Serious Orlando mass shooting

[jumpluff]

To clarify, it's very easy for people to deflect and say 'this is an unfathomable evil, this is an act of evil perpetuated by barbarian ISIS who hate Americans and human rights or whatever' and totally ignore the safety of the victims, who are actually attacked from all quarters. ISIS are fascists yes, they aren't the only fascists with a history of massacring gay people

The dangerous positions many queer people are in isn't something anyone can absolve themselves of, because queer people are marginalised and threatened in general and this makes us easy targets

edit: Attacking a gay club is absolutely a hate crime, and yes it's religiously motivated

Weird, Islam isn't the only religion that frowns on homosexuality and ISIS aren't the only Muslims last time I checked

edit2: Say the attack was meant to demonstrate, say, a hatred of American freedoms or Western decadence or whatever you all think

The fact that a gay club is a suitable representative of that makes it a hate crime

It's really not a coincidence here that a gay club was targeted over any other club

 

[OLD GREGG (im back baby)]

I'm sorry for snapping like that guys. It's just when I see a tragedy like this and know it will be just another notch on the belt of the lawmaker, I get really worked up. The real issue here isn't gun control-regardless of how it effects that agenda. I'm sorry people have to be killed in order for you all to see how dangerous are the guns. I know that people died here and that hurts my heart, truly. However, they are in a better place or whatever our preachers say. I can't help but think this was politically motivated, regardless of the victims' sexual persuasion.

 

[jumpluff]

I'm sorry for snapping like that guys. It's just when I see a tragedy like this and know it will be just another notch on the belt of the lawmaker, I get really worked up. The real issue here isn't gun control-regardless of how it effects that agenda. I'm sorry people have to be killed in order for you all to see how dangerous are the guns. I know that people died here and that hurts my heart, truly. However, they are in a better place or whatever our preachers say. I can't help but think this was politically motivated, regardless of the victims' sexual persuasion.

It was politically motivated in huge part because of their sexual orientation. I have zero problem with politicising this, it needs to be politicised, it is political whether we acknowledge that or not. But ignoring an important angle of it shows everyone's indifference to queer people and an ongoing trend of targeting them; it is rare that people are so eager to overtly politicise a shooting and this could only happen if the victims were a minority and the killer was a Muslim, i.e. there is no sanctity to it that would ordinarily be established by people trying to maintain control over the gun control debate, and instead many competing angles

And the gun control debate is super important to queer people

And I can't believe you actually posted 'they are in a better place' at the same time as talking about people dying for the advancement of the gun control debate

 

[OLD GREGG (im back baby)]

I don't mean to offend, that's what I've always been told for comfort in times of death. They all say there's a better place than here when someone dies, regardless of the diety worshipped. It was my attempt at consolation. Sorry for trying to say that the situation sucks and I feel bad that people died.

 

[jumpluff]

I don't mean to offend, that's what I've always been told for comfort in times of death. They all say there's a better place than here when someone dies, regardless of the diety worshipped. It was my attempt at consolation. Sorry for trying to say that the situation sucks and I feel bad that people died.

I'm sorry people have to be killed in order for you all to see how dangerous are the guns

It's this that I take issue with

It's really dehumanising, and it ignores the long history of queer people dying because of hatred and bigotry (i.e. the focus on guns alone is also dehumanising)

America and the rest of the world need to show solidarity with the queer community, not against Muslims but against fascism

 

[Rugi]

Saying people are in a better place devalues the horrendousness of death IMO, so be careful about saying that.
edit: ninjad

 

[OLD GREGG (im back baby)]

Saying people are in a better place devalues the horrendousness of death IMO, so be careful about saying that.
edit: ninjad

Hey man, that's not how I feel. That is how the people who use this to their advantage will try to play the situation. As if any good could ever come of many families losing loved ones. I didn't literally mean that statement. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

 

[Rugi]

Hey man, that's not how I feel. That is how the people who use this to their advantage will try to play the situation. As if any good could ever come of many families losing loved ones. I didn't literally mean that statement. Sorry for the misunderstanding.

Nah that was just my kneejerk reaction. I've had people tell that to me and friends of mine when people die and I really feel like it devalues death. Sorry that what I said misenterpreted your original intention.

 

[Hulavuta]

I was hesitant to post considering the direction the thread is going at the moment, the fact that I in no way wanted to make this shooting somehow about me, and that I am really not that comfortable discussing my personal life here, but this has been bugging me all day, and I really have no one else to say it to.

When I heard about the other terrorist attacks in California, France, etc. I obviously felt bad a little but it wasn't really something that lasted with me. Of course everyone would hear about it and say "that is so terrible" but I don't think it bothered most people for very long. I don't think it was something they thought about for more than a few days, except maybe for the political ramifications of it. I remember my friend who is over in Paris on a work Visa was joking "they are after me, and all I have to defend myself is a baguette" and I joked right along with him. It's completely understandable to not be able to really care about something that is happening far away. But as a citizen who lives in Orlando, this shooting has honestly shaken me to my very core. Having something so insane like this happen right next to me has just changed my perspective in a way that is seriously bothering me.

I and everyone I know is completely fine, thank God. Everyone always says that you don't think it can happen until it happens to you, and for me the fact that it didn't happen to me but did happen near me makes me feel weirdly relieved but also concerned at the same time. I still don't think it is going to happen soon, but I am very worried. I am worried for my parents. I am worried for my friends. I am honestly also very worried about all those people I don't know. I have never lost someone close to me in my life yet, and I'm afraid that when it finally happens I won't be able to deal with it. The whole situation with Christina Grimmie just a day before has reminded me that it isn't just terrorists strategically targeting public areas; any crazy person can kill someone at any unexpected time. A few weeks ago, I had a near-death experience of almost drowning after being thrown into a very strong river while rafting. These things just make me think. Nobody starts their day thinking they are going to die, they make a bunch of plans for what they are going to do that day and things just take a dark and unexpected turn. The uncertainty of it is seriously frightening and something I did not really think much about until this series of recent events.

I think what bothers me the most is the fact that I am bothered at all. Even here in Orlando, going about my usual daily business, nothing seemed to be any different. Well, all of the radio stations were playing the news and some were playing extremely patriotic/uniting music, but honestly for everything else, things just continued as normal. It's like nothing changed at all, even this close to where the whole thing went down. I went to McDonald's with some friends and we had some casual discussion about their upcoming wedding next year, the workers and all the other guests were acting like normal people you find at McDonald's. I went to my D&D group and we just played the game as normal like we had been doing for weeks. Of course it was brought up here and there, but again, we just said "man, that is really terrible" and that was the end of it. Some people wrote up some short posts about how upsetting this is on Facebook, but it always seems so shallow to me. Like they just took a few minutes to make that quick post, and now they're moving on to their next thing. Some of my other friends were even complaining about how the "tell your friends you're safe" feature on Facebook was blowing up their phone all day and that they were so annoyed by it. Even though I know it's not true, I feel like I am the only one (who was not directly related to a victim) genuinely bothered and affected by these events and that is making me feel seriously lonely. But maybe everyone else was hiding it just like I was hiding it.

That's really it. I am not usually one who puts his emotions out on Smogon; I'm not trying to whore for attention or trying to take anything at all away from the victims, but this whole ordeal legitimately worries me in a way I have never felt before and I seriously feel very alone about it.

 

[OLD GREGG (im back baby)]

I was hesitant to post considering the direction the thread is going at the moment, the fact that I in no way wanted to make this shooting somehow about me, and that I am really not that comfortable discussing my personal life here, but this has been bugging me all day, and I really have no one else to say it to.

When I heard about the other terrorist attacks in California, France, etc. I obviously felt bad a little but it wasn't really something that lasted with me. Of course everyone would hear about it and say "that is so terrible" but I don't think it bothered most people for very long. I don't think it was something they thought about for more than a few days, except maybe for the political ramifications of it. I remember my friend who is over in Paris on a work Visa was joking "they are after me, and all I have to defend myself is a baguette" and I joked right along with him. It's completely understandable to not be able to really care about something that is happening far away. But as a citizen who lives in Orlando, this shooting has honestly shaken me to my very core. Having something so insane like this happen right next to me has just changed my perspective in a way that is seriously bothering me.

I and everyone I know is completely fine, thank God. Everyone always says that you don't think it can happen until it happens to you, and for me the fact that it didn't happen to me but did happen near me makes me feel weirdly relieved but also concerned at the same time. I still don't think it is going to happen soon, but I am very worried. I am worried for my parents. I am worried for my friends. I am honestly also very worried about all those people I don't know. I have never lost someone close to me in my life yet, and I'm afraid that when it finally happens I won't be able to deal with it. The whole situation with Christina Grimmie just a day before has reminded me that it isn't just terrorists strategically targeting public areas; any crazy person can kill someone at any unexpected time. A few weeks ago, I had a near-death experience of almost drowning after being thrown into a very strong river while rafting. These things just make me think. Nobody starts their day thinking they are going to die, they make a bunch of plans for what they are going to do that day and things just take a dark and unexpected turn. The uncertainty of it is seriously frightening and something I did not really think much about until this series of recent events.

I think what bothers me the most is the fact that I am bothered at all. Even here in Orlando, going about my usual daily business, nothing seemed to be any different. Well, all of the radio stations were playing the news and some were playing extremely patriotic/uniting music, but honestly for everything else, things just continued as normal. It's like nothing changed at all, even this close to where the whole thing went down. I went to McDonald's with some friends and we had some casual discussion about their upcoming wedding next year, the workers and all the other guests were acting like normal people you find at McDonald's. I went to my D&D group and we just played the game as normal like we had been doing for weeks. Of course it was brought up here and there, but again, we just said "man, that is really terrible" and that was the end of it. Some people wrote up some short posts about how upsetting this is on Facebook, but it always seems so shallow to me. Like they just took a few minutes to make that quick post, and now they're moving on to their next thing. Some of my other friends were even complaining about how the "tell your friends you're safe" feature on Facebook was blowing up their phone all day and that they were so annoyed by it. Even though I know it's not true, I feel like I am the only one (who was not directly related to a victim) genuinely bothered and affected by these events and that is making me feel seriously lonely. But maybe everyone else was hiding it just like I was hiding it.

That's really it. I am not usually one who puts his emotions out on Smogon; I'm not trying to whore for attention or trying to take anything at all away from the victims, but this whole ordeal legitimately worries me in a way I have never felt before and I seriously feel very alone about it.

You definitely have the "close call" feeling going on. I think it is a normal response for us to be worried after something like this happens so close to home! I've felt it on and off throughout my life. It too shall pass. Thank your diety that you are safe, as well as your loved ones.

 

[OLD GREGG (im back baby)]

I don't want my words from earlier misconstrued at all, so I'm putting it here for all to see. When I said: "I'm sorry people have to be killed in order for you to all see how dangerous are the guns"

I meant it as a play on words as well as my attempt at consolation. We all know the political implications here, so I will say no more from that angle. At the same time when people die religion provides one of the only sources of comfort, so in that sense I DO hope these unfortunate people have entered a better realm.

 

[ant]

I was hesitant to post considering the direction the thread is going at the moment, the fact that I in no way wanted to make this shooting somehow about me, and that I am really not that comfortable discussing my personal life here, but this has been bugging me all day, and I really have no one else to say it to.

When I heard about the other terrorist attacks in California, France, etc. I obviously felt bad a little but it wasn't really something that lasted with me. Of course everyone would hear about it and say "that is so terrible" but I don't think it bothered most people for very long. I don't think it was something they thought about for more than a few days, except maybe for the political ramifications of it. I remember my friend who is over in Paris on a work Visa was joking "they are after me, and all I have to defend myself is a baguette" and I joked right along with him. It's completely understandable to not be able to really care about something that is happening far away. But as a citizen who lives in Orlando, this shooting has honestly shaken me to my very core. Having something so insane like this happen right next to me has just changed my perspective in a way that is seriously bothering me.

I and everyone I know is completely fine, thank God. Everyone always says that you don't think it can happen until it happens to you, and for me the fact that it didn't happen to me but did happen near me makes me feel weirdly relieved but also concerned at the same time. I still don't think it is going to happen soon, but I am very worried. I am worried for my parents. I am worried for my friends. I am honestly also very worried about all those people I don't know. I have never lost someone close to me in my life yet, and I'm afraid that when it finally happens I won't be able to deal with it. The whole situation with Christina Grimmie just a day before has reminded me that it isn't just terrorists strategically targeting public areas; any crazy person can kill someone at any unexpected time. A few weeks ago, I had a near-death experience of almost drowning after being thrown into a very strong river while rafting. These things just make me think. Nobody starts their day thinking they are going to die, they make a bunch of plans for what they are going to do that day and things just take a dark and unexpected turn. The uncertainty of it is seriously frightening and something I did not really think much about until this series of recent events.

I think what bothers me the most is the fact that I am bothered at all. Even here in Orlando, going about my usual daily business, nothing seemed to be any different. Well, all of the radio stations were playing the news and some were playing extremely patriotic/uniting music, but honestly for everything else, things just continued as normal. It's like nothing changed at all, even this close to where the whole thing went down. I went to McDonald's with some friends and we had some casual discussion about their upcoming wedding next year, the workers and all the other guests were acting like normal people you find at McDonald's. I went to my D&D group and we just played the game as normal like we had been doing for weeks. Of course it was brought up here and there, but again, we just said "man, that is really terrible" and that was the end of it. Some people wrote up some short posts about how upsetting this is on Facebook, but it always seems so shallow to me. Like they just took a few minutes to make that quick post, and now they're moving on to their next thing. Some of my other friends were even complaining about how the "tell your friends you're safe" feature on Facebook was blowing up their phone all day and that they were so annoyed by it. Even though I know it's not true, I feel like I am the only one (who was not directly related to a victim) genuinely bothered and affected by these events and that is making me feel seriously lonely. But maybe everyone else was hiding it just like I was hiding it.

That's really it. I am not usually one who puts his emotions out on Smogon; I'm not trying to whore for attention or trying to take anything at all away from the victims, but this whole ordeal legitimately worries me in a way I have never felt before and I seriously feel very alone about it.

I'm not from the US nor I live there, but this was shocking in many places of the world. It's a lot deeper than it seems because it not only shows how close minded a human can be by being significantly bothered by someone's sexual orientation and even by other nationalities (Latinos in this case), but as a backslash, it's also targeting a whole community like Muslims, who are not represented by this man; and to put the cherry on top, from an outsider point of view, you hear people saying how crazy Americans are because they always do these things. But I especially wanted to reply to this because, although it's not related to the topic, I know what's living in a place where you don't feel safe. A 12-year-old girl was hit by a car and raped by many different men in my country. A country where people get kidnapped and murdered and raped and whatever other fucked up shit, happen on a daily basis. And not very far away from where I am, you just gotta turn around the corner and that's it. I especially wanted to reply to this because, I want to tell you that, even though the world is a fucked up place, don't be afraid. Take care of yourself, but don't live a life full of fears. Live your life at its fullest. Things like these suck. Yeah. But life moves on, always. And one day, we'll make a great world where races, nationalities, gender, sexuality and whatever else won't matter. So don't be afraid. I know it's hard, but we need to move on and be happy.
I know this message wasn't very related to the actual topic, so as a final note, my heart goes to all Americans, and all the communities and people deeply touched by this.

 

[Punxsutawney Phil]

I'm not from the US nor I live there, but this was shocking in many places of the world. It's a lot deeper than it seems because it not only shows how close minded a human can be by being significantly bothered by someone's sexual orientation and even by other nationalities (Latinos in this case), but as a backslash, it's also targeting a whole community like Muslims, who are not represented by this man; and to put the cherry on top, from an outsider point of view, you hear people saying how crazy Americans are because they always do these things. But I especially wanted to reply to this because, although it's not related to the topic, I know what's living in a place where you don't feel safe. A 12-year-old girl was hit by a car and raped by many different men in my country. A country where people get kidnapped and murdered and raped and whatever other fucked up shit, happen on a daily basis. And not very far away from where I am, you just gotta turn around the corner and that's it. I especially wanted to reply to this because, I want to tell you that, even though the world is a fucked up place, don't be afraid. Take care of yourself, but don't live a life full of fears. Live your life at its fullest. Things like these suck. Yeah. But life moves on, always. And one day, we'll make a great world where races, nationalities, gender, sexuality and whatever else won't matter. So don't be afraid. I know it's hard, but we need to move on and be happy.
I know this message wasn't very related to the actual topic, so as a final note, my heart goes to all Americans, and all the communities and people deeply touched by this.

Well said.

 

[Punxsutawney Phil]

Double post, but I wanted to share something with you guys.

Tel Aviv showed its solidarity with the U.S. and its LGBT community.

The city had their own terrorist attack only a few days ago at a restaurant in one of their busiest areas. It didn't claim as many lives as this one, but it still happened. Terrorist gunmen fired at innocents until they eventually got rushed by a brave bystander. Israelis know the pain of what Orlando is going through right now.

In the wake of tragedies, such things like displaying solidarity, letting your prayers go out, or expressing your condolences publicly might seem futile. But more often than not, it can be comforting to see things like this. After 9/11, in front of the Eiffel Tower, Parisians constructed a memorial, a small representation of the twin towers. It did not save any lives, but it did show solidarity. Likewise, after the Paris attacks, countless Americans, and people all over the world, edited their profile pictures to include a French flag. This also did not save any lives, but it showed solidarity, even in a tiny way.

To know there's people out there who can sympathize can help, even just a bit. Even if we can't reverse the events, we can help mitigate the pain by expressing our shared grief, and soothe frustration. Even my own frustration.

The world is united against terrorism. Hopefully tomorrow, we can be even more united.

 

[DiscoDucky]

The biggest problem with this shooting is the political ramifications to this. Even though it is by far the worst mass shooting in U.S. history, the GOP will probably focus more on the fact that the shooter was a radical Muslim and not the fact that this has an underlying tone of anti-LGBTQ prejudice.

So, just as I predicted this morning, various GOP groups and figures are critisizing Obama for not saying that the attack was an Islamic terror attack but rather a domestic terror attack. Either way, I really dislike how the LGBTQ community is being disregarded in the realms of U.S. politics, especially when pro-LGBTQ groups such as Log Cabin Republicans turn this tragedy into an "Islamic vs. domestic" issue.

 

[Aladyyn]

Muh gun laws, such safety.

People care too much about guns and not enough about crazy people.

 

[Dubby]

Let me give you guys some Muslim perspective.

Never have I ever personally been the victim of Islamophobia (at least not explicitly), and I'm thankful for that. But that doesn't mean it won't ever happen. This was a horrible tragedy and it disgusts me. Regardless of motive or ideology, you have to be a sick person to even THINK about doing something crazy like this. ISIS has plagued my parents' home country, and now America has been hit. Unbelievable. I guess I'll just make it clear that I'm not homophobic, I support the LGBT community, and I'm not even that religious.

Honestly, I think I've just lost all hope of my fellow Americans ever tolerating Islam, especially with someone like Donald Trump as our potential next president. Luckily I was born and raised in this country so I won't get deported (right?). Idk, this particular shooting had some kind of effect on me that I can't quite understand. I'm not necessarily sad, because as horrible as it might sound, I can't feel sad over the death of someone I don't know personally. It makes me angry and annoyed and frustrated. If you don't tolerate my religion, if you think it's evil and violent and extreme, good for you. All I ask is that you don't judge individual Muslims based on that sole reason, religion. I just hope that this whole Islamophobia doesn't come back to bite me in the ass in trying to land a future job or something.

 

[Rugi]

Muh gun laws, such safety.

People care too much about guns and not enough about crazy people.

Guns aren't banned to prevent homicides. Crazy people will always find ways to kill other people. Guns are banned to prevent said crazy person from being able to kill multiple people at once with nobody capable of intervening. If some crazy guy decides they want to kill people and brings a knife. They will kill a few people max and then be apprehended. With a gun the amount of people increases scarily.

Also I tried to backsearch that graph and I could only find it on website that are pro carry and the like. I couldn't find it on any neutral website or government publication and I actually found other charts with conflicting information also being used on said sites. Please obtain this kind of info from a neutral source or at least one that can be backtraced easily. I looked through as many graphs as I could including articles I found in the commons library and homicides in the UK did actually increase as time passed but it was a flat increase. not only that but it quickly settled back down after a few years reaching an average similar to what it was prior. Did gun laws reduce homicides? No, in fact if you really want to claim cause and affect here it actually increased them slightly. Did it lower the amount of mass murders and mass shootings? Without a doubt. (Most UK gun statistics I found considered air gun crimes and assorted things such as pepper spray and BBs to be in the same category as "firearm related crime" so thats something to consider as well). (statistics on past 10 or so years of firearm related crimes in UK can be found in painstaking detail here http://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN01940/SN01940.pdf)

If you want a detailed look into how gun laws changed the Australian scene check http://ssaa.org.au/assets/news-reso...arms-buyback-and-its-effect-on-gun-deaths.pdf <that out.
tl;dr Gun homicides went down, non gun homicides went up, average homicides slightly lower than originally.

This man had supposedly mistreated his wife prior to the shooting. Had even the slightest background check been done on him he would not have been allowed to obtain a firearm and several lives would've been saved.

 

[Aladyyn]

Guns aren't banned to prevent homicides. Crazy people will always find ways to kill other people. Guns are banned to prevent said crazy person from being able to kill multiple people at once with nobody capable of intervening. If some crazy guy decides they want to kill people and brings a knife. They will kill a few people max and then be apprehended. With a gun the amount of people increases scarily.

Also I tried to backsearch that graph and I could only find it on website that are pro carry and the like. I couldn't find it on any neutral website or government publication and I actually found other charts with conflicting information also being used on said sites. Please obtain this kind of info from a neutral source or at least one that can be backtraced easily. I looked through as many graphs as I could including articles I found in the commons library and homicides in the UK did actually increase as time passed but it was a flat increase. not only that but it quickly settled back down after a few years reaching an average similar to what it was prior. Did gun laws reduce homicides? No, in fact if you really want to claim cause and affect here it actually increased them slightly. Did it lower the amount of mass murders and mass shootings? Without a doubt. (Most UK gun statistics I found considered air gun crimes and assorted things such as pepper spray and BBs to be in the same category as "firearm related crime" so thats something to consider as well). (statistics on past 10 or so years of firearm related crimes in UK can be found in painstaking detail here http://researchbriefings.files.parliament.uk/documents/SN01940/SN01940.pdf)

If you want a detailed look into how gun laws changed the Australian scene check http://ssaa.org.au/assets/news-reso...arms-buyback-and-its-effect-on-gun-deaths.pdf <that out.
tl;dr Gun homicides went down, non gun homicides went up, average homicides slightly lower than originally.

This man had supposedly mistreated his wife prior to the shooting. Had even the slightest background check been done on him he would not have been allowed to obtain a firearm and several lives would've been saved.

But they can intervene, if they, you know, are able to carry a gun.

In my country, the vast majority of gun crimes are comitted by people without a license and therefore an illegal weapon. The number of homicides has been consistently going down as the number of people with a license has increased. Guns are not the problem.

 

[Ampharos]

The US definitely needs to have a conversation about gun safety but unfortunately that's probably going to be drowned out given how political the incident already is. An Islamic extremist committing an act of terrorism against a large group of LGBT individuals? The mainstream media's going to focus on every aspect EXCEPT the weapon of choice, and it's going to (maybe intentionally, maybe not) drown out any discussion about gun control that would have occurred. And frankly that just pisses me off because gun advocates are already trying as hard as they can to just fucking ignore every piece of evidence that says "hey maybe it shouldn't be quite as easy to obtain a firearm as it is". It seems like so many people think we still live in the 1800s western frontier - all the rhetoric about how "the only thing that can stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun" is absurd and childish and shouldn't apply to a modern society where we can act like civil human beings. At this point I don't even wanna advocate for a full ban on firearms because I legitimately think that has zero chance of happening in my lifetime. I'd honestly just settle for mandatory background checks because the only argument anyone ever manages to raise against that is "muh government interference", yet they're OK with the government telling people which bathroom to use?

Sorry for the rant but I'm tired and pissed off at humanity and I just KNOW that my Islamophobic family is going to start drawing ridiculously stupid conclusions from this event any second now.

 

[Aladyyn]

The US definitely needs to have a conversation about gun safety but unfortunately that's probably going to be drowned out given how political the incident already is. An Islamic extremist committing an act of terrorism against a large group of LGBT individuals? The mainstream media's going to focus on every aspect EXCEPT the weapon of choice, and it's going to (maybe intentionally, maybe not) drown out any discussion about gun control that would have occurred. And frankly that just pisses me off because gun advocates are already trying as hard as they can to just fucking ignore every piece of evidence that says "hey maybe it shouldn't be quite as easy to obtain a firearm as it is". It seems like so many people think we still live in the 1800s western frontier - all the rhetoric about how "the only thing that can stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun" is absurd and childish and shouldn't apply to a modern society where we can act like civil human beings. At this point I don't even wanna advocate for a full ban on firearms because I legitimately think that has zero chance of happening in my lifetime. I'd honestly just settle for mandatory background checks because the only argument anyone ever manages to raise against that is "muh government interference", yet they're OK with the government telling people which bathroom to use?

Sorry for the rant but I'm tired and pissed off at humanity and I just KNOW that my Islamophobic family is going to start drawing ridiculously stupid conclusions from this event any second now.

I'm fairly sure "good guy with a gun" has a higher success rate than pleas of love and kindness when faced with a psycho shooting people.

I don't think there's a simple solution to the problem, I definitely agree that firearms should be harder to obtain than they are in the US (apparently in some states you can get a license in like 2 weeks lol?), but a full ban is just ridiculous and short-sighted. Why should people be prohibited from carrying a weapon for self-defense because a psycho shot up some place? If we are a truly civilized and modern society, we don't need to ban guns.

 

[Donald Trump]

I dont trust the government to properly do background checks. That seems like a really easy way to slow down or halt the armament of the citizenry of the united states. There is way too much power there to abuse and I dont trust the typical political sociopath or psychopath to not use that to fuel their ends, like they do with public education and college. People and professors openly calling for the destruction of the white race and blaming whites for every little thing, people virtue signalling against capitalism and in favor of things like marxism or communism - I just cant take it anymore. I want more power back in the hands of the American people

I've got news for you: a bunch of office workers with guns who have never had any training in their lives is no match for the US Army, which includes (among other things) an air force that is immune to small arms.

 

[brightobject]

This makes me really, really sad.

 

[THE_IRON_...KENYAN?]

I've got news for you: a bunch of office workers with guns who have never had any training in their lives is no match for the US Army, which includes (among other things) an air force that is immune to small arms.

Whether or not anyone would ever be able to resist the government if worse comes to worse is irrelevant to gun control. The american people should have the option to resist with more than just handguns, whether in theory it would work or not.

 

[THE_IRON_...KENYAN?]

I mean theyll never be able to use the air force anyway the united states is too packed with people. As soon as innocents got involved it would just end any sympathy anyone had for the US government. Itd be like cutting the head off of a hydra. I mean if the US military can get their ass whooped in vietnam and afghanistan then god damn yeah I do think there would be a chance if we had things like AR 15s on american soil

I think another thing people neglect to mention with gun control is if there truly were no restrictions anywhere on guns youd see a pretty huge culture shift. Since people want to feel safer and protect themselves, more people would buy guns and learn how to use them and then carry them around with them. This would be especially beneficial to black and hispanic ghettos. Just start to slowly cull out all the gangbangers and other morons in bouts of self defense