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PokéMafia Postgame

Discussion in 'Circus Maximus' started by Raikage, Mar 27, 2010.

  1. Raikage

    Raikage

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    Basically I can't be on the computer for many reasons, so I'll be making this over time, sort of. You might want to check back over time in case I update this.

    Comments by me, Raikage

    The main draw of this mafia was supposed to be evolution, but I agree with many others that evolution was never a big enough factor in this mafia. I suppose Avatar and I didn't want to rock the boat too much. The other big surprise in this mafia was the composition of the numbers and roles. The village had much more people than the mafia - a true uninformed majority. To make up for it, the village had much worse roles than the mafia. All in all, I thought the game was actually pretty balanced. Every side claimed that they were the weakest (including the supposedly broken Strong) and most people had differing views on the strongest side.

    Role PMs

    Mew wasn't very well used. It was said that if you found a bad guy you could kill him with the vig or just lynch him, but Mew had other uses as well such as de-volving his own team when it was beneficial and also because he held the Everstone. In addition, he was an important bargaining tool for use with Jirachi.

    Bog standard BG who couldn't protect himself. I decided to give him an evo item to guard to make it a little more interesting.

    Ditto was originally fucking powerful but in line with our philosophy of weak village with numbers we nerfed him bad. Sorry Outlaw!

    ...And sorry, Mekkah. This role was basically a negative role and drew loads of suspicion. It also held the Pokeball, which kidnapped the guy holding it for a cycle. Mekkah suggested that it would have been better to say that the guy holding the Pokeball gets killed if he holds onto it longer so that it would be passed around and fulfill its hot potato role.

    Twins, except I don't believe in the 'gains power when they die' concept. Instead, they were given roles that worked fairly well together.

    Bog standard hooker.

    Voltorb/Electrode are the standard suicide bombers that I invented as a false claim all the way back during Apocalypse. They're actually a pretty good role since a 1-for-1 deal is great with the village's numbers. We lied, by the way, Deoxys Defense Form beats the `Trode.

    Remarkable role but Dubulous (sadly) butchered it. Basically, this role could have faked an inspect, bg, vig, or any other power role death and throw the mafia off guard, but it was never used this way.

    The vig pair. This made for a pretty weak vig since you couldn't protect both of them and they were also doubly vulnerable to inspect and hook.

    This role was invented due to me and Avatar recalling our Cell shenanigans back in DBZ and the Cthulhu fiasco in Apocalypse. The main idea was that you could check the deaths for a third faction or to check if someone had betrayed you, but this role was never very useful. To make him marginally more important, we gave him an evo item to guard.

    Poor thunda. This role was intended to be one of the most useless roles, but it could have proven marginally useful if it had survived for long, but it didn't.

    The mayor/champion. Nobody picked up the oddity of Pichu evolving to Raichu and skipping the famous Pikachu stage and thus the secret evo was never unlocked. It was pretty hilarious since Lightwolf was frightened to death of the de-evo beam, not realizing it would make him stronger.

    Charmander was actually a powerful little role as it cleaned a large amount of people and was arguably better than Charmeleon. Charizard never materialized but he could have been very effective as killing some mafia would have been invaluable with their small numbers. It wasn't stated but he had a cap of 3 aliases killed maximum. He also formed a combo with Mew in that after the rampage was used he could be de-evoed back to bpv.

    A role that only works in a restricted item-hold mafia. Nothing much to say here about the role except that it also works as an item guard since a thief could only hold one item.

    Bog standard rogue that evolved into a team rogue, which I thought was a neat way of solving the rogue problem. Vigoroth didn't exist.

    Pretty standard role here that died early, the only significance it had was inspecting Rayquaza under Ttar's protection and thus keeping Rayquaza alive until the final night.

    This role was apparently very confusing and I can't imagine why. It swapped the order of day and night such that there would be 2 days and then 2 nights. The net benefit of this was basically that you could kill off a mafia earlier and his ability would be lost for an additional night, but this role was never used.

    Evo inspector. It's actually pretty powerful and can detect moles pretty easily but it didn't do anything significant.

    Thief guard. It could protect Buzz to ensure the safety of two items, and was unknowingly the target of Seviper to make it more powerful. This resulted in a bit of confusion since the Devious were convinced Zangoose was Strong instead of Pure.

    Kung-Fu master Heracross counted one night action as two for purposes of evolution, and we decided to give him a berry to guard from Garchomp to make his role a bit more involved.

    Announcer. Avatar and I envisioned a good mole stealing the Microphone and causing mayhem with it but this never materialized. Jigglypuff could evolve as well by announcing thrice, but he wasn't told that. Wiggytuff was the same as Jiggles but could send an anonymous message to an alias every night as well. I mainly did this to reward the village if they kept the item where it was supposed to be.

    Standard inspector.

    The balloonist. Finding 2 NPCs could have proven pretty useful in my opinion since it would have helped shed some light at the end game. Inspired by Apoc for both roles, the inspiration for Driftblim being that during Apoc we had no idea who were NPCs and thought Max and zerowing were NPCs when they were really just idlers.

    Scavenger, not much to see here.

    Devious

    An extremely powerful role that provided some much needed muscle to the Devious, who mostly were comprised of queers. Darkrai was easily the strongest of the three eaders.

    Tricky little role and probably the most creative one in the game, but I thought that it wasn't nearly used as well as it could have been. The Devious kept trying to get people godkilled instead of tricking people as was intended and dak saw through Shadow Trickery as a result of this. Shadow Matter was used ok and was partly why there were so many items with unknown properties in this game (nearly all of them) - so that a Shadow Matter item wouldn't arouse too much suspicion.

    A funny evo line. Abra was a bit of a troll because we envisioned the Devious running around trying to find him when he was basically invincible as long as he kept his mouth shut, and Kadabra was a filler role since we didn't want Zam out so quick. It also gave us an excuse to introduce more useless items to the game (berry).

    A very powerful late-game role that was used to pretty good effect. Vote changers tend to be useless early game so we decided to give him a pretty good thief as well so he had something to do during early game.

    Another funny evo line. I thought Duskull -> Dusclops was a good way to make the recruiter useful after the team had been assembled. Ironically, Dusknoir proved to be more useless than Dusclops due the number advantage conferred by kidnap, whereas Dusknoir's strategic deadtalk was worthless since all the dead Devious swore not to deadtalk in exchange for info on the game.

    A deceitful killer that wasn't used all that well, partly because it died so early, but it did get revived. It was thought that the the role could be used to mess with the other's perception of the Devious' kills but the Devious didn't bother to use it in this way. If Seviper hadn't been revived the Devious would have to pick a role as killer and then had the restriction of being unable to kill on prime numbered nights (2,3,5,7,11,13, and 17 if it ever got there)

    Standard BG, but he was the only one who could protect himself.

    With the numbers in the game, we thought that a crossfire would be pretty fatal and thus introduced this role. It was also a bit of a natural role since the mafia inevitably has to co-operate anyway.

    Necromancer, with an extra kill to make the Devious' kills even more tricky (and make up for the one day lag time of Seviper's).

    Strong

    Rayquaza had bosschoice and global BPV, but global BPV was never used due to Eo being hooked and killed during the fatal night. It may have helped to use it earlier. All in all, actually a pretty weak boss since bosschoice is really a team ability rather than role specific, so we made him immune to thieving as well.

    The Strong's version of the funny evo line. Machoke was possibly weaker than Machop but it was mostly a filler role. Machamp basically gave the Strong unblockable kills but they had to conform to either odd or even nights only instead of their olympian kill if they wanted that. Machamp could also throw someone over the horizon and force them to walk back to the battlefield (which we thought was hilarious), essentially kidnapping them for 2 cycles, though the above pm wasn't changed to reflect that.

    Poor aamto didn't know anything, then died. Riolu evolved when 2 of his team members died and Luke got a redirect for every dead member with insane priority, but he still couldn't affect killers.

    Broken role according to many. I must admit it was extremely powerful but I thought that it was made weaker by Dragonite, whose PM should have alerted the village to the possibility of inspected 'NPCs' being protected aliases.

    Standard BG for Scyther. Scizor gained a one-time revival ability where he could activate the ability and come back if he's killed within 2 cycles of activating the ability.

    Bidoof and Zigzagoon combined into one, in line with the 'stronger roles' theme for the mafia.

    Ctrl F 'Chatot'

    An inspector that we tried to make more interesting by giving him a one-time BPV and an evo item.

    Garchomp the mighty. Gabite was already fairly good but Garchomp was extremely strong. I don't think it's justified to claim that Garchomp was broken though due to his restrictions and the fact that the Devious actually had more kills as a team than the Strong did.

    Neutral

    One of my favourite roles; I thought it was a pretty good wolf. We gave him a .75 kill since there were already too many kills in the game (especially for his size) and that worked out ok. He was expected to Defense Form early to gain access to his full kill but instead took the risky route of holding on in hopes of winning at the end through Def Form, which wasn't a bad strategy. Had a good false claim.

    The plate duo. Celebi wasn't very well used to EA idling and the roles didn't go as how I thought they would. Jirachi's starchild was never messed with which was disappointing; he could lend the item to the other groups for a night so they could make pacts without him. In addition plate info was leaked so Fishin didn't even need to mess with anyone to get it. The Night 12 condition I thought was pretty good in making sure that the neutrals wouldn't be biased towards anyone.
  2. Team Aether

    Team Aether

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    Huh?
  3. Raikage

    Raikage

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    I havent written all the comments due to lack of time.

    This goes for the PMs as well. We obviously didn't write some role PMs until the person evolved, it would have been a waste of time and effort. I'll describe the roles without an actual pm in my comments.
  4. Agape

    Agape

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    I think this was a balanced game, it all came down to tactical thinking as it should (as smogon mafia trades psychology for tactics O_o).

    Some creative new roles, a fitting theme and the concept of evolution. What else could one want?

    Hard to say if Gmax' Dusknoir evolution would have changed the outcome.

    Magikarp for president.

    GO DEVIOUS!
  5. Outlaw

    Outlaw

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    You should be sorry.
  6. Bass

    Bass Brother in arms
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    where's my best gimmick award for stump the PokeFan?
  7. jumpluff

    jumpluff
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    Moderator

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    However, you're still susceptible to lynches; if everyone hates you enough to vote you out of town, you'll go cry in a corner and leave the game.

    rofl

    crybaby gmax
  8. Accent

    Accent

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    go devious

    sorry strongths i have been admitted in the cool club


    (i didn't use caps because when i shout it makes buildings explode)
  9. Dubulous

    Dubulous I look just like Buddy Holly.
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    i have no regrets, although i suppose i should have asked a few people how i could better put my role to use. i knew it was a role meant to die, however, and i believed that a kamakaze was the best course of action. the possibility of taking out an entire team was much too enticing. the reward was worth the risk, i mean.

    it also didn't help that the role i claimed was essentially the same as kumar's. live and learn.
  10. Raikage

    Raikage

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    All comments done
  11. Mekkah

    Mekkah
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    You monster, you actually did it. :)

    I would have liked to have been more involved in this game but there's only so much one Dragonite can do when dak is demanding control. I'm still of the opinion dak was too careless with info management but you'll never hear him admit it. Did all I could, basically asking Gmax to kill me (he already had me delay-killed at that point so w/e), but making sure to do all I could to get CN to give sheet access to billy/asim/lesm I think before I did die.

    The role PMs look very neat in a way, btw. They're not very long, and the overall choice of Pokemon is pretty cool and has some nostalgic feel. At face value, the game doesn't look very imbalanced either, but obviously that's what happens when all three factions gang up on the village at once.
  12. MagicMaster87

    MagicMaster87

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    Hey, where's my awesome role PM?
  13. Jackal

    Jackal I'm not retarded I'm Canadian it's different
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    pokemon mafia: the mafia game I lost yet no one had any idea i was even playing until after the game was over (except billymills)
  14. jumpluff

    jumpluff
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    i actually really loved this game, the role pms, roles, etc. though we had some disagreements and i'm still iffy about the balance. i think, even though i made several mistakes, i did the best i could for my team, and that's what counts. gj starting postgame!

    GO DEVIOUS
  15. Gmax

    Gmax kuahahahaha
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    lol, so you actually completed it this early. That's surprising. Good job!

    This game was a blast! Things weren't looking so good initially, with us having no inspector, having our BG lynched, and having our killer murdered by the Strong, and jumpluff, our mole in the Pure camp, on the verge of being exposed by a pact made with Fishin. It looked like despite having a mole in the village ranks in the form of jumpluff, who was privy to quite a lot of sensitive information, and a decent bunch of roles to work with, we would lose to the village, that had been uniting under dak, LW, CN and Mekkah. The situation seemed pretty bleak. Then things started to pick up really fast. Altair managed to get into the good books of the village, and picked up EW's delayed kill abiity. Jumpluff found Kannon the Zangoose. LN contacted us, and put us in touch with evan and the Strong. We also figured out a way to beat the pact with Fishin. All this took place within three phases, which unfortunately involved the death of jumpluff in between, killed by the Strong because. From that point onwards, both mafia factions and the wolf launched a combined assault on the village using all the info we had amassed with their inspections and jumpluff's moling, taking out the village leadership within two nights, and taking out their power roles the next.

    From that point on it was pretty much a war between the Strong and the Devious. We each had a trump card hidden away. The Devious had Altair holding a souped up version of EW's kill after killing Kannon, looking like a villager. The Strong had Eo, their one-time global BG, supposedly hidden away as the supposedly confirmed NPC Gambler. We both believed we had the aid of Fishin (though Fishin worked with the Devious for a large portion of the game, which was of immense importance). So basically after a bunch of tied votes where both men died (which was a gay rule that I hope isn't used again), some more village massacre, with LN falling on the wayside(props to LN, the village would've won without you), we ended up at Night 11, with the village having 8 men, the Devious having 5, and the Strong having 5 too. Two Strong men were due to die that night thanks to a delayed Devious kill and a regular Devious kill. The Strong were activating their one-time Global BG. After much hesitation, discussion and drama, we decided to hook Gambler, since we believed he was Strong, and it would make most sense for the Strong to kill one of ours using him, since he had been hidden all game. This effectively sealed the game in the favour of the Devious the next day, where we managed to get rid of Gambler thanks to a last moment vote switch by Altair, which I'm sure was a nasty shock for billymills and eo. This was a fun game, and the Devious bunch made for a great team to work with. Thanks to the rest of the Devious for being so great, to Fishin and EA for running with us, to LN for dominating the village, and THANK YOU Raikage, Avatar and Chronicles for hosting such an awesome game!
  16. Jackal

    Jackal I'm not retarded I'm Canadian it's different
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    also i want to say that this actually was a very good game except for, as gmax pointed out, the lynching rule.

    The whole game was essentially decided, among a few other things, based on the fact that i posted a lynch vote about 4 seconds late.

    Also this was kind of another case of "whichever team the neutral decides to help will win", which i hate, but other than these 2 things I really enjoyed this game!

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