Pokémon Pinsir

[Daisukereds]

I've been using Mega Pinsir a lot and I've usually found power to be more of a concern than Speed when using Quick Attack. Might be worth trying for certain situations, but overall, I'd say beating priority from Pokemon with over 105 base Speed is a small gain for having to give up a quarter of your power.

Of course, piercing Protect isn't too shabby either, especially if you're having trouble with something like Toxic Stall Gliscor.

:) Understandable, just wanted to mention it since I am a fan of Toxic Boost/Zangoose with Feint.

Also (in regards to Hyper Cutter/Moxy).. according to Serebii's Speed Priority (have yet to try this myself), "Mega Evolution has a Speed Priority beyond Stage 5, and will always occur at the start of battle before anyone attacks or switches". Unless Pinsir is Lead PKMN.. Hyper Cutter is not doing much if you decide to Mega Evo it "right away" (someone saying staying Pinsir is not worth the risk).. Pokes cannot Switch in fast enough to fail to Intimidate VS Hyper Cutter.. Aerilate will be ON by then. Moxie would offere more benefits IMO.

* BTW, what the **** is 4MSS??

 

[Shiruba]

* BTW, what the **** is 4MSS??

4MSS is Four Moveslot Syndrome, basically having to choose between a few [often crucial] moves because of only having four slots to fit the moves; so not having one move means losing something important, like coverage or priority.

 

[Impy]

:) Understandable, just wanted to mention it since I am a fan of Toxic Boost/Zangoose with Feint.

Also (in regards to Hyper Cutter/Moxy).. according to Serebii's Speed Priority (have yet to try this myself), "Mega Evolution has a Speed Priority beyond Stage 5, and will always occur at the start of battle before anyone attacks or switches". Unless Pinsir is Lead PKMN.. Hyper Cutter is not doing much if you decide to Mega Evo it "right away" (someone saying staying Pinsir is not worth the risk).. Pokes cannot Switch in fast enough to fail to Intimidate VS Hyper Cutter.. Aerilate will be ON by then. Moxie would offere more benefits IMO.

Good point... It still feels a little scary to try and use regular Pinsir, though. I still think he's a high enough priority target that the opponent is going to immediately try to take it out. A good player is not going to give you a chance to get a moxie boost, you're only ever going to kill something on the switch, and that takes a near-godlike level of prediction considering the amount of things that can OHKO normal Pinsir. But, whatever floats. Getting a moxie boost means you don't need to worry about a setup move, allowing you to give Pinsir perfect coverage.

 

[Daisukereds]

Agreed. It's just more of a justification to run Moxie or Hyper Cutter, instead of the later 100% of the time.
Need to take into account play styles, opponent's team, your team, opportunities, etc..

 

[Tesung]

It is so fucking arbitrary, either will boost your attack a decent amount of the time (I know thAt hyper cutter doesn't boost your attack, but +0 is a boost compared to -1). I have used both, but normal pinsir is slow as shit and it's quick attack does nothing, and intimidaters (specifically lando t) are fairly common, so hyper cutter is probably better.


Now, can we get this thread on track, and talk about good teammates, etc. for example, special attacking kyurem b is a good teammate, as it lures and beats physical walls, and deals with rotom really well. I also like empoleon as a teammate, as it defogs for it, sets up rocks, and takes rock hits meant for pinsir, although those two have trouble with electrics, especially non grounded ones

 

[pedro702]

I've been using Mega Pinsir a lot and I've usually found power to be more of a concern than Speed when using Quick Attack. Might be worth trying for certain situations, but overall, I'd say beating priority from Pokemon with over 105 base Speed is a small gain for having to give up a quarter of your power.

Of course, piercing Protect isn't too shabby either, especially if you're having trouble with something like Toxic Stall Gliscor.

im on the other side i found out that being able to use return on base 100s speed has saved me alot of times and unless theres a ohko i miss with quick atack that im not aware off jolly is usualy much better imo, i love to return salamences,garchomps among alot of base 100 speed pokemons.

 

[Frenzy-kun]

I am trying in the game a jolly megapinsir 31/31/31/x/31/31 at 248At / 248Spe /14Def, and it's a total failure.
I wonder how everyhing can almost OHKO me with normal attacks. Got OHKOed by a protean greninja's hydro pump. And of course, the investment in speed was useless on this guy.
When it his, it hits hard, but it cannot resist a single hit. Any recomendation to distribute the EVs?

 

[Thorhammer]

im on the other side i found out that being able to use return on base 100s speed has saved me alot of times and unless theres a ohko i miss with quick atack that im not aware off jolly is usualy much better imo, i love to return salamences,garchomps among alot of base 100 speed pokemons.

Oh, I'm just talking about Quick Attack vs. Feint. In terms of stat distribution, Jolly is the way to go, no question about it.

I am trying in the game a jolly megapinsir 31/31/31/x/31/31 at 248At / 248Spe /14Def, and it's a total failure.
I wonder how everyhing can almost OHKO me with normal attacks. Got OHKOed by a protean greninja's hydro pump. And of course, the investment in speed was useless on this guy.
When it his, it hits hard, but it cannot resist a single hit. Any recomendation to distribute the EVs?

Keep it away from faster special attackers? You've got to choose your battles more carefully. Pinsir is a powerhouse, but you've got to focus on having it come in when it gets a real chance to smash slower stuff or slice things up with Quick Attack.

 

[DTC]

Jolly is not 100% better than Adamant. Here's a small list of things you cannot do without Adamant (all of these calcs assume +2 and SR):

• Have a chance of OHKO'ing Hippowdon with Return after SR
• Have a very high chance of OHKO'ing Latios with Quick Attack after SR
• Near guaranteed chance of OHKO'ing Mega Gengar with Quick Attack before SR
• Have a very high chance of OHKO'ing specially defensive Rotom-W with Return after SR
• OHKO Landorus-T after SR (assuming Intimidate drop)

Among a lot of other useful damage boosts. Mega Pinsir does not need the speed boost that much thanks to Aerilate Quick Attack; remember, it hits around as hard as Mega Lucario's Bullet Punch. The only 2 very relevant Pokemon that Pinsir does not outspeed by using Adamant is Landorus and Garchomp. Salamence and offensive Jirachi (Jirachi in general) are not nearly as relevant now, so you can scratch those off the list.

I'm not saying Adamant is better, but do not be so quick to judge. So far I have been using Adamant, and the lack of Speed has not been of much relevance in my playtesting, but I will also use Jolly too.

Also, re: Feint, it's too weak to be of use. The extra priority level is not very useful in most situations and you will be wishing you had stronger priority a lot of the time.

 

[pedro702]

Jolly is not 100% better than Adamant. Here's a small list of things you cannot do without Adamant (all of these calcs assume +2 and SR):

• Have a chance of OHKO'ing Hippowdon with Return after SR
• Have a very high chance of OHKO'ing Latios with Quick Attack after SR
• Near guaranteed chance of OHKO'ing Mega Gengar with Quick Attack before SR
• Have a very high chance of OHKO'ing specially defensive Rotom-W with Return after SR
• OHKO Landorus-T after SR (assuming Intimidate drop)

Among a lot of other useful damage boosts. Mega Pinsir does not need the speed boost that much thanks to Aerilate Quick Attack; remember, it hits around as hard as Mega Lucario's Bullet Punch. The only 2 very relevant Pokemon that Pinsir does not outspeed by using Adamant is Landorus and Garchomp. Salamence and offensive Jirachi (Jirachi in general) are not nearly as relevant now, so you can scratch those off the list.

I'm not saying Adamant is better, but do not be so quick to judge. So far I have been using Adamant, and the lack of Speed has not been of much relevance in my playtesting, but I will also use Jolly too.

Also, re: Feint, it's too weak to be of use. The extra priority level is not very useful in most situations and you will be wishing you had stronger priority a lot of the time.

with adamant you speed tie with base 91 pokemon and let me tell you from base 91 to 104 there are alot of pokemons and i mean alot that wont die with quick atack alone imo.

 

[Banryu]

Thorhammer is totally right about picking battles with this thing. At first I was having the same trouble as Pedro getting MegaPinsir set up, but that's pretty much the only trouble he has, that he can't just come in and set up with impunity on most things like Cloyster and Scizor and such will. Most of the time on my MegaPinsir team I end up walling the opponent with my defensive core of Defog Gliscor / defensive Wash Rotom / clerical Sylveon, but when Pinsir DOES get a chance to set up against something that can't status him or hit him SE, the thing is a monster.

I've been running Pinsir with Hyper Cutter (which is a godsend against Landorus-T, Mawile, and other intimidators), Jolly 252 atk/252 spe, and Return/EQ/SD/QA and it just wrecks most things. Can't do much to Skarmory (which is mercifully uncommon) and things like Bisharp and Scizor run the risk of KOing it with priority when weakened, but it's still just so strong that it doesn't usually matter. With +2 Pinsir heavily threatens to KO Scizor in reply if it's taken a hit or two beforehand as well (dunno the exact calcs, but my Pinsir has beaten a few Scizors in his time).

 

[Frenzy-kun]

I am thinking i building something bulky using his over average 120 base defense. Though it will be impossible to deal with special attackers maybe I can tank several threats, specially thanks to it's resistance x4 to fighting:

Jolly @pinsirite
248At, 248Def, 12HP
Bulk up
Return / facade
Superpower / storm throw
Rock Tomb /bulldoze

The idea is simple, bulk up to enhance defenses and attack and then blast the enemies with the other movements. Facade is my choice beause it allows it to act as status absorber, as well as storm throw in orde to surpass any defensive boosts. The last slot goes for a move that reduces the speed of the enemy in order to compensate the lack of speed investment. My choice goes for rock tomb since with good prediction it can deal with talonflame and unlike bulldoze it has no inmunities.

The set lacks of any recovering like any other sets for this pokemon, so a wish passer is almost mandatory for the long term survival. The last question is if Jolly nature is good for these purposes or if I should forget to outspeed anything and focus in defense or attack.

Any advice from pros?

 

[The Gentleman Gamer]

I am thinking i building something bulky using his over average 120 base defense. Though it will be impossible to deal with special attackers maybe I can tank several threats, specially thanks to it's resistance x4 to fighting:

Jolly @pinsirite
248At, 248Def, 12HP
Bulk up
Return / facade
Superpower / storm throw
Rock Tomb /bulldoze

The idea is simple, bulk up to enhance defenses and attack and then blast the enemies with the other movements. Facade is my choice beause it allows it to act as status absorber, as well as storm throw in orde to surpass any defensive boosts. The last slot goes for a move that reduces the speed of the enemy in order to compensate the lack of speed investment. My choice goes for rock tomb since with good prediction it can deal with talonflame and unlike bulldoze it has no inmunities.

The set lacks of any recovering like any other sets for this pokemon, so a wish passer is almost mandatory for the long term survival. The last question is if Jolly nature is good for these purposes or if I should forget to outspeed anything and focus in defense or attack.

Any advice from pros?

Mega Pinsir is a TERRIBLE status absorber. Why? Because it doesn't have Guts. Because of this, burns will still cripple you, and MP hates the speed loss from paralysis. Poison will stop your sweep short, and sleep and freezing still completely stop you in your tracks. So yeah, don't use facade.
Superpower is completely pointless. You might as well use close combat, because as you said, he's not taking special hits any time soon, and you'll enjoy the extra power. Speaking of extra power, 30 base power less is a lot to ask for to bypass defensive boosts. They're not exactly common you know.
Your last two choices are interesting, but Earthquake is the superior coverage option. Using rock tomb to take out one pokemon (and only with good prediction) isn't worth the power loss on almost every other. And as for immunities, just stop and think how many pokemon who are immune to Earthquake, are also resisting Flying type Return AND the Fighting coverage move of your choice. Don't even use bulldoze. Why? Because this set enjoys outspeeding if it can, but if it can't, it might as well hit as hard as it can. The main problem I see with this set is indeed the lack of recovery. A bulky set for a pokemon REALLY needs some sort of recovery, and because MP can't hold leftovers, you can't without switching out, removing all your hard work. And at the end of the day, any fast special attacker will make mincemeat of this set. Nice idea, but I can't see it being preferably over SD sets.

 

[pedro702]

yeah mega pinsir isnt made for bulk up at all that is better leaved to mega heracross imo, pinsir is just too fraill the best he can do is the swords dance set imo and revenge kill with quick atack or return if he is faster other than that dont make him be bulky becuase he isnt.

 

[TorchicBlaziken]

I've been using Mega Pinsir a lot and I've usually found power to be more of a concern than Speed when using Quick Attack. Might be worth trying for certain situations, but overall, I'd say beating priority from Pokemon with over 105 base Speed is a small gain for having to give up a quarter of your power.

Of course, piercing Protect isn't too shabby either, especially if you're having trouble with something like Toxic Stall Gliscor.

Also, Feint prevents the attack drop from King's Shield.

 

[The Great Gastly]

I have a question about Mega Pinsir. What use does it have over Talonflame? His main niche seems to be Flying-STAB priority, but Talonflame can do that too AND can run a STAB Flare Blitz for Steel-types... whereas Pinsir is forced to run an un-stabbed Earthquake.

Even though both are subpar defensive typings, Mega Pinsir has the worse of the two as well.

+2 252+ Atk Life Orb (Aerialate) Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 231-274 (71.29 - 84.56%)
+2 252+ Atk Sharp Beak Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 411-484 (126.85 - 149.38%)

I'd love to be enlightened, since I love Pinsir and would love to have a reason to use him in OU. :]

 

[alexwolf]

Mold Breaker is the superior ability to use now that it has been proven that you can't protect from Intimidate on the switch when MEvolving. You get to hit hard Rotom-W and Bronzong on the switch with Earthquake, two Pokemon that could beat you one on one if you MEvolved instead.

I have a question about Mega Pinsir. What use does it have over Talonflame? His main niche seems to be Flying-STAB priority, but Talonflame can do that too AND can run a STAB Flare Blitz for Steel-types... whereas Pinsir is forced to run an un-stabbed Earthquake.

Even though both are subpar defensive typings, Mega Pinsir has the worse of the two as well.

+2 252+ Atk Life Orb (Aerialate) Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 231-274 (71.29 - 84.56%)
+2 252+ Atk Sharp Beak Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 411-484 (126.85 - 149.38%)

I'd love to be enlightened, since I love Pinsir and would love to have a reason to use him in OU. :]

Pinsir hits way harder and is almost impossible to wall, while Talonflame is easily walled by Tyranitar, Hippowdon, Rotom-W, Slowbro, and more.

 

[Curt93]

I have a question about Mega Pinsir. What use does it have over Talonflame? His main niche seems to be Flying-STAB priority, but Talonflame can do that too AND can run a STAB Flare Blitz for Steel-types... whereas Pinsir is forced to run an un-stabbed Earthquake.

Even though both are subpar defensive typings, Mega Pinsir has the worse of the two as well.

+2 252+ Atk Life Orb (Aerialate) Mega Pinsir Quick Attack vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 231-274 (71.29 - 84.56%)
+2 252+ Atk Sharp Beak Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Terrakion: 411-484 (126.85 - 149.38%)

I'd love to be enlightened, since I love Pinsir and would love to have a reason to use him in OU. :]

You're not required to use a move that has sharp recoil, before you Mega Evolve you dont have a x4 weakness to Stealth Rock. I'm using a Mega Pinsir now and I've been very impressed. Also Talonflame gets hit by King Shield whereas Mega Pinsir can use EQ. Mega Pinsirs' base stats were really impressive so I decided to use him!

 

[Thorhammer]

Pinsir has 74 more base Atk and 49 more base Def, Aerilate makes its Return a stronger version of Brave Bird with no recoil, and Earthquake both has no recoil and gets far better coverage than Flare Blitz alongside a Flying move. Plenty of Pokemon resist both Flying and Fire, but if a Pokemon resists Flying, it's almost guaranteed to be weak to Ground.

Talonflame has its own advantages; it has higher Spe and it can use priority at full power. But against foes they both outspeed, which is a lot, given that Mega Pinsir has an excellent base 105 Spe, Pinsir has a ton more destructive power.

 

[dragonhide]

so guys a mega pinsir with QA/EQ/storm throw and return sounds good?cause om planning on using one...any recommendations?

 

[TheTtarManCan]

I would say Swords Dance is almost mandatory. It synergizes well with quick attack and Mega Pinsir can often force a switch and get a +2 for free. I would take out Storm throw for it personally. EQ will hit most of those steel types and rock types for super effective for you.

 

[Thorhammer]

so guys a mega pinsir with QA/EQ/storm throw and return sounds good?cause om planning on using one...any recommendations?

Not much use for Storm Throw; even if it's super effective, a neutral Return will hit harder. It gets neutral coverage on Skarmory and Rotom-W, but you're still better off using a resisted Return against them.

Quick Attack, Return, and Earthquake are the only offensive moves Pinsir needs. I tried Swords Dance, but I usually had better results just bashing things than setting up; I ended up replacing it with Substitute on my own set and I've been very satisfied with the switch. It usually doesn't need Sub, but it's fine with its other three moves anyway, and in the event it can set up a Sub, it's going to cause a lot of damage before it switches out.

 

[TheTtarManCan]

Not much use for Storm Throw; even if it's super effective, a neutral Return will hit harder. It gets neutral coverage on Skarmory and Rotom-W, but you're still better off using a resisted Return against them.

Quick Attack, Return, and Earthquake are the only offensive moves Pinsir needs. I tried Swords Dance, but I usually had better results just bashing things than setting up; I ended up replacing it with Substitute on my own set and I've been very satisfied with the switch. It usually doesn't need Sub, but it's fine with its other three moves anyway, and in the event it can set up a Sub, it's going to cause a lot of damage before it switches out.

Substitute is actually an excellent idea! It would especially help against a Talon flame switch in. I can just imagine the look on their face! Mega Pinsir has the speed to use it well and again it is easily capable of forcing switches.

 

[dragonhide]

Appreciate the help guys :)!Yes i will use sub to cancel any burn or toxic pokemon that are generally annoying anyway!

 

[Deaga]

Also, re: Feint, it's too weak to be of use. The extra priority level is not very useful in most situations and you will be wishing you had stronger priority a lot of the time.

It has a niche in pre-pokébank with Talonflame being so rampant and SR being pretty rare, in that you can use it to avoid being instantly killed by the bird. I'm pretty sure that it's not a OHKO without rocks, but it must be pretty easy to wear down something that depends on recoil moves before attempting to sweep with Pinsir. The lower BP is pretty underwheling though. Sure, it's "only" 10 BP lower, but thats 25% of Quick Attack's power!