OU Bulky Offense + Mienshao

[ijoshjosh]

Hey guys, Smogon has crashed on me twice now, and this is the third time I’ve typed this up, so bear with me for a bit, I’m quite frustrated. Anyways, I’m a veteran D/P battler on shoddybattle, but I have yet to experience the B/W metagame. This team is constructed purely for paper theory crafting and trying to speculate at what pokemon would be good enough to make a team out of. Constructive criticism mch appreciated.

Mienshao w/ Life orb
Ability: regenerator
Nature: Jolly
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
~Hi Jump Kick
~Fake Out
~U-turn
~Stone Edge

I’m thinking of using Mienshao as a strong anti-lead. He comes in, uses a fake out, and then U-turns out of there quickly. Regenerator allows him to come back at full HP, even when a sandstorm is brewing, which allows the Life orb to not kill him. Mienshao reminds me of Ambipom, except actually good. Should I be using another pokemon here, such as conkeldurr?

Ferrothorn w/ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
Nature: Impish
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
~ Leech Seed
~ Stealth Rock
~ Gyro Ball
~ Power Whip

Ferrothorn seems to be quite the good tank. Primarily, he will soak up physical attacks, set up stealth rock and leech seed, and gyro ball and power whip his way to victory. I’m not quite sure how well he’ll fit on an offensive team, suggestions are quite welcome if Ferrothorn does not fit well on a sandstorm aggression team. Should I not place this tank here and put another offensive sweeper good in a sandstorm? Such as Garchomp?


Hydreigon w/ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
Nature: Modest
EVs: 252 SpA / 252 Spe / 4 HP
~ Flamethrower
~ U-Turn
~ Surf
~ Draco Meteor

Hydreigon will serve as a powerful choice scarfer. I feel that with 98 Spd and quite a powerful range of moves, including U-turn and flamethrower, and non 4x weakness to ice, Hydreigon can stand out from Mence, flygon, and Garchomp, and serve as a powerful special sweeper. If you believe Mence or Chomp would still be better, please say so.

*Excadrill w/ Air Balloon
Ability: Sand Rush
Nature: Adamant
EV's: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 HP

~Rock Slide
~Earthquake
~Swords Dance
~X-Scizzor

I don’t think there’s much to say about this pokemon. He looks like he’s going to be dominant and banned soon. Coming in with such high speed and such high attack without any setup is kind of unnatural, and with one swords dance, bad stuff starts happening. I feel to be competititve one has to run this mon; I’m not changing this mon for anything.

*Tyranitar w/ Choice Scarf
Ability: Sand Stream
Nature: Jolly
Ev's: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
~ Earthquake
~ Pursuit
~ Crunch
~ Stone Edge

I need sandstream, and I feel that people often don’t expect double scarves on a single team. I got plenty of kills in D/P with my Heatran/Latias choce scarf combo, and I expect to do so with these two in this game as well. However, its probably important to keep tyranitar alive in this game in case they wipe the weather with another pokemon; hence, not leading with him. I don’t think I’m changing this mon either.


Jellicent w/ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
Nature: Modest
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Def / 156 SAtk
~ Recover
~ Will-o-wisp
~ Scald
~ Ice Beam

Along with Ferrothorn, these two can resist a lot of things. I’m not quite sure about this pokemon right now, but I feel that he’ll be useful, as a lot of my team is weak to fighting. A ghost type seems like quite the fit right here, and I also need a water type to absorb water attacks. Will-o-wisp can be quite useful for removing physical sweepers, but would toxic be better?

Overall, my team is a rather bulky team with the potential for strong fighting. I feel slightly iffy about mienshao right now, and slightly want to sub him for a bulk up conkeldurr, but I feel having 2 stat upping pokemon on the same team might be quite hard to pull off. What do you guys think?

 

[Bastion]

This may sound weird but have you thought of possibly switching your lead with a lead Infernape i just like ape better because i can set up rocks as well which to me is nessasary to help sweeps.

 

[Dezza Laa]

i reckon a gliscor would be a fine addition to this team. Preferably over Mienshao or Hydrogein.

Hide

Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 236 Def / 20 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Swords Dance
- Taunt
- Facade
- Earthquake

GL

 

[SmileZ]

Bulky offence in the 5th gen without Conkeldur, Reuniclus or Scrafty..? I'll provide 3 sets which you can mull over. I've tested all three and they are all great sets. Just work out whether any of them fit.

Suggested sets

Reuniclus (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SAtk
Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Psycho Shock
- Focus Blast
- Recover


Conkeldur (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Guts
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SDef
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Bulk Up
- Drain Punch
- Mach Punch
- Stone Edge


Scrafty (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Shed Skin
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SDef
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Bulk Up
- Drain Punch
- Crunch
- Ice Punch

All great sets. Just as a demonstration of what 5th Gen bulky offence looks like.

Also on a side note for your EV spreads..
HP / Atk / Def / SAtk / SDef / Spe
Looks so much more pleasing and it pretty much the standard order in terms of QC.

Good luck with the team.

 

[Friar]

Hi there,

This seems like a solid team so far. I have a few ideas that I think can help you out.

First off is your Mienshao. I think you're onto something with the idea of Bulk Up Conkeldurr. While Conkeldurr might not hit as hard from the get go without access to Life Orb and Hi Jump Kick, its access to Mach Punch should not be overlooked on this team. Opposing Air Balloon Excadrill look like a real menace for your team. The only way I see you beating it if its setting up on Tyranitar (or even Hydreigon after a Draco Meteor), is to sacrifice your scarfer or possibly Mienshao to break its Balloon, and then revenge kill. While Conkeldurr doesn't like to switch directly into Earthquakes, it can check Excadrill effectively with Mach Punch. It also checks Terrakion and Scrafty, who look like real threats to your team. Try this set:

Conkeldurr @ Leftovers
Adamant / Guts
120 HP / 252 Attack / 136 Special Defense
-Drain Punch
-Mach Punch
-Payback
-Bulk Up

Because Hydreigon can handle most of the revenge killing duties with its Choice Scarf and good power, I recommend taking the scarf off Tyranitar. This gives you a specially defensive behemoth to handle stuff like Latios easily. This also allows you take Stealth Rock off Ferrothorn so you can use a better move. Try this set:

Tyranitar @ Leftovers
Sassy / Sand Stream
252 HP / 180 Special Attack / 76 Special Defense
-Stealth Rock
-Crunch
-Fire Blast
-Ice Beam

This can surprise opposing Ferrothorn with Fire Blast, as well as opposing Gliscor with Ice Beam, opening up for Conkeldurr.

Now, on Ferrothorn, use Spikes where Stealth Rock used to be. That will help in breaking down cores and when combined with Sand, the opposing team won't last long. Also, as your using Gyro Ball, try a spread of 252 HP / 64 Def / 192 Special Defense with a Sassy nature.

Finally, on Jellicent, try a spread of 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 Speed with a Calm Nature and the Cursed Body ability. Especially because you have Ferrothorn, Water Absorb isnt as important. If you use Taunt in place of Ice Beam, you do much better against opposing Ferrothorn as well as Reuniclus, always a huge threat. With Taunt + Cursed Body, you have a good chance to beat Reuniclus if crits or Special defense downs dont happen too often because CM Reuniclus' psychic attack will eventually get disabled.

I think with those changes you have a really solid team on your hands, good luck with it!

 

[ijoshjosh]

Thanks a lot for the responses!

@SmileZ

I like your sets; who should I take out for Conkeldurr and Renuniclus? Meinshao and...?

@Friar

Great analysis, do you think I should also take out U-turn on Hydreigon in favor of a special move dark pulse?

 

[Friar]

No, I don't think that Dark Pulse is especially important. Surf + Flamethrower + Draco Meteor already allows you to revenge kill a lot of the metagame with great coverage. Tyranitar already has Crunch to take out pesky Ghosts or Psychics, and U-turn with hazards is great. If you force a switch with Hydreigon, you not only hit the switch in with U-turn, but also entry hazards take their toll. Then, you get to go into a counter. This will be especially effective if you can lure in Fighting types, probably your teams biggest threat, only to switch out to Jellicent in most cases, countering them. Special care is needed around Terrakion, who Conkeldurr can revenge kill, and Virizion. Still, if you get them weakened enough, they shouldn't be a problem. So, I recommend keeping U-turn. In fact, because super effective Fire Blast is more powerful than Draco Meteor, you should probably use it over Flamethrower just so Virizion can't sweep you. At the very worst, you'll have hazards and can weaken it to the point that Conkeldurr can revenge kill. Definitely a threat to watch out for.

 

[Requiem[9]]

Overall, your team looks pretty solid, but I've got two quick suggestions. The first is the use of HP Ice on your Mienshao with a Naive nature. Mienshao can't switch into many special attacks to begin with due to its low defenses, making a move to get through Gliscor a much higher priority. The only pokemon that HP Ice really misses out on is Gyarados, which isn't extremely common and is handled well by Nattorei. HP Ice also gives you a solid move against Garchomp whom, with Sand Veil, it's impossible to have too many checks for. This is especially valuable since your team features Excadrill, for whom Gliscor is a major counter. With a 4 EV investment and LO, HP Ice + HJK already kills Gliscor. If more power is necessary, Kojondo's speed can be dropped all the way to 232 while still outspeeding Garchomp, decreasing the hassle in KOing. The second is Frustration on Excadrill. While X-Scissor seems nice to hit Latios before SD, you have both Tyranitar and Nattorei. Frustration is a much more useful move in general, preventing standard Rotom-W's from interfering with a sweep and giving you an alternative to Rock Slide that won't miss. I'd consider LO on it too, personally, given the offensive presence Kojondo already gives your team in the midgame.

As for more general suggestions: if you replace something for an Excadrill counter like Conkeldurr, I'd replace Burungeru. While Burungeru has good synergy with Nattorei, it doesn't seem like it's doing too much on this team. SR is your only hazard and smart play can handle fire attacks. You lose the fighting immunity, so I'd actually suggest Gliscor over Conkeldurr to fix a slight weakness to Terakion and completely counter Excadrill (while Conkeldurr really is more of a "check"). Mienshao with HP Ice deals with Landros. I recommend replacing Burungeru over Mienshao because Mienshao/Excadrill is a great, underrated offensive core and Burungeru's not really doing anything.

As for Dark Pulse: I actually like it, since I see your team having trouble breaking Burungeru without it. I'd probably replace Surf instead, to be honest, even though it has better neutral coverage. That, or throwing a CB with some speed on Tyranitar.

Good luck with the team! Hopefully something I've said helps.

 

[Dbest]

Jellicent w/ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
Nature: Modest
EVs: 252 HP / 100 Def / 156 SAtk
~ Recover
~ Will-o-wisp
~ Scald
~ Ice Beam

Along with Ferrothorn, these two can resist a lot of things. I’m not quite sure about this pokemon right now, but I feel that he’ll be useful, as a lot of my team is weak to fighting. A ghost type seems like quite the fit right here, and I also need a water type to absorb water attacks. Will-o-wisp can be quite useful for removing physical sweepers, but would toxic be better?

might I sugest a flashfire Chandelure it is better at covering Ferrothorn's weaknesses and it will also make your team a bit more offensive using

Chandelure w/ Leftovers or Life Orb
Ability: Flash Fire
Nature: Modest
EVs: 4Hp / 252 SpA / 252 Sp
~ Flame Thrower
~ Flame Charge
~ Shadow Ball
~ Grass Not

Always start with a Flame Charge but only do one. Chandelure can always take at least 1 hit and it can outspeed a fully speed trained Aerodactyl after one speed boost. Then your ready for sweep. hopefully you have a flashfire boost but if not Flame Thrower still does rediculous damage with 145 base SpA Grass knot and Shadow Ball are mostly for Shandera's weakneses. at least test this out but Jellicent will work just as well.

Other Comments Mienshao is a good anti lead I tried him out he works excelently especially with just a Fakeout U-Turn after every pokemon K.O.

Ferrothorn is a big dilema for me because he has so many possibilities but your set on him is meh the best set I have tested so far is

Ferrothorn w/ Leftovers
Ability: Iron Barbs
Nature: Impish
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
~ Curse
~ Rest
~ Gyro Ball / Strenght
~ Power Whip / Payback

but he can also be good at setups your set just doesnt have as clear of a purpose (the strenght and payback are just my style which is very akward gyro ball is what I would actually recomend)

Hydreigon is amazing for sweeps. but U-turn? ah well you decide. I guess you were trying to do something like a scarfed Flygon but special attack edition.

Keep the Exadrill. that is all I have to say about that he is good.

Tyranitar oh boy do I have to talk to you about that. I used a similarly typed team with my competitive OU 4rth edition team but the only pokemon other than Tyranitar able to survive Sandstream was Flygon this turned out to take some getting used to the main rules I have leaned from that is only use him if you HAVE TO. I lost games just by the small damage. So be very careful of when it is safe to let him out or he will ruin you. Also only bad thing about his move set is pursuit+choice use Superpower instead learned by move tutor. and remember dont let his ability kill your team.

 

[SmileZ]

Maybe try just Conkeldur, if you like it then try Reuniclus later.