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DPP OU Presenting: The number one ranked offense team!

Discussion in 'RMT Archive' started by panamaxis, Jan 4, 2009.

  1. chenman333

    chenman333

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    Naive is totally better than Mild or Rash. With LO and a neutral nature, Flamethrower still does the damage it needs to do against steel types, Draco Meteor still kicks ass Draco Meteor+Outrage still KOs anything that doesn't resist it, and more importantly, you know for sure that you are going to at least tie with non Scarf Zapdos (the only common one being Jirachi, which should be obvious early game. And Flygon too).

    Going with mild or rash means that many of those Zapdos and Salamence that are EVed to outspeed Lucario will outrun you.
  2. RaikouLover

    RaikouLover

    Joined:
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    Great team!

    I'm posting because I've actually used this team before in its entirety (with permission from Panamaxis :-D).

    My only suggestions I've ever had to make were real minor EV fixes and such:

    I still prefer this spread for Metagross 252 HP / 240 Atk / 16 Spe so that you can outspeed and Explode on Skarm. However, the positive is that you also explode on those 84 Spe Magnezone's that are just trying to beat Skarm since they actually do exist still and I've taken a few down with me. Also, Lum Berry > Leftovers IMO, but its preference.

    For Gyarados... why not just max Speed and Attack? What does the HP get you? But then again, the extra speed doesn't get much either now that Shaymin-S is banned. So between your spread and the standard spread is Dugtrio, Sceptile, Alakazaam, Swellow, and Weavile. None of them pose too much of a threat I guess, and I haven't seen Sceptile in about two months.

    For Salamence.... man just go 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe... your wierd EV spread, lol.

    As far as the team goes.. This team obviously works great, but it does take some getting used to when you play with it. It took me a few battles to understand exactly how everything worke. One of the things I did have trouble with was Sitzmark annoying protect Stall Team, but meh.

    Azelf really is the secret weapon. For starters, any time you can bluff a Choice Item is a good thing, especially with the type coverage Azelf has. I've found myself using Psychic on Machamp as they go to something like Scizor, then just Flamethrowering for the OHKO, as they expect me to switch out. Then blowing up out of no where... thats 2 kills right there, which is crucial for an offensive team.

    Also, I don't know why people suggest Tyranitar as an answer for SpecsJolt as it is a solid 3HKO with SR (I've run into the situation a ton of times). As soon as they see the initial attack, they don't bother pursuiting since Thunderbolt does 34-40% (so the calculator says, but for some reason I've always seem to done more...) so just switch out and Tyranitar has no business "countering" SpesJolt for the rest of the match. If your Tyranitar has taken ANY prior damage, it most likely loses.

    Anyway, Tyranitar hurts this team more than helps. Its slow, and Sandstorm will hurt Salamence and Latias severely.

    Well, the key to that set is the Speciall Attack. Latias is just barely managing the 2HKO and Tyranitar and Scizor so has little offense to spare. If you want to stay in on Salamence, you need to make sure you outrun ALL Salamence, meaning you need to switch to a Timid nature. If you do that, you no longer are guarenteed to 2HKO Tyranitar. In most cases, you soundn't stay in for the dragon confrontation. As for other Latias' if you see leftovers, I always stay in and I'm sure Panamaxis does to as most Latias' Dragon Pulse only hits for 55-60ish%, while you Draco for the OHKO. So when you look at what sits between 330 Speed, Timid and a 280, Modest you see these pokemon:

    Zapdos
    Salamence
    Flygon
    Calm Mind Jirachi
    Calm Mind Celebi
    Calm Mind Life Orb Suicune
    Mamoswine
    Roserade
    Porygon-Z
    Jolly Lucario
    Gliscor

    So out of this common list... Zapdos can't hit you for shit, Salamence and Flygon you should avoid, Calm Mind Jirachi will set up on you anyway, Celebi you shouldn't fight if it Calm Minds, Suicune never tries that confrontation, Mamoswine will Ice Shard you, Roserade is a lead or scarf 100% of the time, Porygon-Z is most likely Scarfed, Jolly Lucario you can't OHKO either way, and Gliscor you just pummel with DM. So against most of these Pokemon the increase of speed doesn't benefit the ant-pursuitness and the extra power.

    Anyway, great team man!
  3. panamaxis

    panamaxis Allons-y!
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    I've killed a lot of salamences with my own, just be outspeeding, so naive definitely has its benifits (although i might test a + sp. atk nature). Azelf is actually a great addition to the team, beating mamo, scizor, infernape and explosion just tops it off.

    RaikouLover with my weird EV spread i 2HKO blissey with EQ and outrage.

    I'm gonna give metagross 16 speed evs, but I'll take them out of HP, so metagross, because if i take them out of attack, metagross has a slimmer chance to OHKO hippowdon with explosion.

    The HP evs on gyarados help against scizor / lucario / infernape / heatran / weavile and are much more useful than outspeeding rare base 120's.
  4. paramylodon

    paramylodon

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    On the standard latter, which has worked out better for you, snorlax or flygon?
    It is a fantastic team, and I enjoyed watching you play with it on shoddy.
    I, and others on similar skill levels, can learn a lot from watching such good players as yourself.
  5. panamaxis

    panamaxis Allons-y!
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    Both have their uses. I've played a lot more games with flygon, but I'd have to say snorlax is probably more useful. It's a great switch-inn to bulky waters and self-destruct is pretty much a guaranteed kill (does around 85% to skarmory). I've done 98% to a suicune using selfdestruct when burned.

    Latias is the most useful.
    Snorlax is the second most useful
    Flygon is the third most useful.
  6. feral_brute

    feral_brute

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    Aug 23, 2007
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    Congrats on the ranking and posting such a great team!

    I've been using a team with 4 of the same pokes you have on here, and have been having such major issues with random paralysis users and specs jolt as mentioned before that I've been testing out a LO Mamoswine to absorb the electric attacks and predicted t-waves. With no resists, and Latias as your only pseudo-status absorber, what do you do to prevent your team from being bogged down if someone starts spamming T-wave?

    Lead Infernapes and Heatrans are major pains, but I don't really know if they're a big enough issue to consider running earthquake and/or an occa berry on metagross. His explosion is awesome, and taking out the opponent's bulky water or hippo/donphan is fun too.. I usually like to keep him alive and at fairly decent health so I can get him in later in the game and explode on a threat, but his bullet punch has came in handy too. If you do opt for Earthquake, definitely keep bullet punch and replace meteor mash.

    Nothing major, just random suggestions and nitpicks. Azelf really plays a huge part in this teams success. Keep up the great teams!
  7. GotengoXGodzilla

    GotengoXGodzilla

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    Really good looking team. I think it could go far, if it already hasn't. Quick question: Say Latias stays Uber (hypothetically speaking). What pokemon do you think you'd replace it with?
  8. panamaxis

    panamaxis Allons-y!
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    On the standard ladder I use snorlax or flygon, so if latias becomes uber ill probably keep using them.

    @feral Brute: Latias takes thunder-waves and will beat always beat specs jolt unless it uses shadow ball, in which case its bait for scizors pursuit.
  9. blasphemy1

    blasphemy1

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    I think Expert Belt > Leftovers could work well on Azelf. Azelf could be a pretty good lure for Scizor, and even tho most can stay in, a smart player will see lefties recovery and immediately send in something else. Expert Belt appears like a choice item, since their is no recoil/recovery involved, and the opponent won't notice the difference in damage between Expert Belt and a choiced Azelf. Other than that, great team.
  10. panamaxis

    panamaxis Allons-y!
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    The thing is, most thing that azelf hits super-effectively will die anyway, the exception being Tyranitar. With leftovers recovery, azelf has a better chance of surviving scizors bullet punch, which is more crucial then bluffing a choice item. It also helps when playing in a sandstorm. I've already playtested Expert Belt, but I prefer leftovers.
  11. paramylodon

    paramylodon

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    panamaxis,
    I've a question and no better place to ask it.
    I've watched a lot of your games (as, like I said earlier, I'm always interested in watching really good players play to try and learn).
    When I was playing NIHILUS, and you started watching, he said something which suggested you told him in the past that I was watching many of your games.

    Some others (mostly whom I've accidentally watched multiple games of trying to get an idea of the new UU metagame without actually playing) complained when I watched their games, making me realize that some may find it annoying, something I then realized I may have been (especially with then disclosing that you've been testing snorlax, something you didn't mention yourself).

    Getting back to the question...is it bothersome?
    If so, I sincerely apolagize.

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