Platinum/HG/SS Battle Frontier and DP Battle Tower Records

Discussion in 'Stark Mountain' started by Peterko, Apr 4, 2009.

  1. Bozo

    Bozo

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    congrats TRE - some great streaks there! you gonna do castle?


    that is a pretty cool strategy, but a lot more luck dependant, since things can wake up quickly, have berries, etc. but yawn's flawless accuracy is awesome - something trick unfortunately does not have (why does trick often miss, yet when you get bright powder their move never misses).

    well, no-one really saw drapion coming - we were all using straightforward stat-up pokemon. so something else might be possible. but probably not, until the 5th gen when something with a no-hax ability shows up.

    thanks man :) and yeah, i still do consider my team/skill to be in a formitive stage. it was not the only thing i "learnt" during that streak, but most of the other things didnt cost me too much - i just thought, man if he had got a certain kind of hax, i would have been screwed.

    twave is a decent idea for yanmega i think - drdimentio also pointed this out to me. i can see the logic.

    and also its not like i ever really "go out of my way" to keep latias alive. most battles go like "latias used trick. lead used ice beam / shadow ball / night slash / dragon claw / signal beam / whatever. registeel comes in and its GG." ie i usually dont "need" to do anything other than trick. i have only twice "needed" latias again, and both times i paralyzed the opponent, hoping this would buy me time for a substitute on salamence (and both times failed, one being my loss, and another being a lucky escape). recover + charm is great for when an opponent uses stone edge - obviously salamence cant come in, and registeel doesnt like setting up on 5pp moves (although i do it sometimes, getting to +5/+5/+4/sub knowing i can get to full strength in the relevant stat in one turn, unless their hp is divisible by 4) and when there is a high CH chance...... so i usually stall with charm and recover (and twave if they are not part ground) and then either retrick, or let it struggle, and take back its scarf and begin on pokemon 2. if the opponent used something very dangerous (such as STAB brave bird or outrage) then i will often sacrifice latias, then go to steel via salamence for the intimidate. if they used an electric move (which is the only type salamence+registeel dont resist between them) i usually just stall it out similar to stone edge. i can see plenty of instances where flash would be great, and even better than recover. but the bottom line is you only get 4 moves, and the instances where recover>flash convince me to keep that, as it is more "reliable" - ive had enough 10+ turn freezes to know that a fully flashed opponent could still hit you multiple times in a row, even when it shouldnt (lol the BF obeying the law of averages).

    EDIT: btw i didnt even realise it was the same as peterko's DP streak!

    no, i definitely appreciate any comments that come my way :) so many thanks to both of you guys.

    i guess i really misunderestimated (i love your previous president's speeches) yanmega. but still, if it didnt have tinted lens, and those moves didnt have a chance to raise all stats, you can see where im going, right? 1) its item didnt increase its attack (nor was it a hax item) 2) it was obviously going to use its STAB move, which wouldnt hurt registeel. 3) when its pp was up, instead of suiciding in a couple of turns, it would just switch to an even weaker move, allowing me to complete the setup. but yeah, tinted lens and the stat-ups mean i made a mistake in that case.

    i usually do normal near the start-middle. basically a lot of those things are really bulky and can do annoying things to you like paralyze (body slam), have an ice move, etc.

    exactly, eg dragon dance on turn 1, then you give it a scarf and watch it outrage you. it could even put you to sleep or something turn one.
  2. Team Rocket Elite

    Team Rocket Elite Data Integration Thought Entity
    is a Pokemon Researcher

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    I considered Salamence for the Battle Hall, but I couldn't really think of a good way to deal with the many Lax Incense/BrightPowder + Blizzard Pokemon that exist in Water and Ice. Weavile, Lapras, Walrein and Slowbro also pose problems.

    In Double Battle Hall, both Aerodactyl will use Sandstorm on turn one against both my Kingdra and Gyarados. I haven't fought Aerodactyl in Single Hall so I'm not sure if they are as obsessed with opening with Sandstorm. In Double Hall, if the opponent Pokemon knew Reflect or Light Screen, frequently both opponents will use it on turn 1. It's not nearly guaranteed like Aerodactyl using Sandstorm, though.

    If my Arcade team looks bad, that's probably because it is. I made it a long time ago and pretty much just slapped together a team from Pokemon I had at the time. My solution to ice teams was choose a panel to burn or paralyze the opponent team. <_< Against lead Weaviles, I think I usually sacrificed Gengar or Garchomp(based on their other 2 Pokemon) and Countered with Blissey. Whenever I get around to doing another Single Arcade run, it'll likely be with a significantly different team.

    As you said, Hall is 99% theorymon. I've run through a couple ideas on paper but nothing I like enough to make a team and do a Single Battle Hall run with.

    Perhaps. I'm also still working on the Battle Factory Gold Print.
  3. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

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    @EonADS: Other than what Psy37 and Bozo said, keep in mind that there are plenty of pokemon that Uxie outspeeds even after tricking the scarf, letting it Memento (or do whatever else) before taking another hit (which might KO Uxie). That said, I should have said 164 Speed EVs for Uxie to get to 136 speed, outspeeding 0 Speed Metagross (90 * 1.5 = 135 speed) even after tricking choice scarf.
  4. dragonite_

    dragonite_

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    Kingbattlus I do have some def evs on my uxie and next time I should probably try to t-wave then reflect (after switching of course) then trying to set up and hoping that it hurts itself in confusion which it of course didn't when I faced it. Although it doesn't really matter anymore because I don't consider using empoleon as a set-up sweeper with this team or and probably on any other trick team.I will definently try a much bulkier set up sweeper next time such as the protect sub DD crunch tyranitar which can somewhat stall if need be but doesn't get as much type synergy as empoleon or other steel types.
  5. kingbattlus

    kingbattlus

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    type synergy is extremely important and i would recommend doing some research and trying to find a good match for your two sweepers. but again in the last situation you need to trick to make sure you're dealing with a CScarf dragonite, not a CB dragonite. CB dragonite, even with reflect, is gonna hurt your team up pretty badly.


    just so everyone knows i'm just a few more rounds away from breaking into the DP leaderboard (147 currently). i did have an issue two days ago when i was facing an eruption typhlosion. i tricked, thunder waved, went to tyranitar, and i used crunch... which did a ton of damage. i only managed setting up a sub and 1 DD before it died to struggle recoil. but again, tyranitar was a beast and came through. i've fully set up in the face on a non-tricked opposing tyranitar, alternating sub, protect and dd when i could. he is just a monster sometimes its so awesome.
  6. Eppie

    Eppie

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    Face this in doubles and try to win, jeeeeeeeeeeeez...


    647 Whiscash Modest Zoom Lens Hydro Pump Earth Power Blizzard Fissure

    689 Rapidash Adamant Brightpowder Flare Blitz Posion Jab Iron Tail Horn Drill

    651 Dewgong Calm Salac Berry Sheer Cold Horn Drill Rest Sleeptalk



    I haven't seen the last poke, it was probarly something with a 1HKO move too..There went my 156 streak...
  7. Bozo

    Bozo

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    actually, if you know it is a CB dragonite you can just charm straight away. this depends on if your tricker has charm of course (maybe use memento if you have that instead). its stats after one turn will be:

    • if you trick - 204 Atk / 150 Speed
    • if you charm - 153 Atk / 100 Speed
    so, not only is its attack lower, but also its speed is. and your lead still has its scarf for possibly more tricking later on if something bad happens. because it has choice band, its not like you need to trick it so you know what it will do (it will outrage for sure). the only thing to be very careful of here is that crits will hurt more than if you had tricked it, so make sure you use sub before setting up with registeel (or whoever else). also, if you have reflect, then beware of it only lasting a fixed number of turns.

    nice work KB :) what is your opinion of the comparitive difficulty between D/P and platinum? the same names seem to be on top of the leader board, but with a much smaller gap.....
  8. kingbattlus

    kingbattlus

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    bozo i'm not sure i can really answer that question objectively since i dont have platinum... but i can say that there is considerable guesswork involved with natures when i'm doing tricky calculations. i usually just end up assuming the worst case scenario that it's a plus attack nature since my team doesn't particularly care about speed that much since both sweepers utilize dragon dance.

    i didnt think about charming dragonite but that would be the better option... of course using cresselia (and uxie) charm isn't on my moveset.

    today was my first encounter with a metagross during my first 98 battles, and it was fortunately metagross 2 (wise glasses special version). shadow ball allowed me to get it tricked, paralyzed, and flashed twice before tyranitar took over. legendaries seem to be my easiest matches, tyranitar almost always dominates them fully (and very few are immune to sandstorm which is also a bonus).
  9. Bozo

    Bozo

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    ah ok, so you're playing d/p because you dont have platinum - i see!

    you sure you flashed metagross? ;)

    d/p is funny because some of the movesets just "show off" the new moves - like magnet rise metagross. and yeah, random natures kinda sucks, especially when you probably have a very specific speed in mind for your tricker (getting outsped by weird things with a beneficial nature is strange), but then again you occasionally get -def walls, so i guess it adds up..... crazy that even when they've updated the natures in the plat BF, they still didnt update abilities - i mean whats with natural cure starmies - when you play through the game (even d/p) every single bronzor/bronzong you face has levitate.

    i like the idea of your double DD team :)
  10. Jumpman16

    Jumpman16 np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
    is a Smogon IRC SOPis a Pokemon Researcheris a Contributor to Smogonis an Administratoris a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

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  11. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

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    Lol haha, nice! Drapion is so uber in BT!

    I just finished breeding my Skorupi today. Not exactly same as your team (actually only Drapion is the same, pokemon-wise, but the underlying strategy is basically the same... originally it wasn't similar at all, but after testing this and that, it seemed that only Drapion fills the role... and... perfectly at that, so I started breeding that yesterday). I'll see how far I get...
  12. Sixfortyfive

    Sixfortyfive

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  13. Groombridge

    Groombridge

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    This is freaking awesome. Once again, TRE sets himself up as the doubles dude to beat! I suspected something like this was coming after his long break...

    I love this team because it combines two effective strategies: Trick Room and AI abuse, exploiting the fact that it will almost always go for a OHKO if one's available. It seems to be on a par with Glenscarfing in singles.

    The addition of Follow Me Togekiss would cover OHKO users on turn 1, which ended TRE's previous streak.

    I used Bronzong/Togekiss as leads in my own TR team about a year ago, but my Kiss was lv.50 and built to attack as well as cover Zong for TR. My set was Follow Me/Protect/Air Slash/Heat Wave @ Lum. The idea was that everything on the team had to be able to score kills, because you don't always know what your last poke will be.

    After playing that team for a while, I came to the conclusion that TRE got it right first time! I was going to try lv.1 Smeargle with Protect/Follow Me/Endeavor/Dark Void, but never got round to it (it would attract EQs, for one thing).

    I also got tired of having to start every match with a -6 priority move, plus seeing the team screwed by evasion hax during critical booming.

    (That's one of the reasons I switched to a Rain Dance team: it's much easier to get the field effect (Timid Starmie FTW), and the team isn't as doomed if it doesn't get it.)

    The cool thing about doubles is that various strategies can work. I've been looking at Ashenlock's Sun team lately, with new moves in mind: Cherrim gets Weather Ball and Shiftry gets Low Kick, Seed Bomb and Sucker Punch in Platinum/HGSS, so perhaps that team might work better now...



    So Jump takes the lead again: grats on the mental streak!

    When the video sped up, I misread several uses of Acupressure as:

    DRAPULA used Acupressure!
    DRAPULA's awesomeness sharply increased!


    It was probably evasiveness - or was it?
  14. darkseeker4

    darkseeker4

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    Congrats jumpXVI that is absolutly insance and im just sitting at 105 in wondering if ill make it past 200 :/
  15. kingbattlus

    kingbattlus

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    damn jump you're a monster.

    also bozo, no, i probably still did flash meta it just didn't care lol sometimes i do something dumb like that. i may just have remembered it wrong though also who knows, i dont record the battles and it was in the middle of a set of 7.

    today was my first bout with a lead staraptor, who i tricked away a CB from but that left me stuck on trick, taking brave birds. so i swapped out, came back and paralyzed it. tyranitar managed +2/+2/Sub and out comes quick claw ursaring4 to hammer arm my sub away while i didn't manage to quite kill it. after a protect and two rounds of SS it was less than 20%... so i had to risk it and Crunch. Thankfully no QC and I beat Exploud2 (double team resttalk return) handily. the beauty is that if i wanted to, i could've set up the rest of the way against exploud. Sandstorm is just so great sometimes.

    161, just about ready to start jumping over people!!!! :)
  16. Eppie

    Eppie

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    Jumpman, I lolled at your Palkia stylus, that's sooo epic :D

    I'd like to read what Peterko has to say about your streak, nice job !
  17. DrDimentio

    DrDimentio

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    .............. that's one of the most amusing posts I've seen in ages. Haha I want to see Peterko's reaction... all his hard work didn't guarantee him the top spot. Also, it's lucky I didn't say "Nobody will ever beat 2363" ... I was about to say that because I assumed that you, Jump, had got bored with it at 1001.

    Anyway, I don't blame you for having had enough of it. If by some lightning-strike chance someone overtakes that number, will you continue?

    And keep in mind that 'when' (not for a while...) I return to the Tower with my 'new' team, I will both directly and indirectly honour your Team and record. I'll try to anyway...

    Also, your video was epic... far superior to my videos in every way possible. I don't have any plastic Ursarings or Palkias to show off, you see.

    Peterko stopped regularly visiting this thread after his streak, so will the same happen with Jumpman now that he seems to have had enough of it despite not losing?
  18. Bozo

    Bozo

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    well, i for one assumed you were doing this ;)

    so, i will add my congratulations - you did a really brilliant job! i'm still totally in awe of the drapion strategy. kinda combines registeel and salamence into one pokemon (and your "backup" is garchomp lol).

    EDIT: the video is kinda blurry and i'm watching it at work - the original number was 2359, right? and you just played enough games to get to 2364 exactly? so, you're just gonna leave your game locked in that in-between stage? i'd finish the last two battles if i were you - i'd be scared of accidentally turning it on and then off, thereby ending the streak. and besides, it'd be good to take a good photo of the board.

    oh man that made me laugh haha :)

    i guess if you had wanted metagross to KO your lead, you're just gonna be randomly using moves that dont do anything (he's already tricked, paralyzed, flash doesnt do anything, etc).

    lead staraptor is really dangerous. i dont know if it is necessarily the best, but usually i:

    1. use charm. if it doesnt use brave bird, then its probably not too threatening.
    2. switch to registeel. will most likely use same move as previous turn.
    3. switch back to latias. this will hopefully flush out close combat if it has it. if so, then trick on your next turn to lock it into -2 BB. if not, then it might have a CB of its own (you can probably tell after the damage on turn 1, but random natures might confuse it in d/p), or it might just have other stuff that is not as powerful as brave bird (steel wing?) - in this case you probably dont need to trick, but maybe you should.
    4. set up registeel.
  19. Ondore

    Ondore

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    Oh my Arceus... and I just updated my blog pimping the peterko streak.
  20. kingbattlus

    kingbattlus

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    I agree, charm is a great way to handle staraptor. Unfortunately, I have no charm. Even though Tyranitar resists Brave Bird, I hardly want to switch him into it right away. I would rather trick away a CB (or muscle band, other item) and a) know which one I'm facing, and b) have a 75% (or 66% chance depending on the trainer as was the case today) of it not having a CB and becoming locked in a move when it may have the freedom to switch otherwise.

    Cresselia uses Reflect - Flash - Thunder Wave -Trick. For me, Staraptor is going to get off a Brave Bird (2-4 have it and none of their other moves would really make sense). I would rather Trick, knowing it will Brave Bird, and then have a strategy that makes sense barring crits. The problem I encountered today was that the recoil from Brave Bird as it chipped away at Cresselia brought it down so low that I couldn't set up very much--a big drawback of two DDs and not having something with a 4-turn set up like Garchomp.

    Since I'll break my way onto the leaderboard tomorrow, I'll give my team layout now so we can continue this conversation constructively.

    Cresselia @ Choice Scarf
    Bold, Levitate
    252 HP / 6 SP DEF / 252 SPD (Jump's spread, iirc that was it)
    -Trick
    -Thunder Wave
    -Reflect
    -Flash

    Tyranitar @ Leftovers
    Careful, Sandstream
    252 HP / 252 SP DEF / 6 SPD
    -Protect
    -Substitute
    -Dragon Dance
    -Crunch

    Gyarados @ Lum Berry
    Adamant, Intimidate
    156 HP / 72 ATK / 96 DEF / 184 SPD
    -Substitute
    -Dragon Dance
    -Waterfall
    -Return

    Ok, the basis for this team was Tyranitar. I've used it before and really loved how it can effectively stall out a large number of potentially threatening Pokemon and even set up in their faces. Protect, Substitute, Sandstream and Leftovers are all lethal combined. I went with the bulkiest spread possible to help the stalling. Why not more speed? Well with Dragon Dance I outspeed everything eventually, and with Thunder Wave being the general plan from Cresselia, it doesn't make much of a difference. Why not more attack? Again, see Dragon Dance. At +6 most things are OHKOed, give me a reason not to and I'll consider changing it. Now, the final piece of the puzzle is Gyarados.

    I began with the knowledge of Cresselia and Tyranitar. Cresselia is going to draw Bug, Dark and Ghost attacks. Tyranitar resists Dark and Ghost but is weak to Bug, so that was first. Since Tyranitar was the star of the show, I wanted to make sure that whatever I chose, could effectively cover his weaknesses. Any effectiveness the other way around was nice but not the focal point. So, Tyranitar is weak to: Water, Grass, Fighting, Ground, Bug, and Steel. Gyarados covers Water, Fighting, Ground, Bug and Steel, leaving only Grass (which he is neutral to). This is about as good of type coverage as I was going to get with only one Pokemon. I also toyed with Salamence and Dragonite in this slot, trading a Steel resist for a Grass resist. But, when it comes down to trick teams, who do we all hate to fight? Metagross. So the Steel resist, though maybe not as common, was an important factor. And since Leftovers were extremely important for Tyranitar to function, I went with a Lum Berry to give me something to switch into status moves.


    Back to the Staraptor story, I Trick, swap to Gyarados (-1 ATK), back to Cresselia, paralyze, and kept Thunder Waving until I died and let Tyranitar go in and get to +2/+2/Sub. I could've went back to Gyara and began Flashing or put up a Reflect, but unless I got lucky with some fully paralyzes I don't think I could get much more set up. I may have been able to get more set up under Reflect if I chose to go for against the next un-tricked Pokemon as well, but I didn't. I suppose I could've left Cresselia alive and able to trick a Choice Band onto something later on if I needed to, but at the time I wanted to get Tyranitar in unscathed.

    I'll be on the leaderboard tomorrow morning barring disaster!
  21. Bozo

    Bozo

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    i really like your team actually KB. i know youve tried heaps of different things, so its nice to see you settling on something which, based on the research, should work! its fun passing milestones as you make your way up the leaderboard - have fun :)

    fair enough - that all sounds like a good way to go about it without charm. and i guess switching back to gyarados too many times is not advisable, given that you really want to keep it as healthy as possible just in case your +2/+2 ttar is not able to finish something off. and the problem with trying to get reflect as well is gyarados might die to a crit, or the bird might just be FP so many times that reflect wears off just before it kills you. in fact, i had an annoying situation where a moltres used flamethrower against my latias - i didnt want to switch registeel in naturally, and salamence doesnt completely wall it, even with a resistence - so i just stalled it out of flamethrowers with latias before getting it stuck on sunny day (i tried retricking a few times to see if this would happen earlier, but no, and pressure meant i didnt want to waste all my tricks). anyway, to cut a long story short, i paralyzed it, and then almost depleted the PP of both charm and thunderwave as it was repeatedly FP - convenient, not!



    here is a question for you all. do you think the door you go in to the battle room effects anything? like which trainers/pokemon you will face (eg door 1 - you'll get more trainers that use set 1 pokemon). serious question.
  22. DrDimentio

    DrDimentio

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    [SIZE=+1]FREE SHINIES![/SIZE]

    Now that I grabbed some attention... Jumpman, please don't miss this question:

    Did the same thing happen to you that occurred to Peterko - the cycle of trainers restarting from the first ones with NFEs, then facing Palmer again?

    I've wondered about that too - it may be as relevant or irrelevant as the percentages said by Factory Fag Thorton before battle... at least in this case we could actually test theories by noting which door is used and then which trainers/pokes.

    But I'd place my bet on it being completely irrelevant...

    You might want to take note that Jumpman has now surpassed that streak and can keep going if he wants...
  23. Groombridge

    Groombridge

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    I always thought that the ride in the lift then the corridor with the four doors functioned as a loading screen. There's no real point to it at all, you don't even control your character, but it's prettier and more 'kayfabe' than 'LOADING BT TRAINERS AND MOVESETS PLEASE WAIT'. Other areas of the game don't need loading screens, but a BT run probably requires more 'thinking time' as it generates trainers and their pokes and retrieves movesets, then checks items aren't duplicated on a trainer, randomises natures and abilities etc.

    I could be completely wrong and the doors could in fact signify which group of trainers you'll be facing - but I'd bet that the door is chosen randomly, to give us something to look at that changes each time, but doesn't cost anything during loading.

    It's sort of like the double doors in Metroid Prime: Hunters, which keep you out of the next room for a few seconds while the game loads it. Man, they were annoying as hell when you were doing the 'run back to your ship before shit explodes' at the end of each mission. OPEN UP YOU BASTARD THE PLANET'S ABOUT TO BLOW UP WHY DOESN'T THIS SUIT CONTAIN A FUCKING KEY OR SOMETHING
  24. Eppie

    Eppie

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    Before I started using this, I knew it wouldn't give me a monster score like TRE's one in doubles, but I managed to be undefeated 129 battles in a row.


    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Error @ Life Orb
    Brave (+Atk -Speed)
    Heatproof
    252 HP / 252 Atk / 6 Sp.Def
    174 / 155 / 136 / 99 / 137 / 34

    - Explosion
    - Gyro Ball
    - Trick Room
    - Earthquake

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Aftermath Lvl 1 @ Focus Sash
    Adamant (+Ignore -Care)
    Aftermath
    12 / 6 / 5 / 5 / 6 / 6

    - Protect
    - Disable
    - Embargo
    - Destiny Bond

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Feint @ Leftovers
    Relaxed (+Def -Speed)
    Pressure
    252 HP / 6 Def / 252 Sp.Def
    152 / 120 / 170 / 85 / 187 / 45

    - Psych Up
    - Ice Punch
    - Trick Room
    - Shadow Punch

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Snorlax @ Sitrus Berry
    Brave (+Atk -Speed)
    Thick Fat
    252 HP / 240 Def / 16 Atk
    267 / 144 / 115 / 85 / 130 / 31

    - Crunch
    - Belly Drum
    - Brick Break
    - Selfdestruct


    Although Drifloon lacks Endeavor, it is immune to 4/10 priority moves,
    2/4 1HKO moves, and finds a great trait in Aftermath. Besides that it has acces to Destiny Bond and Disable thanks to HG/SS.
    The low leveled balloon is also immune for Zong/Lax's Earthquake ánd Explosion/Selfdestruct wich was a huge plus at alot of moments.

    For those who care, I will retry the tower with a lvl 1 frisk Shuppet and a lvl 2 magic guard Clefable.
  25. kingbattlus

    kingbattlus

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    bozo i'm not sure about the doors thing... it really hasn't been apparent to me if it has but i'll start paying attention to see if i can learn something.

    i have a spreadsheet for this streak with every trainer, pokemon and set number, their move choice, who i swapped in and how far i got set up

    no choke getting onto the boards! i'm at 175 now and very happy that i've finally cracked into the top 30.

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