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OU Team Building

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Nova, Dec 6, 2012.

  1. Adrian Marin

    Adrian Marin

    Mar 26, 2011
    Role: Late Game Cleaner, Special Bulky Paralysis Sweeper?


    Exeggutor (M) @ Sitrus Berry
    Trait: Harvest
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Psyshock
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Stun Spore

    -Hidden Power Fire
    -Stun Spore

    What it does:

    Exeggutor is an extremely dangerous Pokemon boasting a high 125 base Special Attack and a potent special movepool. Thanks to its Dream World ability, Harvest, Exeggutor can pull off an effective substunspore plus 2 attacks set that is notoriously hard to KO due to the fact that (in sun) sitrus berry will never stop being grown making it an incredibly odd but effective attacker. Exeggutor's reputation as a Sun Sweeper will force many switches which will also increase its viability and effectiveness.

    Stun spore will let Exeggcutor outspeed most pokemons which will allow him to exploit his ability to the maximum. First make sure the foe is paralyzed, Once he's paralyzed use Substitute until the foe switches or "paralyzed cant move" Once you get a free substitute murder the opposition with that 125 base special attack. Make sure you never lose your substitute and use this strategy against everybody preferably.

    Just put it this way, 1 switch in and the foes team can be completely destroyed. But if you want a more detailed explanation then I will tell everybody, It can spread paralysis to support your team, but the Exeggcutioner will probably 6-0 the foe anyway. Besides that there's not much else to tell.

    Good Teamates: Ninetales is mandatory to make sure sitrus berry recovers 100% of the time, Heatran can cover all of the eggs weaknesses. Terrakion is a good teamate as it can easily counter Tyranitar, Status healers in general are very very helpful to aid the Exeggcutioner as it will help him sweep.

    There are not many good teamates for the 3 eggs I tried my best to post all I could think of.

    What counters it:

    Not many counter it but Tyranitar is a great counter because it changes the weather to Sandstorm and resists both psychoshock and HP fire while threatening the 3 eggs
    With STAB super effective crunch. Hydreigon and Houndoom are also both great counters as they resist,immune to the 3 eggs attacks and can both OHKO the 3 eggs.

    Feedback would be greatly appreciated.

    This video showcases its effectiveness.. just skip to turn 13.


    Another video:



  2. Electrolyte

    Electrolyte Who says I can't get stoned?
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Jul 5, 2012
    Unfortunately, no one has done this guy yet:


    Landorus-T @ Leftovers
    Adamant nature
    244 HP / 64 Atk / 200 Def
    -Stealth Rock
    -Stone Edge

    Hazard User, Bulky Attacker, Tank, Pivot

    What It Does:
    Move over Gliscor, there's a new bad boy in town.
    With Intimidate and decent bulk, Landorus-T has more immediate physical bulk than Gliscor- and makes it extremely good at switching into physical hitters. This, in turn with its massive physical attack even when uninvested, its ability to U-Turn, as well as its ability to set hazards, makes it one of my favorite bulky physical tanks.

    One of the most notable things bulky Lando is capable of is being a great counter to Sand teams. It is one of the best counters to both Tyranitar and Terrakion, using Intimidate to lower their attack stats so that you can set up on them or just plain OHKO them with EQ. It also outspeeds the new SDef Bulky Totom-W, U-turning into a partner so that it can be dealt with accordingly. Common Sand sweepers such as Stoutland or Sandslash need either boosting moves or SE coverage in order to beat this guy as well.

    Aside from just walling Sand in general and being a huge threat to every Ttar in existence, Lando can also wall fighting, dragons, and many other prominent physical attackers. Dragons are one thing Lando is great at walling- as none of them can OHKO full health Lando with any physical move after Intimidate (not even Kyu-B) Lando in turn can 2HKO Mence, Kyu-B and Dnite with Stone Edge, 2HKO Chomp with EQ, and 3HKO Lati@s with U-Turn. This is extremely useful for people that want a check to all of the above threats.

    Lando's also great at beating down special walls such as Jirachi / Blissey / Tentacruel with its powerful EQ, which at least 2HKO's all of them. He can counter Volt Turn easily too, being able to defeat Scizor easily hands down everytime, and switch in to cause problems to a choice locked Rotom-W (though it's not recommended you do so) With SR up its sleeve, you don't have to worry about squeezing it in on another teammate- as U-Turn / EQ / Stone Edge is all Lando really needs to function well. With SR as a bonus, you can easily set hazards as your opponent scrambles for momentum after all of the clever plays you can make with this guy.

    Good Teammates:
    There is a long list of pokemon I can name that work well with Lando-T- but one of the exceptional ones are Rotom-W. It forms a great pair with Landorus, resisting Ice and Water for it, as well as chasing away all of the really powerful rain sweepers like Keldeo-R or Tornadus-T. It can also form a VoltTurn core with Lando, utilizing Lando's SR to deal hazard damage, as well as their powerful pivot moves to inflict pain. Rotom's strong water STABs are useful for taking out Gliscors and other ground types, and its Volt Switches help beat bulky water types. TWave also helps Lando overcome it's low speed.

    Another great partner is SpDef Jirachi. It as well can take the numerous amount of water / ice spam in common rain teams that Lando hates, as well as parahax Lati@s to death. Jirachi's fire punch is also quite useful at removing Forretress / Ferrothorn, two pokemon Landorus-T doesn't like. Jirachi's Wishes can also keep Lando healthy.

    In general, Landorus-T works well with almost any team, because of it's good bulk and power, rare and useful typing, and neat ability. I've used it and loved it on Rain teams to counter Sand / Fighting, but it of course can also be used in Sun for the same purpose. Nonweather likes it too because it isn't really dependent on any weather to work well, and it counters Sand effectively and Sun decently.

    What Counters It:
    Really, only Rain spam, Ice spam, and powerful special hitters can truly defeat Lando (or gradual SR damage) Bulky water types are hard for Lando to handle, since they can do a hefty chunk with their STABs. Ice types such as Mamoswine or Kyu-B can do a lot with their powerful Ice moves. Special attackers like Specs Latios or SubD Gengar can also be painful to deal with.

    In conclusion

    Landorus-T should be considered in any team when looking for a bulky and hard hitting pokemon!
  3. Adrian Marin

    Adrian Marin

    Mar 26, 2011
    I think that landorus is absolutely brilliant mostly because of forcing switches and getting an almost guaranteed scout with U-Turn. Also it has the niche of easily setting up stealth rock.

    Highly recommended as a physical wall that can gain momentum and change a match.
  4. AfroThunderRule

    AfroThunderRule *yawn* ez
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    May 25, 2009
    Sorry if my English is not up to par.

    Dugtrio @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Arena Trap
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    IVs: 21 HP
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Reversal
    - Stone Edge / Sucker Punch / Memento

    Role: Support, Revenge Killer

    What It Does: Helps trap certain Pokemon that can either make other Pokemon easier to sweep with or gain something, like weather support. It helps you revenge kill Pokemon like Blissey, Espeon, Heatran, Infernape, Jirachi, Tyranitar, Terrakion, Ninetales, Magnezone, Tentacruel, Toxicroak and weakened Pokemon like Garchomp, Gastrodon, Keldeo, Politoed, Starmie, etc. Plus after it has done its job of revenging it can further help you by seting up Stealth Rock or using Memento to help support your sweepers to set up easier after its death.

    Good Teammates: Generally weather based Pokemon like Ninetales and Politoed loves Dugtrio support as it helps beat Pokemon like Tyranitar or Nintales (for Drizzle teams), Heatran (for Drought teams) that always threatens their teams goals. Another Pokemon that loves Dugtrio is Volcarona as it helps deal with things like other weather setters, Heatran, Terrakion, Blissey all things that can trouble Volcarona.

    What Counters It: Well it's pretty hard to counter something that you can't switch into, but Dugtrio does have it fair shair of checks. Flying/Levitating types are it's biggest problems as they are the only Pokemon that can switch out from Dugtrio. Pokemon with some priority, like Mamoswine, Breloom, Scizor can trouble Dugtrio as it cannot abuse its speed to get around those moves, note it can use Sashed Reversal to either kill or greatly some of these checks. Hazards can ruin this set can it needs to he at full health to perform it's role.


    Gothitelle (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Shadow Tag
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Psyshock / Psychic
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice] or [Fire]
    - Trick

    Role: Support, Revenge Killer

    What It Does:
    Like with Dugtrio, it can help support your team by removing a big threat for your team, with Scarf Gothitelle can become a great revenge killer as with Scarf it gets in a very nice speed tier (356 speed) as it barely outspeed Tornadus-T. It can safely revenge kill half depending on its move selection thanks due to its ability. Some problematic Pokemon that Gothitelle can revenge and eliminated are Blissey/Chansey (Trick), Breloom, Conkeldurr, Dragonite (HP Ice), Ferrothorn (FP Fire), Forretress, Garchomp, Gengar, Keldeo, Landorus, Politoed, Salamence, Starmie, Tentacruel, Tornadus-T, Terrakion and much more.

    Good Teammates: Almost anything can benefit from having one or two of their biggest checks eliminated. A good teammate for Gothitelle can be Dugtrio, it helps remove pesky steels types to help Gothitelle do its job and can form into the GothTrio combo that can frustrate teams with their ability of trapping Pokemon.

    What Counters It: It's impossible to counter Gothitelle because you can't switch in due to Shadow Tag, but with with Scarf and a non special attacking nature it does have a hard time to power through some threats. Scizor and other Steel types are very good checks to Gothitelle lacking HP Fire as they can easily take any attack and retaliate. With U-Turners, even weak ones, can check Gothitelle as they can switch out to a Counter/check while dealing significant damage.

    Any Additional Info: Note, if you opt for Hidden Power Fire for this set you'll only be able to speed tie Tornadus-T
  5. Subject 18

    Subject 18 Now it ends.
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Battle Server Moderatoris a Contributor Alumnus

    May 3, 2012
    Shouldn't there be a section for weather inducers?
  6. gengarsnemisis


    Dec 2, 2011
    They can be classified under the 'support' section.
  7. BlankZero


    Aug 25, 2012
    I'm going to post a few "standard sets" that I haven't seen around yet. Feel free to edit the EVs, as I will be taking them mostly from the StrategyDex (standard 252 splits)


    Scizor @ Choice Band
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpDef
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -Spd)
    - Bullet Punch
    - U-Turn
    - Superpower
    - Pursuit

    Role: Offensive Hole Puncher, Revenge Killer, Late-Game Sweeper

    What It Does: The king of the DPP OU Metagame still thrives in the BW2 era, even more so now that its Bug/Steel parter in crime, Genesect, has been banished to the Uber Tier, ridding Scizor of one more dangerous counter. Choice Band Scizor trades the power of its Life Orb+SD set for more coverage and more immediate power. A staple on many Hyper Offense teams for its ability to trap and kill the more prominent spinners and walls (Starmie, Lati@s, Gengar), it's best known for its STAB + Technician Boosted Bullet Punch, one of only two Priority moves in the game not walled by Ghost types (the other being Ice Shard), and only resisted by a small handful of types. Superpower is for one of those type, the highly defensive Steel type. Superpower can OHKO Ferrothorn and Magnezone no problem, and while Skarmory, Jirachi, and Forretess wal this choice a bit, Scizor still carries it's second best weapon, U-Turn, to swap out for a more suitable check to the opponents new choice. With this EV Spread, Scizor gains a bit of Bulk over Speed, meaning other Priority attacks will usually beat it. However, gaining a bit of staying power can be a good thing when mispredicting a switch (HP Fire Latias can usually survive a Pursuit if not switching out) and give Scizor a "second life" so to speak.

    Good Teammates: Heatran, especially Balloon variants, are great Scizor partners. With Flash Fire, Tran can come in on any usual Fire type and absorb the attack, giving its own Fire attacks a boost. Another good partner is Magnezone. Magnezone counters the Water types and other Steel types (barring Heatran and EQ-carrying Forretress) that can wall Scizor.

    What Counters it: Fire. This steel bug HATES fire. This is bad, as it is a very common offensive type, with almost everything carrying something Fire-based. Even some pokemon with low Special Attack can carry Hidden Power Fire and destroy Scizor with little or no investment, as a 4x weakness, coupled with middling 80 Special Defense leaves it wide open to such an assault. Bulky Water-Types, specifically Jellicent, can pretty much Hard Wall almost anything Scizor will toss out, barring Pursuit on the switch.

    Anything Else: Scizor also has access to Bug Bite, which, with only 60 BP, gets a Technician Boost, which U-turn does not, making Bug Bite far more powerful that U-Turn in terms of pure power.


    Mamoswine @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -Spd)
    - Ice Shard
    - Stealth Rock
    - Superpower/Endeavor
    - Earthquake

    Role: Lead, Dragon Revenge Killer

    What It Does: Mamoswine makes Dragons cry. Really, that is one of the only reason is is OU. But that doesn't mean that's all it's good for. With access to Stealth Rock, it becomes a great Sash Lead, guaranteeing Rocks, and still having enough offensive presence to smash face. Although it lacks the ability to stop other setup leads, except maybe Ferrothorn with Supwerpower, it can make your opponent think twice about sending out the Outraging Dragon to grab a quick kill.

    Good Teammates: Mamoswine does well on nearly every team, from Sand, Hail, HO, Stall, and even some Sun Hybrid teams. It is one of the only real counters to DragMag nowadays as well, killing Magnezone easily, and still killing all the dragons out there, barring maybe Latias and Multiscale Nite. Even Hydregion falls to a well timed Superpower or Endeavor after Sashing down to 1. That being said, anything that can cover its weaknesses to Rock, Fighting, Grass, and Water (all common mover types) would make Mamoswine a very happy Ice Pig. Also, Rapid Spin support is great, especially on this version, as Mamo suffers SR weakness. Starmie would be a good team mate due to its RS ability as well as sponging Water attacks aimed at Mamo, while Mamo can absorb the thunderbolts coming after Starmie.

    What Counters it: Mach Punch, Bullet Punch or a fast CC are Mamoswine's bane, making Lucario, Terrakion, Scizor, and even Breloom (Jolly Breloom outspeeds Adamant Mamo) send Mamoswine running scared. Also, any high powered Grass attacks, like Venusaur's Giga Drain, or Rain-Boosted Water attacks can send Mamoswine back into semi-extinction.

    Anything else: Mamoswine is the best Dragon check out there offensively. If you find yourself Dragon Weak, try Mamo out.

    I'll post a few more later on, and give more people a chance to post some "standard" sets.
  8. Huntofthelion

    Huntofthelion Live for the nights you can't remember
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Nov 2, 2008
    OK this update is well overdue but finals week + end of term projects + family stuff made it difficult for Asek and I to meet up to work on this and just work on it in general. However I have looked through every post up to BlankZero's post contributing Scizor and Mamoswine. Because I need to speak with Asek regarding some of the discussion posts and the point system I have not updated the leaderboard, that will happen when he and iron some things out. However here is the current set contribution count:

    Sets Added LB (open)
    DarkBlazeR - 4 sets
    Dark Fallen Angel - 4 sets
    TGMD - 3 sets -
    qwertyuiop - 3 sets
    BlankZero - 3 sets
    gan4lf - 2 sets
    NixHex - 2 sets
    ClubbingSealCub - 2 sets
    superpowerdude - 2 sets
    AfroThundeRule - 2 sets
    isr - 1 set
    Tabuu - 1 Set
    remedy - 1 set
    Asek - 1 set
    jaredz99 - 1 set
    White symphoni - 1 set
    ThunderBlunder - 1 set
    jimbon - 1 set
    gengarnemesis - 1 set
    HackerKing - 1 Set
    Tobes - 1 Set
    The Unlucky One - 1 Set
    wikecharlie - 1 set
    cabforpitt - 1 set
    HardCore - 1 set
    electrolyte - 1 set

    That said a few of the sets posted have not been added to the OP for various reasons. Joeyboy's Keldeo / Infernape and Neliel Tu Oderschvank 's Feraligatr have not been added because they need a bit more content. You two can edit your original posts with updates, however I would like to see some discussion on these sets so they can be fleshed out a little bit.

    I'm also holding off on TR Espeon, Shiftry, Focus Sash Gengar, and Exeggcutor. I want to see some more discussion on these sets before I add them because I'm a little skeptical on their effectiveness.

    Other than that keep up the great work guys, it's not going unnoticed. Hopefully Asek and I can get the leaderboard up tomorrow, including points for discussion posts in that, so you guys can see who's winning and who is slacking off. Also if you notice anything wrong with the OP please PM me instead of posting unless you have some content to your post. I appreciate the help checking my work but it kind of clutters the thread and a PM to me will get the same message to me. Thanks!
  9. Neliel

    Neliel Sacred Sword

    Oct 9, 2012
    Edited my set. I hope its good now.
  10. HardCore


    Aug 25, 2010
    What To Use
    Kyurem Black @ Life Orb
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 252 Spd/ 252 Attack/ 4 Def (You can spread the attack with the Special attack)
    Naïve Nature
    -Ice Beam
    -Earth Power/ Focus Blast
    -Fusion Bolt/ Draco Meteor / Subtitute

    Role: Stall Breaker / Mixed Sweeper

    What It Does: Since its suspect test, Kyurem Black’s usage has dropped a little, however due to its typing, bulk, and power it is perfect for breaking stall and sweeping two or three Pokemon while doing it. In a rain dominated metagame you need something that breaks stall and rain cores. With Life Orb Kyurem Black can 2hko ferrothorn on the switch, (which will happen) with Ice Beam and then Focus Blast. A lot of people don’t suspect Outrage after you use special moves for some reason so when you pump out that base 170 Life Orb Outrage, which 2hkos most steels in OU other than Ferrothorn, Skarmory, and Forretress the opponent has a completely new devastating threat on its hands. Kyurem Black can tank a Hydro Pump on the switch and then use Draco Meteor or Ice Beam instead of using Outrage to save Outrage for a more propitious, or advantageous situation. Don’t forget you could safely outrage from the protection of a bulky substitute.

    Good Teammates: Good teammates for Kyurem Black in general are spinners, Magnezone, and other steel types. If you clear out the few steels that Kyurem Black can’t handle on its own and hazards Kyurem Black’s bulk and power do the rest of the work. Kyurem Black is most synergetic with offensive teams, therefore partners such as Scizor, Landorus forms, Garchomp, Terrakion, Keldeo, Politoed, and Lati@s are perfect for Kyurem Black. If you add the amount of inundating power Kyurem Black brings onto an offensive team you can’t go wrong. At least not easily. Personally I will give you guys a huge tip listed here first (pretty sure I made this combo up), which is Tornadus I with Prankster using Tailwind. Kyurem Black wants Agility or Dragon Dance well the next best thing is a late game Tail Wind to give him more than enough speed at max t out speed Scarf Latios.
    More Teammates: Having Kyurem Black on your team means your team should be well prepared for steels, so having a clean up Scarf Mence/ CB/ DD Dragonite that doesn't have to worry about steel types will be to your advantage. Also, instead of using Magnezone who has all to common weaknesses you can make use of Scarf / Specs Gothitelle with Shadow Tag.

    What Counters It: As I have already listed Ferrothorn, Skarmory, and Forretress are all bulky enough steel types to switch directly into an Outrage. However if you are using the Substitute option then you can seriously wreck anything that comes out especially if you are lucky with confusion hax. Choice Band Scizor is a top threat for Kyurem Black, because it’s usually a KO. Keep in mind if you invest a few evs in bulk and have full health you can live LO bullet punch and if the damage roll is right Choice Band Scizor’s Bullet Punch. Your best bet against these Pokemon are simply the partners I have listed above and Pokemon that carry similar roles with those Pokemon.

    Additional Info: Kyurem Black has so much potential that you can make him hard to handle for your opponent. Tailwind Tornadus is frail so when you use the move before you die Kyurem Black is ready to sweep.
  11. Qwertyuiop


    Dec 19, 2010
    Didn't see this in the OP, so...


    Thundurus-T @ Life Orb
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    IVs: 30 Atk / 30 Def
    Timid / Modest Nature
    - Agility
    - Thunder / Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Focus Blast / Grass Knot / Superpower

    Role: Special sweeper, Late-game sweeper

    What it does: Thundurus-T has a mammoth 145 base SpA, the highest of any non-Ubers (tied with Chandelure), and outspeeds everything in the metagame after an Agility, so it is easily one of the best special sweepers you'll find in OU. If you use a Modest nature, the only things which can dream of safely switching in on you are the blobs and to a lesser extent Gastrodon (which can be easily removed by running Grass Knot). With its decent defensive typing, Thundurus can set up on choice locked ground and electric moves, choice locked Scizor etc. and wreak havoc on your opponent's team. Due to its speed after a boost, it's also very difficult to revenge kill without Weavile / Mamoswine. It's a good idea to keep it back for late game sweeps after walls have been weakened and things like Mamoswine removed.

    Depending on whether you run Timid or Modest, you should adjust the IVs. For Modest, dropping the Speed EVs to 188 is good idea; this lets Thundurus-T outspeed Timid Venusaur in sun and Jolly Stoutland in sand after a boost. The rest of the EVs can go in Defense. If you wish to use Superpower with Modest, you can put the remaining IVs in Attack to 2HKO the blobs.

    Good teammates: Politoed is an obvious option here for allowing Thundurus to use the significantly more powerful Thunder. Thundurus can also come in on predicted electric attacks aimed at Politoed. Thundurus has trouble beating Blissey, Chansey or Gastrodon, so physically based wall-breakers like Terrakion are good partners for it. It also appreciates both hazards and rapid spin support, so Ferrothorn, Deoxys-D and Forretress are good partners. Of these, Forretress can both lay down hazards and spin away Stealth Rock. Starmie is also a good choice for a rapid spin user as Thundurus-T can set up on some of Starmie's counters like Ferrothorn.

    What counters it: Few true counters for Thundurus-T exist. The closest thing to counters are specially defensive Water / Ground types like Gastrodon or Quagsire. The pink blobs are good counters as well, but if Thundurus-T is running Superpower, they'll get 2HKOd. Latias can take a hit and kill Thundurus-T with Draco Meteor. Mamoswine is a great check for it as it can easily KO with Ice Shard. SpDef Hippowdon is also dangerous as it only fears HP Ice and removes the rain which Thundurus-T likes.

    Any Additional Info: I have had decent success using Magnet, faking a choice set early game and sweeping late game. As previously mentioned, Superpower is a good option for taking out Blissey / Chansey.
  12. Neliel

    Neliel Sacred Sword

    Oct 9, 2012
    Honestly i would expand a little bit your teammates, since i think that any set of kyurem-b appreciates a lot the help from other dragons. What i mean is, kyurem forces your opponent to switch into a steel types, and in that moment you can get something like a 2ko with outrage to steel types(scizor for example) or in this case, since you have a mixed set, an ice beam /focus blast or whatever else to Heatran / ferrothorn ect, making the sweep for others dragon WAY easier. Something like Scarfmence or Dragonite or any other dragon can spam outrage without having to worry about steels, since this kyurem can baitkill most of them. Honesly i would not use draco meteor anyway, its not like non-steel physical wall can switch on you anyway (for example: donphan) since they get 2koed by outrage.
    I would also add scarf gothitelle; this pokemon gives your opponent a lot of pressure, and unlike magnezone its not fight weak, meaning that you will not have 2 fight weak pokemons, also ghotithelle still put pressure under Skarmory, Ferrothorn and forretress have to think twice about switch-in since gothitelle has hp fire. Gothi also helps with the omnipresent tech loom, wich is one of the three reason kyurem-b its not that good in my opinion (the first is stealth rock, and the second is scizor) and at full hp gothi can also take a bullet punch from scizor and strike a ko back with hp fire, so kyurem-b can spam outrage more easily.
  13. Schpoonman

    Schpoonman formerly Lord of Bays

    Oct 3, 2010

    Staraptor (M) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Reckless
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 HP
    Jolly Nature
    IVs: 30 Atk / 30 SAtk
    - Brave Bird
    - Double-Edge
    - Close Combat
    - U-turn

    Role: Wallbreaker, Cleaner

    What It Does: Breaks shit in half. Brave Bird and Double-Edge are insanely powerful. Physically-defensive Hippowdon (!!!) is 2HKOd by Brave Bird or Double-Edge. Cleanly.

    252Atk Choice Band Reckless Staraptor (Neutral) Brave Bird vs 252HP/252Def Leftovers Hippowdon (+Def): 50% - 60% (213 - 252 HP). Guaranteed 2HKO.

    Anything that resists Brave Bird or Double-Edge is either mangled by Close Combat or made to look like a fool as you U-turn out to something that laughs at it.

    Good Teammates: Rapid Spin support, above all else. As disgustingly powerful as he is (did you read that damage calc above?), his reliance on recoil moves and his weakness to Stealth Rock don't just add up: It multiplies. Okay, what I mean by that is that he loses a quarter of his health every time he switches in to Rocks, and if and when he offs some poor sap with Brave Bird or Double-Edge, he can and will lose upwards of another third or so of his health if they were healthy.

    Magnezone and Dugtrio are probably Staraptor's best friends. Magnezone completely destroys or cripples all the Steels neutral or immune to Earthquake (Skarmory, Bronzong, Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Scizor) while Dugtrio deals with the rest (Jirachi, Metagross, Lucario, and Heatran). Do note that Magnezone's mere presence will deter Scizor from spamming Bullet Punch freely, and should he choose to U-turn, expecting a switch, Brave Bird OHKOs max HP Scizor 81% of the time if he is at full health.

    What Counters It: There are two things Choice Band Staraptor loathes more than anything else in this world: Defensive Steel-type Pokémon, and Stealth Rock. While the four Steels neutral to Flying risk heavy damage from Brave Bird and Heatran risks Close Combat, the rest can freely switch in only slightly worse for wear, especially if they are physically defensive. As I made abundantly clear above, Stealth Rock is probably the worst thing that could happen to Staraptor.

    Those are the only things that counter Staraptor. He hits WAY too hard for anything neutral to Brave Bird or Double-Edge to switch in expecting to walk away easily. Faster Pokémon can switch in on the revenge and threaten him out due to how insanely frail he is.
  14. BlankZero


    Aug 25, 2012
    Here's another Landorus-Therian set for you guys. This time, it's the Double Dancer.


    Landorus-Therian @ Life Orb
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 70 HP /252 Atk / 188 Spd
    Adamant/Jolly Nature
    - Rock Polish
    - Swords Dance
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake

    Role: Physical Sweeper

    What It Does: Double-Dance Lando-T is one of those Pokemon that doesn't get nearly enough recognition in this metagame with its cousin RP Lando-I running around with Sheer Force. Regardless, this guy means business when he comes out onto the field. Running a Double-Dance setup sweeper means learning to read a team in team preview and know that you have what you need to break a team, whether you need Rock Polish up to outspeed a team of high-powered and fast threats, or whether you're facing down a Stall Gauntlet and need some Wall-Breaking power on your side. Either way, Double-Dance Lando-T is your guy, with EdgeQuake coverage on his side, a bit of bulk in the way of Intimidate, and plenty of power coming off of his meaty 145 Base Attack. His slightly disappointing 91 Speed is a bit of a bummer, but you can remedy it by going for Max speed over a bit of Bulk. Overall, as has been mentioned elsewhere before, Double Dance Lando-T is like a Double Dance Terrakion with better typing, bulk and brute force.

    Good Teammates: Good team mates for Landorus include those that can take ice and water attacks for it and Hazard Setters. This means, things like Celebi and Ferrothorn who can come in on the Water Types, and Jirachi who can eat Ice all day long. Also, things that can take out its biggest rival, Skarmory, who walls this set too well for words, where even with Stone Edge, Lando must be at +4 to even bring Skarm down to Sturdy, where Skarm can just Whirlwind it away. This makes things like Heatran, Thunderus-T, and any other Fire/Electric STAB user a very good pairing for Landorus, so long as the Water/Ice weakness is covered also.

    What Counters It: Skarmory, Bronzong, Defensive Gliscor, Hippodown, and anythign else that can live a +2 SE or EQ and hit back or phaze out and heal up. BalloonTran and Celebi packing HP Ice, or Mamoswine and Weaville and even Cloyster with Ice Shard will make Lando fall easily as well. Basically, anything that can survive a hit and hit back with Ice, or that can use Ice Shard are Landorus-T banes.

    Any Additional Info: Another set for this Landorus involves a Gravity team. With Gravity, you can replace Life Orb with Soft Sand and Stone Edge with Gravity for continued setup. Gravity makes everything immune to Ground attacks suddenly very confused. Skarmory and Bronzong, and even Gliscor to a smaller degree suddenly find the Earth Tiger very threatening, as does Lati@s if Lando manages to secure enough boosts.
  15. TheWaddleDeeKing


    Oct 7, 2012
    Figured I'd do one on the slightly popular Flame Charge Heatran. I use it myself, I love it.

    EDIT: Also decided to do a what not to use on Specially Defensive Forretress. I can see some controversy over it, though in my experience I can safely say I don't know why you would ever use that thing.

  16. LilOu

    LilOu PO poopyhead
    is a Tiering Contributor

    May 25, 2012
    Keldeo-R @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spe / 4 Hp
    Timid nature
    -Hydro Pump
    -Hidden Power [Ice]
    -Secret Sword

    Role: Special Sweeper, Late Game Sweeper.

    What it does: Keldeo has beautiful, beautiful attacking stats: 129 Special Attack and 108 Speed. This is something that, in conjunction with his powerful stab in Hydro Pump and his ability to hit really hard bulky Specially defensive pokemons with Secret Sword, can destroy the opponent team once it is weakened. The best item for him is choice scarf because it allows the user to outspeed almost everything except Scarf gengar, scarf jolteon, scarf tornadus-t, scarf Latio@s and scarf Durant, yes, it has 109 base speed. Fortunately, this pokemons are rarely seen holding a choice scarf (except for Latios and Latias). With the appropriate teammates, it is capable to sweep at the late game with Hydro Pump or Secret Sword depending on the situation.

    Good Teammates: Choice band Tyranitar. Nothing else. T-tar can trap and kill 99% of keldeo's counters. Let's think about it. Lati@s is OHKO'ed by pursuit even if he/she decides to stay. Jellycent is also OHKO'ed by crunch and pursuit if decides to switch. Celebi too. Defensive gastrodon receives HUGE damage from stab crunch of CBtar. Blissey is either trapped by tar or killed with Secret sword. Tentacruel, trapped and killed too (with the help of the sandstorm) just be careful about getting burned with scald. Toxicroak, this guy is the only thing that Tyranitar can't kill so the company of landorus-T or Latios is always good received.

    What counters it: As mentioned before, Keldeo gets walled by bulky water or grass type pokemons. Jellycent can take keldeo's hits forever. Toxicroak absorbs Surf and forces Keldeo to switch. Celebi resists his stab. Latios, Latias and Tentacruel too.

    Additional info: Once CBtar has removed Keldeo's counters and the sand or hazards have weakened the opponent's team, Keldeo is ready to go out and spam the correct stab attack. If you are battling a rain team you can take advantage of it and maybe let the rain stay so your surfs or hydro pumps will be stronger than usual.
  17. ssbbm


    May 14, 2010
    @lando t
    i don't think LO is good, i'd rather run muscle band or leftovers.

    @ spdef forry

    i don't think it's compleely outclassed. try running it in sun as a spinner / hazard setter, and that basically makes it a great bulky-water check (it sets up on keldeo and jellicent for example). i do think that standard physically bulky foretress is superior, but spdef forretress isn't something that you "shouldn't use". it's a good defensive pivot, and it has RAPID SPIN, which should be enough to guarantee it a niche.
  18. BlankZero


    Aug 25, 2012
    I could maybe see running Soft Sand for EQ spam, but Muscle Band over LO?
  19. Neliel

    Neliel Sacred Sword

    Oct 9, 2012
    Blankzero, you can add on Landorus leftovers for more longevity, Rock gem to cripple Skarmory or Muscle band to have a little power up without any recoil.

    Special defense forretress is good because it has more chance to spin even against weak special pokemon like bulky water, its not like its supposed to tank draco meteor...
  20. PokèManiac Livio

    PokèManiac Livio Un panino al salame
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    May 15, 2012

    Zapdos @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 248 HP / 232 Def / 28 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Discharge
    - Substitute
    - Roost
    - Heat Wave

    Role: Physical Wall

    What It Does: His Base Stat could suggest that is not a good defensive wall, and his weakness to Rock Type does not help him. But is an incredible underrated Physical Wall, and all that because has access to Roos that in combo with Pressure can PPstall every Stone Edge user wich is slower than him. He is an excellent resistor of a lot of types such as Fight, Steel, Grass, Bug and Flying. Discharge 30% paralysis rate benefits your team more than Thunderbolt is added power does, while Heat Wave is usually prefered on Toxic because of some Special Defender Steel that can hit harder.

    Good Teammates: A perfect Teammates could be Bronzong or Jirachi Wisher, because can cover his weakness to Rock and Ice Type, help him with a Special Dragon and the second can heal with wish; Zapdos cover his weakness to ground types and enter onto an eventually fire type move. Good teammates are even status Hazard Users especially Toxic Spikers such as Tentacruel or Roselia, they offer to him a good stall power thanks his SubRoost with Pressure, and him can cover his Ground/Flying weakness.

    What Counters It: He has more Checks but not much more Counters thanks to his versatily, one that could give him a trouble is without doubt Ground Type pokemon such as Gastrodon or Swampert, in that case Toxic or Hidden Power grass is very very useful, without, you have only to switch. Ground Types pokemon are a little threat, that s because usually they have not something to stop it, Landorus-t is a good check, that s especially if has not Hidden Power Ice, but only offensive version coulb be a forced switch because is too slow and Zappo can stall him more times.
  21. isr


    Aug 19, 2011
    What to use:
    Ditto @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Imposter
    IVs: 2 Spe
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Transform

    Role: Revenge Killer

    What It Does:
    After being a gimmickly novelty during four generations, Ditto returns in BW2 Metagame with its new Ability — Imposter finally get released. This ability allows Ditto to automatically transform in its opponent when entering in the battlefield, stealing everything from it bar item and HP stat. When equipped with a Choice Scarf, Ditto will nearly always guaranteed to move first if the opponent is not with one too. As the majority threats of the OverUsed metagame carry a "auto-super effective" move, such as Latios, Starmie, and Terrakion, it will easily perform its role. This means that it finally is viable, finding his niche as one of the best revenge killers of the game. Ditto can also act as a "spy". If you want to discover the moveset of a Pokémon that can have several options, like Heatran or Landorus, you can use Ditto to it. Hidden Power Ice-typed is the most recommended, allowing Ditto to revenge kill Landorus. The EV spread gives Ditto a best bulk against a possible failed switch on a Zoroark, but it will not survive a Focus Blast with Life Orb or Choice Specs.

    Despite many advantages, Imposter also has its drawbacks. Ditto cannot copy its opponent HP, meaning that it will stay with its awful 48 base HP. This prevents him from Revenge Kill some bulky Pokémon, such as Conkeldurr, while shortening him life span. Being vulnerable to entry-hazards and with that base HP, Ditto will have troubles to do its function consistently. Also, the pressure when Imposter get released while the failure on usage stats, staying on the depths of NU, gives Ditto a bad reputation. However, a Pokémon like this should not be underestimated and is very fun to play with.

    Good Teammates:

    Ditto is a very easy Pokémon to be acceptable in nearly any team. As it will attack as the opponent, it has not so much teammates required for itself. However, the Transform Pokémon cannot copy its opponent HP, so its awful base HP stat is its major drawback. Even while Ditto can copy an Pokémon with a reliable recover without very trouble, like Skarmory, or recover itself by copying an ability and activating it during a switch, like Volt Absorb Jolteon, Wish support is very appreciated, making Pokémon like Blissey or Jirachi good teammates. Blissey can also act as an cleric, helping Ditto in a disaster if it get burned or paralyzed. Ditto also loves Rapid Spin support, as it will need to enter and leave the battlefield many times. This makes a Rapid Spinner, such as Starmie or Forretress, a important teammate for Ditto, even more if it does not has a Wish support from another one, or it will fall quickly.

    What Counters It:
    As Ditto will transform in its opponent, it does not has a literal counter. Illusion and Substitute are the only real thing that can stop Imposter, but be sure to put it on battlefield before Ditto enters. The best way to deal with Ditto is to do not set up while he is alive, as it will steal and defeat your entire team if you cannot handle your +6/+6 Dragonite. Paralyze and Burn are also great ways to stop it, but a Ditto probably will only switch-in if it has certain that can handle the move, mainly if it know that the oponent can paralyze or burn it. Ditto also cannot beat opponent with great bulk, as it has a awful base HP and will not copy from the opponent. That means that it will not defeat the opponent in a OHKO and will be OHKO'd back. If Ditto try to Revenge Kill a Choice Scarf user, it will have 50% fail chance of get defeated in a speed tie. If you are desperate, you can use a signature item-dependent Pokémon, like Pikachu, as Ditto cannot copy its item and will fail to defeat the much stronger opponent.

    Any Additional Info:
    Ditto can use a Iron Ball if you want to use it in a Trick Room team, allowing it to move after the opponent and, consequently, before it on Trick Room. Another type for Hidden Power is also a good option if you want to hit a specific target, such as a Fire-type to hit Chlorophyll Sweepers harder in sun.
  22. flea


    Oct 19, 2012
    The Kyurem-Black post looks good but I'd mention Terrakion as something that gives it a lot of trouble.

    Also you say that Kyurem-Black has Technician. That would be Turboblaze. Although I must admit a Technician Kyurem-B would be interesting.
  23. Reymedy

    Reymedy Colt Python 357 Magnum.
    is an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnus

    Oct 17, 2012

    So now ?
    I did write that for nothing or ?
    If someone wants to criticise go ahead, else I assume that it's accepted isn't it?
  24. Dark Fallen Angel


    May 23, 2012
    What to use:


    Landorus (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Sand Force
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    - U-turn
    - Hidden Power [Ice] / Explosion / Superpower

    Role: Revenge Killer

    What It Does: Peharps the best revenge killer for sandstorm teams. While Terrakion, Stoutland and Keldeo seems like they are better choices, Landorus has much more advantages over each. Landorus has much less weakness than Terrakion, and thus offer better defensive synergy, and has more chances to switch-in and wreck avoc. Landorus is also less dependent from sandstorm than Stoutland, as Landorus retain its speed outside sandstorm. If you were to rely on Stoutland to revenge kill outside sandstorm, you would be put on a bad position if it was raining, for example. As for Keldeo, Landorus is simply stronger, as Keldeo would have to rely on rain to revenge kill effectively. While Landorus doesn't get a good Flying-type move, it can still be an effective revenge killer with the moves above.

    Earthquake is the best STAB that Landorus has. On sandstorm, it is stronger than even Outrage from Dragon-types. Stone Edge rounds off the coverage. It allows Landorus to revenge kill most Dragon-tyes, as well as Volcarona and Tornadus-T. U-Turn provides a way to mantain momentum for Landorus, and also OHKOes Celebi, something that none of Landorus' other attacks can do. Hidden Power Ice is the best move to use on the last slot, as it allows Landorus to defeat opposing Landorus, Landorus-T and Gliscor, something that Stone Edge cannot do. Also, Hidden Power Ice is a more accurate attack to use against Dragon/Flying-types (like Salamence and Dragonite) as long as they have taken prior damage (as otherwise Stone Edge would be stronger). Not to mention that it's Landorus' best attack against Garchomp. Another option, if you can reliably deal with the above threats, is Explosion. Explosion is a stronger attack than even Earthquake on sandstorm, and despite the nerf that it received on this generation, it's a good, last-resort attack to use to guarantee that something on your opponent's team will die. Another option is Superpower. It is good against Air Balloon users (especially Heatran) and Ferrothorn. However, it is rather lackluster otherwise, and has redundant coverage with Earthquake. The advantage of not using Hidden Power Ice, is that Landorus can use a Jolly nature and preserve its decent Special Defense.

    Good Teammates: Tyranitar and Hippowdon must be used as partners, so that Landorus can have a boost on its Earthquakes. It's suggested that you use something that can defeat Skarmory and Bronzong, as they are very problematic for Landorus. Thus, Heatran, Magnezone and Keldeo stand out as partners. Speaking of Keldeo, it can be also problematic, as Scarf variants of him can outrun and defeat Landorus with Hydro Pump. Thus, it's recommended that you use something like Celebi or Jellicent to deal with Keldeo. Other Pokémon to be considered are Pokémon with U-Turn and Volt Switch, like Scizor, Rotom-W, and Forretress, to form a VoltTurn chain with Landorus.

    What Counters It: Skarmory and Bronzong are the best counters. They take little damage from every attack that this Landorus can use against them. The former can phaze Landorus, while the latter can simply defeat it with Hidden Power Ice. However, Landorus has U-Turn to scout them and bring the appropriate counter. Mamoswine and Weavile have Ice Shard to promptly OHKO Landorus. Scizor can also defeat Landorus with Bullet Punch, but will need it very weakened, as otherwise Bullet Punch fail to OHKO. Slowbro is another good Pokémon that can tank everything that Landorus can throw at him, and can OHKO with Scald or Ice Beam. However, Slowbro hates taking repeated Earthquakes. This should not be a problem as Slowbro has reliable recovery, unless Slowbro has been weakened. Gliscor take little damage from most of Landorus' attacks, but fears Hidden Power Ice. Faster scarfers like Lati@s and Keldeo can deal with Landorus, but the latter cannot switch on Earthquake.
  25. LilOu

    LilOu PO poopyhead
    is a Tiering Contributor

    May 25, 2012

    The same. Any opinions about this analysis? I would like to have some kind of debate (the purpose of thise thread)

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