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OU Team Study [Week 2: McMeghan]

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Dice, Jun 9, 2013.

  1. Dice

    Dice what's a god to a nonbeliever
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    OU Team Study
    Certain thread components and idea from Melee Mewtwo!

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Welcome to the OU Team Study. The goal of this project is to help unite the community while improving the overall quality of the playerbase by studying the art of teambuilding at the highest level.

    What is this for?
    This project was shamelessly stolen from Melee Mewtwo, but I liked it so deal with it. The basic idea of this thread is to look at a high level player's team under the microscope and see what the community can find and learn from each team. Discussing a team helps not only you learn and think about it, but the fellow OU'rs who are new can learn by reading your post. It is a win-win situtation! Additionally, you are supplied with high-level teams to take ideas from if you like a build, and it gives us a look at what is "good" in the high-stakes Tournament metagame.

    How does it work?
    Each week (more or less) there will be a high-level team that will be displayed for the community as a whole to discuss. The aim of this discussion will be to analyze the team by identifying roles and explaining their purpose, investigating specific movesets and Pokemon choices, strong points of the team, flaws it may have and even questions concerning unusual or confusing aspects. Essentially, the team will serve as a model to learn from and an example to refer to. Once the discussion is over, the teambuilder will post explaining his decisions and answering any questions or false ideas concerning them.

    What do I get out of it?

    • Good posting can result in nominations for a Ladybug or Community Contributor badge depending on your work in the OU subforum.
    • A good look at current tournament teams and trends.
    • Insight on how teams are built and more knowledge of the OU Metagame.
    • There may be another prize or so, but it's still not worked out yet. Don't let this discourage you, however.
    • A good, intelligent thread!
  2. Dice

    Dice what's a god to a nonbeliever
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    Week 2's team is provided by McMeghan! Thanks!

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Week 2: McMeghan (open)
    Politoed (M) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 168 HP / 252 SAtk / 88 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Focus Blast
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power [Grass]

    Rotom-W @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 8 HP / 252 SAtk / 248 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Thunder
    - Hydro Pump
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Volt Switch

    Gengar (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Shadow Ball
    - Focus Blast
    - Thunder

    Ferrothorn (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 252 HP / 176 Atk / 24 Def / 56 SDef
    Brave Nature (+Atk, -Spd)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Spikes
    - Gyro Ball
    - Power Whip

    Mamoswine (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Ice Shard
    - Icicle Crash
    - Earthquake
    - Superpower

    Gyarados (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 84 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def / 168 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Substitute
    - Dragon Dance\
    - Waterfall
    - Bounce


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Week 1 Team: Ojama (open)
    Terrakion @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Swords Dance
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge


    Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 48 HP / 252 Atk / 208 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - U-turn
    - Ice Punch
    - Fire Punch
    - Iron Head


    Scizor (F) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SDef
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - U-turn
    - Bullet Punch
    - Superpower
    - Pursuit


    Keldeo @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Secret Sword
    - Icy Wind
    - Hidden Power [Ghost]


    Latias (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 72 HP / 184 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Draco Meteor
    - Surf
    - Thunder Wave
    - Roost


    Landorus (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Sheer Force
    EVs: 40 HP / 252 SAtk / 216 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Rock Polish
    - Earth Power
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Focus Blast


    Some things to consider are:

    • What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal McMeghan had when building this team?
    • Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?
    • What are the strong points of the team?
    • What are the weak spots?
    • How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?
    • How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?
    • Just about anything else you might want to comment on or ask about.
  3. Halcyon.

    Halcyon. Come on, she's not burned; she's just gone.
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    This is a really cool hyper offensive team based around Landorus getting Rock Polish up and sweeping. I think the first thing I noticed is that for both Jirachi and Landorus, Ojama made them slightly bulkier with boosting natures to their physical and special attacks, respectfully. He then makes up for the lowered speed, I think, by giving Latias Thunder Wave. The paralysis support means that if anything is faster than base 108 speed (where his Specs Keldeo and Terrakion lie), his main goal will be to catch them with a TWave from Latias so that his other Pokemon can sweep more easily. There are a few that he can't really trap, like Scarf Latios and Specs Latios lacking HP Fire (he wins the "speed tie" against versions that do). But I think that's where Scizor comes in, being able to Pursuit trap Latios locked into Draco Meteor. Once faster threats are out of the way or crippled with TWave, he can set up with Terrakion or Landorus and put immediate offensive pressure on the opponent. I think that's one reason that he chose Swords Dance over Taunt on Terrakion, since it makes it more than just a suicide lead (and also Taunt was more useful during the Deo-D days).

    If we look at his team from a framework perspective, I would say Jirachi and Latias are the offensive pivots for the team, since he can switch Jirachi in on Dragon types that would otherwise be a pain for him to deal with, and Latias takes sun and rain boosted hits reasonably well. Then he's got got SD Terrakion and Specs Keldeo, which do a decent job at wall-breaking if they manage to get in (not too hard thanks to Scizor and Jirachi's U-turns). Scizor seems to be mostly a utility 'mon, since it can grab momentum, pick off weakened threats with Bullet Punch, and trap things with Pursuit. Then, since the rest of the team should blow everything up with relative ease, Landorus shouldn't have any trouble setting up and cleaning up late-game at +2.

    There are two somewhat big issues I can see with the team. The first would be that 4 of his Pokemon are grounded and he has no real way to stop Skarmory from setting up other than trying to kill it. And with 3 Choiced Pokemon (two of which have U-turn), hazards damage (especially Spikes) will rack up quickly, I think. I can also see this team having some trouble with SDef Jellicent, but only if Terrakion gets Burned by Scald. Otherwise he can just Stone Edge it to death, though he risks getting burned by Will-O-Wisp too. If Jellicent has Ice Beam, it can take out Landorus too, which leaves him with no win-condition. But those are very minor problems, since the HO nature of the team means it'll be hard for the opponent to set up hazards, and Jellicent can't take repeated hits from everyone all match. It will die eventually.

    Overall this is a really cool thread idea and an awesome first team. Thanks Princeas Bri and Ojama!
  4. ShootingStarmie

    ShootingStarmie
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    Hey, cool thread Bri (and Melee Mewtwo). So let's get started...

    What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal Ojama had when building this team?

    He wanted to overload his opponent with powerful sweepers and grab a quick win. His team requires a lot of prediction and has very hard hitters. If Ojama fails to predict correctly, he can revenge kill threats with his Jirachi. He has many good win conditions.

    Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?

    Well, Keldeo and Landorus form a great offensive core. Scizor and Jirachi form and U-turn core to gain momentum and switch advantage. Terrakion and Latias have great synegy with one another, as Terrakion beats Tyranitar and the pink blobs, while Latias beats Terrakions checks, like Landorus-T.

    What are the strong points of the team?

    His team has great synergy and work well together. All of the Pokemon are offensive, meaning Ojama will usually have momentum.

    What are the weak spots?

    There isn't much of a defensive back bone to the team, meaning this team has a hard time switching into easily spammable high powered moves (like Keldeo's Hydro Pump in the rain). I mean, Jirachi and Latias are pretty defensive in general, but without investing in bulk, they just can't keep switching in.

    How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?

    Well, just a little thing. Scizor could run 60 speed EVs with an Adamant nature to out speed defensive Politoed before Politoed burns it with Scald. Landorus could run full speed to revenge kill more stuff (like Timid Hydregion), although that isn't Landorus' job. Jirachi could run Jolly nature and 252 speed EVs to revenge kill threats like Adamant Scarf Mence and DD Haxorus.

    How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?

    He's using Thunder Wave Latias, which allows his Specs Keldeo to easily out speed and KO nearly every Pokemon (after the switch in has been paralyzed). Scarf Jirachi is also pretty un common, although it's pretty amazing.

    Just about anything else you might want to comment on or ask about.

    Ily Ojama.
  5. Neliel

    Neliel Sacred Sword

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    What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal Ojama had when building this team?

    I guess he wanted an offensive oriented team which can take some hits and hit back hard, one where you have to switchback often. He probably volountary didnt want to use tyranitar because here it would have been pretty good, probably instead of scizor or jirachi. The absence of a weather setter may be troublesome, but he fixed some common problems weatherless teams have.

    Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?

    Of course, hp ghost keldeo+landorus gives hard pressure to celebi, while he can send both jirachi and scizor to scare it and make the work for landorus even more easier. The core composed of latias landorus and keldeo its pretty known too, and they are almost always paired with a steel type and srocker.

    What are the strong points of the team?

    Looking at it, if it wasnt for random weaknesses like gyarados (use hp eletric on keldeo ç_ç) i can say it has a pretty good matchup against everything. While sun may seem problematic, sword dance terrakion here gives a lot of support against it, being able to beat xatu and probably getting stealth rock up, which is already a gg for most sun teams. With his sash it can also force the sun user to sac something, especially if its already at +2. Thunder wave latias its also an another thing that helps, too many times a volcarona or a venusaur tries to setup after the drop of drago meteor, and there is where thunder wave finds its use. It also generally stops anything that want to setup on it, a -2 latias isnt that threatening. I may ask ojama if this team can beat rain offense teams with ease, because at a first glance it seems that unless he can setup a rock polish with landorus its pretty difficult to beat something like kigodo's team, anyway its a minor nitpick, the team is solid.

    What are the weak spots?

    Well, as i said sun and rain maybe a problem but with a bit of smart switches and prediction it wouldnt be that hard. Gyarados can pretty much destroy this team anyway, it can setup on scizor/jirachi/keldeo/landorus and 6-0 it. Offensive starmie also can be though to face, given the fact that it 2kos the whole team while beating 1 vs 1 scizor, keldeo, and landorus.

    How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?

    I've probably already mentioned this, anyway i think using adamant jirachi ismaybe usefull to get a clean ko on sd scizor, he used adamant probably because riskying speed ties with mence its not too much of a justification for a jolly nature.

    How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?

    :x well there isnt anything underrated here, just 6 top 10 pokemon.

    Just about anything else you might want to comment on or ask about.

    Definetely i want to ask if you expressely wanted to do a weatherless team, because otherwhise a tyranitar instead of something would probably be a better option. Also, have you ever felt the redundancy of cb scizor and scarf jirachi in the same team? if i was you, i would have used sd scizor with pursuit to beat jellicent (also celebi) and sweep with keldeo. I know its a bit different but i've never really liked using both, they do almost the same things. If you want to use this team in the future, remember to change the hp of keldeo because of gyarados.
  6. MikeDecIsHere

    MikeDecIsHere And the haters gonna hate hate hate hate hate.
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    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Week 1 Team: Ojama (open)
    Terrakion @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Swords Dance
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge


    Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 48 HP / 252 Atk / 208 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - U-turn
    - Ice Punch
    - Fire Punch
    - Iron Head


    Scizor (F) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SDef
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - U-turn
    - Bullet Punch
    - Superpower
    - Pursuit


    Keldeo @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Secret Sword
    - Icy Wind
    - Hidden Power [Ghost]


    Latias (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 72 HP / 184 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Draco Meteor
    - Surf
    - Thunder Wave
    - Roost


    Landorus (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Sheer Force
    EVs: 40 HP / 252 SAtk / 216 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Rock Polish
    - Earth Power
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Focus Blast


    What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal Ojama had when building this team?

    It's an offensive team, so the point is mainly to pressure the opponent around with strong hits. It's definitely not Hyper Offense though, more of a slightly bulky offense, with things that can switch into hits and can threaten back mostly. Thunder Wave Latias + CB Scizor provides a ton of offensive pressure as is, with Specs Keldeo and Landorus-I being mid-game wall punchers / late game sweepers.

    Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?

    Well, there's the pretty self evident offensive core of Specs Keldeo and Landorus-I. T-Wave Latias and Scizor / Jirachi is pretty neat as well, especially with T-Wave providing the annoying first half of the Para Flinch combo.

    What are the strong points of the team?

    As with most somewhat bulky offensive teams, the idea is to have as much offensive pressure as possible while being able to have options to switch into big threats. By utilizing Modest Landorus-I and Specs HP-Ghost Keldeo, Ojama is able to threaten almost everything in the metagame with a big hit. He also has some "bulky" options for switching into threats with Latias and Jirachi / Scizor.

    What are the weak spots?

    Custap Leads paired with Hyper Offensive teams seem like they could give Ojama a big deal of trouble. This could probably be avoided if you switch Swords Dance with Taunt on Terrakion. Sub-DD Gyarados can also be a huge threat to this team given Terrakion loses its Sash, but there's not much that can be done there without fucking up the Synergy of the team besides throwing like Thunder Punch on Jirachi, which is fucking stupid. Ojama also doesn't really have anything to switch into Specs Keldeo in the rain which can immediately threaten back. However, he could potentially bluff the Psyshock on Latias.

    How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?


    HP Ghost Keldeo nails Celebi and Latias for a pretty hefty chunk of damage, which is a major switch in for both Keldeo and Landorus-I, although this thing isn't THAT unique. Modest Landorus-I is also a MAJOR powerhouse, dealing an absolute shit-ton of damage when paired with Life Orb. Thunder-Wave Latias catches a lot of things off guard. Other than these things though, the team is fairly Standard.

    How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?

    What underrated threats do you see here? LOL
  7. Bulgrom

    Bulgrom

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    What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal Ojama had when building this team?

    He wanted an offensive team nearly full of hard-hitting mons, in order to punch holes through the opponent team, while conserving a kind of synergy. Basically, all his team but Jirachi are imminent threats for the opponent, allowing him to maintain constant offensive pressure, until the foe's team is weakened enough to clean sweep with one of his win condition (the most important one being Landorus).

    Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?

    There is an offensive core of Landorus + Keldeo + Scizor (a sort of variant of the traditional Ttar+Lando+Kel). Sheer Force Lando and Keldeo share similar counters (Celebi, Latias) and checks (Latios, maybe Gengar), who are sucessfully trapped and killed most of the time by Scizor. The bug also provides momentum with his slows and powerful U-turns for the 2 others, allowing them to come in intact, as well as lurking some mons to sponge the U-turn (like Skarmory), who are easily take cared of by the two.
    Then he added Latias to help against weather and spread paralysis in order to a future sweep, Jirachi for momentum and revenge killing, and Terrakion for rocks as well as an other potential win condition and as a check to everything if sash is up.

    What are the strong points of the team?

    Raw power. As said before, most of his attacks are strong enough to dent seriously a good part of the meta, while doing some damage to even the bulkiest walls. Stalling against this team seems awfully hard, and it is pretty much impossible to hurt it without being hurt, thus opening holes for a sweep of one of his many win condition. The offensive nature of the team tends to give him the momentum, as well as the 2 U-Turners. This team has a good synergy too, with each member helping the others in their tasks (Scizor take care of Celebi for Keldeo and Landorus, Jirachi can bring them safely on the battlefield and stops most of potential sweeps which could rape the offensive core, Latias bring paralysis to help his lightly slow sweepers).

    What are the weak spots?

    As every offensive team, this one can't really stand powerful attacks (even if the mons are reasonably bulky), and thus rely on revenge killing threats. For instance, Latias won't like switching on crazy hydro pumps in the rain too much.
    The lack of recovery of the team can also be an issue. If the momentum is not retained, the sweepers will take too much damage, and being unable to sweep. 3 choice users also requires good prediction. Else, you lose the holy momentum, and give to your opponent a turn to do what he wants (and every turn is precious).
    Jellicent can be annoying, because it don't care much about Jirachi and Scizor, and prevent an hydro pump spam, as well as checking Landorus and Terrakion, but he can't stand assaults forever.
    Volcarona with giga drain may be a threat too, as it outspeed and kill everything at +1, but Terrakion ensure that rocks will be on the field, can check him if sash is intact, and it doesn't have much time to set up anyway.

    How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?

    The most important one is probably Latias. LO Draco Meteor might be unexpected, but Thunder wave is fairly rare, so Ojama may make a surprise paralysis on a key mon.
    Otherwise, the sets are rather standard. Scarfrachi and Speckeldeo are not the most common variants, but it's not very important. Maybe the customs EV spreads (I really don't know what they do) on Jirachi Latias and Lando could mess the opponent, because Landorus is bulkier than expected and you won't be able to stop him as you would stop standard Landorus. And this same Landorus who is more raping you than usual thanks to the modest nature.

    How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?

    They aren't any.

    Just about anything else you might want to comment on or ask about.

    Replays could be interresting for the project.
  8. -Sparkbeat-

    -Sparkbeat- formerly Lunatic Lies

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    What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal Ojama had when building this team?

    To keep offensive pressure and not let up on the opponent. This is evident in the choice of Terrrakion for his stealth rocker, and Thunder Wave on Latias. Terrakion keeps pressure extremely well, while giving him hazards, and Thunder Wave can allow Latias to stay in a turn after firing off a Draco Meteor, which can hurt teams that try to set up on it after it gets -2'd. The obvious win condition for the team is a RP Landorus sweep, and a backup condition, I believe, is a Scarf Jirachi Iron Head sweep, after Latias has spread paralyses. He also wanted to be able to rid himself of his teams normal counters in different ways seen by Specs Keldeo and Thunder Wave Latias.

    Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?

    The main core of this is Landorus/Keldeo/Scizor. I like the use of Scizor instead of Tyranitar because he retains the ability of Pursuit trapping and gains strong priority and an option for momentum. There's also a secondary core between Latias and Jirachi/Scizor. Latias can spread paralyses to allow Jirachi to come in and finish them off with Iron Head or to allow Scizor to KO with U-turn if Bullet Punch is undesirable.

    What are the strong points of the team?

    The Pressure it puts on opponents. If this team keeps momentum, it is very hard to stop. Everything is a threat, and the opponent will find littler opportunity to set up. Once again, bringing up Thunder Wave Latias, since it punishes opponents that try to set up after a Draco Meteor gets fired off. Modest Landorus and Specs Keldeo make sure everything gets hit harder than normal, and makes putting holes in teams much easier. There's also a bulky side to the team, with Rachi, Sciz, and Lati, which allows him to be able to take hits if need while keeping pressure and momentum on his side.

    What are the weak spots?

    Not going to lie, Hydro Pump spam looks like a large problem since Latias is the only solid switch into it. Keeping momentum and pressure is so vital, and if he loses it for too long, he probably has lost the battle. Starmie and Scarf Keldeo look very dangerous, since your only way of beating Starmie is hitting on on the switch with an HP Ghost, revenging with Jirachi, and getting a RP with Landorus. Once Latias is hurt, or gone Keldeo just smashed this team under rain. It can be checked by your own Keldeo, but it has to be damaged first. The best way though is definitely crippling it with Thunder Wave.

    How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?

    Giving Jirachi some more bulk helps against other offensive teams. Specs HP Ghost Keldeo helps rid him of Celebi and Jellicent, which helps give Landorus an easier sweep. The creative use of Latias with Thunder Wave to help against threats to his team and set up mons is very nice.

    How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?

    "Underrated threats"

    Just about anything else you might want to comment on or ask about.

    Fantastic thread idea Melee Mewtwo and Princess Bri. I also support the idea to add replays, to help people understand how the team is supposed to work and how it handles certain threats.
  9. GCSChris

    GCSChris

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    I really like this thread. Thanks Bri and Melee Mewtwo!

    What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal Ojama had when building this team?

    To make a hyper offense team, taking advantage of the biggest threats in the meta to promptly beat down the opponent.

    Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?

    Well, Specs Keldeo and Landorus is a pretty great offensive core. He also has Latias/Terrakion, a great core. U-turn on two Pokemon is nice as well. This team is also a cool spin off, and IMO a better version of the typical BW2 HO team (being Terrakion/Tyrainitar/Latios/Scizor/Landorus/Keldeo). Harsha goes into the team here.

    What are the strong points of the team?

    This team is incredibly strong. It is very fast and everything on it hits like a truck, namely Landorus, Terrakion, and Keldeo. Momentum is kept with u-turns from Jirachi and Scizor

    What are the weak spots?

    The major weak point of this team, and every hyper offense team is the fact that it is so invested in offensive power that it lacks strong defense. Also, vs hyper offense teams using Custap Skarmory, the team lacks a reliable way to prevent hazards from entering the field, and the lack of bulky Pokemon could allow for an easy game for opposing HO teams. It is definately possible to try to muscle through other HO teams, but I feel that this team has a poor matchup against HO because some Pokemon such as Landorus and Jiarchi sacrifice speed for bulk, and this makes it easier for other teams to outspeed, which could easily become a problem. The extra bulk is appreciated, but against other HO teams I don't see it being too relevant. Don't get me wrong, this team is very strong.

    How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?

    It seems that this team uses a couple EV spreads that deviate from the norm. Landorus and Jirachi runs less speed and a bit more HP. This obviously helps a bit by adding a bit of bulk to his team, but the team is still pretty frail. Offensive Latias over Latios gives the team a great bulky attacker and a water and fighting resistance.

    How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?
    There are none. There is nothing wrong with this obviously, but I mean this team basically consists of every huge threat in the current meta (less so with scarf Jirachi and Latias, but I digress).
  10. Reymedy

    Reymedy They live and die by my command.
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    As someone playing mainly Weatherless offense, I just wanted to point out that it's really complicated to bring something really "underrated" or "creative" when you're building this kind of teams.
    Basically it's really hard to give up on Latias and Jirachi usually as the former is most of the time your only security net against Sun Teams (unless you got Ice Shard or a hidden Hail somewhere) and the later gives such an interesting set of resistances for few weaknesses.

    The remaining part of the team is, as everybody said, a classic Keldeo+Lando+Pursuiter core. Hell why not, Keldeo is crucial for weatherless teams. You almost HAVE TO have a sweeper able to take advantage of Rain's teams very own weather (Keldeo, Starmie, Gyarados, a Chomp/Tios with a random water move or hmm, Sharpedo ?). Usually, those water mons gives a good defensive added value (think about SD Scizor sweeping the team if Keldeo is out of the way).

    And finally, the last pokemon, Terrakion, saves the team from the Fire Butterfly better known as Volcarona and obviously, sets Stealth Rock.

    You can have a more offensive, or defensive take on weatherless teams in this meta; you can build around a different offensive or defensive backbone, but in the end, your weatherless team will end up being really similar in its essence to Ojama's team (or you probably screwed up somewhere).
  11. Dice

    Dice what's a god to a nonbeliever
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    Two more days until I post a new team; get your last minute posts in!
  12. victinivcreate1

    victinivcreate1

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    The main idea of the team?
    To nab wins easily and quickly with high speed powerful assaults, and clean up late game w/ Landorus Incarnate.

    Any core I noticed?
    Yep. Lando+Keldeo+Scizor (replaced TTar here). Scizor kills off most of Lando+Keldeo's counters. Then the duo can bust through nearly anything.

    Strong points?
    Yep. Brute force. When I read the team, the first thing that came to mind was Darth Vader. Like Vader, this team uses brute force to utterly tear teams apart. It also uses ScarfRachi, which is a great dragon check and (along w/ Scizor) a powerful momentum grabber. Latias serves as a great sun check as well.

    Weak spots?
    Lack of way to deal w/ Starmie once Scizor is dead. Also its fairly weak to enemy LandoKelTar cores as well. Ttar on Latias=dead=Lando/Keldeo sweep.

    Ways to solve the issue?
    From what I can see, no. If i tried, i would screw up the entire foundation of the team.

    Underrated Threat?
    Jirachi is in top ten
    Keldeo in top 15
    Terrakion in top 15
    Scizor is number one
    Latias is 33 i think
    Landorus is in the top 30

    No underrated threats here.
  13. Vertex

    Vertex

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    The importable is messed up, and is hard to read.
  14. Dice

    Dice what's a god to a nonbeliever
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    Week 2 is up now! All the participants from Week 1 did well. :)
  15. Joeyboy

    Joeyboy Check out my Youtube channel! JoeyboyGames!
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    Quick little post but just looking at the team at a glance it looks like Expert Belt Keldeo does a lot of damage to this team. Gengar is the only 'mon who outspeeds and takes it out but it really shouldn't be switching into Keldeo. Eb Keldeo also 2HKOs every 'mon on the team. Maybe it can't switch-in but Eb Keldeo definitely looks like a problem.
  16. SmashBrosBrawl

    SmashBrosBrawl

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    What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal McMeghan had when building this team?
    He probably wanted to make an offensive team that tried to abuse rain as much as possible while packing excellent defensive synergy making each member of the team a pain to take down. Neither of them are particulary dependant on rain to succeed as well meaning they can still be a threat even when rain is not up.
    Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?
    Gyarados+Ferrothorn+Rotom-W is a strong core that can easily get rid of each other counters and has excellent defensive synergy resisting every move in the game. Ferrothorn can effortless destroy opposing rotom-w for gyarados, rotom-w and gyarados can beat fire types for ferrothorn while gyarados can setup on and beat grass types for rotom-w (though opposing ferrothorn will be a problem).
    What are the strong points of the team?
    All the members in the team pack great offensive power and with the exception of gengar great bulk as well. Gyarados, rotom-w and gengar are extremely hard to switch in while ferrothorn can setup hazards to help them further while maintaining great offensive presence on its own. Notably pokemon that try to switch in it to setup like lucario and thundurus-t are facing potential 2hkos by gyro ball.
    What are the weak spots?
    Opposing ferrothorn are a pain to beat with this team. Neither of the members of the team have fire moves and neither of the fighting move users can ohko ferrothorn. The team also faces problems with custap leads that can easily setup and keep its hazards forever due to the lack of spinners.
    How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?
    Offensive ferrothorn can really surprise pokemon that try to switch on it like the aforementioned lucario and thundurus-t but other than that the team doesnt have many twists.
    How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?
    There are no underrated threats.
  17. GCSChris

    GCSChris

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    I played a few games with this team. It's very balanced, and incredibly well built (I mean it kinda has to be to be on this thread, but still). Other than the strength of the team, it's just fun to play.

    What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal McMeghan had when building this team?

    Rain offense. Use of Gengar as a spin blocker, using thunder over disable for good neutral coverage and high paralysis chance, crippling faster threats and slower ones as well. It seems that the team would usually win via Gyarados sweep, as the team contains pokemon like Rotom-w and Ferrothorn focused on crippling the opposing team.

    Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?
    Classic Politoed/Ferrothorn. Ferrothorn and Rotom-w form a pretty good core as well.

    What are the strong points of the team?
    Great offensive strength while using Ferrothorn to glue together the defensive side of the team, even though it's offensive. Getting hazards up early and protecting them with Gengar seems to be very key to the overall strategy. Protection from dragons is attained through the use of Mamoswine.

    What are the weak spots?
    This team is more reliant on rain when compared to most rain teams. If it loses the weather-war, it is gonna be rough. Gengar and Rotom-w both have thunder, and Ferrothorn really appreciates the lower weakness to fire especially with the lower investment in bulk. Gyarados also appreciates the water boost However, Gengar and Rotom-W have alternatives to Thunder (Shadow Ball, Volt Switch, respectively). That said, when rain is up, this team functions incredibly smoothly (heck, it does pretty well without it considering how the team is built, heavily around rain)

    How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?
    Offensive Ferrothorn catches Pokemon in on it off guard. That Gyro Ball can definitely hurt. Pokemon hoping to set up on Ferrothorn are in for a rude awakening.

    How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?
    Offensive Ferrothorn. Ferrothorn itself is anything but underrated, but the surprise factor could definitely change games.
  18. Alexander.

    Alexander.
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    What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal McMeghan had when building this team?

    This is a Rain Offense. Ferrothorn set ups Entry Hazards while Gengar keeps them up (Thunder here is useful to beat Tentacruel) and Gyarados is a great late game sweeper above all thanks to Mamoswine's support which is here to check Dragon-types and to hit hard Rotom-W and Ferrothorn with Superpower, two of the most common Gyarados' checks / counters.

    Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?

    Gengar + Ferrothorn and Mamoswine + Gyarados as well I guess. As I already said Mamoswine is a great partner for Gyara since it can hit hard its counters and then Gyara can, of course, sweep more easily.

    What are the strong points of the team?

    It has a great offensive and it uses Gyarados as its primary win condition which with the support of Entry Hazards and Mamoswine can do its job pretty well. Other strong points of the team are Expert Belt Rotom-W which can surprise a lot of opponent (especially with the fast EV spread which McMeghan gives to it).

    What are the weak spots?

    Maybe Sun teams can be annoying for this team, especially Volcarona can setup on many mons of McMeghan's team and then sweep the whole team if Gyarados is already weakened. Even Sand Stall teams seems annoying for this team since McM hasn't a Rapid Spin user and Starmie and Forretress can spin on his Gengar. Anyways, this is a really good team so I am pretty sure McM can win with against both Sun and Stall Team and against every matchups with smart plays.

    How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?

    As GCSChris already said, McM's Ferrothorn really hurts with its Brave nature and with its EVs on Attack when it uses Gyro Ball and this can help with threat like Lati Twins and to do more damages in general.

    How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?

    McM's team has not underrated threats but it has some particular things on the moveset or on the EV spread like Brave Ferrothorn and fast Expert Belt Rotom-W which can both really help to win some games more easily.
  19. JohnnyCrying

    JohnnyCrying

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    • What do think was the main/inspiring idea/goal McMeghan had when building this team?
    The main idea by mcmeghan was to play a rain offensive team based around Gyarados late-game sweep, everything is made for him to set-up, Gengar / Mamoswine are Bullet punch baits, Politoed give Gyarados a boosted Waterfall and Ferrothorn provides the very important entry hazards, helping Gyarados to get some more kills.


    • Is there a discernible core that he tried to build around?
    They are many cores in the team :

    Gyara+Mamoswine : Mamoswine can lure Ferrothorn and wreck him with superpower, a very useful thing since power whip can destroy Gyarados sub / twave / leech seed him without fearing much from him, Mamoswine is a mach punch / bullet punch magnet, giving Gyarados a good way to end the game.
    Ferrothorn+Gengar : Gengar is the obvious anti-spinner of the team, helping the team keeps the spikes and stealth rocks used by Ferrothorn. Like i said before, Gengar is a Scizor magnet, so it's very easy to switch on Ferrothorn, he's never gonna superpower on a Gengar behind a sub.
    Rotom-w+Ferrothorn : Rotom-w is baiting pokemons likes Latios, v;olt switch and goes for Ferrothorn to set-up some hazards.
    Politoed + Rotom-w/ Gyarados: Not really a "core", but Politoed can bait and kill pokemon like gastrodon to helps Rotom-w and Gyarados to hit freely with their water attacks.


    • What are the strong points of the team?
    The strongs point or the team are the great synergy between all the pokemons, i don't see any weak link. The 2nd strong point is that the momentum is always on McM's side, even when he uses ferrothorn, he is still kinda threatening with his attack ev's, but he's still a good bulky support. I also like the fact that he got only one choiced pokemon.

    • What are the weak spots?
    The lack of revenge killing is kinda annoying, pokemon like Specs tornadus is very dangerous, even tho he can RK it with mamo, he can't switch at all ... Gengar is a bad spinnblocker but it's my opinion, i don't really like a Spinn blocker who is demolished by Forretress's and Starmie's stabbs.


    • How could his use of certain EV/moveset twists help his team vs specific threats or archetypes?
    Ferrothorn offensive spread is useful against Latias bold sub's and dealing way more damage to thing like Blissey, Jellicent, Breloom, Landorus-T etc....The rest is pretty classic.


    • How does he use some underrated threats to give his team an advantage?
    Mamoswine is very underrated imo, he's very useful to revenge kill threat like dragons type that can be very annoying without that, Gyarados is a really underrated threat too, after a DD+Moxie kill, he can be unstoppable behind a sub.


    • Just about anything else you might want to comment on or ask about.
    Very good team, i don't really see any way of changing it.

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