Project ORAS NU Research Week #8

[Bowtie Addo]

So I used Accelgor and Poliwrath on the same team. As the ladder was ran over by Serperior this week, I caved and joined the snake hype.
Started out with a Life Orb set for Accelgor, yet ended up with the more common Focus Sash lead. Its speed, Unburder ability, plus access to Encore allows you to ensure hazards on the other side of the field even at times when your opponent tries his best to stop you from doing that. As for Poliwrath, I previously had experiences with its Rain Sweeper set, but right now I believe its defensive set has the most viability. Fully investing in its 90/95 bulk helped me the most, being able to stop boosting Gatrs in their pats and phaze out the recently more common Bouffalants trying to take advantage of Serperior teams. Phazing in Circle throw helps out a lot in general, but more so in my case where phazing for hazard damage was the main way to ensure a sweep.

Now individually, Accelgor is as good as a hazard setter as ever. I felt that, especially now with Serperior running around, Accelgor was able to put on more pressure with Bug Buzz besides the other common utility moves- being able to outspeed and KO Serperior that managed to put up a substitute. For times when the snake will be gone, Accelgor has the movepool to aid any team that doesn't need Bug Buzz. Make use of it before the RU people steal it from us.
As it was expected, Accelgor did its job impeccably, but Poliwrath was the one that amazed me the most. I had previously used this exact same set, but pairing it up now with a hazard setter as proficient as Accelgor made its ability to phaze with a STAB Fighting move shine a lot. Besides Circle Throw that was arguably the most commonly used move, having full recovery in RestTalk and being able to fish for burns with Scald made it quite a problem for a bunch of teams I faced.

The team I ended up with:

The One with the Toad'n'Bug

Poliwrath (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
- Circle Throw
- Scald
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

Serperior (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Substitute
- Synthesis

Accelgor (M) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Unburden
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Spikes
- Encore
- Bug Buzz
- Final Gambit

Typhlosion (M) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Eruption
- Fire Blast
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Extrasensory

Steelix (M) @ Steelixite
Ability: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Heavy Slam
- Stealth Rock
- Dragon Tail

Bouffalant (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 156 HP / 252 Atk / 100 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Head Charge
- Earthquake
- Iron Head
- Swords Dance

As I previously mentioned, I decided to use a phazing team. I wouldn't call it hazard stacking, as I didn't try to prevent hazard control on the opposite side of the field, but rather pressure my opponent into wasting turns by trying to clear the field- I had this pleasure of getting Contrary Serp into Defogs. Accelgor acted as the main hazard setter and most of the time it was the go-to lead. Many teams barely have any way to stop you from getting up Spikes. I started off with a team that only showed off my anxiety against Serperior at first, but then realized that Poliwrath alone was not enough of a phazer, so I changed it up a bit and added Mega-Steelix with SR and Dragon Tail for extra hazards and phazing opportunities. The team worked well, but this week sure wasn't a fun one, as Serperior was a thing and teambuilding was quite hindered if you wanted to not lose to mindless Leaf Storm spam-hence the Bouffalant- so I don't think it's worth trying to explain it more, given that it will be quite useless when the snake goes.
Here are some replays where Accelgor and Poliwrath managed to help out.

These replays are of the team I used when I started off;
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/nu-201021166
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/nu-201294030
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/nu-201371018
And here is the team I ended up with:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/nu-202685164

 

[Evan.]

Congrats to Jim E. Russler for winning Week 4 of Research Week! Not only did he have the highest ladder ranking but also had a very informative post.

This week's subject's are Jynx, Kecleon, Mr. Mime, Carracosta

don't forget sign-ups close on Monday!

 

[CanadianWifier]

in with Yveltal, gonna fuck shit up. Glad you finally decided to test some non-nu mons :]
sucks that it got removed


ill dabble around more with Keclon, its fun.
alt: kekelolol

 

[Lord Alphose]

Shoot, I been using Mr. Mime since Sigi got banned.

I'll try to actually do it this week. Alt's Lord Mime.

 

[TehDoomminime]

Ima do Keck, and carcoasta,
ALT: KECLCOASTA

 

[Tornadus-Senpai]

I'm gonna use Kec with Mr mime maybe

New alt:The copycats

 

[Davon]

carrocosta
alt: jackie chang

 

[Karane]

carracosta
alt: gulali

 

[Bobby REKT]

jynx
alt: youowemeasoda

 

[fssong]

kecleon
alt:fsong

 

[snuggles n fluff]

im totaly down for mr mime
alt: my name is mr

 

[Cacturne of Events]

mr mime
alt: mrmime of events
and this time im actually gonna try to contribute

 

[Evan.]

And with that sign-ups are closed for this week. Be sure to post your ladder ranking before Friday!

Let's get some discussion going with these pokes. How useful are these Pokemon in ORAS NU? What sets can they run effectively? What gives them trouble? What advantages do they have over other Pokemon? How well do they work in the metagame?

 

[Cacturne of Events]

i havent really been able to test this at all because ps is incredibly laggy right now and i cant stand it but this is the moveset ive got on my mime right now

IL FKIN KILL U (Mr. Mime) @ Life Orb
Ability: Filter
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Nasty Plot
- Baton Pass
- Psychic
- Focus Blast

idea is you set up on something you can set up on and hit stuff, if something comes up you can bp out into the appropriate mon and preserve the np boost, not sure how good this is in practice/whether it works at all

 

[snuggles n fluff]

i think a cool mr mime set would be filter with dgleam, encore, psychic, healing wish with life orb. kinda like the latias set in ou with the two attacks utility healing wish, but with a mr mime instead of a godly legendary. focus blast or technician hp fire would help for mega steelix but encore is realy good utility.

 

[Evan.]

So nobody posted a ladder ranking for this week so we won't have a winner, don't let this thread die guys any discussion is good discussion!

anyways this week's mons are Gurdurr, Beheyeem, Swellow, and Regice

Let's have a good week of discussion everyone!

 

[Bowtie Addo]

I'll use Gurdurr, Beheyeem, and Swellow because I want Regice to see how much I don't like him.
Alt: RegiNOT

 

[Pokedots]

Regice @ Life Orb
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rock Polish
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Focus Blast

So this is the set I've been using on my not-particularly-good team, but it's certainly better than I expected. Basically this is Regice's best niche in NU, as defensive and non-Rock Polish offensive sets are outclassed by Cryogonal and Jynx. Fortunately, this set's actually pretty fun. It has pretty great 3-move coverage that hits basically everything at least neutrally other than like Shedinja, and in spite of its terrible defensive typing, it finds a sizable amount of set-up opportunities in Grass-types, Water-types, Ice-types, and just generally any special attacker that can't hit it super-effectively thanks to its monstrous special bulk. And while its speed is certainly lacking, it's just enough to outspeed Scarf Mesprit and Accelgor, which is nice. The problem is that it needs a ton of stuff worn down to actually clean late game like Lanturn, Ninetales, Mega Camerupt, Hariyama, etc. I've been paring it with Hidden Power Water Vileplume and Surf Mega Audino, as they're a both great counters to Hariyama that lure Mega Camerupt and other Fire-types, and they've done a solid job of weakening Regice's checks. Specs Typhlosion is also great for this as it has similar checks and counters that it 3HKOes with Eruption

Overall, it's definitely not the worst sweeper you could choose for a team. Won't have a ladder peak because logging out of main and logging in w/ alt is too much effort @_@

 

[Brawlfest]

Regice @ Life Orb
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Rock Polish
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Focus Blast

So this is the set I've been using on my not-particularly-good team, but it's certainly better than I expected. Basically this is Regice's best niche in NU, as defensive and non-Rock Polish offensive sets are outclassed by Cryogonal and Jynx. Fortunately, this set's actually pretty fun. It has pretty great 3-move coverage that hits basically everything at least neutrally other than like Shedinja, and in spite of its terrible defensive typing, it finds a sizable amount of set-up opportunities in Grass-types, Water-types, Ice-types, and just generally any special attacker that can't hit it super-effectively thanks to its monstrous special bulk. And while its speed is certainly lacking, it's just enough to outspeed Scarf Mesprit and Accelgor, which is nice. The problem is that it needs a ton of stuff worn down to actually clean late game like Lanturn, Ninetales, Mega Camerupt, Hariyama, etc. I've been paring it with Hidden Power Water Vileplume and Surf Mega Audino, as they're a both great counters to Hariyama that lure Mega Camerupt and other Fire-types, and they've done a solid job of weakening Regice's checks. Specs Typhlosion is also great for this as it has similar checks and counters that it 3HKOes with Eruption

Overall, it's definitely not the worst sweeper you could choose for a team. Won't have a ladder peak because logging out of main and logging in w/ alt is too much effort @_@

72 HP / 252 SpA / 184 Spe Modest I find to be a good EV Spread as well, as the 72 HP makes setting up and sweeping considerably easier, and even with Modest it gives you enough speed after a single rock polish to get past +Spe base 115s like Sneasel, so I find it is more than enough especially in a slower metagame atm where power is a lot more valuable.

Personally I like this Regice better but whatever:

Regice @ Leftovers / Chesto Berry
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 Spe
Modest Nature
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Focus Blast
- Protect / Rest

Rock polish is cool and everything, but I find in the current metagame Offensive Tank Regice has been the most effective in my testing. Not only does its bulk make it a freaking amazing shut down to nearly any special attacker in the tier. It acts as a safety net against stuff like Lilligant and Special Samurott that a lot of bulky offensive / balance teams have trouble dealing with, and with its bulk can easily pivot in multiple times [especially with good support] to check these threats to make balance teams click. At the same time, its great offenses let it hit hard and not give the opponent an easy time wrestling with teams that cannot afford to lose momentum. Protect + Lefties is the optimal choice easing prediction, healing up passively, and scouting common SE Coverage man pokemon carry, while RestoChesto can alternatively be used if one fears being worn down too quickly.

 

[Mistrals]

Using: Beheeyem, Gurdurr
Alt: TotallySteelWing

 

[Pokedots]

72 HP / 252 SpA / 184 Spe Modest I find to be a good EV Spread as well, as the 72 HP makes setting up and sweeping considerably easier, and even with Modest it gives you enough speed after a single rock polish to get past +Spe base 115s like Sneasel, so I find it is more than enough especially in a slower metagame atm where power is a lot more valuable.

Personally I like this Regice better but whatever:

Regice @ Leftovers / Chesto Berry
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 Spe
Modest Nature
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Focus Blast
- Protect / Rest

Rock polish is cool and everything, but I find in the current metagame Offensive Tank Regice has been the most effective in my testing. Not only does its bulk make it a freaking amazing shut down to nearly any special attacker in the tier. It acts as a safety net against stuff like Lilligant and Special Samurott that a lot of bulky offensive / balance teams have trouble dealing with, and with its bulk can easily pivot in multiple times [especially with good support] to check these threats to make balance teams click. At the same time, its great offenses let it hit hard and not give the opponent an easy time wrestling with teams that cannot afford to lose momentum. Protect + Lefties is the optimal choice easing prediction, healing up passively, and scouting common SE Coverage man pokemon carry, while RestoChesto can alternatively be used if one fears being worn down too quickly.

I like that set and will try it out sometime, but to be honest I probably prefer Cryogonal for this type of thing, as its speed, access to Freeze Dry, reliable recovery, and utility in Rapid Spin would make it my preferred choice most of the time. This is definitely worth a try, though, because of the physical bulk+access to Focus Blast to hit Steel-types Cryo struggles against like Ferroseed and especially Mega Steelix is pretty great.

 

[Evan.]

Sign-ups are now closed for this week. Be sure to post your ladder ranking before Saturday!

Let's get some discussion going with these pokes. How useful are these Pokemon in ORAS NU? What sets can they run effectively? What gives them trouble? What advantages do they have over other Pokemon? How well do they work in the metagame?

 

[ryan]

Swellow is the best. I've been hyping up Specs Swellow since Contrary Serperior was released, and it's still really good. One great quality of the Specs set is that it can lure Mega Steelix and 2HKO it with Heat Wave, even while running Timid:

252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Heat Wave vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Mega Steelix: 180-214 (50.8 - 60.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

But even aside from that, despite having only base 50 Special Attack, Boomburst hits absurdly hard. Fun calcs:

252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Rhydon: 118-140 (28.5 - 33.8%) -- 45.1% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock (can only switch in with Stealth Rock once unless Swellow gets super low rolls every time)
252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Kabutops: 127-150 (48.6 - 57.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock
252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Boomburst vs. 0 HP / 128 SpD Assault Vest Hariyama: 160-189 (37.2 - 44%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock (also only switches in once)
252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Boomburst vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Uxie: 151-178 (42.6 - 50.2%) -- 38.7% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Choice Specs Swellow Boomburst vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Rotom: 237-279 (97.9 - 115.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

The set I most commonly use is:

Swellow @ Choice Specs | Scrappy
252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe | Timid
Boomburst / Heat Wave / Sleep Talk / U-turn

You don't need Air Slash because even when it's super effective, it only hits 225 Base Power vs. Boomburst's 210, while a neutral Air Slash hits 112.5 and a resisted Boomburst hits 105 (only examples of NU Pokemon that resist Boomburst but are neutral to Air Slash that I can think of are Cradily and Armaldo, but still). Locking into Air Slash sucks too.

This set is incredible against offense. Swellow outspeeds nearly every unboosted Pokemon in NU, and offensive teams rely really heavily on priority to kill it, which often just gives you an easy switch into something else. You can also use Swellow to pivot into Ghost- and Ground-type attacks much more easily when running this set than when running the Guts set because it doesn't have a set amount of turns before it dies to poison. It kind of needs hazard support because it misses out on lots of OHKOs vs. bulky offensive Pokemon and doesn't hit anything for super effective damage with Boomburst, but it's not lock hazard support is something that takes away from the rest of your team.

 

[Brawlfest]

I like that set and will try it out sometime, but to be honest I probably prefer Cryogonal for this type of thing, as its speed, access to Freeze Dry, reliable recovery, and utility in Rapid Spin would make it my preferred choice most of the time. This is definitely worth a try, though, because of the physical bulk+access to Focus Blast to hit Steel-types Cryo struggles against like Ferroseed and especially Mega Steelix is pretty great.

Cryo is super passive and has access to literally no coverage that isnt Freeze Dry. Basically it can only run its Ice Stab + Hidden Power, as it needs to dedicate two slots to Recover and Rapid Spin. Furthermore, it really has no physical bulk whatsoever, making it a subpar tank at best, [It also fails to consistently check lilligant without going full SDEF] while Regice gets the added utility of having both insane bulk and better offensive presence with more reliable coverage.

 

[Bowtie Addo]

Had a pretty busy week and couldn't afford much laddering, peaked at 1466- but hey, maybe the rest of you were lazier.

Firstly, Swellow is awesome- but hollywood explained it so well that I really don't have anything to add anymore. Specs Swellow > Guts Swellow.
Gurdurr is probably the best user of Eviolite at the moment. It's a great status absorber, and even if it doesn't get a great deal of setup opportunities, I found it most useful because of its ability to setup on Mega-Steelix. I decided to try and make it shine more by giving it Ice Punch over Mach Punch to also get past Vileplume, but in the long run I do suggest using the usual set of Mach Punch/Drain Punch/Knock Off.
Well those two are standard, and there's not much room to say things that weren't already said before- BUT BEWARE

Because this thing is POWER

Beheeyem (M) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
- Psychic
- Thunderbolt
- Signal Beam
- Trick / Psyshock / Hidden Power Fire

Does it look good? Hell yeah!
Is it powerful? Hell yeah!
Do they know what hit them? Hell no!
Is it good? lolno

Anyhow, Beheeyem was incredibly fun to use. Firstly, it is moderately bulky and is able to take a Knock Off from the Dark-types types that think they can stay in on it (read Malamar) or fighting types that carry Knock Off, bar CB Sawk. I actually ran a variant with both Psychic and Psyshock in case I ever had to face a Hariyama 1v1. Signal Beam 1HKOs all the Dark types that dare to switch into Beheeyem, even Eviolite Pawniard. Thunderbolt is mainly for Xatu and Mantine, though Mantine is also easily dealth with with Psyshock.
And the best part? They think Steelix won't mind coming into one of Beheeyem's attacks. BUT WAIT
252+ SpA Choice Specs Analytic Beheeyem Psychic vs. 252 HP / 252 SpD Mega Steelix: 125-147 (35.3 - 41.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
read: Power

Here are some fun calcs for the sake of it:

Hide

252+ SpA Choice Specs Analytic Beheeyem Signal Beam vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Malamar: 592-700 (157.4 - 186.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Analytic Beheeyem Psyshock vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mantine: 364-429 (108.9 - 128.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Analytic Beheeyem Psychic vs. 200 HP / 56 SpD Seismitoad: 361-426 (90 - 106.2%) -- 37.5% chance to OHKO
252+ SpA Choice Specs Analytic Beheeyem Signal Beam vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Eviolite Pawniard: 232-273 (100.4 - 118.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO

No, I don't suggest using it over other the other Psychic types in the tier, as it has nothing to offer other than random bursts of sheer power- but if you're in for a fun ride, Beheeyem is the mon to go to.
I also completely forgot to save any replay with them in action, my bad. :[