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Platinum/HG/SS Battle Frontier and DP Battle Tower Records

Discussion in 'Smogon's Greatest Hits' started by Peterko, Apr 4, 2009.

  1. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
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    I was doing this with the tower IVs in DP, I mean calcing (more exactly, I asked x-act to do these most of the time because he was faster at it) stats and IVs from damage dealt to my team

    thanks for the info TRE, it´s very helpful, as always

    I´ll be sure to test the IVs as well, using something like a blissey (like I did many times when testing for the damage formula some time ago)

    argenta using flawless pokémon is pretty much a given, the brains are a weird bunch

    yeah the lowest challenger level is 30 (nothing new, I know), and the first three rank10 pokémon (#10, #20 & #30) are lv.24 (14-24), 24 (15-24) & 25 (15-25)

    the most amusing part is that the hall cheats non-existent levels of pokémon...like a lv.24 dragonite or a lv.22 raptor, sucks :(



    EDIT:

    Rank1
    Level 70 Taillow (Taillow, Lonely, Sharp Beak, Brave Bird, Air Slash, Quick Attack, Double Team, Atk/Spd)
    Brave Bird vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 472

    Rank2
    Level 72 Meowth (Meowth, Adamant, Silk Scarf, Slash, U-turn, Fake Out, Charm, Atk/Spd)
    Slash vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 255, 256, 268, 271
    U-Turn vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 142, 143, 154

    Rank3
    Level 74 Zigzagoon (Zigzagoon, Jolly, Silk Scarf, Mud-Slap, Headbutt, Tickle, Facade, Atk/Spd)
    Headbutt vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 213, 222
    Facade vs 24 defense Chansey -> damage: 325, 330

    Rank4
    Level 76 Starly (Starly, Adamant, Sharp Beak, Brave Bird, FeatherDance, Quick Attack, Aerial Ace, Atk/Spd)
    Aerial Ace vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 277, 295, 301
    Quick Attack vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 148, 154, 168, 171
    Brave Bird vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 552

    Rank5
    Level 78 Linoone (Linoone, Jolly, Silk Scarf, Slash, Gunk Shot, Charm, Last Resort, Atk/Spd)
    Gunk Shot vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 328, 332, 371, 379
    Slash vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 385
    IV = 12 (323-380) -> impossible
    IV = 13 (324-382) -> impossible
    IV = 14 (326-384) -> impossible
    IV = 15 (328-387) -> 328, 332, 371, 379 possible, also 385 slash damage

    so yeah, rank 5 Pokémon IVs = 15

    I´ll work on the rest, slowly (what a pain)

    BIG THANKS TO THE SMOGON DAMAGE CALCULATOR, IT´S TOTALLY AWESOME!



    EDIT2

    here is the rank4 starly stuff

    Level 76 Starly (Starly, Adamant, Sharp Beak, Brave Bird, FeatherDance, Quick Attack, Aerial Ace, Atk/Spd)
    Aerial Ace vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 277, 295, 301 (IVs = 9–25)
    Quick Attack vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 148, 154, 168, 171 (IVs = 11–16)
    Brave Bird vs 36 defense Chansey -> damage: 552 (IVs = 0–25)

    99, 103, 112, 114 & 185, 197, 201

    99-117 & 177-209 (IVs = 16) -> 201, 197, 185 impossible
    98-116 & 176-208 (IVs = 14 or 15) -> rand 97/100, 95/100, 89/100 -> all possible (also QA)
    97-115 & 175-206 (IVs = 13) -> rand 98/100, 96/100, 90/100 -> possible (QA 114 & 99 impossible though)
    97-115 & 174-205 (IVs = 12) -> 201, 197, 201 impossible
    96-114 & 173-204 (IVs = 11) -> rand 99/100, 97/100, 91/100 -> all possible (also QA)

    351-414 (IVs = 14 or 15) -> 368 possible (89/100)
    345-406 (IVs = 11) -> 368 impossible (365 is 90/100 and 369 is 91/100)

    Rank 4 Pokémon IVs = 14 or 15
  2. Puplip

    Puplip

    Joined:
    Dec 25, 2009
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    I was wondering if this team would work well in the BT. I AM Terry. T. and as far as I know, it's passed 100. Currently 105. And I won't expect flaming. *points to Bozo*
    ~Epic Lead~
    [​IMG]
    Latias@Choice Scarf
    Modest
    252 HP, 144 SpD, 114 Def
    Trick
    Thunder Wave
    Dragon Pulse
    Calm Mind
    Right, I have reasons. The only reason I have more SpD is because special attackers are more common in the BT than physical (this changes around 3000 but this team can't get there in a million years. My goal is to beat Peterko anyway so I'm safe from that switch. Also note that special attackers run better moves than physical attackers anyway. Incase I get haxed by ScarfTaunt (Speed won't cut it as they (case reference Infernape/Absol) run 252 Speed EVs) I guess that's all I gotta explain.


    Powerhouse
    [​IMG]
    Scizor@Muscle Band
    Impish
    252 Atk, 252 Spd, 6 HP
    Swords Dance
    Bullet Punch
    Substitute
    Aerial Ace
    Full on good-team in 2 Pokémon. AA is for hax protection, and have you seen how many times Dual-Screening comes in in the late BT? Well, I've not really used a hax-proof team before, this will cut it, though. I added Speed for quicker BB/AA. It may not matter on BP, unless something lol happens. Impish is the only Defense I can use really, but don't sweat-this combo got TrapinchBarrier's team of Scizor, Torterra, and Arcanine to 1500 alone. That's why I elected him. So I could get the true power out of Scizor. I hope this guy helps out well.


    Wrap up with more directness!
    [​IMG]
    Feraligatr@Leftovers
    Adamant
    252 ATK, 252 Spd, 6 HP
    Dragon Dance
    Ice Punch
    Aqua Jet
    Earthquake
    Boom. Two physical attackers, almost identical, adding great synenergy. This is the reason I selected Storm Rider, BTW. I tweaked their teams in a way I can't describe. Great synenergy, but an attacking downside. But then again, there's always a way to win with this team.


    I'm not using BB on Scizor because Gatr does Heatran work.
  3. EonADS

    EonADS

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    @Above: Jesus Christ Terry. Bad enough that you had to post that shit on Serebii, but here? You were told that your team was crap on serebii, but now you continue on here. Just shut up, for the umpteenth time.
  4. Bozo

    Bozo

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    whether you consider this flaming or not (lol at not liking constructive criticism), ZOMGG!!!!!!1 Your feraligatr is hacked!!!!!!!!

    anyway, you can't have dragon dance and aqua jet on the same feraligatr since no parent that learns AJ can also learn DD.

    so, tell me, what does that say about your team? and the "fact" that someone has supposedly gone to 100 wins with it?

    having said that, if aqua jet was replaced with something legal, like waterfall, i think this team would possibly do ok. i wouldnt be surprised if you could get 100, maybe 200, wins out of it, but it might take a few tries. lacking substitute on your sweepers will cost you at some stage, but perhaps having your trick lead capable of setting up and sweeping might help with that to some extent.

    EDIT: hang on, you've added sub to scizor, but didnt change the wording (so it still refers to BB, dual screens, etc). something to note though with your comment about feraligatr doing heatran work though - the point is that once one of your sweepers is set up, you dont want to be switching it out. and before you complain that i am flaming you or something, i am giving you constructive criticism on your team - it's what we do here (helping people).



    EDIT: had a funny situation this morning. tricked a random drifblim, who promptly tricked me back. (it got its own black sludge back, and i was returned my choice scarf.) i thought this might end up being one of those stall wars (like mean look, taunt, etc) but on the 2nd or 3rd turn it used will-o-wisp. so i think the best thing i could do was paralyze it, sacrifice latias, and then set salamence up.

    note that this situation is an excellent reason for sub. without it TT's team would have been screwed (now he could do the same as i did, but set scizor up with sub blocking W-o-W). before, as we have said, the only hope for "countering" W-o-W is for latias to set up and sweep, but with black sludge in the mix, it loses 1/4 of its hp each turn - not enough time to effectively sweep.
  5. StealthFire12

    StealthFire12

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    This team is idiotic, hacked and will get nowhere in the frontier.
  6. Berserker Lord

    Berserker Lord unreliable analysis writer.

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    ok i'm baffled at why scizor has AA. you say that it's to get through evasion hax but what mpurpose does it serve? no purpose at all, give him x-scissors.
  7. Lightsabre

    Lightsabre

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    he's using it to be able to hit random stuff that's locked into double team/minimize. btw, can anybody tell me what my team needs to watch out for?

    Starmie @ Choice Scarf
    Modest
    252/252 SPATK/speed
    hydro pump
    trick
    thunderbolt
    ice beam

    Latias @lum berry
    timid
    252/252 HP/speed
    calm mind
    rest
    substitute
    dragon pulse

    registeel @leftovers
    careful
    252HP/180DEF/76SPDEF
    curse
    substitute
    rest
    iron head


    I know fire types in general can give my sweepers trouble, but that's why I went for starmie as a lead, so I could hydro pump them to kingdom come(once I'm set up they have no chance)
  8. Team Rocket Elite

    Team Rocket Elite Data Integration Thought Entity
    is a Pokemon Researcher

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    That's actually IV15 or IV16 since that Linoone has 175 attack for both IV15 and IV16.
  9. Bozo

    Bozo

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    no, he's using it to wrap up with more directness!!!!!

    seriously though, its probably so that when set up, if the second/third poke has an item like bright powder or lax insence, you can counter the hax.

    interesting choice of a trick lead. normally i wouldnt recommend having attacks on it. once youve tricked them, you dont want to kill them, or else you've just wasted your scarf, and cant use the trick strategy on their second poke. alternatively, if you use an attack on turn 1, chances are you will have to switch on turn 2, and that would mean sending in registeel/latias on something that is not locked into any particular move.

    i would also definitely recommend surf over hydro pump. 100% accuracy is extremely important if you want a high streak. missing 1/5 times means 1/5 times you face a troublesome (you say) fire pokemon, you will not KO it, and it might kill starmie and then start posing problems.

    you might want to consider chesto berry for latias rather than lum. if you get burned, poisoned, paralyzed, you can rest it off and wake up, whereas lum gives you the instant heal, but your berry is gone and you havent recovered any hp. if you get frozen its a different story, but really you should have registeel in if your foe is using an ice move.

    overall though it seems like a good choice of pokemon. registeel and latias nicely cover starmie's weaknesses (and therefore the most common moves it will attract), and they also cover eachother's weaknesses well too. the only thing is i would maybe give starmie something more like:

    • trick, thunderwave, recover, flash
    • 252 HP / 106 Def / 116 Sp Def / 36 Speed
    just so it can incapacitate the lead as much as possible. the EVs give it 154 - can outspeed no-speed base 80's after tricking the scarf (like dragonite) and also max speed netural base 100's when noone has a scarf (like salamence). the other EV's are for best defenses, with spdef > def so that any random download porygon will get useless attack boosts. the defensive stats will be 167/120/118, not quite as good as latias which has 187/133/150 at the same speed.

    exactly. so how can you get differences between say 13-14, when the attack stat will be the same in both cases?
  10. Team Rocket Elite

    Team Rocket Elite Data Integration Thought Entity
    is a Pokemon Researcher

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    Not all Pokemon will have the same stat for both IV13 and IV14. You just need to fiddle around with your level and what you fight until you find something that works. With some luck, the Pokemon you want to fight is in Dragon or some other type that doesn't have very many Pokemon so they are a bit easier to find.
  11. Bozo

    Bozo

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    hmmmm.... i think i messed that one up. i think its the same for 30-31 or 28-29 or 26-27 etc. this is just from messing with EV spreads for level 50 pokes. maybe somewhere around the middle of 0-31 it changes from even-even+1 to odd-odd+1 or something. oh well, there's little difference!
  12. CBshuckle

    CBshuckle

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    Doubles is so annoying with Trick Room everywhere. Even though there are only 10 total users, 2 of them are ghosts and if they ever get it off you can be mortally screwed. My rain team has lost twice in a row because of Trick Room and since all my pokemon (in the rain) are >178 speed. Partially it's my fault because I've faked out the wrong poke but still Trick Room is soooo annoying.
  13. Gonzaa

    Gonzaa

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    I haven't even reached the 100 battles yet (i'm 70 atm), but i noticed that i was still using Bozo's Salamence XD So i thought that maybe it could somehow handle with OHKOers by using protect instead of earthquake (assuming that the BT hadn't decided to end your streak). If it's the same Gliscor that owned Peterko, it will use 2 Guillotines with <lead>, and if it misses just one time (not counting a second protect), maybe sala will end up dead but gliscor will run out of PP's. And with every other OHKO user is pretty much the same, but i haven't seen anyone that doesn't miss even one OHKO move.
    Then you can be lucky and t-wave them and protect + sub.
    Just for you to know, mi previous back up idea was Moltres, since it has pressure and covers Registeel's weaknesses. But i'm not sure now if it will work, anny suggestion is accepted!

    Oh, and also remember that i'm new to battle tower TrickScarf team (and to 45+ streaks xD) so i could have forgotten something...
  14. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
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    Bozo: you´re (maybe) still in your lv.50 mindset, the hall is different. Basically you can face pokémon ranging from level 14 (lv.30 challenger, rank 1, battle #1) up to level 100 (lv.100 challenger vs argenta)

    or I misunderstood what you meant...anyway, challenger lv.100 faces a level 78 pokémon in rank5, that´s a pretty high level and most IVs are distinguishable, unfortunately linoone had to be a bitch and have the same attack stat with 15 and 16 IVs lol

    I´ll get another chansey from my diamond with a lot less defense to maximize the damage from pokémon in the lower ranks
  15. Jumpman16

    Jumpman16 np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
    is a Smogon IRC SOPis a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus

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    i would suggest you save your time pinpointing the IVs of rank 4-5 pokemon...they will almost never be relevant because you will have them outlevelled by at least 10 when you're at battle ~155, at which point your pokemon is facing types it matches up well against if you did the harder types earlier like you're supposed to. i would actually be more interested in the pokemon trainers can use in the tower from battles 15-42 since that actually matters sometimes when you want to make the best moves possible
  16. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
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    yes from the view of going for 170 or further, the only thing that matters is rank10 IVs and also the level of rank10 in the, let´s say, first 4 types (starting with the worst matchups to get the biggest possible difference in stats)

    I don´t remember it too good, but battles >171 are always lv.96 if you challenge at lv.100?

    also I´m doing it for the sake of research (knowledge), I mean the IVs...as I said, what´s more important for me is the level at #10, #20, #30 & #40 (also maybe #48 & #49)...

    it´s interesting that "we" (I mean everyone but the two of you that are best in the hall) didn´t know about the IV stuff in the hall (although it was kind of predictable that IVs were chaning, on the other hand why would they if level change) a til few days ago...


    about the tower, I think that´s already known...(31, 18 & 21), (15 & 18), (12 & 15), (9 & 12) ...not? oh wait that was eme? I´m mixing here something :/
  17. CBshuckle

    CBshuckle

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    Hey I have a question about how the battle tower uses different sets of pokemon. Is the battle tower more likely to use the higher sets like #3 and #4 of a pokemon if you're on a higher streak, like above 49? Or at a point is the tower equally likely to use any of the 4 sets of a pokemon? I used to think that they only used the higher sets on high streaks, but after losing to Milotic #1 on a streak of 78 I'm not so sure.
  18. Jumpman16

    Jumpman16 np: Michael Jackson - "Mon in the Mirror" (DW mix)
    is a Smogon IRC SOPis a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Battle Server Admin Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnus

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    haha, i purposely kept my hall knowledge from all of you guys when i asked tre about hall IVs/trainers in early july, "sorry"!

    here is my rationale, as i PMed it to TRE on july 10:

    when paired with the fact that i still spent a good two months chasing a phantom "record" of 302 even though i had the real record with pz before i even PMed TRE, you can understand
  19. Peterko

    Peterko Never give up!
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    lol kind of a comparative advantage, it´s fine

    I think noone else played the hall "seriously" (like some people do the tower now) but you two anyway (no offense to others that did)

    also I had to read TRE´s post record post twice to understand it (my experience in the hall is lol)...I get now that you need 2 sets over 170 (one for 10 and one for 7 types)



    @CBshuckle: smogon is your best friend when it comes to the tower, you should read the first post, all of it...

    if you´re lazy, read this

    http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2159854&postcount=4

    and then this

    http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2278079&postcount=19

    how you deal with that information is up to you
  20. Puplip

    Puplip

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    Dec 25, 2009
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    Wait, feraligatr's hacked?
    Eon, STFU

    EDIT:
    ~Epic Lead~
    [​IMG]
    Latias@Choice Scarf
    Modest
    252 HP, 144 SpD, 114 Def
    Trick
    Thunder Wave
    Dragon Pulse
    Calm Mind
    Right, I have reasons. The only reason I have more SpD is because special attackers are more common in the BT than physical (this changes around 3000 but this team can't get there in a million years. My goal is to beat Peterko anyway so I'm safe from that switch. Also note that special attackers run better moves than physical attackers anyway. Incase I get haxed by ScarfTaunt (Speed won't cut it as they (case reference Infernape/Absol) run 252 Speed EVs) I guess that's all I gotta explain.


    Powerhouse
    [​IMG]
    Scizor@Muscle Band
    Impish
    252 Atk, 252 Spd, 6 HP
    Swords Dance
    Bullet Punch
    Substitute
    Aerial Ace
    Full on good-team in 2 Pokémon. AA is for hax protection, and have you seen how many times Dual-Screening comes in in the late BT? Well, I've not really used a hax-proof team before, this will cut it, though. I added Speed for quicker BB/AA. It may not matter on BP, unless something lol happens. Impish is the only Defense I can use really, but don't sweat-this combo got TrapinchBarrier's team of Scizor, Torterra, and Arcanine to 1500 alone. That's why I elected him. So I could get the true power out of Scizor. I hope this guy helps out well.


    Wrap up with more directness!
    [​IMG]
    Feraligatr@Leftovers
    Adamant
    252 ATK, 252 Spd, 6 HP
    Dragon Dance
    Ice Punch
    Waterfall

    Earthquake
    Boom. Two physical attackers, almost identical, adding great synenergy. This is the reason I selected Storm Rider, BTW. I tweaked their teams in a way I can't describe. Great synenergy, but an attacking downside. But then again, there's always a way to win with this team.


    I have to remember my sets.
  21. Lightsabre

    Lightsabre

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    I just can't seem to get to palmer the second time :/ I've already lost 5 times to random crits followed up by stuff I couldn't beat without the sub. this is what happened in the latest run

    Gengar used ShadowBall
    Registeel's substitute disapeared
    Registeel used substitute.

    ok, I'm at +6, behind a fully healthy sub, and know that Gengar's shadow ball only 2KOs it, so it's time to sweep

    Gengar used shadowball
    CRITICAL HIT!
    Registeel's sub disapeared
    registeel used iron head
    Gengar fainted

    ok, in comes Probopass, and I'm getting the feeling that I'm done for(starmie's dead to shadow ball after tricking). Probopass used earth pwoer to finnish registeel. ok, so I bring in Latias for the 2KO, take a hefty amount in return and hope that he has something bad next. it's Gardevoir :( shadow ball ands me while dragon pulse does only 1/3 damage. I'll give it another go later today
  22. Bozo

    Bozo

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    ah yes, you are totally correct. i'd forgotten you get to face all kind of random levels.

    actually, when i did the hall i used a level 50 salamence, and im pretty sure everything was level 50 once i got beyond 170.

    when i was facing lower level pokes i didnt really "care" about IV's - i just knew what i could outspeed, and basically hoped for the best - very little 2x outrage could not deal with, and with focus sash, there were only certain kinds of hax that could beat me. like jumpman, i lost a fair few times in the hall, the most notable irritations against the dusknoir (or was it dusclops) that kept getting a QC with ice punch......

    hmmm yeah, gotta try that.


    @lightsabre - i think something must have been going wrong if your registeel was at that low health against a gengar. or it must have got a ridiculous number of crits??
  23. Lightsabre

    Lightsabre

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    it's 2KOing my subs so I have to sub, curse, sub, curse, sub ,curse, ect. and then the EP knocked me out. but yeah, Gar got several crits as well
  24. Chinese Dood

    Chinese Dood

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    So, I guess the question to ask is... why weren't you using amnesia, so it wouldn't 2HKO your subs?

    EDIT: Oh, nvm, I see you have Rest over Amnesia... I personally think Amnesia > Rest.
  25. Lightsabre

    Lightsabre

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    where would I fit it onto the moveset?

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