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Platinum/HG/SS Battle Frontier and DP Battle Tower Records

Discussion in 'Smogon's Greatest Hits' started by Peterko, Apr 4, 2009.

  1. Nickm65

    Nickm65

    Joined:
    May 26, 2010
    Messages:
    8

    Good luck with that! =D. In all seriousness it should be SO easy for you to beat my record considering my streak was just a boatload of hax redirected at the frontier lol.
  2. Team Rocket Elite

    Team Rocket Elite Data Integration Thought Entity
    is a Pokemon Researcher

    Joined:
    May 3, 2005
    Messages:
    1,006
    With Battle Factory out of the way, here's another record:

    Bronzong @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Heatproof
    Nature: Brave (+Atk, -Speed)
    EVs: 252 HP, 252 Atk, 6 Sp.Def
    -Trick Room
    -Iron Head
    -Earthquake
    -Explosion

    Lv2 Togekiss @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Serene Grace
    Nature: Naughty (+Atk, -SpDef)
    EVs: ~50 Vitamins for Happiness in not-HP
    -Protect
    -Endeavor
    -Follow Me
    -Foresight

    Snorlax @ Life Orb
    Trait: Thick Fat
    Nature: Brave (+Atk, -Speed)
    EVs: 100 HP, 252 Atk, 160 Def
    -Double-Edge
    -Crunch
    -Earthquake
    -Selfdestruct

    These 3 remain unchanged.

    Dusknoir @ Iron Ball
    Trait: Pressure
    Nature: Relaxed (+Def, -Spd)
    EVs: 252 HP, 120 Def, 136 Sp. Def
    -Gravity
    -Night Shade
    -Protect
    -Sucker Punch

    Dusknoir on the other hand now runs Gravity, but at a cost. It lost Will-o-wisp and Leftovers, which causes it to lose out in 1 vs 1 situations a lot more. Fortunately, Gravity makes them happen a lot less often.

    The deal here is to use Gravity to remove the chances of missing with Explosion or SelfDestruct by the various forms of evade hax the CPU can try. Gravity cuts out all the BrightPowder/Lax Incense/Snow Cloak/Sand Veil/Double Team hax the CPU has, allowing me to go with trigger happy explosions when Togekiss leaves play. The Iron Ball is required since Dusknoir needs to move before Bronzong/Snorlax to get off the Gravity. Now if only I could remove the threat of OHKOs and Quick Claws.

    I was playing this whole run on a trip so I didn't have access to any lists or damage calculators. Thus the whole run was done with what I had memorized of the Battle Frontier Pokemon, and what I had loosely memorized from some notes of damage calculations I made for myself a while back that tells me what Pokemon are guaranteed to be taken out by an Explosion/SelfDestruct which goes as follows:

    100% chance KO with Bronzong Explosion 75% (152 Atk, 375 power)
    Abomasnow 1,3,4
    Absol
    Alakazam
    Altaria
    Ambipom
    Ampharos
    Arcanine
    Articuno 1,4
    Blastoise 4 (IV 21)
    Blaziken
    Blissey
    Breloom 2,3,4
    Charizard
    Claydol
    Crobat
    Dewgong 1,2,4
    Dragonite 1,4
    Drapion 3,4
    Drifblim (Requires Forsight)
    Dugtrio
    Electivire
    Electrode 1,2,3
    Entei
    Espeon
    Exeggutor 1,2,4
    Exploud
    Flareon
    Floatzel
    Flygon
    Froslass (Requires Forsight)
    Gallade
    Garchomp 1,2,4
    Gardevoir
    Gastrodon 2,3,4
    Gengar (Requires Forsight)
    Glaceon 1,2
    Glaceon 4 (IV 21)
    Glalie
    Golduck
    Granbull
    Hariyama
    Heracross
    Honchkrow
    Houndoom 3,4
    Hypno
    Infernape
    Jolteon 2,3,4
    Jynx
    Kangaskhan
    Kingdra
    Kingler
    Lanturn
    Latias
    Latios
    Leafeon 1,2
    Lopunny
    Ludicolo 1,3,4
    Luxray
    Machamp 1,3,4
    Magmortar
    Mamoswine 4 (IV 21)
    Manectric
    Marowak 4 (IV 21)
    Medicham
    Meganium 4 (IV 21)
    Milotic 1,3,4
    Miltank 2,4
    Mismagius 1,2,3 (Requires Forsight)
    Moltres 1,3,4
    Mr. Mime
    Muk
    Nidoking 2,3,4
    Nidoqueen
    Ninetales
    Pinsir
    Politoed
    Poliwrath 4 (IV 21)
    Porygon2
    Porygon-Z
    Quagsire 1,3,4
    Raichu
    Raikou
    Rapidash
    Regice 1,4
    Roserade
    Sceptile
    Shiftry
    Skuntank
    Slowking 2,3,3
    Snorlax 2,3
    Staraptor 4 (IV 21)
    Starmie
    Tauros
    Tentacruel 1,2,4
    Togekiss 1,3,4
    Toxicroak
    Typhlosion
    Ursaring 2,3,4
    Vaporeon
    Venusaur 1,3,4
    Vespiquen 4 (IV 21)
    Victreebel
    Vileplume 1,3,4
    Wailord 1,3,4
    Weavile 1,2,4
    Weezing 3
    Whiscash
    Yanmega
    Zapdos

    100% chance KO with Bronzong Explosion 100% (152 Atk, 500 power)

    Abomasnow 2
    Aerodactyl
    Arcanine (if Intimidated)
    Articuno 2,3
    Blastoise
    Dewgong 3
    Donphan 2,3,4
    Dragonite 2,3
    Drapion 1,2
    Dusknoir (Requires Forsight)
    Feraligatr
    Glaceon 4
    Gliscor 1,2,4
    Granbull (if Intimidated)
    Gyarados
    Hippowdon 3,4
    Lapras
    Leafeon 3.4
    Lickilicky
    Lucario
    Ludicolo 2
    Luxray (if Intimidated)
    Mamoswine
    Marowak
    Meganium
    Miltank 3
    Moltres 2
    Nidoking 1
    Poliwrath
    Quagsire 2
    Regice 3
    Regigigas 3,4
    Rampardos 4
    Salamence
    Slaking 3
    Slowbro 2,3,4
    Slowking 1
    Snorlax 1,4
    Staraptor
    Suicune 2,4
    Swampert
    Tauros (if Intimidated)
    Togekiss 2
    Torterra
    Umbreon 1
    Venusaur 2
    Vespiquen
    Vileplume 2
    Wailord 2
    Walrein
    Weezing 1,2,4

    100% chance KO with Snorlax Selfdestruct 75% (178 Atk, 300 power STAB + Life Orb)

    Armaldo 1,2
    Cresselia
    Donphan 1
    Empoleon
    Hippowdon 1,2
    Lapras 2
    Milotic 2
    Miltank 1
    Rampardos 1,2,3
    Regice 2
    Regigigas 1,2
    Scizor 2,3
    Slaking 2,4
    Slowbro 1
    Suicune 3
    Tangrowth
    Umbreon 2,3,4

    100% chance KO with Snorlax Selfdestruct 100% (178 Atk, 400 power STAB + Life Orb)

    Armaldo 3,4
    Bronzong
    Cradily 3,4
    Heatran 1,2,3
    Magnezone 3,4
    Scizor 1,4
    Slaking 1
    Tyranitar 1,2


    Not Killable with 100% Snorlax Selfdestruct
    Aggron
    Bronzong 1 (15/16 chance KO)
    Bastiodon
    Cradily 1,2 (11/16 chance KO)
    Forretress (7/16 chance KO)
    Golem 1 (survives with 25HP at most)
    Golem 2,3,4 (9/16 chance KO)
    Magnezone 1,2 (15/16 chance KO)
    Metagross (9/16 chance KO)
    Probopass
    Regirock 1 (Survives with 61 HP at most, 60.6~71.6%)
    Regirock 2,3 (Survives with 69 HP at most, 63.1~74.9%)
    Regirock 4 (Survives with 37 HP at most, 76~90%)
    Registeel 1,3 (Survives with 34 HP at most, 81.2~96.3%)
    Registeel 2,4 (Survives with 30 HP at most, 77.2~91.5%)
    Rhydon 1,2 (Survives with 28HP at most, 84.4~99.4%)
    Rhydon 3,4 (1/4 chance KO)
    Rhyperior 1,2 (survives with 46HP at most, 75.8~88.9%)
    Rhyperior 3 (Survives with 92 HP at most)
    Rhyperior 4 (Survives with 48 HP at most, 78.4~91.9%)
    Shuckle 1,3 (Survives with 28 HP at most, 75.9~89.7%)
    Shuckle 2,4 (Survives with 19 HP at most, 83.6~98.3%)
    Skarmory 1,3 (5/16 chance KO)
    Skarmory 2 (3/8 chance KO)
    Skarmory 4 (13/16 chance KO)
    Steelix 1,3 (Survives with 56 HP at most, 62.7~74%)
    Steelix 2,4 (Survives with 47 HP at most, 68.7~81.3%)
    Tyranitar 3 (1/2 chance KO)
    Tyranitar 4 (13/16 chance KO)

    Things that Have Focus Sash
    -Aggron 4
    -Bastiodon 4
    -Breloom 1
    -Electrode 4
    -Exeggutor 3
    -Garchomp 3
    -Gastrodon 1
    -Glaceon 3
    -Gliscor 3
    -Heatran 4
    -Houndoom 1,2
    -Jolteon 1
    -Machamp 2
    -Mismagius 4
    -Rhydon 2
    -Rhyperior 3
    -Suicune 1
    -Tentacruel 3
    -Ursaring 1
    -Weavile 3

    My loss was against a Pokefan leading with Abomasnow 4 and Empoleon 4. Empoleon manages to go on a Quick Claw rampage KOing Togekiss before it got to use Endeavor, and Bronzong with a Torrent Hydro Cannon. I could have salvaged the battle, but misjudged how much damage Double-Edge did to the Golduck that came after. I thought it would OHKO easily, but it's actually a 50/50 chance. Golduck survived the attack, and both the opponent's Pokemon focused on Snorlax (who was at full HP before Double-Edge) instead of my Dusknoir at half health who used Protect. It became a 3 vs 1 and there was no way to win. Their last was Armaldo 4. I sort of panicked in the end and that costed me, since I could pretty much feel the Quick Claw spam coming from that Empoleon at the time.

    SoulSilver Double Battle Tower
    Team Rocket Elite (955) - Bronzong, Togekiss, Dusknoir, Snorlax
    http://members.shaw.ca/teamrocketelite/TREBattleFrontier955.JPG

    I was about 2 hours of gameplay off the 4 digits mark record mark, which would have made this picture way more awesome. But the run could have easily ended at a much lower number as there were a number of close calls in the run. I could have died when I wasn't paying attention and explosion missed against Walrein 3, and I had to stall out OHKOs. It's a bit unsettling when you see the "Dusknoir protected itself" message when they use OHKOs since that means that they would have hit you with it if you didn't block. Another time my opponent started with Rampardos 4 and Aerodactyl 1 which would have ended me if I got flinched. Or Tyranitar 1 and Aerodactyl 1 with Bronzong losing over half its health to Rock Slides before getting off Trick Room. Or that time a Golem Critical'd Snorlax, then tried to finish Dusknoir with a Quick Claw Stone Edge. The list goes on.

    I didn't record any battle vids this time, as I could have only recorded one during the trip, and was in a slight state of shock and forgot to save my loss battle. It's a bit difficult to say if I'll be able to get another run in before 5th Gen release in Japan. If I get a chance, I'll probably be replacing Crunch on Snorlax for either Seed Bomb or Superpower.
  3. Little Green Yoda

    Little Green Yoda

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2005
    Messages:
    2,458
    TRE, you never fail to impress. Awesome streak; love the pic with your team surrounding the DS.

    Been trying to get another doubles streak going myself but I keep losing to horrible hax (Sand Veil activating twice with two crit Outrages in between, OHKO/OHKO/OHKO/OHKO, etc.) or just dumb mistakes by me. The worst part of getting a decent sized streak is how worthless future streaks feel if you don't surpass your personal best.
  4. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,072
    Lol, wow, TRE, that's amazing! Good job! :D Nuts!

    I'm not sure if you thought about this yet, but the first thing I thought of when you mentioned your reason for using Iron Ball on Dusknoir was... Have you considered using Dusclops instead of Dusknoir? Losing 5 base for HP, Def, and Sp Def is... of course going to be at least a bit noticeable, but having 25 base speed instead of 45 will allow Dusclops to be slower than Snorlax/Bronzong without the use of Iron Ball.

    I haven't done any calcs (nor did I really plan to lol), but yah, that was just what I thought.

    EDIT: O yeah, and of course, there's the much lower attacking power of Sucker Punch that I totally forgot about.
  5. HiddenDragon72

    HiddenDragon72

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2009
    Messages:
    75
    It makes sense that to get records in BT castle etc like Jumpman's or Peterko's you would have to put in a lot of time but after looking through this forum i can't help think its not that simple.

    My question is was the intense amount of time used to achieve those records really used to get that high or to actually learn the ins and outs of the BT castle etc?

    To me I can't help notice how many people have tried out top caliber teams only to see a few actually getting a prestigious record (this is not to be read as spite but as an observation). Now considering how much of a hax frontier can be I also can't help think it may also have to do with how much time you play going though rounds. Not just do 7 or 14 then take a break but i mean going though leaps and bounds at a time even after facing continuous loss. I just want to confirm if my suspicions apply to the frontier
  6. MazeL

    MazeL

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2010
    Messages:
    42
    Can someone tell me how my CurseLax stayed frozen for 17 turns?
  7. ungulateman

    ungulateman

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2009
    Messages:
    1,120
    It's a random chance to unfreeze.

    Also, sucks to be you. I've had long freezes, but nothing that absurd.
  8. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,072
    I had 15 before in Battle Factory using the leftovers DT Aqua Ring Milotic. I still remember it was pretty funny, because it got frozen while fully set up (Aqua Ring +6 Evasion ... or at least nearly), and then opponent (2nd pokemon) fainted from Toxic 2 turns later, and the last pokemon failed to KO Milotic after 13 more turns of freeze.
  9. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
    is a Researcher Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2005
    Messages:
    1,070
    everyone who played a curselax or setup registeel before, experienced 10+ turn freezes...defrost % is 20 if I remember correctly...well, the number is based on my test results from some years ago


    guys who play doubles a lot, have you noticed that the AI has changed?

    I think I remember that in DP the foe wouldn´t use quake, unless his partner was flying/levitating, but now in soulsilver they just spam quakes and surf like it´s everyday business...maybe I´m wrong, because I haven´t played that much doubles in plat./HG/SS

    HiddenDragon72 I´m not sure what answer you seek

    you definitely have to put a lot of time into streaks, but everyone is different in their approach/learning process...as for me, I do a lot of theorymon (when I say a lot I mean a lot), but the best way for me to get the best out of a team is just to use it in actual battles

    learning by losing is not very logical when you account for the time you spend on a streak, but next time I instantly know something is dangerous and it becomes kind of an automatic process over time...when you play really long streaks, it gets repetitive and you may lose focus, which is not optimal, but you have to be able to identify the threats and my past losses/negative near loss situtations against a particular trainer/pokémon alarm me, most of the time

    also when I lose I try to lower the chance of that happening again as much as possible, even if it means pure theorymon for a few days or a week...

    with latias, on my 696 run I checked each lead on my printed version of the list (was part of the learning phase) and highlighted its move against my latias, which also helped me figure out the AI...I had to learn when and how to use registeel, because that really isn´t easy and how and when to use garchomp...and after 3500+ battles with the team I know most of the tower ins and outs (related to this particular team)

    achieving a high streak is not that easy, because you have to play perfect and not give a helping hand to the hax waiting behind the corner (the BT doesn´t need your help to get you), you have to be lucky as well, it´s pokémon, afterall and no team is unbeatable

    even the leading teams can´t do jack if a rhydon decides to go on a rampage with QC+drill, for example


    oh, I almost forgot, TRE you´re a hero, sorry that your streak ended so close before 1000, you definitely deserve a doubles 1K+
  10. Tombstoner

    Tombstoner

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2010
    Messages:
    659
    Anybody ever thought of this?
    [​IMG] @ Chople Berry
    Ability: Adaptability
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    - Nasty Plot
    - Substitute
    - Tri Attack
    - Thunderbolt
    I don't yet see what's wrong with this (besides the Defenses, which quick setup stuff can sacrifice, I think.) Chople Berry helps cover its one weakness, Nasty Plot raises its already impressive Special Attack to even higher levels, Tri Attack is incredibly strong when boosted by Adaptability, and Thunderbolt hits Rock-types, Steel-types, and Ghost-types for neutral damage. Thoughts?
  11. ungulateman

    ungulateman

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2009
    Messages:
    1,120
    A Lum Berry would probably be more useful than a Chople, you aren't setting up on any Fighting-type moves anyway.

    It's been used before, it's just not very tough.
  12. HiddenDragon72

    HiddenDragon72

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2009
    Messages:
    75
    Lum Berry is an idea, don't know if its the best but I don't think you need to worry too much about setting up for fighting types as speed and P-Z's strong SpA should cover you.

    Peterko: thanks, i got what i wanted to know from what you said and a few extra things. I didn't think too much about those blaring warnings you get against certain pkmn. Looking back a lot of my losses were b/c i didn't think too much about it. Big mistake i know.

    It never occurred to me to develop it as an automatic response though or to actually consider when to use pokeB or pokeC. who i choose would depend on which move was locked but thinking about it that could be dangerous. I still have a few more questions but I think i'll tinker with the BT and to reconfirm what i should ask.

    Btw is it natural to suddenly want to go from 100 streak to 1000 streak after reading these forums after a while?
  13. Tombstoner

    Tombstoner

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2010
    Messages:
    659
    I think I will use Lum Berry, to keep it going. Thanks, both of you, for that idea.

    As for the second part I quoted, I certainly do want to reach 1000, but I know it's much tougher than it seems after seeing how few people have done it.
  14. Kamisutra

    Kamisutra

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2009
    Messages:
    31
    I just ended my win streak at the Battle Factory(single, Level 50) with 51 wins Pokemon Heart Gold. Lost battle 52:

    Photo proof: http://img185.imageshack.us/img185/4950/1000254q.jpg

    I saved two battle videos from the streak(my in-game name is Iocus so don't get confused)

    The Gold print battle versus Thorton: 23-05957-98901
    The 52nd battle which I lost: 56-38280-21231

    War story:

    I guess I'll start at battle 29 since that's when things start getting tough. My intial choices were relatively good and I made a team consisting of:

    748 | Milotic | Calm | Wide Lens | Hydro Pump | Blizzard | Mirror Coat | Recover |
    500 | Marowak | Adamant | Thick Club | Bone Rush | Fire Punch | ThunderPunch | Rock Slide |
    697 | Ursaring | Adamant | Toxic Orb | Facade | Superpower | Crunch | Protect | (with guts)

    The first battle(29) went well and featured my favorite Forretress with whom I replaced Ursaring.

    372 | Forretress | Brave | Occa Berry | Gyro Ball | Bug Bite | Revenge | Counter |

    So with Milotic, Marowak and Forretress I had a well balanced team that covered each other's weaknesses. With that battles 30-35 went rather smooth, I had some close calls, but all in all it went good. This was mostly due to Milotic attacks not missing a single time, so I was lucky too.

    The battles 35-42 on the other hand were a nightmare. My initial choices featured no less than 4 Fire Pokemon, so I decided to take the one Fire Pokemon with the best movepool and the two other choices that weren't Fire type to build this team:

    834 | Houndoom | Timid | White Herb | Overheat | Dark Pulse | SolarBeam | Sunny Day |
    824 | Poliwrath | Adamant | Expert Belt | Waterfall | Focus Punch | Earthquake | Hypnosis |
    649 | Vespiquen | Adamant | Muscle Band | X-Scissor | Aerial Ace | Pursuit | U-turn |

    With this very shaky team, which has an obvious weakness to fast Electric types, I proceeded to have 4 battles which were extremely close calls, especially the one where my Houndoom battled Jolteon 589 and managed to get paralized and tank a Dig and still win it in the end. Anyway battle 4 of that round(39) featured a Gallade with whom I replaced my Vespiquen:

    584 | Gallade | Jolly | Brightpowder | Drain Punch | Fire Punch | ThunderPunch | Ice Punch |

    With Houndoom, Poliwrath, and Gallade I managed to win battles 40-42, though battle 42, in which I had a 3-1 lead only for Steelix 847 to go on a Quick Claw activation rampage with an EQ critical hit on my Poliwrath, was by far the closest call battle I had, before my eventual loss. Luckily Gallade's Drain Punch saved me at that point.

    Now my initial choices prior to battle 43 were absolutely fantastic. So fantastic in fact, that I had trouble deciding who to pick. Eventually I went with:

    880 | Gyarados | Adamant | Chesto Berry | Waterfall | Earthquake | Rest | Dragon Dance |
    921 | Cresselia | Bold | Lum Berry | Psychic | Toxic | Double Team | Moonlight |
    833 | Ursaring | Adamant | Quick Claw | Return | Cross Chop | Earthquake | Aerial Ace |

    Cresselia absolutely dominated the first battle, and with a few Double Teams and Moonlights defeated the fantastic Garchomp 893, whom I quickly replaced Ursaring with. Since it covered not only Gyarados' Electric weakness but also covered for Steel types Cresselia couldn't poison:

    893 | Garchomp | Adamant | Persim Berry | Outrage | Earthquake | Crunch | Fire Fang |

    So with Gyarados, Cresslia and Garchomp the battles up till Thorton went like a breeze I only had one 2-0 victory, all the rest ended 3-0.

    The battle versus Thorton is featured in the first battle video I posted, but I guess I'll comment on it, since it looks far easier than it was in my head.

    Thorton opens with Weavile which gets Intimidated, it uses Night Slash while my Gyarados Dragon Dances, I figure the Weavile can't be number 712 since if it was, knowing Thorton, he would have used Counter on the first turn. So I use my math "skills" and come to the conclusion that my Gyarados now has a speed stat of 198 after one DD, so I figure I shouldn't DD again to not "risk" a critical hit from Night Slash or a freeze from Ice Punch since my Gyarados should outspeed any Factory Weavile, so I order Waterfall. Only that I'm an idiot who forgets to take IVs into account. Turns out Weavile still outspeeds my Gyarados and this time it hits with an Ice Punch, luckily no freeze nor critical hit happens and Gyarados takes out Weavile with Waterfall. Next, Thorton sends out Magnezone, I'm filled with glee as I order my Gyarados to EQ it. Magnezone goes down and out comes Aerodactyl. And now I'm pissed that I didn't set up a second Dragon Dance against Weavile, since if it is Aerodactyl 579, he could with some flinch hax on Cresselia still turn this battle around. Still I come to the conclusion that it's most likely an Adamant Aerodactyl since if it were Jolly, Thorton would have sent it out before Magnezone. So I order a Waterfall, and indeed Gyarados outspeeds the Aerodactyl and KOs it for a 3-0 win.

    So now I finally have a Gold Print. I quickly upload the Battle video via Wi-Fi and decide to continue my streak, which in hindsight was a big mistake, since I was far too excited and tired to think clearly.

    My choices prior to battle 50 were relatively average, neither bad nor good. I picked:

    423 | Scizor | Impish | Brightpowder | X-Scissor | Bullet Punch | Swords Dance | Baton Pass |
    531 | Golem | Adamant | White Herb | Earthquake | Superpower | Fire Punch | ThunderPunch |
    730 | Glaceon | Modest | Focus Sash | Blizzard | Hyper Beam | Hail | Mirror Coat |

    Battles 50 and 51 went rather easy and I didn't make any trades. I pondered taking Slaking 622, but decided against it, since I'm not very comfortable using Slaking and really dislike that Pokemon, in retrospect I probably should've made the trade.

    Anyway battle 52 is posted as a Battle Video. It's pretty embarrasing to look at, but I guess I'll explain what happened since it'll just look awkward otherwise.

    Opponent opens with Gengar. I figure that in 3 out of 4 cases setting up a Swords Dance is the right thing to do. Sadly it's the most dangerous Gengar 827, it Thunderbolts and brings my Scizor below 50%, after the SD, I order Bullet Punch on next turn, sadly Scizor has Swarm and not Technician so it only brings Gengar's HP bar to red, but doesn't kill it. Second Thunderbolt brings Scizor down. I send out Glaceon. I know that Gengar has Destiny Bond so I order Mirror Coat to be covered in case it uses Destiny Bond. And indeed it does, due to Mirror Coat it fails. I'm not sure how the AI behaves after the first Destiny Bond fails, so I order another Mirror Coat in case it switches to Shadow Ball or Sludge Bomb, it doesn't, and Gengar does another Destiny Bond. So now I'm sure it'll continue to use DB until it's PP goes out, so I order Hail to give Gengar indirect damage and to activate Snow Cloak. Gengar continues to use Destiny Bond till it's PP goes out, while I stick to Mirror Coat. The Hail does not take out Gengar before it's PP goes out, so once it can no longer use Destiny Bond it switches to Sludge Bomb, but misses due to to Snow Cloak, Hail takes it down right afterwards. Opponent sends out Claydol against my, still at full HP, Glaceon. Its Psychic hits and does quite a bit of damage, my Glaceon does Blizzard which due to Hail has 100% accuracy and takes out Claydol. In comes opponents last Pokemon, Glalie. Hail ends. I look at Snapper's Battle Frontier Pokemon Search, and order Hyper Beam... only that due to not looking at the screen I misclick and click on Mirror Coat(great moment nespa?). Glalie uses Hail, so it's Glalie 798, my Glaceon uses Mirror Coat and I throw curse words since I only now realize I have misclicked. This time I make sure to click Hyper Beam, but Glalie will have none of that as it uses Sheer Cold which hits. At this point I knew I had lost. I send out Golem which dies due to 100% accurate Blizzard. Thus my streak ends at 51 wins.

    I guess I could complain about the "hax" of a Sheer Cold hitting on first try when Snow Cloak is active. But honestly, I totally deserved that loss for:
    1. Not looking at the screen when picking an attack.
    2. Not having taken a break after winning the Gold Print
    3. Not having traded Golem for Slaking due to some dumb prejudice.
    4. Having had a ridiciously powerful team in battles 42-49.

    Besides I'm not doing damage calculations, when playing Factory so I'm not 100% sure if Hyper Beam would've take Glalie down(though I'm inclined to think it would), nor if it would've hit, since that particular Glalie holds Lax Incense.

    So yeah, in spite of a dumb loss. I'm still very proud of this streak and of finally obtaining the hardest to obtain Gold Print in the history of Pokemon Games.
  15. HiddenDragon72

    HiddenDragon72

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2009
    Messages:
    75
    Congrats on the Gold Print, on Lvl 50 no less. At least we know it isn't impossible at lvl 50
  16. Hutch3

    Hutch3

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2009
    Messages:
    285
    Question about trading and the battle factory. I read that guide about trading and how it works but I didn't quite understand. Is it the more you trade the better the pokemon you get to choose from at the start of the next set or the less you trade the better the pokemon are? (referring to IV's here)
  17. Little Green Yoda

    Little Green Yoda

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2005
    Messages:
    2,458
    Haven't played doubles in DP (probably should though) but HG/SS trainers do indeed use moves that will damage their own Pokemon. I'm not sure I'd call it spamming since it doesn't happen all that often. Seems like most of the time when EQ/Surf/etc. are used, the partner is immune. Then again, I don't keep track of all the times where EQ/Surf/etc. could have been spammed but weren't used.

    The more trades, the better Pokemon.
  18. VaporeonIce

    VaporeonIce

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2010
    Messages:
    295
    Wow, way to go, Kamisutra. Don't worry, that Glalie is one of the bitchiest Pokemon in the Factory...knowing it, Hyper Beam would have missed if you'd used it.

    I'm incredibly biased against slow, powerful Pokemon like Golem and Ursaring in the Factory; when everything and its mother outspeeds them and uses attacking moves of four different types (one of which they're bound to be weak to, particularly Golem), I just don't see them as viable. Obviously, slow Pokemon with good bulk, ton of resistances, and very few weaknesses (Magnezone, Forretress, Snorlax) are a different story. But given my attempts at using slow Pokemon with relatively poor defenses (even if it's just physical or special defense), I have to say, I'm pretty impressed that you did so well taking those Pokemon.
  19. VaporeonIce

    VaporeonIce

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2010
    Messages:
    295
    I failed to make the leaderboard by one battle, but nevertheless here's my latest result: a streak of 117 in the HeartGold Singles Battle Tower.

    My team:

    Jumpluff (Hurrah!)
    Jolly
    IVs: Who cares?/31 in speed
    EVs: 252 HP, 252 Speed, 4 Def (maybe SpDef, I don't remember)
    Item: Focus Sash
    Moveset:
    ~Protect
    ~Encore
    ~Memento
    ~Toxic

    Suicune (Aquamarine)
    Nature: Bold
    IVs: 7, x, 23, 22, 30, 25
    EVs: 252 HP, 252 Def, 4 SpA
    Item: Leftovers
    Moveset:
    ~Surf
    ~Substitute
    ~Calm Mind
    ~Rest

    Garchomp (Dagger)
    Nature: Jolly
    IVs: 28, 31, 28, x, 12, 31
    EVs: 12 HP, 248 Atk, 248 Speed
    Item: Lum Berry
    Moveset:
    ~Substitute
    ~Swords Dance
    ~Dragon Claw
    ~Earthquake

    The team strategy is fairly obvious; I almost always Protect on the first turn, Encore on the second, hang on with Focus Sash, Memento on the third, then switch in whatever takes the Encored hit best and set up. If the opponent uses a setup move besides Dragon Dance, I hit with Toxic and use Encore to keep them on the setup move until they faint, then use the strategy on the second Pokemon. If the opponent uses Dragon Dance or is faster, I usually use Memento on the second turn, skipping the Encore turn. Garchomp comes in on status moves, Rock-type moves (almost always Stone Edge), most Fire-type moves, most moves used by Grass-types, and Electric-type moves; Suicune comes in on pretty much everything else. I usually Swords Dance on the first turn with Garchomp and Substitute on the second; the move generally won't break my Sub without a crit, and will usually do under 3/4 damage with a crit, so I'm better off taking the risk of a crit and ending the Encore with a Swords Dance and a Sub intact (assuming the opponent doesn't get 2 crits in a row, and if they do, I'm trying to sweep with a +2 Garchomp, which is usually pretty manageable with Suicune as backup). Suicune will usually Sub on the first turn, since it doesn't like being hit with status.

    My loss was pretty unavoidable; there were other things I could have done, but they gave me worse odds of winning in most cases. The opponent led with Steelix 4. I protected on the first turn while it used Stone Edge, then Encored Stone Edge. On the third turn, Quick Claw activated, and Stone Edge got a KO on Jumpluff. Bad start.

    Without hitting it with Memento, I didn't want to switch Garchomp in to take the next two Stone Edges; I thought I'd probably end up without a Sub, and Garchomp might faint. I switch in Suicune.

    On the first turn in, I use Sub, and Steelix uses its last (two) Stone Edge(s), failing to break the Sub. I use Calm Mind, and Steelix responds with Earthquake, breaking my Sub. That's what I'm expecting; I figure I can stall out Earthquake pretty comfortably, forcing it to use Gyro Ball or Explode, both of which leave me in a fairly good spot (assuming a Sub takes the Explosion). On the next turn, I select Sub again (obviously), but Quick Claw activates, and Steelix Explodes. Suicune faints. Dammit.

    I'm left with a full health Garchomp against a team of set 4s with 21 IVs. I figure the odds aren't too bad. The opponent sends in Aerodactyl. Fuck.

    I read what Aerodactyl has for Set 4, but I guess I don't read it that closely, because I missed Dragon Claw. I figured it would use Earthquake, and after running a quick calc, I see that it does 45-54% damage to Garchomp. Unfortunately, Garchomp doesn't KO with Dragon Claw (barring a crit), so I take my chances and use Swords Dance. Obviously, Aerodactyl uses Dragon Claw. Garchomp lives (barely), sets up Swords Dance, and dies on the next turn. I lose.

    So yeah...not a lot I could have done. Switching in Garchomp after Jumpluff fainted was technically the better move, but I had no way of knowing that; my second Pokemon wasn't supposed to be a sacrifice. If I had to do it again, I MIGHT use Memento on the second turn, anticipating severe hax, but hitting Steelix with Encore and Memento would have given Garchomp a chance to set up a Sub and a Swords Dance, which is probably better than what Suicune would have managed to pull off before Steelix used Explosion. But hey, it was a good run. I'll probably try again later, since this team has a ton of potential. Plus, it uses a freaking Jumpluff, which is the coolest thing about it.

    This team does have a couple of problems. Besides hax, the biggest one is Poliwrath 2 and 4 with Water Absorb, assuming I've set up Suicune instead of Garchomp. Poliwrath 2 can use Bulk Up while Suicune is stuck doing nothing, and Poison Jab has enough PP that I can't stall it out. Poliwrath 4 can keep throwing Focus Punches (though it'll usually use Earthquake first, letting me stall that out before switching Garchomp in and potentially set up when it gives me free turns by using Hypnosis, or get free hits when it tries to use Focus Punch). Lapras 3 with Water Absorb has the same problem, but I've never encountered it; fortunately, Lapras 3 seems to spam Outrage on a fully set-up Suicune, which may allow me to stall it out, thanks to the confusion turns. Clear Body/Hyper Cutter leads can be annoying too; Hyper Cutter hasn't given me problems, but Metagross and Regice 4 can be a pain. Note that it's always better to Memento against BoltBeamers like Regice, even if they have Clear Body; I learned that lesson the hard way when I switched in Jumpluff out after activating its Sash by Encoring Ice Beam, only to have Suicune freeze for four turns before Regice's Encore ended and it killed me with Thunderbolt. Leads that manage to mess me up before I can Memento (by freezing, poisoning, or burning Jumpluff, or by Quick Claw activation on the Memento turn) can give me problems (as Steelix did in my loss), but usually Suicune is so bulky that it can stall out the opponent and win anyway. This team isn't as reliable as (properly used) Trick teams, but I'd say its more reliable than most other teams, and it's a lot of fun. I'll probably try to get a higher streak later, since this team can definitely do it. But I think I'll take a break for now; I've finally broken 100, and I did it with a team of my own design, so that's something.

    EDIT: Sorry for the double post. I didn't notice I had done it, seeing as how my last post was 3 days ago.
  20. Little Green Yoda

    Little Green Yoda

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2005
    Messages:
    2,458
    Am I missing something or was switching in Garchomp against an Encored Steelix Stone Edge an obvious move? A crit Stone Edge does 27.3% - 32.2% so you could easily take two of them while setting up a Swords Dance.

    Worst case scenario:

    QC crit SE
    Swords Dance

    QC crit SE
    EQ for the KO

    Also, Outrage is almost always a superior choice over Dragon Claw in the Battle Frontier.

    As for Suicune, maybe drop Rest for an second attack? You lose out on stalling ability but it's probably better than a near-automatic loss against certain foes. Get a long enough streak and you're bound to face them sooner or later.
  21. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

    Joined:
    Aug 15, 2008
    Messages:
    1,072
    @VaporeonIce: Whoa!! I never mentioned this before haha, but I actually used a very similar Jumpluff lead last year.

    The only difference is that instead of Toxic, I had Worry Seed, which was fairly useful on things like Yanmega (Speed Boost), Metagross (Clear Body), and for my team Stick Hold users (Gastrodon & Muk) and Mold Breaker (Rampardos, Pinsir). (EDIT: Oh, and Hypercutter pokemon)

    I might as well just make a brief mention of it now. I originally wasn't going to since the streaks weren't that high, lol.

    I had 126 streak with Uxie and 132 streak with Mismagius... probably around 9 or 10 months ago.
    Team was as follows:
    1. Jumpluff / Jolly @ Focus Sash
    EVs: Speed and Defenses (no HP EVs so recoil moves deal less damage to opponent)
    - Protect / Encore / Memento / Worry Seed

    2a. Uxie / Bold @ Choice Scarf
    EVs: Defensive ... ... I think it had the 136 speed for outspeeding Metagross after tricking
    - Trick / Memento / Thunderwave / Flash

    2b Mismagius / Bold @ Choice Scarf
    EVs: Mostly HP, some defense, and I think also 136 speed.
    - Trick / Memento / Thunderwave / Flash (tried Grudge over Flash for a bit, but didn't go so well)

    3. Drapion / Careful @ Leftovers
    EVs: 252 HP 252 Sp Def 4 Def
    - Acuppressure / Substitute / Crunch / Rest

    BASICALLY if I know opponent's lead does not have any attack or special attack boosting moves or any OHKO moves or U-Turn, Memento + Memento = Drapion will be able to set up, even if opponent has earthquake. I don't even need to trick. Tricking only limits number of turns Drapion has to set up.

    If it's a clear body pokemon, then worry seed and then memento. If opponent has a stat upping move, then it's encore first, memento, then trick and twave, memento etc.

    It's been a while, but I think I chose Mismagius over Uxie because of the bug resistance and Horn Drill / Guillotine immunity. So Drapion rarely ever had to take any Signal beams and get confused.

    Obviously anyone having used Drapion before would know that the main issue with this team is that Drapion sometimes will require many turns to get the right stat boosts, and locking opponent into 5 PP moves (or even somethings 10 PP moves) would mean Drapion isn't nearly fully set up and might be vulnerable. IIRC I think that was how I lost.

    LOST:
    647,Whiscash 3,Modest,Zoom Lens,217,88,93,140,91,80,Hydro Pump,Earth Power,Blizzard,Fissure,HP/Sp.Attk
    Yeah, that thing's annoying because of Fissure. If it was just Earth Power, after 2 mementos (and probably some flashes), Drapion would set up no problem, only fearing consecutive sp def drops from earth power, but with fissure there also, it's not that easy.

    What I do is - I switch to Drapion (takes the blizzard) to lure the ground move, and then switch back to Jumpluff and encores the ground move. Chances are, it's Earth Power at first, so then I switch to Mismagius to trick, flash 7 or 8 times (whenever the last Earth Power PP is), trick back, go to Drapion again (takes the Hydro Pump) to lure the fissure, go back to Jumpluff to encore that, and in the next few turns, just switch to Mismagius to memento, back to jumpluff to stall out the fissure PP and then memento, and then Drapion has 8 PP (Blizzard and Hydro Pump, but 2 PP have been used when switching to Drapion.) 8 PP turns + 4 Struggle turns to set up. I remember facing that Whiscash in the 132 streak and managed to get the "good" stat boosts the first time, but then the 2nd time wasn't so lucky, and I don't remember what the 2nd pokemon was, but it had Earthquake that 2HKO'd Drapion.

    EDIT: Actually, if I remember correctly, I *think* it was one of the QC Machamp but don't quote me on that.

    Well, that's that. Oh yeah, other problematic pokemon were recoil moves and life orb which make the opponent lead die too quickly. ... I think the CB Staraptor was a bit problematic. OH yeah, Choice Scarf Rampardos (and the LO one) is definitely a problem. I Need to stall out the Head Smashes, but that also means Drapion can't set up.

    FINAL EDIT: Whoa, I just finished reading your post, VaporeonOnIce (sorry I actually typed this post without reading the last couple paragraphs before)... Maybe you should give Worry Seed a try seeing how you had/might face problems facing Hypercutters and Clear Body pokemon.
  22. VaporeonIce

    VaporeonIce

    Joined:
    Mar 11, 2010
    Messages:
    295
    I'll admit that Stone Edge did less than I thought it did; I thought it would break Garchomp's Sub, and trying to sweep with an unsubbed Garchomp is a pretty bad idea (and wouldn't have helped me in this case, given Aerodactyl's presence). I knew EQ would break my Sub, and here prior experience messed with me; I remembered a Steelix living against a +4 EQ once. What I didn't remember was that that Steelix was carrying a Shuca Berry, which is the equivalent of living through a +1 EQ without a Shuca Berry. So I guess that gives me something different to do next time, though I still could have had problems with Quick Claw.

    A second attack on Suicune completely destroys its stalling potential; you have no idea how many times I've relied on Rest to get a full setup. If I were using Trick, it might make sense (though it would still be a terrible idea against Outrage/Brave Bird), but as is, there are so few situations where another attacking move even helps me that it's just not worth it. Even against Water Absorb Poliwrath and Lapras, I've got a pretty good shot; the AI seems to see a +6 Suicune, read "offensive threat," and spam attacking moves in an attempt to take you out. That generally means that I can stall Lapras out of Outrage or at least leave it confused when Garchomp comes in, giving Garchomp a good chance to set up Swords Dance, so Lapras will usually faint. Poliwrath is pretty much in the same boat; I can stall it out of Earthquake, and while it will still have Waterfall, it will usually try to Hypnosis/Focus Punch, giving me time to set up (as it will usually FP the turn after Hypnosis, regardless of whether it actually put you to sleep). That means that, even if I run into those Pokemon, I have a good chance of beating them with Garchomp, meaning I'm really only at the thread of a loss if they're in the second position; if they're in the first position, Suicune never comes in against them in the first place, and if they're in the third position, I faint them anyway and win the match. Note that, because both Lapras and Poliwrath lack super-effective moves against Suicune (and Suicune resists their Water and Ice STAB), the AI will often send out something else before sending them in, giving me a better shot at winning. And even if they're in the second spot, I have a Garchomp a Swords Dance under its belt to fight off their third Pokemon. So while I don't like fighting against them, I think the odds of them actually ruining my sweep (with the help of some other third Pokemon) before battle 200 are quite low, and 200 is my next goal (though really, 150 would be a good start).

    There have been about a thousand times that I was glad I used Dragon Claw over Outrage. Frequently, I'm only able to set up one Swords Dance; leaving yourself locked into Outrage is practically begging Aggron, Steelix, or Metagross to come in and kill you. I mean, the only move Garchomp would have against Skarmory would be forcing itself into Outrage, and that's against a team that probably has other Steel-types. In learning how to use my team and getting myself to the 100 mark the first time, I probably fought about 300 post-battle 49 battles. There wasn't one of them where I wished I had the extra power Outrage provided, but I was always glad when I could continue my sweep after coming in on an Encored status move that used up my Lum Berry, and picking Dragon Claw against the first Pokemon. Outrage is great if you can pretty much guarantee that you'll get to +6, and that you'll break out of confusion if it only attacks twice. If you're not using any other physical attacks, you're pretty much forced to use Outrage. But if you're trying to sweep with only +2? I'll take the power reduction for the freedom to switch attacks any day, particularly since EQ only has 20 less BP against non-resistant Pokemon (30 if you factor in STAB).
  23. VileTung

    VileTung

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2008
    Messages:
    1,384
    Well I'm trying to do the Battle Hall and yesterday my streak ended at 79, a Magnezone killed me.

    I Outraged then Magnezone used Zap Canon
    I did another Outrage and became confused, the foe used Zap Canon
    While I was confused, It didn't hurt himself and did another Outrage
    The foe used (again) zap canon, and that killed me...

    My Pokémon:

    Garchomp
    Jolly nature - Focus Sash
    IVs: 31/31/31/0/31/31
    EVs: 100 Atk / 100 Speed (I used vitamins, because I'm lazy, but I think that the laziness killed me..., so back to ev-training now)
    Moves: Outrage, Dragon Claw, Stone Edge, Earthquake

    So my question is, do I need to change the Moveset? Becuase magnezone is quite difficult =/
  24. Kamisutra

    Kamisutra

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2009
    Messages:
    31
    Sorry for my lack of replies, but ever since I posted my Factory record I've been busy getting all the other Frontier Gold Prints in Heart Gold which I've been missing(Arcade, Castle, Hall). They were actually very easy to get after how hard Factory was. I saved all Gold Print Battles as Battle Videos, though the fights themselves aren't really exciting to watch:

    Arcade Gold Print in Heart Gold: 82-75163-28422
    Castle Gold Print in Heart Gold: 94-17639-36813
    Hall Gold Print in Heart Gold: 15-28740-47703

    I used the following team for Arcade and Castle:

    | Garchomp | Jolly | Outrage | Earthquake | Swords Dance | Fire Fang | Atk/Spe
    | Starmie | Modest | Surf | Psychic | Thunderbolt | Ice Beam | SpA/Spe(with Natural Cure)
    | Infernape | Jolly | Close Combat | Flare Blitz | U-turn | Stone Edge | Atk/Spe

    In the Battle Hall I used the Garchomp.

    Thank you for the kind words. As can be seen on the photo I've been unable to get a 49 win streak on Open Level, so I guess for me personally level 50 isn't the more difficult mode. But nonetheless I'm very proud of this streak, and I hope it'll be posted in the record section of this thread.
    Thank you very much. It's still a bit of a shame I didn't click that Hyper Beam, since I will forever wonder what would've happened if I did.

    As for using slow Pokemon, well, it's not like I particularly like to use them. But in that streak out of the initial 6 choices most had horrible movepools and that particular Golem had a good movepool and was necessary to have something resistant to Fire attacks, to cover Scizor and Glaceon. In most other cases I probably wouldn't have take it. Also, while I did rent 2 Ursarings during my 51 win streak, I never actually used one, I traded away both before they had the opportunity to enter battle.

    I'm sorrry, if I sound rude, but that story makes no sense. Zap Cannon is an Electric move and should have no effect on a Ground type like Garchomp. Moreover, if you had used Earthquake against Mangezone who is an Electric/Steel type it would have KOd Magnezone with just one hit easily. Magnezone's two abilities are Sturdy and Magnet Pull, it does NOT possess Levitate.

    I definitely do suggest replacing Dragon Claw with Swords Dance though. Having two Dragon type attacks while doing the Battle Hall makes no sense. An attack like Stone Edge which often misses, is also not very prudent for use in the Hall.
  25. UPPERDECKER

    UPPERDECKER

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2010
    Messages:
    251
    what? Garchomp is immune to electric. maybe you're using Salamence?
    you should probably replace dragon claw for fire fang/crunch if it is a Garchomp that you are using.

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