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OU Cores in the BW2 Metagame

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by -Rockstar-, Jul 8, 2012.

  1. Ehrmantraut

    Ehrmantraut

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    neither things are issues
  2. moonbase

    moonbase

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    There should really be a HOF of cores here.
  3. Chou Toshio

    Chou Toshio @Fighting Necktie
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris an Artist Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus
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    What are you talking about? Keldeo loses 1 on 1 to Kingdra under rain, and Celebi is one of the best Keldeo counters in the game because HP Bug is rare and sucky. Landorus is outsped and destroyed by Kingdra (and it can't OHKO Kingdra anyway). It also can't do jack to Celebi without U-Turn. The core is a bit weak to Ttar, but TTar doesn't like taking Hydro Pump, even under sand, and it can't switch into Kingdra. Lava Plume could replace Flamethrower to make the core stronger against TTar, but you're likely to have a fighting type anyway.

    Ferrothorn can't exactly waltz in on Kingdra's Hydro Pump btw:
    252+ SpA Life Orb Kingdra Hydro Pump vs. 252 HP / 168 SpD Ferrothorn in rain: 129-153 (36.64 - 43.46%) -- 99.27% chance to 3HKO


    A bit of prior damage and it's toast.


    Overall though, your posts are a bit trivial. Every core has holes-- what's your point?
  4. dadoux

    dadoux formerly Morpheus

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    I'm not saying "your core is shit, kill yourself", don't say that i'm trivial or what, it's a thread and i can give my opinion, i ain't said nothing disrespectful at all, he said that Weather got trouble to deal with this core, and i just don't think so, i know cores got holes, but i'm just saying that this core is not THAT "Anti-weather", and he said nothing about what he got in teammates for this core, so i think that's his main way of dealing with weathers. If the goal of the core is too make every weather in trouble, then it's not that accomplished imo..But if debating is not the goal of the thread, then sorry.

    I encountered a lot of hp bug keldeo recently, and a Landorus with U-turn can just deal easily with the core by himself, Kingdra have to set up rain to outspeed him, and he just can switch on him, Landorus is played a lot in SS so he have to set Rain himself. Ferrothorn can Leech seed / Protect out pretty easily, and Hydro pump misses too often to be a viable way of killing it.

    I'm just trying to light up the problems of the core and that can be helpful, don't think that i'm a bad guy lol.
  5. RoyalBlue

    RoyalBlue

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2013
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    Not really sure if this was mentioned before but here's my defensive core that I really like using.


    Gastrodon @ Leftovers
    Trait: Storm Drain
    EVs: 252 HP/ 252 SDef/ 4 SAtk
    Calm Nature
    - Scald
    - Earth Power
    - Toxic
    - Recover

    Skarmory @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP/ 252 Def/ 4 Atk
    Impish Nature
    - Drill Peck
    - Stealth Rock
    - Whirlwind
    - Roost

    The 2 work together extremely well weakness, resistance wise. Gastrodon is weak to Grass which Skarmory quad resists while Skarm is weak to Electric and Fire, which Gastrodon handles with ease. The 2 of them share 10 resistances and 4 immunities. That's 14/17 types that these two can handle. There are a couple things that rip through this core (Volcarona, Thundurus w/ Grass Knot, Offensive Heatran etc) but easily handled by other Pokemon.

    This core handle weather pretty easily, excluding Hail and Sun. Gastrodon is built to counter rain, immune to both Water and Electric, the 2 most common offensive types for rain teams. Skarmory handles common sand Pokemon with relative ease. Gliscor, Physical Landorus, Scizor an Jirachi. Really good core if your team struggles against Rain and Sand.

    -B)
  6. ShootingStarmie

    ShootingStarmie
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    Okay so here's an interesting duo I've been using. The team I've been using it with actually got me reqs for the Lando-I suspect test. Toxicroak it the best counter to strong Fighting types in the tier, namely Keldeo, Breloom, Terrakion, and Lucario.

    Toxicroak @ Leftovers
    Trait: Dry Skin
    EVs: 244 HP / 12 Spd / 252 Def
    Impish Nature
    - Substitute
    - Toxic
    - Drain Punch
    - Bulk Up

    Latias (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
    Timid Nature
    - Psyshock
    - Roost
    - Reflect Type
    - Dragon Pulse

    Here's some calcs to demostrate Toxicroak's impressive tanking abilities.

    Show Hide


    252Atk Choice Band Technician Scizor (+Atk) U-turn in Rain vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Dry Skin Toxicroak (+Def): 11% - 14% (44 - 52 HP). Guaranteed 9HKO.

    252Atk Life Orb +2 Lucario (+Atk) Close Combat in Rain vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Dry Skin Toxicroak (+Def): 63% - 74% (234 - 275 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.

    252Atk Fight Gem Technician Breloom (+Atk) Focus Punch in Rain vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Dry Skin Toxicroak (+Def): 51% - 60% (189 - 223 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.

    252Atk Life Orb Technician Breloom (+Atk) Bullet Seed in Rain vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Dry Skin Toxicroak (+Def): 32% - 38% (120 - 144 HP). Guaranteed 4HKO.
    (that's 3 hits)

    252SpAtk Choice Specs Keldeo (Neutral) Secret Sword in Rain vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Dry Skin Toxicroak (+Def): 26% - 31% (97 - 115 HP). Guaranteed 4HKO.

    252Atk Choice Band Terrakion (Neutral) Close Combat in Rain vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Dry Skin Toxicroak (+Def): 37% - 43% (137 - 162 HP). Guaranteed 3HKO.



    As you can see, Toxicroak really can take a lot of Physical attacks.

    As for Latias, it's a special wall, and it also takes on Ground types like Lando-I, Hippodown, Gliscor, etc. I've been running Reflect type to take on the ever too common Ttar + Lando-I + Keldeo core, but if Landorus is banned, you can easily change the set to something more suited to your preference.

    Anyway, have fun testing this core, I know I have. (I suggest you run this core with Politoed, obviously for Dry Skin).
  7. UltiMario

    UltiMario

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    IMO HP Bug is the best HP for Keldeo because it just mauls Celebi, who people really like to switch in on Keldeo. It also hurts Latias just as bad as HP Ice or Ghost would anyways. You do lose coverage compared to HP Ice, but if you want it so badly just use Icy Wind. It deals with the 4x weaks pretty well anyways, and nobody likes the speed drop.

    I don't use Keldeo a lot anymore (it just doesn't fit on teams as easily as some people suggest it does, tbh), but when I do I always use HP Bug. There's basically no reason not to.
  8. Nysyr

    Nysyr

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    Seconding this, With HP bug all that really blocks you str8 up is Jellicent and Toxicroak.

    Jellicent can get trapped by ttar support, and croak does not like taking icy winds all day. EB Keldeo is usually the recipient of Nasty Pass as well so it can muscle thru Toxicroak.
  9. Martian Manhunter

    Martian Manhunter

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    Tyranitar and Breloom are great partners because Latios and Latias are some of brelooms main checks and so is celebi. Tyranitar does a good job of disposing of all three counters.
  10. X5Dragon

    X5Dragon

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    After playing with the same core for 3 years and peaking number one in different metas, I think it's safe to say this is a good core:

    [​IMG]
    Dragonite (F) @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Multi Scale
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Dragon Dance
    - Fire Punch
    - Extreme Speed
    - Outrage


    [​IMG]
    Scizor (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Adamant (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Bullet Punch
    - Swords Dance
    - Super Power
    - Bug Bite

    [​IMG]
    Breloom (F) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Spore
    - Swords Dance
    - Mach Punch
    - Bullet Seed

    [​IMG]
    Starmie (F) @ Life Orb/Left Overs
    Trait: Analytic/Nature Cure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Rapid Spin
    - Rain Dance/Ice Beam/ T-Bolt
    - Scald/Surf/Hydro Pump
    - Psychic/Psyshock


    Breloom sets up on hazard setters, puts switching sweepers to sleep, and does a number on 4 out 5 weather starters, and can handle Starmies problems. Starmie spins away hazards, changes weather if must, kills most of the spin blockers in one or two hits and ensures Dragonite can sweep. Scizor sets up on choice locked pokemon and wears anything that outspeeds Dragonite after DD and proceeds to OHKO and 2HKO most of the meta after SD + LO, while Dragonite sets up on Scizors most loathed enemy, fire pokemon and with nearly perfect coverage and +2 priority proceed to demolish the enemies team.

    The last 2 slots can be customized to do nearly anything from DragMag to Rain Offense, etc.
  11. iliekmudkipz123456789

    iliekmudkipz123456789

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    Here's a pretty good late game core that I've been using to success lately:

    Feraligatr @ lum berry
    252atk/96hp/160spe
    Adamant
    ~Aqua Jet
    ~Swords Dance
    ~Crunch
    ~Ice Punch

    Thundurus-T @ Choice Scarf
    252spe/252spa/4hp
    ~Hp ice
    ~Thunder
    ~Grasss Knot
    ~Focus Blast
    This core is specifically meant for rain. What it tries to do is that after your teammates have weakened the opponents team these guys come in mid-late game and just wreck because they're so powerful. Every late game sweeping core needs a scarfer so Thundurus-T is just the right pokemon to fullfil that role because of it's RAW power and moderate speed. Feraligatr however, is a physical sweeper with Swords Dance and it's pretty much designed to wreck teams late game because since it has pretty good bulk you can get it to Torrent range while setting up an SD and destroy the rest of the opponents team. It also outspeeds Scizor so it doesn't have to worry about getting killed by bullet punch if it has an SD and is in Torrent range.
  12. Vertex

    Vertex

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    [​IMG]
    Heatran | Choice Specs | Flash Fire
    Timid | 252 SpA / 4 Def / 252 Spe | 0 Atk
    Fire Blast | Earth Power | Flash Cannon | Hidden Power [Grass]

    [​IMG]
    Skarmory | Rocky Helmet | Sturdy
    Calm | 248 HP / 232 SpD / 28 Spe | Max IVs
    Brave Bird | Roost | Spikes | Whirlwind

    This core was used a lot in DPPt and makes a return on this post o.O, and I have had huge success with this core, except its not the classic Spikes Skarmory + Stealth Rock Heatran Defensive core. The core is built around a Choice Specs Heatran, which is relatively rare in this metagame. Okay let me rephrase that. "Really Rare". Choice Specs Heatran only needs to be either run in the sun, or gain a Flash Fire boost, and then something's going to die. I've ran Overheat, and I have to say, it's not to bad, but Fire Blast is much more consistent and prevents it from being set-up bait. To show Heatran's power, Dragonite is OHKOed after Stealth Rock with a Flash Fire boost / or sun, and many resists are OHKOed in the sun with a Flash Fire boost like Jellicent. That's really impressive.

    Skarmory is the second part of this core and helps Heatran gain Flash Fire boosts since many Fire-type moves are aimed at Skarmory. Whenever Heatran gets a Flash Fire boost, the word that jump to my mind is something is going to die or going to live and die. Rocky Helemet is an excellent item on Skarmory, since it punishes U-turn users, Rapid Spinners, and moves like Dragon Claw for example, even better if its Garchomp's Dual Chop. Spikes is good for Choice Specs Heatran, since it forces many switches to get most of its KOs, which stacks up, into ultimate destruction. Roost and Heatran's coverage is fairly obvious, and common partners are Pokemon that make use of this. Currently, I run a Sharpedo with it, since it appreciates the holes planted into bulky Water-types and the Spikes and it's working wonders. I also run a Hippowdon because Heatran is useless in rain. No really, it is. I've ran Dragon Pulse but after SR + Spikes, most Dragon-types die to Flash Cannon, and Flash Cannnon is a really consistent move on Choice Specs Heatran.

    These two even have awesome synergy too. Ground-type moves aimed at Heatran are swappped to Skarmory and Breloom trying to Mach Punch kill find itself destroyed by Skarmory's Brave Bird. The team has trouble against special rain-boosted attacks like Hydro Pump and Surf, but that's what team support is for, aeh? Overall, I had huge success with this core, so I wanted to share it.
  13. Captain Evil

    Captain Evil

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    Apr 24, 2012
    Messages:
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    [​IMG]
    Dragonite @Leftovers
    Ability: Multiscale
    252 HP/252 SpD/4 Def, Careful Nature
    - Substitute
    - Roost
    - Thunder Wave
    - Dragon Tail

    [​IMG]
    Jirachi @Leftovers
    Ability: Serene Grace
    252 HP/252 SpD/4 Def, Careful Nature
    - Body Slam
    - Iron Head
    - Stealth Rock
    - Wish

    The premise of this core is twofold: first and foremost, they offer excellent defensive synergy as both cover the other one's weaknesses well, either through resistance or immunity. Furthermore, ParaShuffle Dragonite relies on entry hazard support in order to be effective, which Jirachi can reliably provide. Jirachi also assists Dragonite in spreading paralysis with Body Slam, especially the troublesome Ground-types which are untouchable by Thunder Wave. Wish is also good for support. Given how these two particular sets are considered quite annoying by some (http://smogon.com/smog/issue23/annoying_sets), this core can be a nightmare to play against.
  14. Shrug

    Shrug

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    Jul 12, 2013
    Messages:
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    I tried this on a whim, and wow. Acrobatics Scizor is much better than Tyranitar as a Keldeo partner. Anyway, a core I had on my latest team:

    [​IMG]@[​IMG]
    Latios @ Dragon Gem
    Trait: Levitate
    Nature: Timid (+Spe, -Atk)
    Evs: 4 Hp / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    -Draco Meteor
    -Psychic
    -Trick
    -Memento
    [​IMG]@[​IMG]
    Volcarona @ Chesto Berry​
    Trait: Flame Body​
    Nature: Modest (+SpA, -Atk)​
    Evs: 160 Hp / 236 SpA / 112 Spe​
    -Quiver Dance​
    -Rest​
    -Fire Blast​
    -Bug Buzz​
    [​IMG]@[​IMG]
    Terrakion @ Rock Gem​
    Trait: Justified​
    Nature: Jolly (+Spe, -SpA)​
    Evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe​
    -Rock Polish​
    -Swords Dance​
    -Stone Edge​
    -Close Combat​
    Dragon Gem Latios is simple: It uses coverage/blasts with Draco Meteor, at which point it's usually staring at a Tyranitar/Heatran/Scizor weakened and Pursuit-vulnerable. That's when the fun starts: use Memento, killing Latios, but weakening the Pokemon defending it. Then, you go to Volcarona or Terrakion, two of the premier set-up sweepers in OU, ho both happen to love setting up on Latios's counters. You can pull easy sweeps with this one.​
  15. Homeslice

    Homeslice

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    Messages:
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    Now that Landorus is banned, I finally feel safe posting this core.

    [​IMG]
    Alakazam @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Magic Guard
    Nature: Modest
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    -Psychic
    -Focus Blast
    -Signal Beam
    -Hidden Power [Fire]

    [​IMG]
    Breloom @ Life Orb
    Trait: Technician
    Nature: Jolly
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    -Spore
    -Swords Dance
    -Mach Punch
    -Bullet Seed

    [​IMG]
    Hyrdeigon @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Levitate
    Nature: Naive
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    -Dark Pulse
    -Draco Meteor
    -Fire Blast
    -U-Turn

    (Some of these sets are just my preference, the Pokemon aren't really even the basis of the idea of the core)

    So one day I was thinking, if FWG has such great synergy defensively why don't we have a core that covers that offensively? And then I realized we do, we just haven't figured it out yet. We always talk about the perfect neutral coverage Dark/Fighting or Ghost/Fighting gives us, and I realized a core of Dark/Fighting/Psychic completes the common trio and is actually a huge force on Hyper Offensive. With the team I created, the only Pokemon that could ever stand up to this core was Landorus, which I had checks in Jellicent and Landorus-T for. Breloom and Alakazam were chosen over other Pokemon simply because they were the core chosen in OUTC (go check it out) so I used them and this is what came to mind. Hydreigon was the only decent Dark type I could think of to abuse Dark STAB, and he actually is a realy good scarfer in that he can just blast off super-powerful moves to beat anything that could wall my STAB core once someone has fallen. Scizor somewhat can beat this core, but that's why Alakazam has HP Fire and Hydreigon has Fire Blast.

    The main point of this post is just to bring up an example of what a DFP (I just made that up, if it sounds better please rearrange the letters) core could look like, in hopes that someone else can take the idea and then also try it with mons like Latios and Terrakion over Alakazam and Breloom instead.
  16. ShootingStarmie

    ShootingStarmie
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    Yeah, I used a similar core in BW1 with Tyranitar / Reuniclus / Conkeldurr. While my core is generally bulkier, it doesn't quite pack the fire power that your core provides. I quite like the idea of Terrakion and Latios over Alakazam and Breloom like you said, but I still think this core has problems with Scizor. Maybe Latios could run an Expert Belt set to lure in Scizor only to be met with a HP fire? I dunno, I think that might be going into too much detail. But yeah, I like this core on paper.
  17. Homeslice

    Homeslice

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    I never really had problems with Scizor, Breloom can usually Spore and then set-up and OHKO, Alakazam can hit it with HP Fire or Hydreigon can hit it with Fire Blast. I also ran Landorus-T which could easily check it and KO it if it stays it. No solid counters, but plenty of ways to check it.
  18. Shurtugal

    Shurtugal The Enterpriser.
    is a Pre-Contributor

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    Scarf Keldeo is also a nuisance if Alakazam should ever lost its sash.
  19. MikeDawg

    MikeDawg keep calm; ban everything
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    That's not a core

    that's a team...
  20. Halcyon.

    Halcyon. Come on, she's not burned; she's just gone.
    is an official Team Rateris a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

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    Ah yes, the famous Four Pokémon Team strategy.

    But yeah the core does seem to be weak to Agility Thundurus-T in the rain, which can set up on Scizor that isn't boosted or a Breloom that's had its Sash broken and OHKO everything after Stealth Rock. Venusaur in the sun can also be a problem, since it also OHKOs everything after rocks at +2. Life orb Latias can take on every member 1v1 (Draco for Starmie and Dragonite, Psyshock for Breloom, HP Fire for Scizor). A Weavile or a Mamoswine could fix both of these problems, preferably Weavile since it better deals with Latias. You could also deal with her by putting it in a rain team (which also helps with Venusaur), but you already mentioned that possibility.
    iliekmudkipz123456789 likes this.
  21. X5Dragon

    X5Dragon

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    Well to be honest I kind of scanned this thread seeking to know how many pokemons can be fitted in a core, but in reality I view all of them as a core, even though Starmie and Breloom are a support duo and the best IMO for weatherless HO teams, and the other 2 are an attacking core/duo.

    So anyway, I do recognize the problems Halycon mentioned, and to mention them against NP Thundrus, Cloro Venasaur and CM Latias. Another fourth problem tends to be SD Lucario, but rather than tampering with an otherwise great core/team I use the last two slots to fix these problems, namely Kingdra, Volcarona, Mamoswine and Scarf Latios. Weavile with Low Kick is also awesome, wiping out Ferrothorn's at +2 is just jaw dropping.
  22. MikeDawg

    MikeDawg keep calm; ban everything
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    It seems like thundy and lati are somewhat easily handled though

    Lucario is the only big problem, but as you mentioned that can be dealth with
  23. Captain Evil

    Captain Evil

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    Perhaps a more descriptive term would be "dual-core"...

    That aside, is it possible to just slap two or three cores together (for three- and two-Pokemon cores, respectively) and call it a team?
  24. X5Dragon

    X5Dragon

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    Usually when you want to put more than one core together you need to look at their collective weaknesses and stick them together with glue pokemon. Since most glue are just a single pokemon and how easy the team falls apart if that said pokemon dies, people just use a single core and then use the rest to support them.
  25. Nysyr

    Nysyr

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    Okayish balanced hazards core I use on weatherless and sand/hail teams. I prefer Spdef Skarm to just roost on volt switches; though Spdef rotom-w can be a bit of a dick if it gets in safe on skarm.

    Starmie @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 248 HP / 4 SAtk / 228 Spd / 28 Def
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Psyshock
    - Scald
    - Rapid Spin
    - Recover

    Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet/Life Orb
    Trait: Rough Skin
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Outrage
    - Stealth Rock
    - Fire Blast

    Skarmory @ Leftovers/Rocky Helmet
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 224 HP / 32 Spd / 252 SDef
    Careful Nature
    - Spikes
    - Brave Bird
    - Whirlwind
    - Roost

    First Slash is for hail mostly, second is for Sand/Weatherless.

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