1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Rain, Rain, Come And Stay

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Hydreigon X, Nov 15, 2012.

  1. Hydreigon X

    Hydreigon X

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2011
    Messages:
    6
    This team utilizes rain to mow down everything in its path, yet be able to stall teams and hit back hard with rain-boosted moves. My first RMT here on Smogon.

    ~~MY TEAM IN A NUTSHELL~~

    Show Hide
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    ~~A CLOSER LOOK~~

    [​IMG]

    *Kermit (Politoed) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Perish Song

    Suggestion by ganj4lf. A Choice Scarf Politoed is a good revenge killer, outspeeding many Pokemon such as opposing Politoed. Hydro Pump is a spamming move and is, I feel, OP while rain-boosted. Ice beam is to take down pesky Dragon-types, and HP grass takes down enemy Water-types such as Starmie who try to take advantage of the rain. Perish Song takes down boosted Pokemon, in which I will use Perish Song then switch out to a wall.

    [​IMG]

    Draco (Dragonite) (M) @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Multiscale
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Mild Nature
    - Hurricane
    - Thunder
    - ExtremeSpeed
    - Dragon Pulse

    Special Attacker. Hurricane and Thunder both have 100% accuracy in rain, so I try to abuse it as much as possible. I don't really want to lose too much HP over life orb, however, because I want to exploit Multiscale. Extremespeed is a good priority move to take down opponents that have less than 20% HP. Dragon Pulse is the preferable STAB move to hit Pokemon for neutral damage.

    [​IMG]

    *Obesity (Chansey) (F) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    - Seismic Toss
    - Thunder Wave
    - Wish
    - Protect

    Suggestion by ganj4lf, who said that Chansey is better than Blissey in this team. Wish + Protect helps out my sweepers in battle, and Thunder Wave cripples enemy sweepers that utilize speed such as Venusaur in sun. However, I feel that this set is easily crippled by Substitute Gengar.

    [​IMG]

    *Punchy (Breloom) @ Toxic Orb
    Trait: Poison Heal
    EVs: 236 HP / 212 SDef / 60 Spd
    Careful Nature
    - Bulk Up
    - Spore
    - Seed Bomb
    - Drain Punch

    My Bulk Up wallbreaker. I found that on opposing teams, Spore is a very good move to shut down walls. In this set, I will first use Spore on the said wall, set up with Bulk Up and proceed to Seed Bomb/Drain Punch the opponent.

    [​IMG]

    *Fairy Thingy (Azelf) @ Light Clay
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 HP / 4 Def
    Jolly Nature
    - Taunt
    - U-turn
    - Light Screen
    - Reflect

    Idea from undisputed. He suggested that I increase my defenses, so I decided that I was going for the Dual Screens strategy, I also found out a hole in my team, and that is that I don't have a taunter. Azelf fits perfectly, with maximum EVs assigned to Speed and HP to ensure that it hits first and absorbs the damage taken. Though I'm quite unsure of using Azelf as a Dual Screener due to its low defenses.

    [​IMG]

    Rock Thingy (Forretress) @ Shed Shell
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SDef
    Relaxed Nature
    IVs: 0 Spd
    - Volt Switch
    - Rapid Spin
    - Stealth Rock
    - Gyro Ball

    Every good team needs a spinner. And an entry hazard-layer. Forretress fits both jobs perfectly. Gyro Ball hits hard because of its low speed investment. Volt Switch ensures that it carries momentum for the team. I use Shed Shell to escape from enemy Magnezones, as I need to keep my bulky spinner alive.

    So, there's my team, so please help me rate and improve on it, and identify any threats to this team!

    Note: A star (*) denotes a new change.

    ~~IMPORTABLE~~

    Kermit (Politoed) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Perish Song

    Draco (Dragonite) (M) @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Multiscale
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Hasty Nature
    - Hurricane
    - Thunder
    - ExtremeSpeed
    - Dragon Pulse

    Obesity (Chansey) (F) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    - Seismic Toss
    - Thunder Wave
    - Wish
    - Protect

    Punchy (Breloom) @ Toxic Orb
    Trait: Poison Heal
    EVs: 236 HP / 212 SDef / 60 Spd
    Careful Nature
    - Bulk Up
    - Spore
    - Seed Bomb
    - Drain Punch

    Fairy Thingy (Azelf) @ Light Clay
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 HP / 4 Def
    Jolly Nature
    - Taunt
    - U-turn
    - Light Screen
    - Reflect

    Rock Thingy (Forretress) @ Shed Shell
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SDef
    Relaxed Nature
    IVs: 0 Spd
    - Stealth Rock
    - Rapid Spin
    - Spikes
    - Gyro Ball


  2. ganj4lF

    ganj4lF Nobody is safe from the power of science!
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Messages:
    785
    Hi. Your team is really interesting but has quite a bit of flaws, too.

    Your team is generally slow and susceptible to faster sweepers. LO Latios can come in on many things and just wreck everything if he can predict correctly, Psyshock 2HKOs Blissey, Draco Meteor OHKOs everything else except from Forretress, which is promptly disposed with Surf or HP Fire. Water attacks aren't a good news too, since even with your two resistances and Blissey you can be easily destroyed by those who usually use said attacks (Blissey dies to the main abuser of Water attacks, Keldeo, and Dragonite hates Ice attacks, that many Hydro Pump spammers carry. Politoed will absorb some hits, but it won't last forever). Also, you are 6-0ed by Venusaur in Sun (either Sludge Bomb or Sleep Powder versions). It just OHKOs everything at +2 after SR, the only exception being Blissey which can't do anything back and will die to +6 Giga Drains. Last, but not least, you don't carry Stealth Rock, which is a huge problem on its own.

    So, the first thing I'd suggest is to replace Quagsire with Specially Defensive Celebi. Celebi can do a number of things for your team, namely set up SR, take Water attacks (and Keldeo generally) without problems, tank somewhat LO Draco Meteors from Latios (64% max, which may seem a lot but it means that Latios can't 2HKO without entry hazards, and even with SR it's roughly 50% chance), absorb status and be a generally good special wall. You won't miss your Quagsire against BP teams, but I'll cover this later.

    Celebi (open)
    [​IMG]
    Celebi @ Leftovers | Natural Cure
    Calm | 252 HP / 224 SpD / 32 Spe
    - Giga Drain
    - Recover
    - Stealth Rock
    - HP Ice / Thunder Wave / Reflect


    The second suggestion is to change your Politoed in a Scarf variant. This would give you some serious revenge killing potential. It also carries Perish Song, to make sure you'll never miss Quagsire against BP teams or set-uppers out of control. Blissey support is awesome here, being able to WishPass and heal an otherwise easily worn down set. Politoed's defenses won't be missed either, since you have three solid walls in Celebi and Blissey (special) and Forretress (physical), both backed up with recovery in the form of Wish and Recover. Politoed will give you much needed offensive prowess, from a reasonable speed.

    Politoed (open)
    [​IMG]
    Politoed @ Choice Scarf | Drizzle
    Timid | 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Focus Blast / HP Grass
    - Perish Song


    So, we have covered Water attacks and general slowness till now, to handle Venusaur (and to an extent Tornadus-T) I suggest changing your Blissey set into a Chansey, like the following one (they basically do exactly the same job, just Chansey fits better IMHO):

    Chansey (open)
    [​IMG]
    Chansey @ Eviolite | Natural Cure
    Bold | 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
    - Seismic Toss
    - Thunder Wave
    - Wish
    - Protect


    This will allow to Thunder Wave Venusaur while taking its attacks, rendering it much less dangerous; Thunder Wave also tends to perform better against such an offensive metagame respect to Toxic. It keeps Wish Passing ability but loses Heal Bell, however that's not too problematic since you have now Celebi to take care of status in addition to Chansey itself. Chansey, as said before, also handles better Tornadus-T, since its superior physical bulk allows it to take Superpowers better, and Torn-T is obviously not happy about paralysis either.

    Hope my rate helped somewhat. Good luck.
  3. Hydreigon X

    Hydreigon X

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2011
    Messages:
    6
    Thanks a lot! However, I have a question: I need a way to cure status from my team, I think it's easily crippled by Paralysis and Toxic. You removed Heal Bell for Thunder Wave in this. So how do I counter status inducers (e.g. Spore Breloom)? Thanks.
  4. undisputed

    undisputed
    is a Tutor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Frontier Lackeyis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2009
    Messages:
    2,117
    Hey!

    Nice team, man. I think you're team is caught in between stalling and playing a little offense. In my opinion, you'd be better off going with one or the other, and I'm going to recommend a stall approach.

    My first suggestion is to take Terrakion and replace it with Specially Defensive Jirachi. This set will give you some defensive help, especially against Rain teams. Blissey won't be able to take them alone, and Jirachi compliments her nicely. Focus on using Blissey against predicted Water attacks, and leave Jirachi to counter other special attackers like Tornadus-t that Blissey can't beat by herself. Jirachi's applications are much greater than Terrakions long term. While you might be able to switch in and pound a Ferrothorn occasionally, Jirachi will provide defensive benefits that outweight Terrakion's immediate power.

    Second, on Quagsire, definitely try the moves Curse / Earthquake / Scald / Recover. You can try Waterfall instead of Scald if you want, but Scald has it's uses (namely burning Ferrothorn). This will give you an endgame Pokemon to finish the battle with. Right now you're just stalling, but you have no way to definitively stop a last Pokemon sweep attempt. Defensive Quagsire is also a good Defensive Pokemon anyway, so it will be a countering utility mid-game, and then an end-game finisher.

    Third, for Dragonite, I'd like to see you use Thunder / Hurricane / Earthquake / Roost. For EV's use 248 HP / 252 Sp Def / 8 Sp Atk. This is a great Specially defensive counter and rain tank. Roost is for longevity, and Earthquake is for catching Tyranitar and Steels off guard.

    The choice of item on Forretress is up to you. I personally like Leftovers, but Magnezone is pretty popular lately, and I don't want you to straight up lose to those teams.

    On Blissey, switch the Sp Def EVs to HP. It's a better spread. Blissey stops almost every Special Sweeper in its tracks, and now you have more Special defensive walls anyway.

    Good luck!
  5. ganj4lF

    ganj4lF Nobody is safe from the power of science!
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Messages:
    785
    Well, this is a problem, but many teams don't rely on an Heal Bell user to handle Breloom. You could just switch to Celebi and try to put the Breloom user in a bad position (he can't touch Celebi, so he may switch out while you'll get rid of Sleep on switch out, or he could stay, doing little damage and giving you the chance to wake and smack with HP Ice or paralyze). If you can't really play without Heal Bell, feel free to ditch my Thunder Wave suggestion, however I think that you'll have far biggest problems that way.
  6. Hydreigon X

    Hydreigon X

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2011
    Messages:
    6
    @undisputed thanks a lot for the suggestions, but I might want to keep Extremespeed on Dragonite cause I want a priority move that can knock off about the last 20% of HP of any opponent (especially Ice-types) and using Roost I lose my Ground-type immunity. I don't have any Ground-type counters in my team, can you suggest some for me? Also, by losing Terrakion, I'm also losing Fighting-type coverage and wallbreaking potential. What do you think of this? Thanks.

    @ganj4lf Thanks a lot, Thunder Wave is working like a charm. I'm also considering adding Toxic Spikes on Forretress, but I'm afraid of it being redundant while I have a Thunder Wave user on my team. Perhaps I should use Stealth Rock on Forretress replacing Volt Switch and switch out Stealth Rock on Celebi for another move, and which move do you suggest for that? Thanks.
  7. Hydreigon X

    Hydreigon X

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2011
    Messages:
    6
    My team has been edited, please view it and see what you guys think!
  8. ganj4lF

    ganj4lF Nobody is safe from the power of science!
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Messages:
    785
    You still need to add SR somewhere. Forretress is the obvious, and easier way to fix this, and a moveset of Stealth Rock | Spikes | Rapid Spin | Gyro Ball / Volt Switch is perfectly viable. However, I always felt that such a moveset is too much for Forretress, who lacks reliable recovery and is vulnerable to Spikes. Forretress' main job is to wall and spin, and if you expect from it to set up more than one hazard, your expectation won't come true quite a number of times. I suggest giving up Spikes and just use Stealth Rock instead of them; SR is much more important for your team, nailing every non-Magic-Guard poke in the game and avoiding issues with Multiscale / Sash pokes. However, if you feel that your Forretress is consistently surviving longer than expected, you can consider running the previously listed moveset and try to squeeze in some layer of Spikes after having set up SR.
  9. Hydreigon X

    Hydreigon X

    Joined:
    Dec 14, 2011
    Messages:
    6
    Alright, I'll try SR/Volt Switch/Rapid Spin/Gyro Ball

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)