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OU Leads

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Jukain, Sep 4, 2012.

  1. Hiphopanonymous


    May 19, 2012
    Speaking of Trick, I like to use Scarf or Specs Gengar as a lead, utilizing both Trick and Hypnosis. Strategy is pretty much the same as what Anikrahman mentioned, Tricking the lead and then sleeping the switch in, taking two pokes out of the match in the first two turns. Not as reliable as the T-wave previously mentioned, but it still gets the job done nonetheless.
  2. victinivcreate1


    Nov 22, 2012
    Tornadus Incarnate>most other leads

    Prankster messes crap up

    Taunt alone allows me to almost always force out Deoxys D

    Tornadus-I @ Life Orb
    EVs: 4 Atk/252 SpA/252 Spd
    Heat Wave

    Very effective, as well as featured on my 1st RMT.

    OHKOs even SpD Ferrothorn with Heat Wave
    OHKOs TTar with Superpower
    Taunts Ninetales, them 2HKOs with Supepower
    2HKOs Politoed with Hydro Pump

    And its speed lets me outspeed the L@tis, Gengar, and the Sacred swordsmen and get the drop on them
  3. Dark Fallen Angel


    May 23, 2012
    But Politoed can OHKO back with Hydro Pump, not giving you time to 2HKO.

    Also, I have used Thunder Wave on Choice Scarf Deoxys-D and I have to thank to which one suggested me to do this. Scarf Deoxys-D with Thunder Wave functions very much like Double Powder Amoongus, crippling 2 of your opponents at same time. Trick Scarf on the lead Pokémon, and your opponent will more often than not, switch out, allowing you to cripple the second Pokémon with Thunder Wave. Then, you Taunt it if it is a setup sweeper or something that may be carrying a status move (like Terrakion with Stealth Rock). If it is something that can 2HKO/OHKO Deoxys-D, you simply setup Stealth Rock, and proceeds to switch to something that can use the opponent as setup fodder.
  4. Takion


    Dec 7, 2012
    I've been testing this:


    @ Mental Herb
    Trait: Synchronize
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Taunt
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Thunder Wave

    Pros: Great counter to Deo-D, and status Inducers, you could even replace Mental Herbs with Lum Berry, but note that Deo-D will get right back at you. The Will-O-Wisp is for Tyranitar and Scizors, once it hits it allows Mew to Set-up stealth rocks.

    Cons:No attacks, no spikes. Gengar can still set his sub up on it.

    Basically, this is my replacement if Deo-D gets banned. I'd recommend it to anyone trying to test a replacement for H.O.​
  5. HackerKing


    Dec 3, 2012
    Garchomp @ Focus Sash
    -Stealth Rock
    -Swords Dance
    (Jolly; Rough Skin; 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4HP)

    Garchomp serves two purposes. 1 is as a guaranteed SR setter. Sporting the latest runway model-esque sash, Garchomp can survive any hit and set up Stealth Rock. But what if he has a match-up against Abomosnow or something that would completely rape it? Well, with this current set, Garchomp also serves as a threatening late-game sweeper. It can plow through pokemon (even SD on a predicted switch) and then plow through a weakened team, living Weavile's Ice Shard or Scarf-Salamence's Dragon Claw thanks to the sash.
  6. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn a e s t h e t i c
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Champion

    Mar 17, 2012
    i'd definitely modify that set since it lacks any way to get through extremely common walls to chomp like forretress, skarm, defensive ferro, bronzong, etc. my favorite form of chomp leads utilizes the same idea but with a little surprise thrown in:

    garchomp @ focus sash
    trait: rough skin
    evs: 252 atk / 4 satk / 252 spd
    naive nature (+spd, -sdef)
    - stealth rock
    - dragon claw / dragon rush
    - earthquake
    - fire blast

    big fire blast shocks steel types and sun teams have issues with it too, especially when their spinner is forretress, since fire blast brings it down to sturdy range and then rough skin prevents the spin from working which is super nice. eq is standard fare for stab power. i slashed dragon claw and dragon rush since the latter is only 75% accurate, but has a cute 30% flinch rate, 20 extra base power, and lets you 2hko common stuff like 252 hp rotom-w that dragon claw does not. also ohkos 252 hp latias after rocks, which dragon claw does not always do. worth the accuracy drop imo

    oh yeah credit goes to ctc for the set i just put the dragon rush spin on it
  7. MikeDecIsHere

    MikeDecIsHere And the haters gonna hate hate hate hate hate.
    is a Smogon Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Sep 28, 2010
    Takion, the main problem with your set is that it loses to Magic Coat Deoxys-Defense 100% of the time. I would probably modify it a wee bit with maybe U-Turn over Thunder-Wave, and pair it with something like a CB Scizor with some speed investment, but yeah. Just my two cents.
  8. Takion


    Dec 7, 2012
    Mike, yea I see what your saying, but how about magic coat over t-wave?
  9. ReshiRampage


    Jan 11, 2013
    I like to lead with this rotom-w set

    Rotom-W @ Chesto Berry
    EVs:4 SDef 252 SAtk 252 Hp
    Modest Nature

    Volt switch
    Hydro pump
    Hidden power ice

    This thing is great because it can bluff a choice item.
  10. Jcpdragonx


    Aug 19, 2009
    Scarf Jirachi is my favourite lead. You pretty much get momentum from the moment you U-turn, but it kinda sucks vs rain stall unless you're running trick.
  11. Shurtugal

    Shurtugal The Enterpriser.

    Jun 25, 2011
    I like SashSR Terrakion, as well as Mental Herb DeoD and this little guy:

    Dragonite @ Life Orb
    Trait: Multiscale
    Nature: Mild
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 SpA / 4 Spe (I cant remember what speed evs i used because im sure i invested more so someone can always fix this but I dont have access to PO or PS on proxies so give me a break ^-^)
    - Draco Meteor
    - Outrage
    - Superpower
    - Extreme Speed

    Its a nice anti-lead. Good for just hitting random stuff in general. I'm sure 1/2 of you are now taking this set into consideration for SPL lol (I think CTC used it in one of his rounds, hes the one who introduced me to this set). Its pretty fun to use when you want an antilead that isnt gay like machamp
  12. doughboy

    doughboy backhand slap ready
    is a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Sep 4, 2011
    I'd rather use Intimidate Mixmence considering that it is much faster to make up for the lack of Extremespeed and has much better coverage/wallbreaking power since it has Fire Blast (which is really important in the beginning of the game). That speed is especially key when facing Deoxys-D, since the combination of Draco Meteor+Outrage always KO's Deoxys-D where it can only get up SR. Intimidate provides a similar effect to Multiscale where you can limit the opponent's attack, although not as great of an extent to multiscale.
  13. Boondocker


    Nov 6, 2009
    The speed increase deffinitely does not make up for Extremespeed. Can Mence's speed help it win against Garchomp? Terrakoin? Azelf? Can Mence even think about staying in on Mamo? Mence fares better against Deo, I'll give u that, but Nite is better against the vast majority of leads. Nite also has Fire Blast, and should probably use it over Outrage.
  14. pom


    Jan 1, 2013
    What is Extremespeed doing against Garchomp, Terrakion, and Mamo?

    252 Atk Dragonite ExtremeSpeed vs. 0 HP / 4 Def Mamoswine: 107-127 (29.63 - 35.18%) -- 20.29% chance to 3HKO

    252 Atk Dragonite ExtremeSpeed vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Garchomp: 94-111 (26.33 - 31.09%) -- guaranteed 4HKO

    252 Atk Dragonite ExtremeSpeed vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Azelf: 120-142 (33.89 - 40.11%) -- guaranteed 3HKO

    I won't even bother with the calcs on Rakion. It doesn't even two-shot AZELF without a plus nature and boosting item. Dragonite also can hardly stay in on any of the pokemon you listed any better than Salamence.
    -1 252+ Atk Mamoswine Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Salamence: 232-280 (70.09 - 84.59%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    -1 252 Atk Terrakion Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Salamence: 264-312 (79.75 - 94.25%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252 Atk Terrakion Stone Edge vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Multiscale Dragonite: 169-201 (52.32 - 62.22%) -- 98.83% chance to 2HKO

    252+ Atk Mamoswine Ice Shard vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Multiscale Dragonite: 152-180 (47.05 - 55.72%) -- 69.92% chance to 2HKO

    I'd rather have the higher speed and attacking stats, personally.
  15. Jok


    Dec 14, 2012
    are you seriously using max hp azelf?
  16. Sacaen


    Oct 4, 2012
    252 hp/252 spe azelf is used for it's dual screen set, and it is a competent dual screener/lead, even though it has alot of competition.
  17. Sork


    Sep 3, 2012
    This is a set I have particularly enjoyed using.

    Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Serene Grace
    Nature: Jolly
    EVs: 252 Attack / 252 Speed / 6 HP
    - Trick
    - Magic Coat
    - U-turn
    - Iron Head

    This Jirachi is pretty much the perfect counter to Deoxys-D. Fortunately, Mental herb and magic coat do not prevent trick, so with this Rachi in the lead position, there are a number of things you can do. If you're facing a Deoxys-D, then you can just trick it a scarf, and watch as the momentum switches to your side of the field. If they decide to only get up rocks, then you can u-turn out to whatever they switch out to, and proceed to have the game be in your favor. If they magic coat and you trick them a scarf, then they can either A. Go for rocks. B. Set up spikes. Or C. Switch out. Now, with Magic coat, 2 out of those three options will spell doom for them. After they see you're running magic coat and deflect their hazards back at them, then you can just u-turn out on the obvious switch, and then it's actually YOU making all the moves of the game. Deoxys-D's only offensive option to hit Jirachi is fire gem boosted HP Fire, which it can't even use since you trick it the scarf. This Rachi also helps out late game, being able to trick an item you got earlier onto something that doesn't appreciate it. Say you tricked a chansey your scarf, now you have an eviolite to trick onto something else. If you choose to keep your scarf intact, then you are able to keep up offensive pressure with scarf u-turn. If you lead with this rachi and it's an unfavorable matchup, then you can just u-turn out and have rachi serve as a way to cripple walls, and as a way to bounce back the opposing hazards.
  18. pom


    Jan 1, 2013
    Like the other guy said, yeah, dual screens set. Now that I think about it though, it might not even 3HKO if Azelf Reflects after the first ESpeed. Either way, Dragonite doesn't really fare any better against the other three, even if it does better against the highly rare Azelf.
  19. Scorpiopt


    Jan 2, 2013
    Fastest Taunt and Fake out ( last is non prankster obviously)
    She can pack a punch and provide support for the team stop hazard setting and broking sashes and Multi-scale

    Weavile @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Pickpocket
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Ice Punch
    - Night Slash
    - Fake Out
    - Taunt
  20. Moltres light

    Moltres light

    Feb 24, 2013
    Mew @ Leftover
    252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly nature
    ~ Fake out
    ~ Taunt
    ~ Stealth rock
    ~ U-turn

    Fake out to see if the item of the opponent's lead is leftover, as well as breaking focus sash. Mew is such a fast taunter only slower than few leads, it can easily taunt and set up stealth rock. U-turn to scout. By the way, Mew is really bulky that it cant be OHKOed by nearly everything even if it is a super effective attack.
  21. Lilligant562


    May 21, 2012
    Deoxys-D @ Leftovers
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 248 HP / 240 SDef / 22 SpDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Recover
    - Nightshade
    - Stealth Rock
    - Taunt

    Worked a treat! =] But now it's gone =[

    So I just use bog-standard but reliable Skarmory instead =/
  22. Bryce

    Bryce Lun

    Mar 21, 2012
    That set is just like Anti-Lead Rayquaza in Ubers lol.It looks like a pretty good anti-lead.I had used DD and CB Nite as attacking leads and had good results.Also,about what Espeed does,it finishes of Garchomp,Terrakion and Mamo once they are down to their sash from Dragonite's other moves as they SR.

    Froslass (F) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Cursed Body
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Spikes
    - Taunt
    - Ice Beam
    - Destiny Bond

    With Deo-D getting banned,this can be used as a fantastic alternative for spike stacking offense.With great 110 base speed as well as taunt,it can get up hazards easily and prevent your opponent from setting up,with the extra benefit of spin blocking at the same time and potentially taking out something via Destiny Bond.But unlike Deo-D,this set suits bulky offense more than Heavy offense since it can't set up SR too.But it can still be used in HO paired with something like SR Terrakion.
  23. pom


    Jan 1, 2013
    What I've been using

    Accelgor @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Unburden
    EVs: 208 Spd / 252 SAtk / 48 HP
    Modest Nature
    - Bug Buzz
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Spikes
    - Yawn

    Always sets up 2 layers unless you use a multi-hit/move+priority move that KO's, or outspeeding and 2HKOing without breaking the Sash. Even faster Scarfers like Scarf Rakion can't stop it from getting 2 layers because after the Sash is gone, Unburden kicks in and the Scarfer is now outsped. Modest 252 because it doesn't hit very hard at all (not that it really needs to). EV'd to beat 224 Jolly Weavile before Unburden. All you ever really click is Spikes, but Bug Buzz hurts Magic Bouncers and Starmie, and HP Fire hits Ferro, Scizor and Forry. Last move can be anything. Encore is incompatible with Unburden unfortunately. Try it out, maybe tweak the EV's a little for a more efficient spread, but 252 Modest is pretty much not optional if you ask me. Unlike Deoxys, this guy handles the Starfish himself, so the only support you REALLY need is Gengar or another spinblocker.
  24. Solerme


    Jan 22, 2012

    Abomasnow @Choice Scarf
    Ability: Snow Warning
    EVs: 16 Atk / 252 SpA / 240 Spe
    Nature Naive (+Spe / -SpD )
    - Blizzard
    - Giga Drain
    - Earthquake
    - HP Fire

    Reaching a speed of 254 he can surprice your enemy and take the advantage immediatly. Thanks to hail he can also OHKO the focus sash leads, setting up weather too. Maybe is more a gimmick than a solid choice, but it can really help you to have a good start. Sadly (or rightly) now he is UU, but still he is the only Hail inducer, so if you are running a hail team he may be a good lead with this build. Beware of other weather inducers Leads, cause the 254 speed will let other pkms set up their weather instead of Hail.

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