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Poison Arceus (Analysis)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Furai, Jan 3, 2012.

  1. Furai

    Furai a Ωdefender // a αguardian
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    [​IMG]
    Poison Arceus
    [​IMG]
    Code:
    [B]QC Checks:[/B] trickroom, Fireburn
    [B]GP Checks:[/B] Calm Pokemaster, NatGeo, November Blue
    [B]AF Checks:[/B] shrang, barry4ever, bojangles

    trickroom's Original Thread
    badalcristiano's Thread

    [Overview]

    <p>The Creator oozes with the scum and filth He has deemed you to be in His toxic form. The might of the pestilential deity vanquishes His victims faster than the deadliest of poisons. While the virulent master cannot scratch the hide of His Steel-type nemeses with His filthy sludge, or stomach the telepathic onslaughts of his arch-nemesis Mewtwo, His viscous hide protects him from the potent barrage of draconic assaults his underlings unleash. The venomous creator even consumes all forms of Toxic and Toxic Spikes within His mighty gullet upon entering the battlefield. Bow before your corrosive maker or risk incurring His putrid Judgment!</p>

    [SET]
    name: Support Arceus
    move 1: Recover
    move 2: Will-O-Wisp / Reflect
    move 3: Ice Beam / Flamethrower
    move 4: Roar / Stealth Rock / Perish Song
    item: Toxic Plate
    nature: Bold
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Poison Arceus's main advantage over its other formes is the ability to remove the dreaded Toxic Spikes. It makes a fantastic supporter just because of that reason alone. With access to a reliable healing move in Recover, and great support moves, Poison Arceus can stall out multiple threats. Will-O-Wisp is a great move that helps Arceus weaken its opponents while severely crippling physical attackers. Reflect never misses and halves damage to the team from physical attacks for 5 turns. Roar fits well in the final slot to prevent your opponent from setting up, and racks up residual damage. Stealth Rock can be used if you have nothing else to set it up. Since Poison Arceus usually doesn't need coverage moves on this set, Perish Song can be used instead to ensure your victory over end game sweepers, providing you can stall them out for at least 3 turns. Thanks to its Poison typing, Poison Arceus can swallow any Fighting-type move from the likes of Terrakion, Heracross, and Lucario.</p>

    <p>Will-O-Wisp is the preferred status move because this set is geared to counter physical sweepers such as Swords Dance Ghost Arceus and Rayquaza. Though Toxic and Thunder Wave both have their merits, Will-O-Wisp has the advantage of crippling the feared Choice Band Groudon, who would otherwise stomp Arceus to pieces. Ice Beam's utility and coverage in Ubers makes it the primary choice for an attack, and it deters Groudon from switching in, while OHKOing both Rayquaza and Garchomp. Flamethrower prevents Steel-types, such as Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Skarmory, from setting up on Poison Arceus for free.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Poison Arceus's main niche is to absorb Toxic Spikes. Therefore, it is very hard to stop it from doing so. However, there are some Pokemon that are especially disruptive to Poison Arceus. Mewtwo is this set's nemesis, as Arceus would be forced to either fire very weak Ice Beams or risk getting smashed by a super effective Psystrike. A great way of dealing with Mewtwo is Giratina-O, whose Shadow Sneak can wear down Mewtwo rather quickly. Lugia, and Giratina also do fine as checks to Mewtwo. Heatran will wall Poison Arceus easily due to its unique typing, so you will need something such as Garchomp to take care of it with a powerful Earthquake. Reshiram can roast Heatran with Blue Flare thanks to Turbo Blaze while laughing at Heatran's Flamethrower. Forretress, Ferrothorn, and Skarmory make great teammates for Support Arceus, as it will be forcing a lot of switches, which you can take advantage of by laying down entry hazards of your own. Reshiram can easily threaten Poison Arceus with its immensely powerful Blue Flare, while Kyogre with its turbulent downpour is able to drown Arceus easily with a mighty Water Spout, making Palkia a great teammate. Palkia can come in on Blue Flare and Water Spout thanks to its resistances while threatening both Reshiram and Kyogre with Draco Meteor and Thunder, respectively. Choice Band Groudon can OHKO Poison Arceus with its enormous Earthquake, and even with Will-O-Wisp, Poison Arceus should not try staying in on offensive Groudon. Giratina, Skarmory, and Lugia should be considered as partners to handle offensive Groudon. Chansey and Blissey are natural partners to any physical wall, Poison Arceus included, as it will greatly appreciate Wish support and someone to absorb powerful special attacks for it.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Calm Mind
    move 1: Calm Mind
    move 2: Sludge Bomb / Judgment
    move 3: Focus Blast / Fire Blast
    move 4: Recover
    item: Toxic Plate
    nature: Timid
    evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Poison-type moves are resisted by four types, not including Steel, while only hitting Grass-types super effectively, who are rare in Ubers. However, Poison Arceus's immunity to Poison-type moves, especially Toxic, allows it to set up on both Chansey and Blissey with impunity. Apart from absorbing Toxic Spikes, this set plays identically to almost every other Arceus forme's Calm Mind set.</p>

    <p>The choice between Sludge Bomb or Judgment is up to the user. Sludge Bomb is the preferred attack, because it exchanges only 10 Base Power for 30% poisoning rate, which could end Calm Mind wars with Poison Arceus with the upper hand. However, sometimes poison might not come in handy; for example, if a Physical Attacker, such as Extreme Killer Arceus, switches in and gets poisoned, you will no longer be able to cripple it with a burn, thus Judgment is a very solid option. Judgment also has more Base Power, but that's subsidiary, as this set does not focus on immediate power. Focus Blast is recommended in the second slot due to its ability to hit most Steel-types for super effective damage. Fire Blast is another option to roast Ferrothorn, Forretress, and Skarmory in one blast, though when using Fire Blast Arceus loses the ability to smack Dialga hard, and Heatran is now immune to both of its moves. Ice Beam, on the other hand, trades the ability to hit Steel-types for the ability to hit the plethora of Dragon-types in Ubers for super effective damage, most notably Giratina, who resists Sludge Bomb with its Ghost typing.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Poison Arceus greatly appreciates Groudon being out of the picture before it attempts to sweep, as the standard Rock Polish Groudon will always OHKO Arceus with Earthquake, while Arceus needs two Calm Minds under its belt to OHKO with Ice Beam or five Calm Minds to guarantee an OHKO with Focus Blast. Lugia makes a fantastic partner for Poison Arceus by resisting Psychic- and Ground-type moves, and Lugia can wall any Groudon set with a combination of Reflect and Roost. Wobbuffet is a great teammate for Calm Mind Arceus, as with Encore, it can almost guarantee a free Calm Mind boost for Arceus while your opponent switches out. Wobbuffet greatly appreciates Poison Arceus removing Toxic Spikes. If Ice Beam is chosen over Focus Blast, Magnezone makes a great teammate, trapping and killing off the Steel-types that wall you, though Magnezone needs Hidden Power Fire to eliminate Ferrothorn. Cresselia is also a decent partner by providing useful resistances to Poison Arceus's weaknesses while easily walling Groudon and Garchomp. Giratina-O makes a great partner by checking Mewtwo who is a major threat to this set and checking Groudon to an extend.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>For the Support set, Judgment or Sludge Bomb can be used over Ice Beam or Flamethrower because it is Arceus's strongest attack, but having a Poison-type move as the only attack is horrible in Ubers. Thunder Wave or Toxic can be used over Will-O-Wisp on the Support set, but Will-O-Wisp's ability to cripple Poison Arceus's biggest threats in Groudon and Garchomp makes it the superior choice. Earthquake can be used to eliminate Heatran in one hit.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Mewtwo is definitely a huge threat for Poison Arceus, being able to switch into any of Arceus's unboosted moves. Psystrike can OHKO the Calm Mind set regardless of any boosts, while the support set is 2HKOed. Mewtwo can even set up its own Calm Minds while taking little damage and threatening not only to destroy Poison Arceus but to take out your entire team. Will-O-Wisp will not even cripple Mewtwo because Psystrike uses its Special Attack stat. Heatran and other Steel-types are a pain for Arceus because it will have to rely on Focus Blast's shaky accuracy in order to take care of them, as they are immune to its STAB move. Steel Arceus should be especially noted, as not only can it Calm Mind boost alongsidePoison Arceus, but it could also use Roar to phaze your Arceus out, putting you in a real tough spot. However, Steel Arceus risks being OHKOed by Fire Blast in the sun, or a super effective Focus Blast after a Calm Mind boost. Ground Arceus and Psychic Arceus are another great counters, being able to strike hard Poison Arceus with their STAB moves and KO without boosts. It should be noted that Ground Arceus also resists Poison Arceus's STAB. Groudon can shatter Poison Arceus's thick hide with a mighty Earthquake. Rock Polish and Choice Band Groudon will always OHKO non-support Poison Arceus with Earthquake. Groudon has to avoid Will-O-Wisps though. In a similar manner, Garchomp can pose a threat if Arceus lacks Ice Beam or Will-O-Wisp, as Choice Scarf Garchomp will 2HKO with Earthquake. Excadrill is immune to Poison Arceus's STAB, but must be wary of Fire Blast or Focus Blast. In sandstorm, Excadrill's Speed is doubled due to Sand Rush, making it faster than Poison Arceus, while still retaining the ability to OHKO Calm Mind Poison Arceus with a super effective Earthquake. Reshiram and Kyogre can OHKO the support set with their mighty STAB attacks. If Arceus failed to set up enough Calm Minds, both Reshiram and Kyogre can OHKO Arceus with Water Spout or Blue Flare, respectively. Calm Mind Kyogre can set up alongside Arceus and win the war with its superior special stats and weather-boosted attacks. Ho-Oh can smash poor Poison Arceus with its mighty Sacred Fire or repeated Brave Birds while laughing at most attacks, though Ho-oh will not enjoy facing the support set if it has Roar and Stealth Rock because Ho-Oh absolutely hates taking Stealth Rock damage.</p>
  2. shrang

    shrang Go to your room
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    Seems fine.

    AF 1/3
  3. Furai

    Furai a Ωdefender // a αguardian
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    Thanks, shrang. Keep these AF checks coming, I really want this GP checked again!
  4. barry4ever

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  5. shrang

    shrang Go to your room
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    Actually:

    http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4039503&postcount=11

    Maybe explain Sludge Bomb vs Judgement?

    Sludge Bomb:
    + 30% Poison rate to defeat other boosters (Massive)

    Judgement:
    + More power (Not that important, since we're not focussed on immediate power)
    + Does not inflict status so you could still potentially burn other Pokemon (although I believe this is very minor, as CM Poison Arceus isn't burning things anyway)
  6. Furai

    Furai a Ωdefender // a αguardian
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    Thanks barry!

    1 more and I can get this GP checked.


    EDIT: Will mention, shrang.
  7. Eo Ut Mortus

    Eo Ut Mortus Elodin Smells
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    Sludge Bomb exchanges ten Base Power, not five.
  8. shrang

    shrang Go to your room
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    Small nitpick:

    Sludge Bomb is 90 BP, so it's a 10 BP difference.
  9. Furai

    Furai a Ωdefender // a αguardian
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    Oh, oops. Changed
  10. Banedon

    Banedon

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    Would it be more accurate to say it exchanges 15 base power because Arceus is getting STAB on it?
  11. Furai

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    No, it doesn't. We're speaking Base Power only
  12. Banedon

    Banedon

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    Yes but every time Arceus uses those attacks it will not have 90 / 100 base power. Barring weird Pokemon with idk-what-attack-it-is-that-changes-the-target's-type, it will have 135 / 150 base power, and the effective difference is 15. I'd suggest noting this down at least.

    Incidentally is there a CM Pokemon that Poison Arceus wins CM wars with thanks the Sludge Bomb's poison rate? Mewtwo is just going to walk over Poison Arceus, most other Arceus formes are going to have Recover in a CM war, and so will at least hurt Poison Arceus enough until it's easily revenged. Good chance Kyogre will have Rest, Manaphy doesn't care, Lugia is going to Roost. I guess Giratina-O, but it resists Poison and will probably have Sub, so ...

    Also:

    Should be spelled "definitely".
  13. shrang

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    Fighting Arceus is the biggest one. You can also go one-on-one against stuff like Dark Arceus (yeah, he has Refresh, but he'll have to waste turns Refreshing and then Recovering off the damage, which hands you the momentum which probably lets you crit first), and other more offensive CM Arceus forms (that don't hit you super effectively) won't enjoy constant residual damage, either, even if it is only 12.5% per turn. Lugia isn't going to like constant Poison damage either, so you can easily get like a poison hit in and then go to Dialga or something and then whittle it down.
  14. Furai

    Furai a Ωdefender // a αguardian
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    I changed definetly to definitely.


    I will not change that Base Power difference, because it seems completely wrong to me. We're speaking Base Power only, not the addons.
  15. bojangles

    bojangles IF YOU TRULY BELIEVE,
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    Looks fine to me.

    AF 3/3
  16. Furai

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    Alright, thanks a lot bojangles!

    I would like this re-GP checked again, so if anyone can to that it would be awesome.
  17. November Blue

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  18. November Blue

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    [​IMG]

    Poison Arceus Analysis (open)


    [​IMG]

    GP Approved.
  19. Furai

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    Implemented, thanks NoBlue. This is Done!
  20. Komodo

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    uploaded

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