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Potential sets for underused Pokemon in the CAP metagame

Discussion in 'CAP Metagame' started by Vryheid, Dec 13, 2013.

  1. Vryheid

    Vryheid fudge jelly

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    Specifically, the Pokemon I'm referring to as "underused" are Mollux, Malaconda, Pyroak, Krilowatt, and Voodoom. They are easily the least common Pokemon I see in CAP matches and all suffer from either crippling weaknesses or simply losing whatever niche they had back when they were originally created. Are there sets for these Pokemon that could make them not only viable but entirely competitive in Gen 6 CAP matches? And if so, how would they play out in ways which the original creation process could not have predicted?

    The first Pokemon I've been experimenting with from this list is Krilowatt. From personal experience, I've found that it along with Voodoom have been the least threatening CAPmon I've ever used or had to face, which is the reason I started toying with them first. I assumed that to make any effective use of them in Gen 6 CAP I'd have to find them a role significantly far from what the standard Gen 4 OU analysis suggests players should make use of. After some experimentation this is what I've found to be the most useful set for my team and potentially other players, as it has helped me break through some very tough defensive cores used by some good CAP players:

    [​IMG]

    Krilowatt @ Assault Vest
    Ability: Magic Guard
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Ice Beam
    - Surf
    - Thunderbolt
    - Earth Power/HP Fire/Signal Beam

    At first glance, you'd think that a Pokemon with the second highest BST in CAP and a fantastic ability like Magic Guard would be an incredible threat. Unfortunately, its godawful stat distribution and mediocre movepool ensures that other Pokemon totally outclass it at everything it's supposedly good at. Cyclohm is a better physical wall, Wash-Rotom is a better Water/Electric type sweeper, and pretty much every other special attacker in CAP can do more damage than this thing can do even with a Life Orb. Even Wobbuffett does a far better job with Mirror Coat/Counter revenge killing. It doesn't help that it can't use superior Water type attacks like Scald or Hydro Pump, or any sort of reliable recovery moves. Revenankh can set up for free on this Mon, which can be a huge liability for your team.

    So why even bother using Krilowatt at all? Well, it's quite good at the one thing Pokemon with no good recovery moves and lopsided defensive stats seem to be designed for- using an Assault Vest. The main niche Krilowatt has over other AV users is the ability to easily switch into and threaten both Tomohawk and Cyclohm, two of the most common and influential defensive pivots in the tier. Using Assault Vest over Leftovers allows it to consistently take on even offensive sets such as Choice Specs Cyclohm with Draco Meteor or Tomohawk with Earth Power.

    This by itself may not sound like much, but used in conjunction with offense threats like Revenankh and Cawmodore- which repeatedly force the opponent to bring these pivots out- Krilowatt can get free potshots on the opponent's team as they desperately switch back out again. Krilowatt is also fast enough that it can often get yet another free hit on the switchback, possibly leading to a 2HKO. Magic Guard allows you to switch in over and over even when hazards are up, meaning a Krilowatt which forces enough switches can potentially cripple an opponent's entire team before your main sweepers even have to set up.

    EVs/Other Options:

    While the EVs may seem a little strange, without any HP investment at all Krilowatt still tanks special hits significantly better than an Assault Vest Wash Rotom does even with max SpDef and HP. It needs all the Sp Atk EVs it can get to ensure it can 2HKO the Pokemon this set is designed to counter. Thunderbolt and Ice Beam are obvious choices to deal with Cyclohm and Tomohawk, and also allows it to beat many common Water type Pokemon like Starmie, Slowbro, and Tentacruel. Earth Power and Surf help beat down Pokemon like Mollux and Volt Absorb Cawmodore that might otherwise try to set up on it. HP Fire is an option over Earth Power to deal with Ferrothorn and the Steel/Bug types, but isn't useful otherwise. Signal Beam is another option for the last slot, and is this Pokemon's best option for beating most Psychic types such as Aurumoth and surprising Malaconda switchins.

    Teammates:

    The most obvious teammates are Cawmodore and Revenankh, who can bait out the main defensive pivots this Pokemon is so devastating against. A Tomohawk of your own can help deal with Colossoil and other Earthquake users that would otherwise severely threaten Krilowatt, as well as prevent it from being Revenankh setup bait. Heatran and Mega Venusaur can threaten Necturna and many of the other hard hitting Grass type Pokemon which would otherwise break through Krilowatt's stellar special defenses.



    I'm going to keep testing Krilowatt and then switch to looking at Voodoom. I'm thinking a Choice Specs Set could be pretty damn hard to deal with, especially if it gets a boost from a predicted Electric move. I just don't see the point in using it otherwise, it just doesn't hit hard enough without Specs and Tomohawk totally outclasses its supporter sets thanks to Prankster.
    Last edited: Dec 13, 2013
  2. Yilx

    Yilx Sad
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    except the whole point of krill was that you specifically tailor him to do ONE job
    such as patching up a specific hole ot covering a highly specific threat, that's krill's whole concept
    he's not an "lol i swepe u" mon
    Luigifan, Arcticblast and S0L1D G0LD like this.
  3. Vryheid

    Vryheid fudge jelly

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    Every Pokemon in existence can be specially designed to cover "one specific threat". That barely qualifies as a "concept", that's more like "here's a Pokemon with a butchered stat spread and movepool, let's mutilate even further it to make it occasionally useful against something that can switch out anyways". The Krilowatt I made isn't just here to "patch up a specific hole", it salvages what's good about Krilowatt to turn it into a defensive pivot that can punish opposing teams for using quite a few common specially offensive threats while partnering extremely well with common physical threats in the current CAP meta.

    And it's funny that you say it's not a sweeper, when the first sentence of the number one listed Krilowatt set says "This Krilowatt is a surprisingly excellent sweeper, despite only having a base 83 Special Attack stat." Yes, the people who made this Pokemon seriously thought giving it 83 SpA and no setup moves was enough to allow it to be able to sweep. They reiterate this in the section specifically dedicated to CAP battles- "even with Magic Guard, Krilowatt is many times unable to stop these threats at all, forcing him to be an offensive threat himself or go unused." And since people new to CAP are going to come in and see these sets they're going to think that Life Orb Krilowatt is straight up the best set it can use despite it being more of a liability than an asset in Gen 6 CAP teams.

    I'm not posting this thread in an attempt to say that certain CAP Pokemon are completely useless, I'm saying that there has to be more potential in them beyond the movesets created for them when they were originally designed.
    Luigifan likes this.
  4. Eagle4

    Eagle4

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    I wouldn't say Krilowatt is an underused CAPmon at all. It can singlehandedly dominate rain teams, and has great typing, fantastic coverage and deent versatility. On the same tangent, Mollux is also one of the more used CAPmons due to its immeasurable versatility as both an offensive threat and a special wall. The only CAPmons I would consider "underused" are Pyroak, Fidgit, and Voodoom, with Revenankh and Arghonaut being sub-par as well (although still used a lot by newer players).
  5. Vryheid

    Vryheid fudge jelly

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    I agree that dominating rain teams is useful- but not quite so useful this gen because of how rare Weather teams as a whole are in the CAP meta. I've seen maybe one high-rated player regularly use Weather teams and because there are so many good Grass types and pokemon like Mollux currently in CAP, you don't even need Krilowatt to easily shut them down now. Cyclohm is super common and is an excellent counter to Keldeo, so there goes another Gen 5 golden weather child. To be fair, I did mention the water resistance in my post though, saying that Krilowatt can easily take on the likes of Tentacruel and Starmie.

    Personally, I think that this benefit is nice, but not a primary reason to use it considering how uncommon weather teams actually are. It's main job should be to punish defensive pivots and support common offensive sweepers that can singlehandedly wreck entire teams.

    ...

    "revenankh" "sub par"

    I'm sorry but WHAT? What CAP were you playing where Revenankh wasn't one of the most dominating sweepers in existence? It can set up on the majority of special and physical attackers in CAP/OU, is practically immune to status, and is nearly impossible to take down thanks to that ridiculous bulk and constant health regeneration from Drain Punch. There are a grand total of TWO commonly used Pokemon that can reliably switch into and actually threaten the Bulk Up set, being Intimidate Cawmodore and Tomohawk (two equally overpowered CAPmons). Arghonaut can wall it and a few Pokemon can phase it out, but they will take heavy damage in the process and it's only delaying the inevitable late game sweep. "Checks" like Alakazam and Gengar get demolished before they can even make a move. After a Bulk Up, it's pretty much invulnerable on the physical side- it can tank hits so well that Mega Medicham with Psycho Cut and Bullet Punch will still lose to it. On the special side, even frigging Tornadus-T with Air Slash loses to Revenankh after a Bulk Up if Stealth Rocks is up.

    I'd argue that in Gen 6 CAP Revenankh is biggest offensive threat in the entire metagame. It will crush your entire team unless you have a plan in advance to deal with it, and even then nothing but a few specific counters are a surefire bet. You can at least reliably stop something like Aurumoth or Necturna with priority, but Revenankh brushes off every priority attack in the game bar Brave Bird from Talonflame. With a couple of Bulk Up boosts or by simply having SR up it will easily take down Talonflame as well. Revenankh also has the ability to singlehandedly counter and threaten some of the most devastating threats in OU, such as Genesect, Terrakion, Mega Kangakhan, and Mega Lucario. NO other Pokemon can do that, not even in Ubers.

    I'm not going to argue that Arghonaut is super amazing, but it is way better than all the CAPmons I listed in my original post. Like Revenankh, it can reliably check almost every physical Pokemon in existence and can threaten to sweep with Bulk Up. Unlike Revenankh, it's extremely vulnerable to status and a number of Pokemon can reliably wall it no matter how many boosts it gets. Still, Unaware is pretty sweet, and I don't think it needs any niche beyond what's already listed in its article.
  6. jas61292

    jas61292 used substitute
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    Well, personally, I wouldn't say Kril is underused at all. I mean, it was number 6 in usage last month, and for good reason. Simply put, its LO offensive set is one of the most devastating and versatile sets that has ever existed on any Pokemon. Sure, there are a few common Pokemon who can wall it, sort of, but but not incredibly well (it can easily switch out its 4th move for something to beat a counter depending on team makeup, most notably HP Fire or HP Grass). Yeah, its not the most powerful Pokemon out there, but nothing that strong and that fast with that good coverage has nearly that much bulk (The speed is the biggest key. If you are running a bulky LO set, you are doing it wrong).

    With that said I definitely agree about the rest of those underused guys, especially Mollux, who went from a top 5 quality pokemon to very, very mediocre with the loss of permanent rain this gen. However, Mollux still has some great qualities that give it a few useful sets, the main one of which, in my opinion, is as a Scarfer, being able to revenge kill almost any water type out there, among many others. Its easy to forget it, but Mollux is actually the most powerful CAP we have ever made, and while in the past people have gone defensive with it, if you want to succeed with it today, you really need to take advantage of that power.

    Mollux @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Dry Skin
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Fire Blast
    - Sludge Wave
    - Thunderbolt
    - Trick

    Poison getting a buff this gen is especially nice for Mollux as its type is now even better than ever. A new double resist gives it more switch in chances, and its poison STAB is now actually not bad at all offensively. It hits incredibly hard, and while it may not be the most useful scarfer ever, it brings qualities to the table that no other scarfer can.

    As a side note, Mollux is also a fantastic Pokemon on a Sticky Web offense team. Effectively can work like the scarf set, but can use another item and switch moves, making it even more deadly.

    ---

    Now, on a different topic, I just want to say that on the topic of Revenankh, I personally see it as a mid-OU quality Pokemon. Is it good? Yes, definitely. Is it a top sweeper though? Not against any good player. Its a Bulk Up tank that can be a great last Pokemon once you clean out some of its counters, and, while almost no one does, it can make a wonderful tank when using non-Bulk up set. However, it just has way too many solid counters among good Pokemon (most notably Tomohawk) to really be what I'd ever call one of the most dominating Pokemon in the game.

    However, whether or not it is one of the best or just one of the middle of the pack Pokemon, it is certainly not underused or underappreciated, so it is not really relevant to this topic. Lets try and keep the thread on those that actually fall under what this thread is for.
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2013
  7. Fuzzie

    Fuzzie

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    To simply rank the CAP usage to give an easier idea of who is underused and who is overused:

    1. Tomohawk
    2. Aurumoth
    3. Colossoil
    4. Revenankh
    6. Krilowatt
    7. Stratagem
    9. Mollux
    10. Necturna
    11. Syclant
    12. Cyclohm
    16. Malaconda
    19. Pyroak
    21. Kitsunoh
    25. Fidgit
    35. Arghonaut
    46. Voodoom

    100. Cawmodore (Though it is new, this is forgivable)

    The bolded half of the list are those that I believe are under used CAPs. There are not many surprises there, with squishy wizard Syclant and ultimate support Fidgit, which would take a bit more skill/knowledge to properly use than bulky sweepers such as Colossoil or Krilowatt.

    On the topic of potential sets, anyone who knows me knows just how much I love Fidgit. It is a shame that he is not used, but it is also not a surprise. I think people are discouraged by his unoffensive movepool and generally "sub-par" stats, as with the majority of the underused CAPs. He has many good sets, but I find that he is an excellent lead.

    Fidgit @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Vital Spirit
    EVs: 252 HP/ 4 (S)Atk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Spikes
    - Encore
    - U-Turn / Earth Power
    - Whirlwind

    There are two things Fidgit has that I believe make him stand out more than other Spikes/Stealth Rock users. First his his speed, he will be able to drop at least one layer before running the risk of being paralyzed/flinching. The other is his ability. Whenever I use another hazard laying Pokemon like Skarmory, I am always put to sleep. I am not sure if this is just bad luck, or every single trainer in the history of Pokemon Showdown puts Spore on their lead, but it has really frustrated me. However, with Fidgit, I cannot be put to sleep. My only worries are Glare and Fake Out.

    The Focus Sash works well with Fidgits speed, ensuring that I am able to drop at least two hazards before fainting, or one hazard and a whirlwind if I am in need of phazing. Spikes needs no introduction here, this is the primary reason why I use Fidgit. With how few people use Rapid Spin, it will guarantee a great amount of damage against those who do not properly prepare for it. The only reason why I do not run Stealth Rocks alongside it is because in the CAP metagame, there are only three (two, with Syclant's Mountaineer) who have a weakness to it. Mollux and Aurumoth. Everyone else either takes it neutrally, or shrugs it off.

    Encore is good against both those who think it is a good idea to set up, and those who make the mistake of using a weak/ineffective move against Fidgit. They will then either continue using the move until Encore wears off, or they will switch out, which allows you to send out another layer of hazard. U-Turn (4 Atk EVs) is a good pivoting move against those pesky Taunters, which allows you to at least do some damage before getting out. Alternatively, Earth Power (4 SAtk EVs) has STAB, a higher base power, and uses Fidgit's stronger stat, but at the cost of being ineffective against Taunting Tomohawks, as well as forcing Fidgit to stay in the battle (though this could also be a benefit, as he will be able to quickly lay waste to low SDef Pokemon like Mollux.) Finally, there is Whirlwind. This move tops off Fidgit's set by not only allowing him to phaze, but also allowing him to deal additional damage with Spikes. The Focus Sash once again ensures that you will at least get one Whirlwind in.

    Counters and Teammates:

    There is a short list of counters, since as long as Fidgit gets at least one hazard in the field, he has done his job. Rapid Spin renders him next to useless, but having a Ghost type on your team allows you to milk more damage out of the Spikes. Fake Out and Glare as mentioned earlier also screw over Fidgit, Fake Out causing both flinching and negating the Focus Sash, while Glare avoids Fidgit's immunity and still causes paralysis. Finally, multi-hitting moves, such as Icicle Spear or anything used by Mega-Kangaskhan, as they find their way around the Focus Sash, rendering it useless. Good teammates are any Ghost type, as they prevent Rapid Spinners, as well as Pokemon with Dragon Tail, allowing even further use of the hazards.
  8. Vryheid

    Vryheid fudge jelly

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    What drives me crazy about Fidgit is that it could support a lot of other goofy and underused sets if Persistent was working properly. If you can Trick Room with it you're pretty much guaranteed to get a second turn U-turn with it. This lets Choice Specs Mollux get a damage free switchin with 5 turns left on Trick Room and do some absurd damage with Eruption. Pretty much anything that isn't a resist or a heavily invested special wall can get OHKOd:

    252+ SpA Choice Specs Mollux Eruption (150 BP) vs. 36 HP / 252 SpD Colossoil: 394-465 (94.7 - 111.7%)
    252+ SpA Choice Specs Mollux Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 124 SpD Tomohawk: 423-498 (102.1 - 120.2%)
    252+ SpA Choice Specs Mollux Eruption (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Pyroak: 444-523 (100 - 117.7%)

    If you somehow managed to get up Sunny Day as well... you can just run a Life Orb set with Fire Blast and wipe out your opponent's entire team right then and there.

    Personally I feel like U-turn is pretty much mandatory on Fidgit, because you need something to safely scout out Illusion Aurumoth leads. Personally I don't find it all that useful for me to just run a straight up utility hazard mon, but if I did want a stall team I would definitely partner this with Necturna to block Rapid Spin, maybe put down Toxic Spikes, and handle the inevitable water/ground attacks that try to threaten it in battle.
  9. DetroitLolcat

    DetroitLolcat Maize And Blue Badge Set :)
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    Revenankh is not the colossal threat it's made out to be in this thread. Although its two STABs form one of the best attacking combo in the game, Revenankh cannot do it all in a metagame that isn't particularly kind to it. With Tomohawk and particularly Togekiss flying around and walling Revenankh to no end, Revenankh develops some four-moveslot syndrome wanting to run both Rest and Ice Punch. Furthermore, Aegislash's handy Fighting immunity means that Revenankh cannot heal with Drain Punch and King's Shield (because of the Attack drop) means that Revenankh will lose to Aegislash unless it predicts perfectly.

    Furthermore, Revenankh absolutely needs Special Defense investment to set up on Pokemon such as Mollux, Krilowatt, and weak Specially-based walls. That means it won't be investing in Attack. Revenankh will switch in with an uninvested 105 base Attack and horribly weak STAB and coverage moves (nothing above 75 BP). It needs a Bulk Up boost to do decent damage; even Super-Effective Drain Punches barely sting without a boost.

    Revenankh is a good Pokemon, definitely. But it needs Ice Punch to get past Pokemon such as Gliscor, Togekiss, and Tomohawk, and even then the latter two Pokemon will need to be severely weakened before Revenankh can pick them off.

    You do need to be prepared to face Rev in the CAP meta, though; it's not a Pokemon that just "gets countered" by adequate teambuilding unless you happen to use Tomohawk or Togekiss. Its best set is:

    Revenankh @ Leftovers
    Ability: Shed Skin
    252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SDef
    Careful Nature
    -Bulk Up
    -Drain Punch
    -Shadow Sneak
    -Ice Punch

    I'm not even sure if Rest deserves a mention anymore. So many Pokemon resist Fighting and Revenankh's Ghost STAB isn't strong enough to make up for it.
  10. Luigifan

    Luigifan

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    I personally think Malaconda is vastly underrated as a destroyer of special sweepers.
  11. FlarZ

    FlarZ

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    This isn't really just a set. It's more so an explanation of how to team-build with Voodoom. Voodoom is a lightningrod user with high speed and special attack. This year however, MR.Crocker was right the fairy invasion has begun, and voodoom is now an easy pick off for stuff like florges, clefable, and sylveon. That being said, voodoom can pair well with Mega-Scizor to eliminate these problems. Now, what does mega scizor get in return? his 3rd and 4th teammates Poliwrath and Gyarados. Politoed and Gyarados are both water types, reisting fire. Poliwrath's weaknesses are resisted by voodoom (electric) and Scizor (grass).
    Gyarados's weaknesses include Rock (voodoom) and Electric (voodoom). With that being said, these pokemon can form a nearly Perfect rain core. Here are the sets.

    Voodoom @ Life Orb Ability: Lightningrod EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef Timid Nature- Dark Pulse- Aura Sphere- Vacuum Wave- Counter



    Gyarados @ Gyaradosite/Life Orb/Leftovers Ability: Moxie Evs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP Jolly/Adamant Nature- Waterfall- Dragon Dance- Stone Edge- Earthquake



    Scizor @ Scizorite / Choice Band Ability: Technician EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk/ 4 Spd Adamant Nature- Bullet Punch- U-turn/Bug Bite- Knock Off- Superpower/Swords Dance



    Politoed @ Leftovers Ability: Drizzle EVs: 252 HP / 252 SDef / 4 Satk Calm Nature- Scald- Ice Beam- Rest- Sleep Talk
  12. finnaggann

    finnaggann

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    i use a voodoom and an arghonaut along with commodore which allows me to draw electric attacks switch into voodoom destroy the opponent or they switch and when they least expect it(after they killed voodoom) I send out arghonaut and then commodore with the same combo destroying the opponent. so two of those on your list are essential to my team. revenankh is good but I do not see it, pyroak I see and it is quite good, fidget is the only one in your list that I would call underused or subpar.
  13. EternalSnowman

    EternalSnowman

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    I want to say this right now. Something that Krillowat CAN do as a sweeper and a check to things like Revenankh and Cawdomore. Krillowatt has access to the move Heart Swap (Manaphy's move) and what it does is that it exchanges stat boosts between the two participants. You can essentially steal things like Dragon Dance boosts from Dragonite or Bulk Up from Revenankh and Belly Drum from Cawdomore.

    Krilowatt @ Life Orb
    Ability: Magic Guard
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
    Jolly Nature
    - Heart Swap
    - Waterfall
    - Thunder Punch
    - Ice Punch

    Krilowatt has 84 attack which is 1 point higher than its special attack and a completely viable physical movepool with BoltBeam+Water STAB. This is a pretty niche set but can dominate the game in the right situation.
  14. finnaggann

    finnaggann

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    that seems unlikely because I kill it in one turn with voodoom.
  15. jas61292

    jas61292 used substitute
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    First off, that is a completely invalid reasoning for such a claim. Losing to one thing does not mean something doesn't fill a role. What's more, your example isn't even correct in any sense of the word. Voodoom CANNOT OHKO Malaconda. Ever.

    252+ SpA Choice Specs Voodoom Aura Sphere vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Malaconda: 296-350 (79.7 - 94.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    And that is with highly unrealistic sets. With a more realistic Timid Voodoom and max SpD Malaconda, it is failing to even 2HKO most of the time.


    With all that said, your post, and the one it was responding to, don't really add anything to the thread. If you have a set, for the thread, feel free to post it, but don't make comments without any evidence about a Pokemon without a set even posted in the thread.
  16. finnaggann

    finnaggann

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    I spoke from experience, but I think I had a special boost and used focus blast. Despite that you make a good point and I am sorry for being a bit of an idiot.
  17. DarkSlay

    DarkSlay This Wouldn't Have Happened In Romney's Smogon
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    Decided to bump this up, as not only has there been a wide gap since the last post but threads like these coincide with what PRC is talking about currently. Therefore, I have a fun set for people to try that's both effective and gives a new use for an underused CAPmon!
    [​IMG]
    Noh More Hazards
    Kitsunoh @ Leftovers
    Ability: Limber
    EV's: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Spe
    Moveset:
    - Defog
    - Will-O-Wisp / Taunt
    - Shadow Strike
    - U-Turn / Earthquake / Ice Punch

    Thanks in part to Dark buffs/Steel nerfs and the rise of Aegislash, Kitsunoh has been delegated to a much lesser position in usage when compared to previous generations. No longer being the only Steel / Ghost type in the metagame, Kitsunoh's offensive, scouting and stallbreaking sets have lost some luster in XY. However, what some players may not know is that Kitsunoh has access to Defog, a great utility move in XY and one of the few CAP Pokemon to have said move (quite ironic, since its non-inclusion back in Gen IV and V was due to its then uselessness). What makes Kitsunoh stand out amongst existing Defog users is its combination of typing and movepool, as many prominent Defog users are weak to Stealth Rock or are useless against Defiant users (namely Bisharp).

    Defog is a must on this set, obviously. It has the potential to switch in on a good number of attacking types (Fighting, Ice, Grass, Dragon, etc.) and garner a free Defog. Kitsunoh is one of the few Pokemon that resists Stealth Rock, is immune to Toxic Spikes and learns Defog (the others being Empoleon and Flygon), so that's a plus. It also has good match-ups against common Pokemon in the tier, most notably Tomohawk lacking Earth Power. Will-O-Wisp cripples opposing Pokemon who try to switch in on a potential Defog, particularly Bisharp, Mega Mawile and Cawmodore, as well as other physical threats. Taunt is another option over Will-O-Wisp to shut down Pokemon like defensive Tomohawk and Chansey, rendering them near useless, as well as giving Kitsunoh a pseudo-role as a stallbreaker. Toxic can be used as well over these two moves to cripple bulky Pokemon and walls like Cyclohm and Tomohawk, but does leave Kitsunoh open to a good deal of offensive threats when compared to Will-O-Wisp, so it is simply just an "Other Option". Shadow Strike is a good move in general and allows it to fight against opposing Ghost types, as well as Psychic types such as Mega Gardevoir, Aurumoth, Necturna and Lati@s. The last move is personal preference, depending on what your team needs. U-Turn and 110 Speed enables Kitsunoh to quickly switch in, Defog, and safely switch out against slower opponents. This eases prediction while also giving it an offensive tool against common switch-ins like Colossoil and Cyclohm. Earthquake gives it a decent offensive option against Heatran, Cyclohm, Mega Mawile, Mollux, Mega Charizard-X, Bisharp, and a variety of other threats in the metagame. Ice Punch is specifically for Landorus, Cyclohm, Tomohawk, and Colossoil, but the damage output really isn't that impressive on non-4x weak Pokemon. Still, if you want to be able to offensively pressure these things, this is an option.

    The EV's are pretty self-explanatory: 252 Speed EV's lets it out-speed a good portion of the metagame, while 252 HP EV's gives it as much general survivability as possible. There are benchmarks in Attack for coverage moves if need be, though. The standard variant of this is a Defog user first, a supporter second, and an attacker third, so heavy Attack investment isn't totally necessary. Leftovers is for general survivability and gives Kitsunoh its only form of recovery. Air Balloon is an interesting alternative, letting it switch into errant Earthquakes and giving it a pseudo-immunity to Spikes until it is popped. Limber is the optimal ability here, as it always seems to be, ensuring that it will never be slowed down by paralysis.

    OPTIMAL OFFENSIVE PARTNERS: Mega Charizard-X, Mega Gyarados, Kyurem-B, Mega Charizard-Y, Mega Pinsir, Gyarados, Stratagem
    OPTIMAL DEFENSIVE PARTNERS: Sylveon, Chansey, Cyclohm, Pyroak
    Last edited: Jun 19, 2014
    dwarfstar, jas61292 and HeaLnDeaL like this.
  18. Vryheid

    Vryheid fudge jelly

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2013
    Messages:
    155
    Tomohawk should be listed as a prime defensive partner to deal with inevitable Colossoil switchins (seriously, this monster is everywhere). U-turn the predicted switchin, sub up on Tomohawk, then BP your way to a sweeper that resists whatever they send in to deal with it. I do think Defog is an innovative way to make use of Kitsunoh, at the cost of not being able to run a Scarf.
  19. Tadasuke

    Tadasuke

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2013
    Messages:
    62
    [​IMG]
    Mixed Stall Pyroak

    Pyroak @ Leftovers
    Ability: Battle Armor
    EVs: 252 SDef / 248 HP / 8 Def
    Calm Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Substitute
    - Leech Seed
    - Ancient Power/Any other special coverage move
    - Will-O-Wisp/Toxic

    Movepool Choices:

    I'm going to start this off by saying that Pyroak isn't really a Pokemon too well suited for the CAP metagame. Its intentions were for it to be usable in DPP OU, not for the dangerously more fast paced XY CAP tier. However, this set is going to try to change all that. Its basic intent is to be able to set up a Substitute then thoroughly piss off the opponent with a combination of Leech Seed and either burn or toxic poison. Added to that is any coverage move that can help against offensive checks to Pyroak. I chose Ancient Power for Special Rock-type coverage in to take care of Talonflame, both Charizards, Kyurem-B, Pinsir, and any other threat to Pyroak that's weak to Rock. It also allows for that 10% chance of having all of your stats boosted by 1.5x. The choice between Will-O-Miss and Toxic depends on how Physically weak your team is in general.

    EV Spread:

    The EV spread is very basic. 252+ Special Defense makes Pyroak a defensive threat to wannabe Special Sweepers. 248 HP makes it so Pyroak can have its highest amount of HP possible while still having an odd HP stat. This lets it switch in more frequently to Stealth Rocks and Spikes, due to a lower HP percentage being taken as damage. The 8 EV's in DEF are just the remaining EV's put to their best use.

    Threats:
    • Talonflame
    • Tomohawk
    • Charizard variants
    • Ferrothorn
    • Chansey/Blissey
    • Heatran
    • Mega-Venusaur
    • Magic Bouncers
    • Grass-types
    • Infiltrators
    • Taunt
    Potential Teammates:

    • Tomohawk - Tomo goes with everything. Don't question it
    • A physical Water-type - Creates a Pseudo-FWG core and helps balance out Pyroak's special tendencies.
    • Tyranitar - Helps Pyroak cope with its Talonflame and general Flying weakness, while also bringing the potential to set up Stealth Rocks and Sandstorm to whittle down the opponent further.
    • Mandibuzz - Clears hazards away and serves as a check to the main Magic Bouncer in the tier (Espeon)
    • Colossoil - Spins, bounces, and looks cool doing it
    • Aurumoth - Illusioned to be a Pyroak, Aurumoth can safely set up so long as the opponent doesn't have a Talonflame.
    Show Hide
    I'd like to finish off our long journey by thanking my legs for always supporting me, my arms for constantly being at my side, my fingers and toes for being something that I can count on, and lastly, the sidewalk for keeping me off the streets.
  20. NinjaStars

    NinjaStars

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2013
    Messages:
    67
    Assault Vest on Malconda is deadly. He can take a Special Hit and hit hard off of its base 100 Attack especially with Knock Out
  21. Tadasuke

    Tadasuke

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2013
    Messages:
    62
    You should edit your post to have a full set for AV Malaconda. Believe in yourself!
  22. V4LOVER

    V4LOVER

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2010
    Messages:
    105
    Speaking of Malaconda, here's a set that I used to quite some success:

    [​IMG]

    Infinite ChestoRest Malaconda

    Malaconda @ Lum/Chesto Berry
    Ability: Harvest
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
    Careful Nature
    - Rest
    - Aromatherapy / Toxic
    - Taunt
    - Knock Off

    Abusing Harvest because it can. 252+ brings Malaconda's SpDef to 394, allowing it to easily take a large majority of unboosted special attacks. Rest works in conjunction with the Lum Berry as a means of full recovery, as well as dispelling any status that might plague Malaconda along the way. Chesto can be substituted instead of Lum if you don't want Rest to be interrupted by an unfortunate lack of a harvested berry. Aromatherapy is good as team support, allowing it to be useful outside of its own specially defensive world, and to get rid of status when running Chesto Berry so as not to waste it on a Rest. Toxic can be used in place of Aromatherapy if you want toxic stall, or Knock Off just doesn't cut it. Taunt shuts down opposing walls or stall Pokemon. Knock Off is the main source of damage (only one if Aromatherapy is run over Toxic), has a power boost when the opponent still holds an item, and gets rid of it to boot.

    As an example of what this Malaconda can do, it can wall and take out a Cyclohm not running Signal Beam with a combination of Rest healing and Knock Off spam. Dragonblaze052 can attest to this (iirc, it made his decision between Ice Beam and Signal Beam). While I don't have a replay of it, you can try it out on your own and see how it works for you.
  23. heartofgold

    heartofgold

    Joined:
    Oct 1, 2010
    Messages:
    31
    I see the appeal of AV Malaconda, and it makes it even more specially bulky than it already is (ie, EXTREMELY), but the fact is AV seems like a waste of both Malaconda's incredible support movepool and ability - Harvest. Glare is an awesome move, very valuable when used in conjunction with strong, not-quite-fast enough heavy hitters like Aurumoth, Kyurem, or Mollux. And Harvest is, frankly, the ONLY reason to use Malaconda. Instant, passive 25% HP recovery? That's reasonably reliable? Yeah, that's a lot more valuable than some extra bulk on the special side. I suppose a gimmicky Infiltrator set might work, but frankly it's hard to pass up that recovery.

    And let's keep the Malaconda love train going! This one's my favorite, not necessarily groundbreaking though. It opts for a slightly more offensive approach, using that handy Attack stat.

    [​IMG]

    THE SET
    Malaconda @ Sitrus Berry
    Ability: Harvest
    EVs: 252 HP / 108 Atk / 148 SDef
    Careful Nature
    - Knock Off
    - Power Whip
    - Sucker Punch
    - Toxic/Glare

    AT A GLANCE
    The thing's got KILLER bulk on the special side - unless your opponent has got something that's SE AND STAB, it's gonna have a tough time. Flamethrower from Stratagem? No problem! Fire Blast from Cyclohm? Bring it on! Krillowatt? Yeah, good luck with that. The Attack EVs aren't particularly tailored to anything, and could probably be fine-tuned. As it stands, they just give it a little extra punch. As far as moves go, Knock Off is a must, and Power Whip provides a surprisingly useful Grass STAB for picking off Krill, Strata, and Colossoil (note: Malaconda is not a Colossoil counter. Heartofgold is not responsible for any damages obtained attempting to use it as such). Sucker Punch is a natural fit for something as slow and strong as Malaconda, and can pick off a variety of threats after they eat a Knock Off on the switch. From there, it's a question of utility. Toxic is handy for wearing down Cyclohm, who'd otherwise completely wall this set. It's also good for catching Tomo on the switch, who's a pretty hard stop to Malaconda. Conversely, Glare's a great utility move, and an option for slowing down offensive switch-ins, and can provide valuable support to a variety of sweepers.

    Overall, Malaconda's problematic - it gets beat hard by anything physical, and fairy, fighting, flying, and bug is a bad slate of weaknesses in CAP (and in Gen VI in general). Not only that, but two of the premier CAP Special Sweepers - Aurumoth and Syclant - carrying devastating Bug STAB moves. That said, it's bulky, strong, and what it can shut down it shuts down hard - I'm looking at you, Krillowatt/Lati twins.

    PARTNERS
    • Tomohawk: What Tada said. But moreover, Tomo resists both Fighting and Bug, and is the tier's best physical wall. Covers Mala's weaknesses extremely well.
    • Heatran: Two slots on Special Walls? If you've got the room to spare, they've got incredible synergy - Heatran easily handling Bug, Fire, and Fairy moves, and Malaconda picking up the dreaded Water and Ground types.
    • Volkraken: Besides taking those pesky Thunderbolts with little trouble, Malaconda can deftly handle Cyclohm, the Lati twins, and Goodra, who otherwise tank Volkraken's STABs.
    NinjaStars and CerberusSONE like this.
  24. Tadasuke

    Tadasuke

    Joined:
    Nov 30, 2013
    Messages:
    62
    Have any of the people posting Malaconda sets thought of using Harvest with Tanga Berry?
  25. V4LOVER

    V4LOVER

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2010
    Messages:
    105
    Outside of Rest, Malaconda has no move that can reliably recover HP (hence the ChestoRest or Sitrus). Halving damage from a glaring 4x weakness is awesome, sure, but gaining that HP back will make him last much longer than with a Tanga Berry. Keeping Rest and running Tanga Berry would probably lead to the use of Sleep Talk - and at that point you've used up two move slots just for a 50% chance every turn to (re)gain a berry that reduces a 4x weakness to a 2x weakness, effectively.

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