice is Outrage, since it resists EQ and Fire Fang. And Crunch is unstabbed and might take more than two hits. I'm really up shit creek without a paddle.

Garchomp used Outrage!
(~80% damage to Ludicolo)
Ludicolo used Giga Drain!
(~35% damage to Garchomp)
Sandstream damage to Ludicolo.

WTF?!? It had a 4x ice move and didn't use it? Oh well, I might win this thing after all. But confusion is gonna rape me...

Garchomp used Outrage!
(Ludicolo fainted)
Garchomp became confused due to fatigue.
Opponent sent out Nidoqueen.

I never get a third outrage hit. Never. I hate the fucking battle tower! Oh well, it comes down to confusion. If I can get in some move I have a chance. I doubt it, since my earlier luck with Ludicolo is likely the last peice of luck I'll get here...

Garchomp is confused!
Garchomp hit itself in confusion!
Nidoqueen used Avalanche!
(Garchomp fainted)

Another streak bites the dust. That Quick Claw was bullshit, but perhaps I misplayed this one. Any comments? Should I have switched out Starmie from Venusaur? I don't think so, since it would pound TTar and probably take Chomp. Should I have switched in Chomp after Starmie went down? Or did that one Quick Claw hax completely doom me? I'm open for suggestions, since I'll probably go trudging up the Battle Tower again...
 
Another streak bites the dust. That Quick Claw was bullshit, but perhaps I misplayed this one. Any comments? Should I have switched out Starmie from Venusaur? I don't think so, since it would pound TTar and probably take Chomp. Should I have switched in Chomp after Starmie went down? Or did that one Quick Claw hax completely doom me? I'm open for suggestions, since I'll probably go trudging up the Battle Tower again...
I don't think you made big mistakes, maybe you should've changed to Chomp after Starmie went down to try 2HKOing him with Fire Fang, or from Tyra imediately to Chomp to benefit from SS.
But afterall I think you was just unlucky. Bulky grass types are a pain in the ass if they lead the opposite team... Starmie and Tyra are surely dead when facing one of those if they don't OHKO him (which rarely happen), and switching to Chomp may be a good idea if you feel lucky, but you can run into true bastards too (like the Meganium that killed my Chomp with a Frenzy Plant CH..).

BTW, I've noticed that sometimes the AI makes illogical mistakes too.
Like you said, Venusaur didn't killed you even if it could.
And don't know if that happened to others too, but when facing Palmer's Regigigas (he's pretty much always the lead, by me..) he always used Crush Grip (60-65% to Starmie) and then, instead of finishing me off with the same move, he uses for no reason Stone Edge, who does like 20-25%, allowing me to 3HKOing him with Surf...
 
this team has been working out pretty well the last couple of days for me:

heatran - choice scarf
HP electric
fire blast
dragon pulse
earth power

counters most leads pretty well. fire blast has OHKO'ed alakazam, gengar, weavile, and lopunny, as well as a few other threats. haven't faced any gyarados or dragons off the bat that i wanted to try to HP electric or dragon pulse, but earth power has come in handy quite a few times. i wish i could be faster and use a life orb though or something to get more power/versatility.

cresselia - leftovers
rest
sleep talk
charge beam
ice beam

earthquakes coming at heatran are completely wasted when i switch here. also covers the water end of things pretty well. i've outstalled milotics, swamperts, and beat out starmies and feraligatrs as well with this guy. incredibly bulky on the physical end of things, could be a bit more bulky on the special side though.

salamence - focus sash
dragon dance
earthquake
dragon claw
brick break/aerial ace/rock slide

i'm not sure which to choose for the last attack. i've been running aerial ace which is a god send because i would've been screwed against a couple of leech seed/double team ludicolos and other grassers, but i have a problem against TTar and i think brick break would be good. if i get locked into something else not earth power i have to pretty much sacrifice heatran just to get mence in, and sandstorm ruins my focus sash. i'm contemplating putting garchomp here to alleviate that problem but this is just a damn sweet pokemon.

i also used bronzong in the earlier rounds instead of cresselia.

bronzong - leftovers
rest
sleep talk
earthquake
gyro ball

basically a different typing version of cresselia. takes some hits better, some worse, and deals slightly less damage overall i think.

i'm at batle 42 without even a slight concern, i'll continue a bit more later tonight perhaps.
 

Jumpman16

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Yeah Doug, that's a tough break. Before scrutinizing the BT Moveset list I was inclined to never switch Starmie out of Venusaur since I thought an EB Psychic is always a OHKO, but there is actually no variant on which the EB Psychic is a guaranteed OHKO, doing 89% min to the least Defensively EVed one. And of course, that one has QC, as does another. But while Garchomp is definitely not OHKOing any Venusaur, and with a 394 Scarf EQ actually will rarely 2HKO the non-QC variant Sleep Powder one that wouldn't OHKO Stamie with Giga Drain (EQ does 46-54% so even though Venusaur has no Lefties that's iffy), it is probably safer to switch in Garchomp in general, since the chances of a Modest Starmie OHKOing either of the two troublesome Venusaur (the QC ones) is very slim, and Garchomp's EQ will 2HKO three of the four Venusaur with little risk, the only coming from the Sleep Powder Variant that can "set up" with its Big Root Ingrain.

So yeah, this is probably one of the more complicated leadoff matchups, but the slight edge seems to go to Garchomp. Hindsight is 20/20, but if you'd switched that in, you would have made short work of Venusaur and then been able to switch Tyrantiar into Ludi, then have Starmie for Nidoqueen. Venusaur's unboosted Seed Bomb only does 27-33% to a Garchomp with ~160 HP EVs, and is 2HKOed by EQ virtually every time (min 58% then min 39% after a Curse, no Lefties).
 

DougJustDoug

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Just had another streak with Jumpman's team end at 54. I faced an Aerodactyl lead that KO'd Starmie with a CH Stone Edge. I sent out Tyranitar, who took some damage, but KO'd Aero with Rock Slide. Next came out Mamoswine, who KO'd Tyranitar with EQ. It then KO'd my Garchomp with Ice Fang, after surviving the Outrage. I didn't even get to see the next Pokemon. Without that critical hit, I would have likely swept that team with Starmie. Instead, I get to go back to square one.

I'm really thinking about changing to a different team. Just to change the pace. This team generally works great against legendaries and OU pokemon. It's the BL and UU stuff with fucked up movesets and hax that really mess with my streaks. In the case above, the opponent was reasonable and I might have been able to play it differently. But I think I got screwed on the critical hit. OTOH, Stone Edge is a high-CH move, so maybe I didn't get screwed as much as I'd like to believe.
 

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