What a Hax Factory. I had Heatran 3 and Aerodactyl 4 agianst the opponents last Raichu, this is battle 41, about to beat my old record. Raichu Thunder Waves Heatran, and I'm fully paralyzed. Next turn, he Thunderpunches, and I'm fully paralyzed. Next turn he thunderpunches again and I'm fully paralyzed for the 3rd time. He kills me and I sent out Dactyl. I have choice band and earthquake, so I proceed as such. He hangs on with FOCUS BAND and thunderpunches me to death. This is all hax, i nearly puked when I lost that one. Aiya.
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Honestly, there really is no right answer to this, which is one of the reasons nobody responded the first time you asked. If you really want to know, you'll have to do some evaluation - figure out how many Pokemon will go from OHKO to 2HKO, decide how much you value the increased crit rate/flinch chance, decide how much that extra 10% hit chance/8 PP is worth, and so forth.
Personally, I don't think the extra accuracy makes up for the damage loss. Either attack leaves you wide open to get screwed over by misses, though. If accuracy really scares you that much, you should switch to a non-Rock type move and/or Pokemon.
Thanks! I was hoping to use it for super effective attacks only, and I don't like missing. I'll experiment.
feeling you bro, especially hard when it happens in the fear-Factory =/
My first Follow Me team only got a streak of 51. In my defence Garchomp didn't get a Swords Dance, Gengar missed 2 Focus Blasts (God I hate that move) and when I could've pulled it back at the end Crobat flinched my Latios with Dark Pulse.
I guess no team is really immune to hax. I was thinking about switching Latios for something more defensive, especially something that I can switch and absorb Ice attacks aimed at Garchomp (my Registeel with Iron Head has always worked well) but I just love the destructive power of a Life Orbed STAB Draco Meteor :/
Another problem I have is not knowing when to use Substitute and when to use Swords Dance. Substitutes aren't as reliable in double battles and it often breaks before I can get a SD in. But when I choose not to set one up I get a crit and see why they're so important.
I can't give up on this team, though, it's the first one I've really built that wasn't a standard rip off of someone else's so I'll keep trying it til I at least get my 100 streak.
I guess no team is really immune to hax. I was thinking about switching Latios for something more defensive, especially something that I can switch and absorb Ice attacks aimed at Garchomp (my Registeel with Iron Head has always worked well) but I just love the destructive power of a Life Orbed STAB Draco Meteor :/
Another problem I have is not knowing when to use Substitute and when to use Swords Dance. Substitutes aren't as reliable in double battles and it often breaks before I can get a SD in. But when I choose not to set one up I get a crit and see why they're so important.
I can't give up on this team, though, it's the first one I've really built that wasn't a standard rip off of someone else's so I'll keep trying it til I at least get my 100 streak.
Platinum Multi Tower Record - 72
Garchomp @ Choice Band
Sand Veil
252 Att / 252 Speed / 4 Hp
Jolly
-Outrage
-Earthquake
-Dragon Claw
-Rock Slide
Metagross @ Occa Berry
Clear Body
252 Att / 172 Hp / 84 Speed
Adamant
-Earthquake
-Meteor Mash
-Explosion
-Bullet Punch
So yea, I just mainly did this because I knew I could eventually get first here. Basically Garchomp would either outrage or earthquake based on the better opening move, and if I were against two ice types or something like weavile I would switch to metagross. Dragon Claw was only there so I knew I could hit dragons and not rely on the 50% outrage (if I didn't hit the dragon then it would almost surely kill me). Rock Slide is mainly filler but is the best option against 4x weak rock types.
Metagross is the same I use for almost all facilities, occa berry because I remember losing on a previous streak to a fire type, but ironically the only time occa was activated was in my loss, and in that battle it didn't matter since metagross was weak enough for the occa berry to be useless.
Here's how the 73rd battle went...
Garchomp and Metagross + Raikou and Aerodactyl vs.
Abomasnow and Charizard + Latios and Steelix
Raikou used Light Screen
Garchomp used Dragon Claw
Latios fainted!
Abomasnow used Blizzard
A Critical Hit!
Garchomp fainted! (I did the calcs, and even with my imperfect HP iv, due to the light screen that was up, Garchomp had a 100% chance of surviving even with the hail, taking a maximum of 92% from the blizzard.)
Raikou used Thunderbolt
Metagross used Meteor Mash
Abomasnow fainted!
Steelix used Earthquake
Raikou fainted!
I wanted to get rid of Abomasnow, but I kind of knew this would happen.
Aerodactyl used Rock Slide
It hit steelix but missed charizard -_-
Charizard used flare blitz
Metagross fainted!
And from there, it was aerodactyl vs. charizard and a steelix. He got rid of charizard next turn, but without earthquake, aero stood no chance.
http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/7392/img4744j.jpg
So I got:
72 wins in the platinum multi tower
74 wins in the platinum singles arcade
323 wins in the platinum doubles tower
Garchomp @ Choice Band
Sand Veil
252 Att / 252 Speed / 4 Hp
Jolly
-Outrage
-Earthquake
-Dragon Claw
-Rock Slide
Metagross @ Occa Berry
Clear Body
252 Att / 172 Hp / 84 Speed
Adamant
-Earthquake
-Meteor Mash
-Explosion
-Bullet Punch
So yea, I just mainly did this because I knew I could eventually get first here. Basically Garchomp would either outrage or earthquake based on the better opening move, and if I were against two ice types or something like weavile I would switch to metagross. Dragon Claw was only there so I knew I could hit dragons and not rely on the 50% outrage (if I didn't hit the dragon then it would almost surely kill me). Rock Slide is mainly filler but is the best option against 4x weak rock types.
Metagross is the same I use for almost all facilities, occa berry because I remember losing on a previous streak to a fire type, but ironically the only time occa was activated was in my loss, and in that battle it didn't matter since metagross was weak enough for the occa berry to be useless.
Here's how the 73rd battle went...
Garchomp and Metagross + Raikou and Aerodactyl vs.
Abomasnow and Charizard + Latios and Steelix
Raikou used Light Screen
Garchomp used Dragon Claw
Latios fainted!
Abomasnow used Blizzard
A Critical Hit!
Garchomp fainted! (I did the calcs, and even with my imperfect HP iv, due to the light screen that was up, Garchomp had a 100% chance of surviving even with the hail, taking a maximum of 92% from the blizzard.)
Raikou used Thunderbolt
Metagross used Meteor Mash
Abomasnow fainted!
Steelix used Earthquake
Raikou fainted!
I wanted to get rid of Abomasnow, but I kind of knew this would happen.
Aerodactyl used Rock Slide
It hit steelix but missed charizard -_-
Charizard used flare blitz
Metagross fainted!
And from there, it was aerodactyl vs. charizard and a steelix. He got rid of charizard next turn, but without earthquake, aero stood no chance.
http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/7392/img4744j.jpg
So I got:
72 wins in the platinum multi tower
74 wins in the platinum singles arcade
323 wins in the platinum doubles tower
You did get kind of unlucky here with the two CHes and Rhydon hitting through +6 Evasion twice then QCing Drapion. I do think that you should have Subbed on Skarmory's last Struggle though, as this would have allowed Drapion to 2HKO Rhydon since +4 Crunch does 50% min.
Congrats on 100, but I'm interested in knowing the details of the first two (Yanmega is a dick and probably the poke I wanna see least so I understand losing to that). Did you not know it was Tyranitar2 off the bat? If not, did you try to "refresh Mesprit's Scarf" by switching it back in to Charm or Flash? And for the second one, was Mesprit not able to Paralyze then Flash at least once? Signal Beam can be lame but it's usually manageable especially with prior help from Mesprit.
Mediocre (but passable?) streak
Heart Gold version, Battle Tower Singles, streak of 109
Okay, so I didn't quite make the top 30 here, but I am still ecstatic about my success with this team, as this is the first time I ever got past battle 100. Furthermore, the most solid member of my team was something that's very rarely seen here: Lapras.
Anyways, my main reason for posting my success with this team is to (hopefully) inspire new variants of the trickscarf strategy. Back in the early days of battling in the Frontier facilities (all the way back in Emerald), I always enjoyed a rather simplistic sweeping strategy. Of course, this never got me very far, as not only do the appropriate stallers shut me down, but I, too, am plagued with the terrible luck associated with challengers of the Battle Frontier.
When I bought my Heart Gold game and finally got the courage (and appropriate pokemon) to challenge the Frontier for the first time in 4th Gen, I decided that maybe I should research strategies that worked for other people, and a friend referred me to Smogon's forums. Well, long story short, the success that teams had with setting up against a successfully crippled foe (using trickscarf) inspired me to try integrating such a strategy this time around.
The Trick/Charm/Thunder Wave/Flash moveset narrowed down my options pretty quick, and I decided to go with Togekiss as my trickscarfer, just for something different (also, I don't have any other 4th gen games, so Uxie wasn't even up for grabs).
So, without further ado...
Bold
@ Choice Scarf
Serene Grace
31/x/20/x/x/31
252 HP / 252 Speed / 6 Def
* Trick
* Charm
* Flash
* Thunder Wave
Of course, this is my invaluable lead. The advantage of it is that it draws 3 types of attacks: Rock, Ice, and Electric. If the opponent uses Rock or Electric, Garchomp can take care of them pretty easy (Rock does carry some exceptions...) while Lapras happily absorbs any Ice attacks. There really isn't much more to say, as the other people using trickscarfers have said enough.
Jolly
@ Lum Berry
Sand Veil
27/31/20/28/19/31
252 Atk / 6 Def / 252 Speed
* Swords Dance
* Outrage
* Substitute
* Earthquake
I actually hated Garchomp before I bought Heart Gold, and for a lot of my gameplay initially. For fun, I decided to breed them, and I actually ended up with these nice IVs thanks to the new Power item breeding strategy. Friends had always told me about how this thing is uncommonly overpowered in standard play, and so I really did not want to get too attached to it.
Sadly, I ended up becoming a fan of it for the Frontier. While training it for the sake of pokedex entry, I quickly fell in love with its amazing power, and this beast got me to a streak of 186 in Battle Hall after repeated failures with Espeon (why did Weavile appear constantly for Espeon and never showed up for Garchomp?)
Since my strategy needed a Ground type with great resistances and good power, along with the ability to set up nicely, I decided to go with Garchomp, and I am not dissatisfied. Once again, so many have used this beast in their teams that I don't think I have to say much to explain my "strategy" with him.
Impish
@ Leftovers
Shell Armor
28/31/31/31/30/28
32 HP / 158 Atk / 208 Def / 112 SpDef
* Waterfall
* Return
* Substitute
* Dragon Dance
Here's the star of my team. Ever since the days I played Yellow, I've adored Lapras. Its stat total, general appearance, and its typing's STAB coverage have always appeased to me enough to stand out significantly. Lapras is just great. The only real problems lie in its typing, as a lot of things get to score supereffective hits on the poor thing. Still, despite this, Lapras has enough bulk to survive hits and just enough power to hit back.
The general strategy of this guy is to go out against something with a weak physical attack (or doomed to use Struggle soon). Nothing can break this guy's Substitute in less than 3 Ice attacks, and anything that uses Struggle after 3 Charms from Togekiss is simply helpless. Basically, this guy is almost guaranteed to get 6 Dragon Dances in after Togekiss cripples the opponent's lead.
After 6 DDs, he scores important 1hkos against many of his counters. As for those that resist/absorb Water, Return manages to 1hko almost all the time. Hell, even if a Gyarados is sent out and manages to successfully Intimidate, I can 1hko it with a good Return if it has no HP EVs.
What I really love about this guy is that his Subs are so bulky that he, 70% of the time, manages to return to full HP (from Leftovers) after 6 Dragon Dances. So, essentially, he is at full HP, has a Sub protecting him, and has the ability to 1hko most of the game, 2hko the rest. What's not to like about this beast?
As for EVs, I arranged them specifically so he would have Subs that could take 4-5 Struggles from anything, along with the ability to survive just about any powerful, supereffective attack. To give you an example, this guy took a DynamicPunch from a Machamp @ 75% HP and survived with about 12.
The HP EVs in particular were added so he would have 208 HP, the very first number that allows Leftovers to recover 13 HP. This has proven to be extremely effective (read above) in terms of balancing Defense and HP.
Finally, the Attack EVs were there specifically to get him to 125 exactly. It's a nice clean number, and guarantees a lot of important 1hkos against moderately bulky grass types. It actually even scores a 1hko on Roserade with Waterfall!
How I lost:
Went up against a Battle Girl. Her lead was Lucario, the king of unpredictability. I made a HUGE mistake of using Trick with Togekiss, and it turned out to be the Close Combat variety. So, I have a monster that can 2hko all of my team AND outspeed them. Major facepalm moment. So, I let Togekiss die, knowing it's better to lose the crippler than waste a sweeper. Garchomp goes out, takes a non-crit CC (whew!), and uses EQ. KOs Lucario, of course, and then a Machamp gets sent out.
And, here's where my bad luck kicks in. Quick Claw activates. Machamp uses EQ and takes out the remaining ~60 HP that Garchomp has, before I can attempt some damage using Outrage. Lapras is my last contender, and at this point, I know I'm done. Thankfully, Lapras was able to outspeed this Machamp, and I got a successful Waterfall in, which took out about 30% of its HP? I then get a moment of luck. Machamp flinches! Next, I made another mistake (though at this point I don't think I could've found a way out of the mess) by using Sub, hoping that it's a Guts Machamp, and assuming it'd use Stone Edge. It does use Stone Edge, but it connects and the Sub fades. Next, I decide to keep trying to Sub. Much as would be expected by now, Quick Claw activates... Machamp uses DynamicPunch, and Lapras survives with about 12 HP. Lapras then manages to get through confusion and try Sub, which fails of course. Next turn, I decide to just go all out offensive, since I'm screwed at this point. I try a Waterfall, and I hit myself in confusion. Match over. orz
Videos!
All I have for now: my 49th battle vs. Palmer. The whole thing went smoothly, and is the quintessential way my team wins, typically, so I'm pretty proud of this one - 67-49391-56571
Heart Gold version, Battle Tower Singles, streak of 109
Okay, so I didn't quite make the top 30 here, but I am still ecstatic about my success with this team, as this is the first time I ever got past battle 100. Furthermore, the most solid member of my team was something that's very rarely seen here: Lapras.
Anyways, my main reason for posting my success with this team is to (hopefully) inspire new variants of the trickscarf strategy. Back in the early days of battling in the Frontier facilities (all the way back in Emerald), I always enjoyed a rather simplistic sweeping strategy. Of course, this never got me very far, as not only do the appropriate stallers shut me down, but I, too, am plagued with the terrible luck associated with challengers of the Battle Frontier.
When I bought my Heart Gold game and finally got the courage (and appropriate pokemon) to challenge the Frontier for the first time in 4th Gen, I decided that maybe I should research strategies that worked for other people, and a friend referred me to Smogon's forums. Well, long story short, the success that teams had with setting up against a successfully crippled foe (using trickscarf) inspired me to try integrating such a strategy this time around.
The Trick/Charm/Thunder Wave/Flash moveset narrowed down my options pretty quick, and I decided to go with Togekiss as my trickscarfer, just for something different (also, I don't have any other 4th gen games, so Uxie wasn't even up for grabs).
So, without further ado...
Bold
Serene Grace
31/x/20/x/x/31
252 HP / 252 Speed / 6 Def
* Trick
* Charm
* Flash
* Thunder Wave
Of course, this is my invaluable lead. The advantage of it is that it draws 3 types of attacks: Rock, Ice, and Electric. If the opponent uses Rock or Electric, Garchomp can take care of them pretty easy (Rock does carry some exceptions...) while Lapras happily absorbs any Ice attacks. There really isn't much more to say, as the other people using trickscarfers have said enough.
Jolly
Sand Veil
27/31/20/28/19/31
252 Atk / 6 Def / 252 Speed
* Swords Dance
* Outrage
* Substitute
* Earthquake
I actually hated Garchomp before I bought Heart Gold, and for a lot of my gameplay initially. For fun, I decided to breed them, and I actually ended up with these nice IVs thanks to the new Power item breeding strategy. Friends had always told me about how this thing is uncommonly overpowered in standard play, and so I really did not want to get too attached to it.
Sadly, I ended up becoming a fan of it for the Frontier. While training it for the sake of pokedex entry, I quickly fell in love with its amazing power, and this beast got me to a streak of 186 in Battle Hall after repeated failures with Espeon (why did Weavile appear constantly for Espeon and never showed up for Garchomp?)
Since my strategy needed a Ground type with great resistances and good power, along with the ability to set up nicely, I decided to go with Garchomp, and I am not dissatisfied. Once again, so many have used this beast in their teams that I don't think I have to say much to explain my "strategy" with him.
Impish
Shell Armor
28/31/31/31/30/28
32 HP / 158 Atk / 208 Def / 112 SpDef
* Waterfall
* Return
* Substitute
* Dragon Dance
Here's the star of my team. Ever since the days I played Yellow, I've adored Lapras. Its stat total, general appearance, and its typing's STAB coverage have always appeased to me enough to stand out significantly. Lapras is just great. The only real problems lie in its typing, as a lot of things get to score supereffective hits on the poor thing. Still, despite this, Lapras has enough bulk to survive hits and just enough power to hit back.
The general strategy of this guy is to go out against something with a weak physical attack (or doomed to use Struggle soon). Nothing can break this guy's Substitute in less than 3 Ice attacks, and anything that uses Struggle after 3 Charms from Togekiss is simply helpless. Basically, this guy is almost guaranteed to get 6 Dragon Dances in after Togekiss cripples the opponent's lead.
After 6 DDs, he scores important 1hkos against many of his counters. As for those that resist/absorb Water, Return manages to 1hko almost all the time. Hell, even if a Gyarados is sent out and manages to successfully Intimidate, I can 1hko it with a good Return if it has no HP EVs.
What I really love about this guy is that his Subs are so bulky that he, 70% of the time, manages to return to full HP (from Leftovers) after 6 Dragon Dances. So, essentially, he is at full HP, has a Sub protecting him, and has the ability to 1hko most of the game, 2hko the rest. What's not to like about this beast?
As for EVs, I arranged them specifically so he would have Subs that could take 4-5 Struggles from anything, along with the ability to survive just about any powerful, supereffective attack. To give you an example, this guy took a DynamicPunch from a Machamp @ 75% HP and survived with about 12.
The HP EVs in particular were added so he would have 208 HP, the very first number that allows Leftovers to recover 13 HP. This has proven to be extremely effective (read above) in terms of balancing Defense and HP.
Finally, the Attack EVs were there specifically to get him to 125 exactly. It's a nice clean number, and guarantees a lot of important 1hkos against moderately bulky grass types. It actually even scores a 1hko on Roserade with Waterfall!
How I lost:
Went up against a Battle Girl. Her lead was Lucario, the king of unpredictability. I made a HUGE mistake of using Trick with Togekiss, and it turned out to be the Close Combat variety. So, I have a monster that can 2hko all of my team AND outspeed them. Major facepalm moment. So, I let Togekiss die, knowing it's better to lose the crippler than waste a sweeper. Garchomp goes out, takes a non-crit CC (whew!), and uses EQ. KOs Lucario, of course, and then a Machamp gets sent out.
And, here's where my bad luck kicks in. Quick Claw activates. Machamp uses EQ and takes out the remaining ~60 HP that Garchomp has, before I can attempt some damage using Outrage. Lapras is my last contender, and at this point, I know I'm done. Thankfully, Lapras was able to outspeed this Machamp, and I got a successful Waterfall in, which took out about 30% of its HP? I then get a moment of luck. Machamp flinches! Next, I made another mistake (though at this point I don't think I could've found a way out of the mess) by using Sub, hoping that it's a Guts Machamp, and assuming it'd use Stone Edge. It does use Stone Edge, but it connects and the Sub fades. Next, I decide to keep trying to Sub. Much as would be expected by now, Quick Claw activates... Machamp uses DynamicPunch, and Lapras survives with about 12 HP. Lapras then manages to get through confusion and try Sub, which fails of course. Next turn, I decide to just go all out offensive, since I'm screwed at this point. I try a Waterfall, and I hit myself in confusion. Match over. orz
Videos!
All I have for now: my 49th battle vs. Palmer. The whole thing went smoothly, and is the quintessential way my team wins, typically, so I'm pretty proud of this one - 67-49391-56571
SoulSilver Battle Factory Open Level
Streak: 41
Trades: 13
I lost to a Pokemon Collector.
I hate this place. For battles 29-35 I got Garchomp, Scizor, and TTar right off the bat and never had to switch the whole time. I got an okay team for battle 36, doing well until the seventh match.
My team at this point was:
854 Yanmega (Bug Buzz/Air Slash/Psychic/Shadow Ball)
774 Quagsire (EQ/Waterfall/Stone Edge/Ice Punch)
848 Weavile (Night Slash/Ice Punch/Aerial Ace/Brick Break)
He sent out Electrode, so I switched to Quagsire, and it used Thunder for no damage revealing it to be 658 Electrode with Thunder/Hyper Beam/Magnet Rise/Rain Dance. I EQ'd, hoping the AI would be dumb and not Magnet Rise but it did. Next turn I meant to click Waterfall but misclicked on Ice Punch, which worked out great because he switched to Sceptile, which promptly died. He switched back out Electrode, which died to two Waterfalls, only getting out Magnet Rise and Hyper Beam for paltry damage. I felt pretty good at this point, with him on his last Poke, but I really should have known better. This is Battle Frontier, after all.
His last pokemon was a Rhydon. I clicked waterfall, thinking it was over (even if it had Passho berry, it still couldn't have killed me). Of course, it was 804 Rhydon. It uses Horn Drill, OHKO's. Fuck. I send out Yanmega to get some damage with Bug Buzz to ensure Weavile's Ice Punch will kill. Quick Claw activates, and Stone Edge (which I'm pretty sure has like 300% accuracy for the AI) kills me. I send out Weavile, QC activates again, and Stone Edge crushes my Gold Symbol dreams. T_T
Streak: 41
Trades: 13
I lost to a Pokemon Collector.
I hate this place. For battles 29-35 I got Garchomp, Scizor, and TTar right off the bat and never had to switch the whole time. I got an okay team for battle 36, doing well until the seventh match.
My team at this point was:
854 Yanmega (Bug Buzz/Air Slash/Psychic/Shadow Ball)
774 Quagsire (EQ/Waterfall/Stone Edge/Ice Punch)
848 Weavile (Night Slash/Ice Punch/Aerial Ace/Brick Break)
He sent out Electrode, so I switched to Quagsire, and it used Thunder for no damage revealing it to be 658 Electrode with Thunder/Hyper Beam/Magnet Rise/Rain Dance. I EQ'd, hoping the AI would be dumb and not Magnet Rise but it did. Next turn I meant to click Waterfall but misclicked on Ice Punch, which worked out great because he switched to Sceptile, which promptly died. He switched back out Electrode, which died to two Waterfalls, only getting out Magnet Rise and Hyper Beam for paltry damage. I felt pretty good at this point, with him on his last Poke, but I really should have known better. This is Battle Frontier, after all.
His last pokemon was a Rhydon. I clicked waterfall, thinking it was over (even if it had Passho berry, it still couldn't have killed me). Of course, it was 804 Rhydon. It uses Horn Drill, OHKO's. Fuck. I send out Yanmega to get some damage with Bug Buzz to ensure Weavile's Ice Punch will kill. Quick Claw activates, and Stone Edge (which I'm pretty sure has like 300% accuracy for the AI) kills me. I send out Weavile, QC activates again, and Stone Edge crushes my Gold Symbol dreams. T_T
I have currently a 490 streak in Diamond Battle tower I don't expect you to believe me I'll post a pic but the question is, how do you guys manage to take a good and clear pic I grab my sony cybershot camera and I get always blurry quality and have tried all the modes :S
I use the "macro" option to take pictures of a screen. Most digital cameras have one. Mobile phones cameras also sometimes have one.
New streak, still not past 300. Oh well.
Platnium Battle Tower Singles Streak: 264
Latias @ Choice Scarf ** (Millennium)
Timid
EVs: 252 Hp / 172 Def / 84 Spe
IVs: 31/17/31/31/31/31
~Levitate~
-Trick
-Thunder Wave
-Charm
-Flash
Getting a Timid Latias with near-perfect IVs is a pain. I upped the Speed EV count to 84 to outspeed Garchomp 2-4 after Tricking the Scarf so I can hit them with Charm. I'd probably never use another TrickScarf lead in the tower.
Drapion @ Black Sludge ** (Hiruko)
Careful
EVs: 252 Hp / 32 Def / 220 Sp. Def / 4 Spe
IVs: 31/31/31/16/31/31
~Battle Armor~
-Crunch
-Accupressure
-Substitute
-Rest
Yeah, it's basically Jumpman's Drapion. Two key differences, mine is Careful natured rather than Adamant natured, and I modified the EV spread to give him a little more bulk on the physical side as well. The 4 Speed EVs are for outspeeding some random Pokemon (my memory is a load of fail), but they also serve to make sure I have one more point in Special Defense than Defense so P2 and PZ don't get a boost from Download.
Scizor @ Leftovers ** (G.E.A.R.)
Adamant
EVs: 152 Hp / 252 Atk / 104 Spe
IVs: 31/31/31/4/31/31
~Technician~
-Bullet Punch
-Brick Break
-Substitute
-Swords Dance
Scizor is the closest thing to "uber" outside of the usual suspects in the Tower. Speed EVs for outspeeding Heatran, who my team hates with a passion. He'll usually only come in on the powerful attacks that Drapion doesn't resist (I'm looking at you, Ice Beam, Outrage, Dragon Pulse, ect). He's an excellent partner for Drapion, since he can generally OHKO or 2HKO anything in the tower at +6 Attack and he resists most anything that Drapion and Latias don't. In fact, the only type unresisted between the three of them is Flying, which isn't too bothersome unless you're looking at Staraptor's Brave Bird. I know that my team is similar Jumpman's DRAPULA I, but I've changed it up plenty.
Btw, G.E.A.R stands for Gigantic Erratic Aluminum Roach, in case you were wondering ;)
Threats List:
QC OHKO Users: Nothing but a cesspool of pure evil here. There's nothing you can do against them unless you have a Sub up when they come out. And even then, you're not safe unless you can OHKO them or stall out their OHKO move of choice.
Choice Item Leads/Trick Leads: Always hazzardous for Trick teams. There are few things worse than Tricking the Scarf and then having it handed right back to you. Choice Item leads are less problematic, but they're still not easy to beat down.
The Untrickables: Leads like Gastrodon and Muk are a nuisance because Tricking to them is a waste. That simple.
Clear Body: Metagross, Regice, Regirock, Tentacruel, and Registeel. They're immovable lumps of pain that mess up the entire strategy because they're impossible to weaken with Charm/Flash. Torkoal and Hyper Cutter users are similarly annoying, only less so.
Heatran: He's a monster. Even if he's coming out in second or third position, there's no garantee of a victory. My first run ended at 162 several weeks ago thanks to him. On top of that, Focus Sash and Brightpowder spell doom to Scizor, which sucks.
Battle 265 Warstory: So I'm in the middle of the set, just crusing along. Abomasnow leads. I Trick, and it blasts Latias with Blizzard. So now I know it's Abomasnow 3. Latias gets fainted next turn, but not before T-Waving the thing. I send out Scizor, who Subs up and sets up with SD. I use Bullet Punch, fainting Abomasnow the turn after my Sub breaks (one of the Blizzards got a crit). Up next, Frosslass 4. I use Bullet Punch, it misses. Blizzard hits home, and Scizor is frozen. Fortunately for me, it defrosted on the next turn, and Bullet Punch hit home. Then Lapras comes out. I'm praying, hoping against hope that it's not the QC Sheer Cold Lapras. It is. Quick Claw activates and Confuse Ray hits. Scizor hits itself twice before being blasted by Sheer Cold. So I'm down to Drapion. I try to use Sub, but it's no good, as Quick Claw activates again and I die to a haxxed Sheer Cold.
In hindsight, I should have Subbed on that turn with Scizor, but I was worried that by the time I did, I'd have lost too much health to do so. Ah well. Hindsight is always 20/20, as they say.
Could somebody who is less lazy than I am calculate the chances of that loss? I'd really appreciate it, thanks.
Let me know if I missed anything, cheers!
Platnium Battle Tower Singles Streak: 264
Latias @ Choice Scarf ** (Millennium)
Timid
EVs: 252 Hp / 172 Def / 84 Spe
IVs: 31/17/31/31/31/31
~Levitate~
-Trick
-Thunder Wave
-Charm
-Flash
Getting a Timid Latias with near-perfect IVs is a pain. I upped the Speed EV count to 84 to outspeed Garchomp 2-4 after Tricking the Scarf so I can hit them with Charm. I'd probably never use another TrickScarf lead in the tower.
Drapion @ Black Sludge ** (Hiruko)
Careful
EVs: 252 Hp / 32 Def / 220 Sp. Def / 4 Spe
IVs: 31/31/31/16/31/31
~Battle Armor~
-Crunch
-Accupressure
-Substitute
-Rest
Yeah, it's basically Jumpman's Drapion. Two key differences, mine is Careful natured rather than Adamant natured, and I modified the EV spread to give him a little more bulk on the physical side as well. The 4 Speed EVs are for outspeeding some random Pokemon (my memory is a load of fail), but they also serve to make sure I have one more point in Special Defense than Defense so P2 and PZ don't get a boost from Download.
Scizor @ Leftovers ** (G.E.A.R.)
Adamant
EVs: 152 Hp / 252 Atk / 104 Spe
IVs: 31/31/31/4/31/31
~Technician~
-Bullet Punch
-Brick Break
-Substitute
-Swords Dance
Scizor is the closest thing to "uber" outside of the usual suspects in the Tower. Speed EVs for outspeeding Heatran, who my team hates with a passion. He'll usually only come in on the powerful attacks that Drapion doesn't resist (I'm looking at you, Ice Beam, Outrage, Dragon Pulse, ect). He's an excellent partner for Drapion, since he can generally OHKO or 2HKO anything in the tower at +6 Attack and he resists most anything that Drapion and Latias don't. In fact, the only type unresisted between the three of them is Flying, which isn't too bothersome unless you're looking at Staraptor's Brave Bird. I know that my team is similar Jumpman's DRAPULA I, but I've changed it up plenty.
Btw, G.E.A.R stands for Gigantic Erratic Aluminum Roach, in case you were wondering ;)
Threats List:
QC OHKO Users: Nothing but a cesspool of pure evil here. There's nothing you can do against them unless you have a Sub up when they come out. And even then, you're not safe unless you can OHKO them or stall out their OHKO move of choice.
Choice Item Leads/Trick Leads: Always hazzardous for Trick teams. There are few things worse than Tricking the Scarf and then having it handed right back to you. Choice Item leads are less problematic, but they're still not easy to beat down.
The Untrickables: Leads like Gastrodon and Muk are a nuisance because Tricking to them is a waste. That simple.
Clear Body: Metagross, Regice, Regirock, Tentacruel, and Registeel. They're immovable lumps of pain that mess up the entire strategy because they're impossible to weaken with Charm/Flash. Torkoal and Hyper Cutter users are similarly annoying, only less so.
Heatran: He's a monster. Even if he's coming out in second or third position, there's no garantee of a victory. My first run ended at 162 several weeks ago thanks to him. On top of that, Focus Sash and Brightpowder spell doom to Scizor, which sucks.
Battle 265 Warstory: So I'm in the middle of the set, just crusing along. Abomasnow leads. I Trick, and it blasts Latias with Blizzard. So now I know it's Abomasnow 3. Latias gets fainted next turn, but not before T-Waving the thing. I send out Scizor, who Subs up and sets up with SD. I use Bullet Punch, fainting Abomasnow the turn after my Sub breaks (one of the Blizzards got a crit). Up next, Frosslass 4. I use Bullet Punch, it misses. Blizzard hits home, and Scizor is frozen. Fortunately for me, it defrosted on the next turn, and Bullet Punch hit home. Then Lapras comes out. I'm praying, hoping against hope that it's not the QC Sheer Cold Lapras. It is. Quick Claw activates and Confuse Ray hits. Scizor hits itself twice before being blasted by Sheer Cold. So I'm down to Drapion. I try to use Sub, but it's no good, as Quick Claw activates again and I die to a haxxed Sheer Cold.
In hindsight, I should have Subbed on that turn with Scizor, but I was worried that by the time I did, I'd have lost too much health to do so. Ah well. Hindsight is always 20/20, as they say.
Could somebody who is less lazy than I am calculate the chances of that loss? I'd really appreciate it, thanks.
Let me know if I missed anything, cheers!
First of all, switch Bulk Up for Iron Defense and switch Crunch for Dark Pulse/Shadow Ball. This sets you up 3 turns faster and gives you a dump stat for nature purposes while basically being the same Lucario. Alternately, you can run EonADS's set, which also runs Substitute and Flash Cannon. He used HP/SpA for EVs and Modest nature, if that interests you.
If you want to make your own spread, I'd suggest you take the following steps (this is generally how I EV):
1) Find a Pokemon stat calculator, and put in the Pokemon you want to check (I personally just use Smogon's damage calculator)
2) Use the list of speed tiers as well as the stat calculator to decide what you want to outspeed and whether you can do so without sacrificing more EVs than you'd like. Decide on Nature and Speed EVs.
3) Assuming that you don't want to spend any EVs on attack stats, you can plug the remaining information into X-Act's Defense EV calculator. If you are willing to really work hard, it is better to calculate what you need to do to survive specific threats, but the EV calculator is much faster if you don't want to do that much work.
---
On a completely unrelated note, I discovered the hard way that the team I've been tinkering around with (Breloom, Heatran, Gyarados) has a crippling weakness to Starmie 1 the night before last. I might have been able to salvage a lucky win, but 3 turns of confusion self damage and 2 turns of paralysis was enough to take out Gyarados before he had a chance to do anything meaningful.
Incidentally, Lead Breloom actually played somewhat better than expected, though I certainly miss the +1 Speed and +6 Attack/Defense my previous team provided. Having a third a slot due to not needing a Baton Passer, being able to switch at will, not needing to spend forever setting up, and not needing to make risky Baton Passes are all nice, though.
thanks thats very helpfull :)
Oi, that's my Lucario set, not Eon's! :p
Technically, some passerby posted it here a long while back, and I popularised it over at Serebii among the smarter Tower battlers. But yeah, my Luke set you have there. >:o
Technically, some passerby posted it here a long while back, and I popularised it over at Serebii among the smarter Tower battlers. But yeah, my Luke set you have there. >:o
Sorry, then. The necessity of providing timely advice strongly outweighed the necessity of fact-checking. For what it's worth, I avoid Serebii since the layout and color choices make my inner programmer/web designer weep.
Eon was the one who had the best run with it in the listed Platinum rankings and wrote up the best concise description. As such, I pointed to his writeup and gave him credit. It seems like the sort of set that multiple people can come up with independently, since it doesn't exactly make any counter-intuitive choices.
In happy news, I finally broke 100 wins, but in order to do so I took some measures that would presumably prevent me from claiming a spot on the rankings if I continue my streak. As soon as I lose, though, I'm going to try out a completely legitimate streak and see if I can't make it past 100 again.
I don't mind, I was just saying it's my set. >_>
Oh, and congrats on beating 100!
Oh, and congrats on beating 100!
Oh, sorry, I think I misread you as being more hostile than you actually were. It's been a long day.
So yeah, my team still hasn't lost quite yet, but there have been some close calls, like this particularly absurd match (turn off battle animations if you want to watch the whole thing):
47-14905-15520
I misplayed several times (this battle did take place at around 1 AM), the worst being that I should have used Spore on Milotic much earlier so that I could kill it before it got off too many Double Teams. I think I may have just gotten carried away by the thought that it had absolutely no way to kill me.
It's worth noting that by the time that Milotic was reduced to Struggling, I had exhausted all my PP in everything but 10 PP in Facade (and these are all maxed out PPs, of course).
The match that was the closest, though, was against an Ace Trainer packing lead Latios 4 - which my team apparently struggles with, since it took out 2/3 of my team and almost took out Breloom before being finished off. The second Pokemon was Suicune 4, who was fairly unremarkable besides the fact that he reduced my Spore count to single digits (he never once let me land more than one Facade before waking up). Regice 3 was the final Pokemon, but he was a pushover besides the fact that Chesto Berry is something that Breloom doesn't like and that if he had woken up any earlier he would have Rested off 90%+ damage.
I'll probably write up the exact team I'm running tomorrow. I need some sleep.
Just came across possibly one of the most annoying Pokémon ever at the Factory:
Munchlax@Sitrus Berry
Metronome
Recycle
Stockpile
Swallow
It managed to Metronome a Blizzard on my Gabite, which was totally retarded. Luckily my Gabite survived due to the Yache Berry. Safe to say, it managed to earn its place on my team. As for the streak, I've just beaten #14, so hopefully a little later I'll be able to give you guys a new best streak. (:
Munchlax@Sitrus Berry
Metronome
Recycle
Stockpile
Swallow
It managed to Metronome a Blizzard on my Gabite, which was totally retarded. Luckily my Gabite survived due to the Yache Berry. Safe to say, it managed to earn its place on my team. As for the streak, I've just beaten #14, so hopefully a little later I'll be able to give you guys a new best streak. (:
There's nothing more retarded than the Cradily with Double Team/Toxic/Ingrain/Stockpile.
It's built so you're not doing a lot of damage to start with, then it starts Double Teaming so you can't hit it, then it starts Stockpiling so even if you do hit it it doesn't matter cause it'll heal off the damage.
The only time I ever lost with it on my team was when a Toxicroak got lucky with Dynamic Punch. Other than that I've PP stalled Metagross and loads of Poison types immune to Toxic. (Apart from one that actually beat me with Struggle -.-)
As for my own streak at Battle Tower, Follow Me didn't work as well as I hoped. Nobody shuts up about Garchomp so I figured, well, Clefable will always let Garchomp get at least one Swords Dance in and (usually a sub as well) then it can sweep. My highest streak is 51, Garchomp isn't as uber as it seems, at least not in Double Battles (I won Battle Hall with one, though.)
Died twice at 51, once at 50, really starting to think there's a code that triples hax at that stage or something. Doubt I'll try again for a while I'm meant to be revising D;
It's built so you're not doing a lot of damage to start with, then it starts Double Teaming so you can't hit it, then it starts Stockpiling so even if you do hit it it doesn't matter cause it'll heal off the damage.
The only time I ever lost with it on my team was when a Toxicroak got lucky with Dynamic Punch. Other than that I've PP stalled Metagross and loads of Poison types immune to Toxic. (Apart from one that actually beat me with Struggle -.-)
As for my own streak at Battle Tower, Follow Me didn't work as well as I hoped. Nobody shuts up about Garchomp so I figured, well, Clefable will always let Garchomp get at least one Swords Dance in and (usually a sub as well) then it can sweep. My highest streak is 51, Garchomp isn't as uber as it seems, at least not in Double Battles (I won Battle Hall with one, though.)
Died twice at 51, once at 50, really starting to think there's a code that triples hax at that stage or something. Doubt I'll try again for a while I'm meant to be revising D;
I got a run of 175 in Platinum's Battle Hall with Garchomp
Garchomp@Choice Band/Yache Berry/Haban Berry
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
-Outrage
-Earthquake
-Fire Fang
-Brick Break
First 170 went smoothly, no tough sets or hax. I don't really remember how I lost, it was over a year ago now. I don't thing I minded too much, I was just pleased to get to 170.
Here is some proof:
Garchomp@Choice Band/Yache Berry/Haban Berry
4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
-Outrage
-Earthquake
-Fire Fang
-Brick Break
First 170 went smoothly, no tough sets or hax. I don't really remember how I lost, it was over a year ago now. I don't thing I minded too much, I was just pleased to get to 170.
Here is some proof:
As promised, here's the team I've been running:
Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 204 HP / 52 Def / 252 Spe
Nature: Jolly
-Facade
-Protect
-Spore
-Substitute
Here's the star of the show: Breloom. There were several battles where she swept the entire team by herself, even without Baton Passing a speed boost or running Bulk Up. She might have a good number of weaknesses and low Speed/Defenses, but she also has a good number of resistances to incredibly common attack types. The EVs are for 161 HP, with the rest of the extra EVs being put into Defense (to make switching her into neutral attacks a little easier).
Facade gets the nod over Seed Bomb due to better damage and better neutral coverage. Since she doesn't need to set up at all with this setup, being forced to switch against Ghosts is only a very small concern. Leech Seed and Mach Punch were both considered but didn't make the cut (Leech Seed can't kill Leftovers users and Mach Punch is too weak). Focus Punch is strong, but I can't stress enough the importance of having a Substitute up when facing the next opponent.
I fell in love with Protect on leads when I was running Baton Pass Ninjask. It almost always tells you what set the opponent is using, which makes switching so much easier. It is especially potent on Breloom, though, since it allows you to guarantee Toxic Orb's activation and can be used for a free turn of healing later in the match. I also won one match only because I could alternate between Protect and Substitute every turn while the foe's Toxic Orb killed it off.
Substitute and Spore should be self-explanatory. Having a not-quite-guaranteed win against anything with less than 134 Speed makes winning much easier, and Substitute also makes for a huge quality of life improvement.
Heatran @ Life Orb
Ability: Flash Fire
IVs: 30 SpA
EVs: 28 HP / 252 SpA / 228 Spe
Nature: Timid
-Flamethrower
-Earth Power
-Dark Pulse
-Hidden Power (70 Power, Electric)
This is a fairly straightforward build. Heatran plays incredibly well with Breloom, since they resist every type (except for Fighting) between the two of them. 138 Speed is a somewhat arbitrary choice, but it outspeeds the fairly large group of Pokemon with 137 Speed. The only Pokemon that Heatran can outspeed by being any faster are Raticate 2, Absol 1 and 3, and Kingler 2 - a bit of a waste of EVs, in my opinion.
Flamethrower over Fire Blast for accuracy concerns. Dark Pulse was added last (replacing Dragon Pulse), mostly due to the fact that Breloom and Starmie don't like Ghosts and I didn't really have anything to take out Psychics with. I've thought about switching Hidden Power for Dragon Pulse, but it helps out too much in a number of matchups, while Dragon Pulse is really only amazing for Lati@s and Kingdra.
Starmie @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Nature: Timid
-Surf
-Ice Beam
-Thunderbolt
-Recover
Starmie plays well with Breloom/Heatran, since they share no weaknesses, they all have numerous resistances, and Starmie resists the only type that Breloom/Heatran don't: Fighting. Starmie and Breloom can both get hit by status attacks without worrying too much (and Heatran is immune to Toxic), which is another nice aspect to the team.
I would rather spend EVs on defenses instead of speed, but it's really unavoidable. Starmie needs them in order to match the speed of Starmie 1 and 2, since Starmie tends to kill off Breloom/Heatran fairly easily.
I don't particularly like both of my coverage sweepers being Special oriented, which is why I originally ran Gyarados instead. Starmie's speed and better movepool seem to make it the better overall choice, though.
Attacks are incredibly straightforward, though I need to remember to switch Recover for Psychic.
Breloom @ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
EVs: 204 HP / 52 Def / 252 Spe
Nature: Jolly
-Facade
-Protect
-Spore
-Substitute
Here's the star of the show: Breloom. There were several battles where she swept the entire team by herself, even without Baton Passing a speed boost or running Bulk Up. She might have a good number of weaknesses and low Speed/Defenses, but she also has a good number of resistances to incredibly common attack types. The EVs are for 161 HP, with the rest of the extra EVs being put into Defense (to make switching her into neutral attacks a little easier).
Facade gets the nod over Seed Bomb due to better damage and better neutral coverage. Since she doesn't need to set up at all with this setup, being forced to switch against Ghosts is only a very small concern. Leech Seed and Mach Punch were both considered but didn't make the cut (Leech Seed can't kill Leftovers users and Mach Punch is too weak). Focus Punch is strong, but I can't stress enough the importance of having a Substitute up when facing the next opponent.
I fell in love with Protect on leads when I was running Baton Pass Ninjask. It almost always tells you what set the opponent is using, which makes switching so much easier. It is especially potent on Breloom, though, since it allows you to guarantee Toxic Orb's activation and can be used for a free turn of healing later in the match. I also won one match only because I could alternate between Protect and Substitute every turn while the foe's Toxic Orb killed it off.
Substitute and Spore should be self-explanatory. Having a not-quite-guaranteed win against anything with less than 134 Speed makes winning much easier, and Substitute also makes for a huge quality of life improvement.
Heatran @ Life Orb
Ability: Flash Fire
IVs: 30 SpA
EVs: 28 HP / 252 SpA / 228 Spe
Nature: Timid
-Flamethrower
-Earth Power
-Dark Pulse
-Hidden Power (70 Power, Electric)
This is a fairly straightforward build. Heatran plays incredibly well with Breloom, since they resist every type (except for Fighting) between the two of them. 138 Speed is a somewhat arbitrary choice, but it outspeeds the fairly large group of Pokemon with 137 Speed. The only Pokemon that Heatran can outspeed by being any faster are Raticate 2, Absol 1 and 3, and Kingler 2 - a bit of a waste of EVs, in my opinion.
Flamethrower over Fire Blast for accuracy concerns. Dark Pulse was added last (replacing Dragon Pulse), mostly due to the fact that Breloom and Starmie don't like Ghosts and I didn't really have anything to take out Psychics with. I've thought about switching Hidden Power for Dragon Pulse, but it helps out too much in a number of matchups, while Dragon Pulse is really only amazing for Lati@s and Kingdra.
Starmie @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Nature: Timid
-Surf
-Ice Beam
-Thunderbolt
-Recover
Starmie plays well with Breloom/Heatran, since they share no weaknesses, they all have numerous resistances, and Starmie resists the only type that Breloom/Heatran don't: Fighting. Starmie and Breloom can both get hit by status attacks without worrying too much (and Heatran is immune to Toxic), which is another nice aspect to the team.
I would rather spend EVs on defenses instead of speed, but it's really unavoidable. Starmie needs them in order to match the speed of Starmie 1 and 2, since Starmie tends to kill off Breloom/Heatran fairly easily.
I don't particularly like both of my coverage sweepers being Special oriented, which is why I originally ran Gyarados instead. Starmie's speed and better movepool seem to make it the better overall choice, though.
Attacks are incredibly straightforward, though I need to remember to switch Recover for Psychic.
When used properly that thing is hilariously bulky :D
Still working on a higher Factory Streak