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Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Tobes, Jan 2, 2013.
So... with Ninjask at #56, is it getting an upgrade in tiers? =P
Nope. It didn't make the ~3.41% cutoff.
Okay, the stats on Ninjask are really interesting.
It is within a few ranks of the cutoff in every tier. Even UU, where it was lowest, it was #62 in rank, and the last mon in the tier is Houndoom, at #56. Ninjask is almost like Ditto, it has a purpose in all tiers. Even a slight change in the meta could make it rise to anywhere.
I think my favorite stat is "100% of Chanseys switched out of Tangela."
| Tangela 100.000 (100.00±0.00) |
| (0.0% KOed / 100.0% switched out)|
Vaporeon > Landorus??? Espeon, alakazam, infernape, vaporeon, cloyster need to get out of the tier.
I'm kinda confused, could someone explain the percentages? Does the 20% on scizor mean that 20% of teams have a scizor? 19% of teams are rain teams (politoed)? And how is the "real" percentage calculated?
Those percentages match your descriptions. iirc the "real" percentage is determined by how many battles the Pokemon showed up on the field (ie actually did something)
Ok going through the stats:
| 1 | Scizor | 184871 | 19.225% | 148224 | 19.058% |
Scizor back at #1 again? The whole Bug/Steel with U-Turn being at #1 is getting a little old. But whatever, Scizor is such a boss that I don't care, it deserves the usage it gets.
| 4 | Dragonite | 152726 | 15.882% | 119202 | 15.327% |
| 9 | Garchomp | 112127 | 11.660% | 86260 | 11.091% |
| 18 | Salamence | 88705 | 9.225% | 67014 | 8.616% |
Maybe its just me but Dragonite is horribly outclassed by these two in the role it is mainly used for IMO. Multiscale is broken by Stealth Rock and if the opponent has Tyranitar/Hippowdon/Abomasnow then it will never use it. Granted, Dragonite is a beast in rain with its advantages over Tornadus-T (such as bulk and the ability to go mixed with Waterfall) but Salamence outclasses Dragonite as a Dragon Dance sweeper while Garchomp outclasses it as a Choice Band user. I don't think it deserves this usage.
| 25 | Infernape | 78792 | 8.194% | 63837 | 8.208% |
I'm sorry but this is undeserved. For all the reasons previously mentioned.
| 26 | Keldeo | 72344 | 7.523% | 55916 | 7.190% |
Keldeo should be top 10. Seriously this thing 2HKOes all but the bulkiest resists with Choice Specs Hydro Pump in rain. And with its counters criminally underused too, there won't be a better time to spam Hydro Pump like its 1999.
| 32 | Deoxys-Defense | 63787 | 6.633% | 58405 | 7.510% |
The face of hyper offence is only #32? What is this madness?
| 30 | Jolteon | 66660 | 6.932% | 54013 | 6.945% |
| 33 | Thundurus-Therian | 63029 | 6.555% | 50037 | 6.434% |
These two are beasts in rain. Both of them, especially Thundurus-T, deserve higher usage.
| 34 | Kyurem-Black | 62560 | 6.506% | 47664 | 6.128% |
| 38 | Hydreigon | 60001 | 6.240% | 47213 | 6.071% |
Now that Genesect is gone, I expected these two, especially Hydreigon, to rocket in usage. Seriously neither of them have counters. Admittedly Kyurem-B hasn't shown its full potential yet though, fyi a Kyurem-B with 0 investment in its Atk packs more power than Jolly Salamence with full investment. These two deserve much higher usage, top 20 at least.
| 44 | Metagross | 52352 | 5.444% | 43279 | 5.565% |
| 45 | Landorus | 51803 | 5.387% | 40504 | 5.208% |
Ugh. This is disgusting. Landorus is one of the best sweepers in the tier and is used less than Metagross. I'm more appalled by this than the amount of usage Infernape gets. Especially now Genesect is gone, Landorus has no more competition as a Rock Polish user. This is criminal.
| 46 | Latias | 51380 | 5.343% | 40249 | 5.175% |
| 47 | Celebi | 49069 | 5.103% | 40309 | 5.183% |
| 48 | Toxicroak | 45290 | 4.710% | 34728 | 4.465% |
These three deserve more love. All three take on Keldeo well, which is enough reason to use them. Why is Latios at #13 when Latias can't get above #46? I much prefer the extra bulk of Latias than the extra power of Latios. Seriously Latias counters sun, Breloom and even Terrakion better than Latios. While Celebi has a best friend who is at #5 in usage. I don't understand this.
| 60 | Sableye | 25137 | 2.614% | 21541 | 2.770% |
Wow did I do that many battles? Hehe. Anyway, Sableye is so much better than most people think. It actually has usable bulk, Ferrothorn fails to 3HKO even if it miraculously manages to avoid being burned. Prankster is the best thing that ever happened to Sableye and nobody (except me) seems to want to take advantage of that. Its a little upsetting actually :'(
| 73 | Zapdos | 17526 | 1.823% | 14474 | 1.861% |
| 74 | Xatu | 16633 | 1.730% | 13790 | 1.773% |
| 82 | Slowbro | 13801 | 1.435% | 11300 | 1.453% |
| 84 | Wobbuffet | 13562 | 1.410% | 11560 | 1.486% |
| 88 | Stoutland | 12177 | 1.266% | 9250 | 1.189% |
| 89 | Gothitelle | 12128 | 1.261% | 10109 | 1.300% |
| 118 | Meloetta | 7380 | 0.767% | 5816 | 0.748% |
| 126 | Sandslash | 6496 | 0.676% | 4804 | 0.618% |
All of these are extremely viable in OU and deserve more usage IMO.
Vaporeon is a bulky water with Wish, perfect for teams that don't need spin-blocking(Jellicent) or Spinning(Cruel). Cloyster has already been argued here, but basically BP 125 STAB attack plus Shell Smash and Rapid Spin is hard to ignore. Zam is a seriously fast, offensive sweeper, and Sash basically guarantees a KO on one of your opponent's threats. I'm less a fan of it, but it's not unreasonable for it to be OU.
Cloyster is hard to ignore unless you have a water or steel type. And rapid spin with shell smash is just stupid. Vaporeon is rotom-w that is weak to electric doesnt have will o wisp a flying resist or speed or volt switch. It is a celebi without fighting resist, and a jirachi that can't take outrage or draco. It just seems like an offensive heatran counter outside of sun and thats about it. IT has good bulk to live random hits and retaliate, but pretty much anything can 2HKO it.
Vaporeon has nearly identical bulk to Jellicent and Tentacruel, just with somewhat different support options. Each one of them fits well on different teams.
Cloyster can come in, forcing your opponent to either switch their spinblocker into a Rock Blast/Icicle Spear(or Shell Smash if you're feeling ballsy), a guaranteed 2hko on every OU/UU blocker other than Jellicent, or they can switch someone else in and risk you getting off the Rapid Spin. Later on, you can switch it in again and go for the Shell Smash to get in a mid-game sweep.
Few things to say.....
Firstly, sun teams are not getting enough love. I know that it is the least favorable when compared to Rain and Sandstorm, but it is still a great weather with great sweepers.
| 20 | Cloyster | 85567 | 8.898% | 66178 | 8.509% |
Secondly, wtf is Cloyster doing in 20th??
| 50 | Reuniclus | 39309 | 4.088% | 30793 | 3.959% |
Finally, I can't believe Reuniclus is really that low in usage? It dominates as a stallbreaker, and it can set in the face of almost any wall and proceed to sweep. It's movepool could use some fixing though.
You said it yourself why Reuniclus is low in usage. It does indeed dominate as a stallbreaker, but is it really worth wasting a teamslot on Reuniclus to break stall when you can just use a core of stupidly powerful attackers that aren't deadweights against offense (i.e. Specs Keldeo + CB Terrakion). CM Reuniclus just isnt justifiable anymore, and Reuniclus is doomed to a life in low OU. However, its ability to turn speedy offensive teams against themselves with a TR set is much more useful. In this respect, Reuniclus could rise a little bit, but the CM set is honestly awful in this meta, with Scizor being common and Tyranitar running CB more often now, as well as Rain attackers doing a ton of damage to it, even after a CM.
tl;dr: Dont use CM Reuniclus. If you need to use the blob, use LO TR.
Yall act like cloyster is as bad as farfetch'd or some shit. Last time I checked it was B tier. Does B tier equal shit in OU or something?
It can sweep entire teams when the opponent is not careful. It can be stopped with taunt, priority users and Keldeo but once those are out of the way Cloyster is near unstoppable.
Alakzam is alsoa great cleaner, at the end of the game when thing's are weakeend and the scarfers are gone, alakazam will outspeed every ou pokemon with out priority bar jolteon and has a base 135 special attack from which even with a focus sash is still sky high and makes it easy for him to pick off weakend threats with relative ease.
Alakazam's old probelm was it's frailty and while that still exists, thanks to magic guard it's become much easier for alakazam to survive longer now. He is a glass cannon with a second chance button should anything go wrong or he could be a glass cannon with extra gun power if you asume it's sashed and it's using life orb and thta can really screw people over, if they always assume sash.
Alakazam and Cloyster both have issues switching in, as they are rather frail, and while they are good pokemon and definitely deserve a spot in ou, they should not be as high in ou as they are, at the expense of other similarly good offensive pokemon.
Alakazam is actually not that powerful, even with Life Orb. OU's standard of special attacking is pushing 140+ base offense with 120+ BP moves to toss around. Alakazam doesn't have anything stronger than Psychic to use or even a good offensive typing. It has a niche in OU for getting the jump on other sweepers with its unusual speed tier and surviving things it isn't supposed to with a free Focus Sash, but in terms of pure offense, it falls well below the standard Latios, Keldeo, Landorus, and Thundurus-T have set for some months now.
I say this, of course, as an Alakazam user. You will probably spend more time using Focus Blast than Psychic. Do not expect it to OHKO anything. Calc up before you stay in and attack something with most of its HP left.
ye thats generally what i use it for, more cleaner than sweeper.
magic guard alakazam is threatening for many teams lol
Arguments in bold.