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Pinsir [QC 3/3] [GP 2/2]

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Hollywood, Jul 18, 2013.

  1. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
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    [Overview]

    <p>Pinsir's combination of a high Attack stat, great coverage, and incredible abilities for its role makes it a premier physical sweeper in NU. For these same reasons, Pinsir is very difficult to wall, especially when considering that some of the more common physical walls, such as Musharna and Tangela, are weak to its STAB. Thanks to its Defense, which is rather high for an offensive Pokemon, Pinsir is also able to set up against some of the most common Pokemon in the tier, including Golurk, Piloswine, and Choice Scarf Primeape. In addition, Pinsir is fairly fast, allowing it to outspeed most of the important walls in the tier. Unfortunately, its Speed can also be a major detriment; while base 85 Speed allows it to outpace common walls and tanks, it's not quite enough to beat many of the tier's premier offensive threats. Pinsir also faces stiff competition as a Bug-type physical sweeper from Scolipede, which has much greater Speed and comparable power thanks to its stronger STAB move. Ultimately however, Pinsir still sets itself apart with its access to priority and two great abilities that can help it beat certain Pokemon that Scolipede struggles to defeat.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Sword Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: X-Scissor
    move 3: Earthquake
    move 4: Quick Attack
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Moxie / Mold Breaker
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Pinsir's most effective set is that of a boosting sweeper, utilizing either of its great abilities and Swords Dance to help muscle past entire teams and even some of the tier's most dominant defensive threats. After a Swords Dance boost, Pinsir's power becomes massive, hitting a whopping 766 Attack. X-Scissor is Pinsir's best STAB, and it helps defeat a variety of common physical walls, such as Musharna and Tangela, which other sweepers in the tier struggle to take down. Earthquake takes out the Steel-, Fire-, and Poison-type Pokemon that resist Pinsir's STAB. Finally, Quick Attack is used to help defeat common Choice Scarf users, such as Jynx, Primeape, and Charizard, which would all be able to otherwise easily revenge kill Pinsir.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>An Adamant nature is used on this set, as the only important Pokemon that a Jolly nature allows Pinsir to outspeed are base 80 and 85 Speed Pokemon with a positive Speed nature, which are relatively rare. Life Orb is the best item for the set, as it allows Pinsir to attain OHKOs against certain Pokemon such as max HP Golurk and helps increase its immediate offensive presence. However, Lum Berry is a very viable alternative on Mold Breaker sets to lure in and defeat Misdreavus that try to use Will-O-Wisp to cripple Pinsir. The ability you use mainly depends on what you want Pinsir's role to be on your team. With Moxie, Pinsir makes a great cleaner, as once it has a Swords Dance and Moxie boost under its belt, very few Pokemon can withstand it. Slower Pokemon fall to its STAB and coverage move, while faster Pokemon are typically frail enough to take out with Quick Attack. However, with Mold Breaker, Pinsir can be used as a wallbreaker by utilizing Earthquake to take out Pokemon with Levitate, such as Misdreavus and Weezing, that wall Moxie Pinsir.</p>

    <p>Pinsir greatly appreciates Stealth Rock support to help it achieve an OHKO at +2 against Swellow and Charizard with Quick Attack and against Lickilicky with X-Scissor. Stealth Rock support is also useful in wearing down the Flying-types that Pinsir struggles to beat. Regirock makes a good partner for this reason and more, as it can not only set up Stealth Rock, but it can also tank Normal-, Flying-, and Fire-type attacks and spread paralysis to give Pinsir an easier time when attempting a sweep. Spikes support is also helpful to allow Pinsir to OHKO Piloswine and defensive Seismitoad; Garbodor can set up Spikes while Pinsir can defeat the Psychic-type Pokemon that threaten it. While Alomomola is unable to wall Pinsir completely, it can survive a hit at +2 and use Toxic against it, which when combined with Life Orb recoil, greatly hampers Pinsir's ability to sweep. Because of this, strong special attackers, such as Ludicolo and Eelektross, are good partners to help take it out. Finally, because Flying-type Pokemon wall this set, offensive Electric- and Ice-type Pokemon can be used to deal with them; Rotom-A and Jynx are good examples of Pokemon that fulfill this role.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Scarf
    move 1: X-Scissor
    move 2: Close Combat
    move 3: Stone Edge
    move 4: Earthquake
    item: Choice Scarf
    ability: Moxie
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With a Choice Scarf and Moxie, Pinsir becomes a dangerous revenge killer and late-game cleaner. Basically, if this set can revenge kill one Pokemon, it can often heavily damage or sweep the rest thanks to its effective +1 boost to both Speed and Attack. X-Scissor is used on this set for STAB, and it does a great deal of damage to Psychic- and Grass-type sweepers, such as Musharna and Serperior. Close Combat does great damage to many of the Pokemon that don't mind taking an X-Scissor, such as Piloswine and Probopass. Stone Edge hits the Flying- and Bug-type Pokemon that don't mind taking a hit from the rest of the set. Finally, Earthquake patches up Pinsir's coverage, hitting Poison-type Pokemon for super effective damage.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>An Adamant nature is preferred on this set, as the only noteworthy Pokemon that a Jolly nature enables it to outspeed are +2 Modest Gorebyss and base 80 Speed Pokemon with a positive Speed nature wielding a Choice Scarf, which are generally rare. A Moxie set with Life Orb and four attacks is another viable option, as the easiest way to wall Pinsir is typically to switch into something that resists whatever move it locks itself into. Because this set is pretty easy to wall before it attains a Moxie boost, it tends to cause many switches, especially into the Flying- and Fire-types that resist its STAB. For this reason, Stealth Rock support is really helpful to aid Pinsir in wearing down its checks and counters. Offensive Stealth Rock users, such as Seismitoad and Golem, can be used in order to help keep up offensive momentum throughout the game and share good offensive synergy with Pinsir. Most physical walls in the tier also give this set troubles, so wallbreakers are great to help take care of them. Mixed Eelektross, Swords Dance Charizard, and Gothorita can all be used to help with this. Finally, Pinsir is quite vulnerable to faster Choice Scarf users that can revenge kill it, such as Primeape, Charizard, and Jynx; Kangaskhan makes a good partner, as it can defeat these Pokemon with priority attacks.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>While the above sets are the best ways to use Pinsir, it does have some other options at its disposal. First off, a powerful Choice Band set can be used to hit hard off the bat, and it can be effective thanks to Mold Breaker ignoring abilities such as Levitate and Sturdy. A Swords Dance Salac Berry set can also be used; however, such a set would be completely useless without the Salac Berry boost and thus would be easy to revenge kill. A set with Endure and Reversal is a pretty flashy idea, but in practice, it's very unreliable, especially because such a set would struggle to beat any Ghost-type Pokemon in the tier. For this same reason, a set using Substitute and Focus Punch would be difficult to use successfully. Pinsir also has access to another boosting move, Bulk Up, but Swords Dance further enhances Pinsir's immediate offensive presence and is preferred because of how much easier it is to set up. A Stealth Rock set is another neat idea as Pinsir's ability to force switches provides free opportunities to set it up, but its lead matchup against most other Stealth Rock users is bleak. Finally, Pinsir has access to Knock Off, which can be used to cripple Eviolite users, such as Misdreavus and Piloswine. It might be difficult to find a slot to run it, but if you can, Knock Off can be a very effective move.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>While Pinsir's great physical strength is unable to be ignored, some Pokemon are able to take it down and wall its attacks with relative ease. Ghost-type Pokemon, such as Misdreavus and Golurk, are typically the best ones for the job, as they resist Pinsir's STAB and are hit neutrally at best by its coverage moves. The former is able to burn Pinsir with Will-O-Wisp, crippling it for the rest of the match, while the latter can take any hit before a Swords Dance boost and threaten back with a powerful Shadow Punch. Even so, both must be wary of taking a +2 Earthquake from Mold Breaker variants, as it does a massive amount damage to Misdreavus and will KO Golurk after Stealth Rock. Alomomola can beat Choice Scarf Pinsir by stalling it out with Toxic, Wish, and Protect, though Swords Dance Pinsir can 2HKO Alomomola with +2 X-Scissor. Regirock, Armaldo, and Metang can all take a hit from Pinsir, while the first two can strike back with their super effective STAB, and Metang can take out a Pinsir that has taken some prior damage with Meteor Mash and Bullet Punch. Because Pinsir is fairly slow, the easiest way to take it out is by revenge killing it. Most of the faster Pokemon that can take a +2 Quick Attack can easily take out Pinsir's Swords Dance set; Haunter is immune to Quick Attack, while Rotom-A and Tauros can both survive one. The Choice Scarf set is more difficult to revenge kill, but most faster Choice Scarf users are able to handle it. Charizard, Primeape, and Rotom-S all outspeed it with a Choice Scarf and have super effective STABs to hit it with. Kangaskhan is able to revenge kill either set, taking care of the Choice Scarf set with the combination of Fake Out and Sucker Punch and the Swords Dance set with Double Edge.</p>

    Took this over from Pkn range6 with permission from Raseri.

    Skeleton: http://pastebin.com/Xxk6yibZ
    Last edited: Aug 2, 2013
  2. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    sure go for it
  3. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
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    write-up's done; ready for 3rd QC check :o
  4. Annoyer

    Annoyer =)~

    Joined:
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    OK everything looks good except for Mold Breaker > Moxie. Moxie is the main reason to use the SD set. The advantage you said of OHKOing Primeape at +3 of Moxie's only advantage isn't true at all. Pinsir's main job is to have this sort of snowballing effect with the Moxie boosts and you're supposed to clean weakened teams with Quick Attack for frail and faster Pokemon, and X-Scissor/EQ for slower mons. Moxie is also great for forcing your opponent into certain situations so you can get the boost and start the wreckage. Mold Breaker hitting like Misdreavus and Weezing (which isnt even too common) is definitely not worth the bonuses of Moxie which basically allow the set to function. You never know the conditions of the team in a battle especially in the lategame so that's why the Moxie boosts are so important - to ensure sweeps and to hit a lot harder. You can also sweep without setting up a Swords Dance just through Moxie which is a huge bonus. I talked with ebeast for a while and he agrees that Moxie should be the first slash. Therefore, I would put Moxie as the first slash and Mold Breaker as the second and add all these benefits of Moxie. Also Lum Berry shouldn't be slashed, it should be put in AC just because the power of Life Orb is really important such as koing max HP Golurk 100% of the time after rocks with +2 EQ (also in checks and counters, just mention Golurk is a good check for the Scarf set as SD Pinsir wrecks Golurk) and Lum is only really useful with Mold Breaker.

    "Alomomola can beat Pinsir by stalling it out with Toxic, Wish, and Protect, though if Pinsir has gathered enough boosts, it can 2HKO with X-Scissor."

    Pinsir already 2HKOs Alomomola at +2 so just state Alomomola as a counter to Scarf Pinsir as it gets completely walled, and that it can take a hit from SD Pinsir to get off a Toxic or Wish but definitely not stall it out all the way.

    Also state Pinsir's really good physical defensive bulk for a sweeper it has allowing it to set up an SD against stuff like choice-locked Primeape, Golurk, or Piloswine just to hit it harder.

    Everything else looks pretty good so I'll give the 3rd check once this is completed. (lol im actually qcing since like forever)
  5. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
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    implemented changes. if the part about Golurk in Checks and Counters is too vague, let me know, but I think it should be alright.
  6. Annoyer

    Annoyer =)~

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    looks good
    3/3
  7. Governess

    Governess A Beautiful Blossom Waiting to Bloom
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    Hihi, amcheck!

    It looks solid; great job!

    Additions
    Removes
    Comments

  8. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Other Metas Leader

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    thanks Governess :)
  9. melvni

    melvni
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    GP check. Good job on writing this.
    Additions in Blue
    Subtractions in Red
    Comments in Purple
    __________________________________
    | ggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg|
    | gggggoggg oggggggggggg 0gggggg 0gggggggggg |
    | ggggggg_ gggggggggggggggggCgggggggggggggg |
    | ggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg|
    | gggggggggggggggggGP 1/2gggggggggggggggggg |
    | ggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggggg|
    |ggggggggegggg egggggggggggggg U ggggU ggggg|
    | ggggggggg<>ggggggggggggggggggg = gggggggg|
    |_________________________________|
  10. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Battle Server Administratoris a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
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    thanks! 1/2 achieved
  11. Ender

    Ender Comfortably Numb
    is a Contributor to Smogon
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    Messages:
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    [​IMG]
    Of approval


    GP Check 2/2

    Additions and Changes
    Deletions
    [Comments]

    fuckorganicchemistry (open)
    [Overview]

    <p>Pinsir's combination of a high Attack stat, great coverage, and incredible abilities for its role makes it a premier physical sweeper in NU. For these same reasons, Pinsir is very difficult to wall, especially when considering that some of the more common physical walls, such as Musharna and Tangela, are weak to its STAB. Thanks to its Defense, which is rather high for an offensive Pokemon, Pinsir is also able to set up against some of the most common Pokemon in the tier, including Golurk, Piloswine, and Choice Scarf Primeape. In addition, Pinsir is fairly fast, allowing it able to outspeed most of the important walls in the tier. Unfortunately, its Speed can also be a major detriment downside; while base 85 Speed allows it to outpace common walls and tanks, it's also not quite enough to beat many of the tier's premier offensive threats. Pinsir also faces stiff competition as a Bug-type physical sweeper from Scolipede, which has much greater Speed and comparable power thanks to its stronger STAB move. Ultimately however, Pinsir still sets itself apart with its access to priority and two great abilities that can help it beat certain Pokemon that Scolipede struggles to defeat.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Sword Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: X-Scissor
    move 3: Earthquake
    move 4: Quick Attack
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Moxie / Mold Breaker
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Pinsir's most effective set is that of a boosting sweeper, utilizing either of its great abilities and Swords Dance to help muscle past entire teams and even some of the tier's most dominant defensive threats. After a Swords Dance boost, Pinsir's power becomes massive, hitting a whopping 766 Attack. X-Scissor is Pinsir's best STAB, and it helps defeat a variety of common physical walls, such as Musharna and Tangela, which other sweepers in the tier struggle to take down. Earthquake takes out the Steel-, Fire-, and Poison-type Pokemon that resist Pinsir's STAB. Finally, Quick Attack is used to help defeat common Choice Scarf users, such as Jynx, Primeape, and Charizard, which would all be able to otherwise easily revenge kill Pinsir otherwise.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>An Adamant nature is used on this set, as the only important Pokemon that a Jolly nature allows Pinsir to outspeed are base 80 and 85 Speed Pokemon with a positive Speed nature, which are relatively rare. Life Orb is the best item for the set, as it allows Pinsir to attain OHKOs against certain Pokemon such as max HP Golurk and helps increase its immediate offensive presence. However, Lum Berry is a very viable alternative on Mold Breaker sets to lure in and defeat Misdreavus that try to use Will-O-Wisp to cripple Pinsir. The ability you use mainly depends on what you want Pinsir's role to be on your team. With Moxie, Pinsir makes a great cleaner, as once it has attained a Swords Dance and Moxie boost under its belt, very few Pokemon can withstand it. Slower Pokemon fall to its STAB and coverage move, while faster Pokemon are typically frail enough to take out with Quick Attack. However, with Mold Breaker, Pinsir can be used as a wallbreaker by utilizing Earthquake to take out Pokemon with Levitate, such as Misdreavus and Weezing, that wall Moxie Pinsir.</p>

    <p>Pinsir greatly appreciates Stealth Rock support to help it achieve an OHKO at +2 against Swellow and Charizard with Quick Attack and against Lickilicky with X-Scissor. Stealth Rock support is also appreciated useful to help in wearing down the Flying-types that Pinsir struggles to beat. Regirock makes a good partner for this reason and more, as it can not only set up Stealth Rock but it can also tank Normal-, Flying-, and Fire-type attacks and spread paralysis to give Pinsir an easier time when attempting a sweep. Spikes support is also helpful to allow Pinsir to OHKO Piloswine and defensive Seismitoad; Garbodor can set up Spikes while Pinsir can defeat the Psychic-type Pokemon that threaten it. While Alomomola is unable to wall Pinsir completely, it can survive a hit at +2 and use Toxic against it, which when combined with Life Orb recoil, greatly hampers Pinsir's ability to sweep. Because of this, strong special attackers, such as Ludicolo and Eelektross, are good partners to help take it out. Finally, because Flying-type Pokemon wall this set, offensive Electric- and Ice-type Pokemon can be used to deal with them useful to help take them out; Rotom-A and Jynx are good examples of Pokemon that fulfill this role.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Scarf
    move 1: X-Scissor
    move 2: Close Combat
    move 3: Stone Edge
    move 4: Earthquake
    item: Choice Scarf
    ability: Moxie
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With a Choice Scarf and Moxie, Pinsir becomes a dangerous revenge killer and late-game cleaner. Basically, if this set can revenge kill one Pokemon, it can often heavily damage or sweep the rest thanks to its effective +1 boost to both Speed and Attack. X-Scissor is used on this set for STAB, and it does a great deal of damage to Psychic- and Grass-type sweepers, such as Musharna and Serperior. Close Combat is as powerful as X-Scissor, and it does great damage to many of the Pokemon that don't mind taking an X-Scissor one, such as Piloswine and Probopass. Stone Edge hits the Flying- and Bug-type Pokemon that don't mind taking a hit from the rest of the set. Finally, Earthquake patches up Pinsir's coverage, hitting Poison-type Pokemon for super effective damage.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>An Adamant nature is preferred on this set, as the only noteworthy Pokemon that a Jolly nature enables it to outspeed are +2 Modest Gorebyss and base 80 Speed Pokemon with a positive Speed nature wielding a Choice Scarf, which are generally rare. A Moxie set with Life Orb and four attacks is another viable option, as the easiest way to wall Pinsir is typically to switch into something that resists whatever move it locks itself into. Because this set is pretty easy to wall before it attains a Moxie boost, it tends to cause many switches, especially into the Flying- and Fire-types that resist its STAB. For this reason, Stealth Rock support is really helpful to aid Pinsir in wearing down its checks and counters. Offensive Stealth Rock users, such as Seismitoad and Golem, can be used in order to help keep up offensive momentum throughout the game and share good offensive synergy with Pinsir. Most physical walls in the tier also give this set troubles, so wallbreakers are great to help take care of them. Mixed Eelektross, Swords Dance Charizard, and Gothorita can all be used to help with this. Finally, Pinsir is quite vulnerable to faster Choice Scarf users, such as Primeape, Charizard, and Jynx, that can revenge kill it, such as Primeape, Charizard, and Jynx; Kangaskhan makes a good partner, as it can defeat these Pokemon with priority attacks.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>While the above sets are the best ways to use Pinsir, it does have some other options at its disposal. First off, a powerful Choice Band set can be used to hit hard off the bat, and it can be effective thanks to Mold Breaker ignoring hindering abilities [removed comma] such as Levitate and Sturdy. A Swords Dance Salac Berry set can also be used; however, such a set would be completely useless without rely on getting the Salac Berry boost and very prone to being revenge killed in order to keep itself from being easily revenge killed. A set with Endure and Reversal is a pretty flashy idea, but in practice, it's very unreliable, especially because such a set would struggle to beat any Ghost-type Pokemon in the tier. For this same reason, a set using Substitute and Focus Punch would be difficult to use successfully. Pinsir also has access to another boosting move, Bulk Up, but Swords Dance further enhances Pinsir's immediate offensive presence and is preferred because of how much easier it is to set up. A Stealth Rock set is another neat idea as Pinsir's ability to force switches provides free opportunities to set it up, but its lead matchup against most other Stealth Rock users is bleak. Finally, Pinsir has access to Knock Off, which can be used to cripple Eviolite users, such as Misdreavus and Piloswine. It might be difficult to find a slot to run it, but if you can, Knock Off can be a very effective move.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>While Pinsir's great physical strength is unable to be ignored, some Pokemon are able to take it down and wall its attacks with relative ease. Ghost-type Pokemon, such as Misdreavus and Golurk, are typically the best ones for the job, as they resist Pinsir's STAB and are hit neutrally at best by its coverage moves. The former is able to burn Pinsir with Will-O-Wisp, crippling it for the rest of the match, while the latter can take any hit before a Swords Dance boost and threaten back with a powerful Shadow Punch. Even so, both must be wary of taking a +2 Earthquake from Mold Breaker variants, as it does a massive amount damage to Misdreavus and will KO Golurk after Stealth Rock. Alomomola can beat Choice Scarf Pinsir by stalling it out with Toxic, Wish, and Protect, though Swords Dance Pinsir can 2HKO Alomomola with +2 X-Scissor. Regirock, Armaldo, and Metang can all take a hit from Pinsir, while the first two can strike back with their super effective STAB, [added comma] and Metang can take out a Pinsir that has taken some prior damage with Meteor Mash and Bullet Punch. Because Pinsir is fairly slow, the easiest way to take it out is by revenge killing it. Most of the faster Pokemon that can take a +2 Quick Attack can easily take out Pinsir's Swords Dance set; Haunter is immune to Quick Attack, while Rotom-A and Tauros can both survive one. The Choice Scarf set is more difficult to revenge kill, but most faster Choice Scarf users are able to handle it. Charizard, Primeape, and Rotom-S all outspeed it with a Choice Scarf and have super effective STABs to hit it with. Kangaskhan is able to revenge kill either set, taking care of the Choice Scarf set with the combination of Fake Out and Sucker Punch and the Swords Dance set with Double Edge.</p>

    Took this over from Pkn range6 with permission from Raseri.

  12. Hollywood

    Hollywood she's thin, she's blonde, she says "wow" a lot
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    thanks! :o
    we should upload this now imo
  13. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    Sorry Treecko, this analysis has been rejected for the following reasons:
    • fake
    • gay
    If you wish to appeal this decision, please PM the user Oglemi with goofy pictures. Thank you.


    Uploading
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