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Rainy Daze

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Jolteon Bandit, Mar 14, 2012.

  1. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
    Messages:
    116
    Rainy Daze OU Rain Team

    Introduction

    Greetings Smogon! I've used Smogon for ideas for teams for a long time, but I have only recently joined the forums and would like to post my very first RMT here. For my first team, I wanted to build around a Jolteon, one of my favorite pokemon, and bring it to its maximum offensive potential. Once it's counters are gone, Jolteon can go to town and bring down most any pokemon that isn't immune to its electric attacks. To do this, I gave the electric fox his most powerful attack and set up a rain team that would allow him to abuse the 100% accurate Thunder. So without further ado, here is my team:

    At A Glance

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    In Depth

    [​IMG]
    Politoed (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 228 HP / 252 SAtk / 28 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Perish Song

    What's a rain team without the OU Drizzler himself, Politoed. His role is pretty much straight forward; come in, set up Drizzle, go out. Right? Wrong. With these EVs, Politoed has surprising bulk and power. Not exactly enough to be a sweeper by any stretch of the imagination, but he can KO or damage some unsuspecting pokemon. Politoed's STAB Hydro Pump in the rain does pretty good damage to anything that does not resist water. There is always the risk of a miss though, so I can see Surf or even Scald being an option. Ice Beam hits dragons and grass types. I also use it if an opponent has low HP and I don't want to risk a Hydro Miss. Hidden Power Grass owns Swampert and Gastrodon and can be used on other water types as well, though Breloom is much better for that. Perish Song has saved games for me many times, especially against Baton Pass teams and set up sweepers. The most common counter to this pokemon that I have seen are Rotom-W and Gastrodon. As far as Rotom-W, I usually just switch to Breloom because neither Hydro Pump nor Volt Switch can really hurt it. Gastrodon is taken care of by HP Grass. I used to use a more defensive set, but I've opted for a hard hitting, tank set.

    [​IMG]
    Breloom (M) @ Toxic Orb
    Trait: Poison Heal
    EVs: 236 HP / 212 SDef / 60 Spd
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Bulk Up
    - Spore
    - Drain Punch
    - Seed Bomb

    I think everyone will attest that Breloom is a pain in the @$$ to face off against, no matter what set it's running. This is a Bulk Up variant and, surprisingly, I don't see it too often and many of my opponents comment on having not face many if any at all, which is surprising to me. After one Bulk Up, Breloom reaches 444 Atk and 294 Def and can take a variety of hits given his decent SpD. Add that to his excellent STAB coverage moves, amazing regeneration and inability to be statused and Breloom is just about unstoppable. What's more, it is so dang easy to come in and set up. Any wall can quickly become set up fodder for this mean, green pokemon. On a rain team, the deal is even sweeter because one of Breloom's weaknesses gets severely weakened. He fits great on this team because he can counter so much of what my other pokemon are weak against, namely, Ground and Electric type attacks. However, Breloom is not invincible, especially in rain. Special based flying type attacks ruin Breloom's day; most notably, Hurricane. Though I don't see it too terribly often, every once in a while I'll face a Tornadus or Dragonite with Hurricane. For that counter, I usually use Vaporeon to come in and try to sponge the hit then Rest it off. If I see it become more common, I may change either Vaporeon's EVs or switch Breloom for something else. But that isn't the case now so this is what I'll go with. Princess Bri helped me out with this EV spread.

    [​IMG]
    Forretress (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 16 Atk / 176 Def / 64 SDef
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Rapid Spin
    - Volt Switch
    - Gyro Ball

    Sigh. Some of you will see that I've replaced one of my favorite pokemon with this armor plated bug. In all seriousness though, Vaporeon and Politoed were essentially the same pokemon anyway, so I'm not losing too much by letting her go. Also, gaining Stealth Rocks is important for this team. It allows Jolteon to OHKO Dragonite by breaking Multiscale (which is reason enough given how common this pokemon is now) and is good for wearing down teams that have to switch on me a lot. Rapid spin is also incredibly useful since I also must switch quite often early in a battle. Volt Switch is a godsend in this generation for Forretress. It essentially lets him get out of Magnet Pull without needing Shed Shell. He'll still take an HP Fire, but rain and his bulkiness usually let him take at least one. It also allows a switch after an opponent moves, very useful if I want to bring in one of my more fragile pokemon. Gyro Ball is also a pretty strong STAB move with 0 Spe IVs. All in all, a very good support pokemon for this team. Thank you Lavos Spawn for suggesting him (and your immense help in general).

    [​IMG]
    Gyarados (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 56 HP / 244 Atk / 208 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Waterfall
    - Bounce
    - Substitute
    - Dragon Dance

    This is the slot on my team that has changed the most by far. I went from a SD Feraligatr to a CB Azumarill to, most recently, Rain Volcarona. Volca was good, but there was one thing I constantly saw that needed to be remedied. I needed a physical sweeper. Badly. As you can see, I tried a variety of 'mons in this spot, but none really stuck. I had actually completely forgotten about Gyarados until a few days ago, but I wasn't sure how good he'd be. The first time I swept with this wannabe dragon, my face went (O_O) The only way I can describe this beast: powerful. After one Dragon Dance, Gyara's reaches 575 Atk and 392 Spd. This means he will outspeed and outdamage pretty much everything not wearing a Scarf. In the rain, Gyarados basically gets a double STAB Waterfall to play with, making its base power 160. Bounce is an okay secondary STAB which can hit grass types, the only drawback is it being a two turn attack with low accuracy. I mean come on, if Dugtrio can get Aerial Ace, why can Gyarados get a Flying move!? Water/Flying by itself is actually very good coverage, as only six out of the 649 Pokemon in the entire game resist it. Two of those are Uber and three are rarely seen in OU. The one OU 'mon that does resist is our old pal Rotom-W. Jeez he's annoying. Thank you Lavos Spawn set.

    [​IMG]
    Tornadus (M) @ Sharp Beak
    Trait: Prankster
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hurricane
    - Taunt
    - Tailwind
    - Rain Dance

    Ever since I started using this little green cloud man, he's been an invaluable part of my team. Really, he acts more as a hard hitting support pokemon rather than a sweeper. With only one attacking move, Tornadus is able to use his amazing ability, Prankster, to the fullest. Taunt is an awesome move that really annoys those walls that come in trying to sponge Hurricanes from this guy. Depending on the wall, Tornadus can taunt and switch to the appropriate counter or deal with it himself. Tailwind is an AMAZING move. I usually use it when I know Tornadus is going to die and there's no point in saving him. With this, he essentially passes Agility to the next pokemon for a short time. This can help Breloom get off a quick Spore or let Jolteon get back on top of a +2 Atk/Spd Outraging Dragonite, among other things. Rain Dance is great as well, especially against sun teams. I don't know how many times I've lol'd and thought, "Why, no, your Venusaur is not safe just because the sun is out." And then, of course, there Tornadus' signature move, Hurricane. To be blunt, it hits hard. Very, very hard. Combined with STAB, an excellent SAtk stat and Sharp Beak, Tornadus can really put a dent in any pokemon foolish enough to stand against him. Even resisted Hurricanes usually cripple a pokemon for the rest of the match.

    [​IMG]
    Jolteon (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Thunder
    - Volt Switch
    - Signal Beam
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    WARNING! Unless you are a ground type or pink blob, do not approach Jolteon at risk of being fried. Seriously though, this thing is powerful. He is the fastest OU pokemon with 394 Spd and has an amazing 319 SpA. Thunder is so strong that all of the other moves are almost filler moves. Almost. I like to try and conserve Jolteon's usage until late game where he can lead an epic sweep of my opponent's remaining pokemon. Hopefully by that time I have eliminated all of Jolt's counters (namely ground types and pink blobs) which will allow him to simply spam an item boosted Thunder until either the match is over or he dies. Of course, it doesn't always work out like this. Sometimes, I get a little too Jolt happy and use him as a revenge killer. This is usually fine, but Jolteon is a frail pokemon. He can take one, maybe two special hits, but any physical hit is just going to tear him to shreds. Choice Scarf users and Priority moves also give Jolteon a hard time. That is why he makes a good late game sweeper, because I will have by that time seen most of what my opponent has to offer and can employ Jolteon accordingly. I used to use a Choice Specs on Jolt, but with Gliscor being so prevalant, I needed a more reliable way to counter him. Life Orb allows Jolteon to still hit very hard with a STAB Thunder and, since he'd probably be KOed by anything anyway, the constant HP drain is not really a big deal. Thanks to Princess Bri for suggesting Signal Beam over Shadow Ball. Celebi was a good counter to this team until I took your advice =)

    Conclusion

    Well that's all for now. I think I gave an account of most of the common threats to each pokemon on this team. I did my best to cover all of my bases, but I'm sure I've missed some stuff. If I have failed to credit you with anything I used and you suggested, let me know. I will always give credit where credit is due. I look forward to everyone's comments! Thank you!

    Importable
    Show Hide
    Politoed (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 228 HP / 252 SAtk / 28 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Perish Song

    Breloom (M) @ Toxic Orb
    Trait: Poison Heal
    EVs: 236 HP / 212 SDef / 60 Spd
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Bulk Up
    - Spore
    - Drain Punch
    - Seed Bomb

    Forretress (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 16 Atk / 176 Def / 64 SDef
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Rapid Spin
    - Volt Switch
    - Gyro Ball

    Gyarados (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 56 HP / 244 Atk / 208 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Waterfall
    - Bounce
    - Substitute
    - Dragon Dance

    Tornadus (M) @ Sharp Beak
    Trait: Prankster
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hurricane
    - Taunt
    - Tailwind
    - Rain Dance

    Jolteon (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Thunder
    - Volt Switch
    - Signal Beam
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
  2. _AlexiS_

    _AlexiS_

    Joined:
    May 13, 2008
    Messages:
    150
    Well, I advice you to put shed shell on Forretress, to avoid the "ZoneTrap" or to place a very useful VoltSwitch over EQ on it...Try it, its very useful!
  3. tikidude

    tikidude

    Joined:
    May 1, 2011
    Messages:
    321
    This team is good. :D You could swap out Feraligatr for a Choice Band Azumarill. Azumarill has extremely powerful priority, without the need to set up. Here's the set:
    Azumarill
    Item: Choice Band
    Ability: Huge Power
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: 212 HP/ 252 Att/ 44 Spe
    Moves: Waterfall, Aqua Jet, Superpower, Ice Punch

    This guy wrecks in the rain!
  4. Lady Alex

    Lady Alex I asked Mawile to not hurt me. I was betrayed.
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Aug 28, 2010
    Messages:
    572
    Hi, I love using 3 attacks vaporeon. It's so fun xD.

    The weakness to rotom concerns me. You have jolteon to absorb volt switches, but you are going to be very hard pressed to switch into it if jolteon goes down (which is very realistic, since jolteon is going to get 1hkod by a hydropump if you mispredict). I think that feraligatr is your weak link, and getting rid of it to address your weakness to rotom (as well as tornadus, who also is going to give you trouble) would help you a lot. I think chansey fits in quite well on this team. All of your pokemon appreciate her presence on the field, currently. This change might make you more susceptible to terrakion, so to remedy that I think you should get rid of earthquake on forretress for toxic spikes so that vaporeon can rest stall it out. Losing earthquake on forry shouldn't be a big deal, since the only reason I can see you using it would be too hit opposing tentacruel who try to force it out. You already have jolteon who deals with tentacruel very well, and predicting the switch to tentacruel shouldn't be that difficult.

    lastly, get rid of surf on politoed and vaporeon for scald. The slight decrease in power is more than worth the potential burn on physical attackers. Good luck with your team!
  5. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
    Messages:
    116
    Hey everyone! Thank you for your comments =)

    @_AlexiS_: As far as getting zone trapped, that was my reason for choosing EQ. It should be in the rain so HP fire hopefully won't be doing too much damage. If it becomes a problem though, I'll definitely consider switching either EQ or lefties off of it.

    @tikidude: CB Azu is a beast in the rain there is no denying that. The only thing that I do not like about him is that he can't switch attacks =/. I will try him out though and see which one I like better.

    @Lady Alex: Rotom-W really doesn't bother this team that much to be honest. What I do is switch to Breloom and force my opponent to counter him. I was thinking of maybe using a Gastrodon to give me a ground type to also take care of Volt Switches. But I decided on 'Gatr instead. However, I do find replacing him with Chansey an interesting option. That would also mean that I could make my Vap and Forre more physically defensive as well. As far as T-Spikes goes, I'll definitely consider it. Entry hazards definitely help Jolteon sweep. And regarding your last comment, I've been kind of teetering between the two but went with Surf for more power rather than a sometimes unreliable burn. But I'll switch it and see if I like it.

    Well, with these suggestions in mind, I'll test a new team and see which ones I like and update where necessary.

    Thank again everyone =)
  6. LUST

    LUST
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winneris a SPL Winner

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2011
    Messages:
    955
    Hey

    This is a pretty cool Rain Offense team. I really like the use Hydration Tank Vaporeon, it is definitely one the best rain-abusers in the current metagame. Although Sun teams seems to be your biggest threat. Under Sun Special Growth Venasaur sweeps your entire team as it isn't fully prepared for it. Volcarona also presumes a huge threat but only under the influence of sun, Feraligatr potentially OHKOs it with Aqua Jet in Rain. Trick Room and Calm Mind Reuniclus could also be very tricky to counter; it effortlessly sets up on Forretress and continues to wreck havoc. Thus to fix the above situation, I would highly recommend replacing Feraligatr for Sub DD Dragonite. This new addition fits in extremely well with-in your team, it utilizes Jolteon, Breloom, and Vaporeon to eliminate its most common checks for it to be golden. The primary objective of this set is to set up and outstall the opposing team by using Dragon Dance, Roost, and Substitute, attacking once Dragonite accumulates enough boosts or whenever necessary. 176 speed EVs allows it to substitute faster and basically set up on potential status users. Max HP and 80 special defense EVs comes in handy while tanking hits alongside Multiscale, Roost essentially re-activates it and makes its survivability even longer. Dragon Claw is the only single attack move on this set which hits like a truck after a proper setup. Leftovers is chosen over Life Orb because Dragonite really appreciates consistent form of recovery other than Roost. Jolly Nature enables it to outspeed its primary checks such as Choice Scarf Terrakion at +2. Jolteon and Vaporeon effectively remove ground and steel-type mons which are a massive obstacle in Dragonite's success. Breloom on the other hand utilizes its bulk to take on strong rock-type moves and put bulky steel types to sleep. After this change, Sun teams and Reuniclus are no longer considered as 'big' threats.

    Substitute + Dragon Dance Dragonite (open)
    [​IMG][​IMG]

    Dragonite @ Leftovers | Multiscale
    Jolly | 252 HP / 80 SDef / 176 Spd
    ~ Substitute
    ~ Dragon Dance
    ~ Dragon Claw
    ~ Roost

    For some minor changes you should heavily consider changing up Breloom's EVs to 236 HP / 212 SDef / 60 Spd with a Careful nature. This new spread maximizes Brelooms potential to be more efficient. 236 EVs ensure it recovers the most from poison heal; 60 speed EVs let's it out speed Choice Band Tyranitar, Defensive Politoed, Jellicent, Skarmory and among many others. 212 special defense with careful nature enables Breloom to tank many super effective hits like Hidden Power Fire from Celebi and Latias under rain. With this new spread volt-turn teams get very less opportunity to be annoying. On Vaporeon something along the lines of 212 Def / 252 SAtk / 44 Spd with a Modest nature increases its offensive presence significantly. Max Special Attack comes in handy while eliminating Dragonite's common counters with a surprise; 44 speed EVs allows to outspeed base 70s with minimum investment. Rest are in defense to improve Vaporeon's tanking capabilities. HP investment isn't required because this fish already has a high HP as it is. Overall brilliant team dude, Good Luck!
  7. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
    Messages:
    116
    Thank you for your rate mostwanted =)

    You're very right on your first point, this team has a fair amount of trouble dealing with any other weather really since most of my pokemon are so dependent on the benefits rain gives them. Having used a Sub DD Dragonite before, I can attest to it's power. I've have just decided in this message to replace Feraligatr with either him or a Tornadus I've been thinking of using. Or I could use both... I like Tornadus to deal with Venusaur actually, his ability gives Rain Dance priority and allows him to spam Hurricane. Then if my opponent uses a special wall, I can use it as a set up for Dragonite. Test time! Thanks for you ideas. As for the EVs, I will change them, I kind of just threw EVs on their at my discretion. Anyway, thank you so much for your insightful rating. I'll test these changes ASAP.
  8. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2012
    Messages:
    3,019
    Well, Jolteon Bandit, this is a fairly solid team. For your first post here, rather exceptional. You combine numerous 'mons that perform well in Rain into a balanced combination of hard-hitting offensive powerhouses and rock-solid walls. The synergy, the symmetry, it's all there.

    However, there's a problem that plagues your team. A BoltBeam user can effectively decimate the entire squad, bar MAYBE Jolteon. Common utilizers could include, but aren't limited to, Zapdos, Raikou, and opposing Jolteon. In fact, I could see a Dugtrio + any one of those sweeping you, no problemo.

    To fix this, I would consider removing either the Vaporeon or the Feraligatr, most likely the latter, and replacing it with Mamoswine. Then you can have priority coverage on Dragons, which you currently lack, and add a BoltBeam resist to instantly shut down any of the aforementioned Pokes. Not to mention, this will aid you in your inevitable fights against Sand and Hail teams, both of which tend to not like opposing Mamoswine.

    That's all I have for now, but I'll keep you posted. Excellent team, and continue the good work. Best of luck in your future endeavors.
  9. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
    Messages:
    116
    I had never even thought of Mamoswine on this team actually. Interesting option, thank you Lavos Spawn. Which type of Mamo were you thinking though (I was going to try out banded but if there's a specific one you had in mind let me know).

    As a general update, I've been using all of your suggestions and the only real changes I've made so far are the EV updates that mostwanted suggested. I've tried out many of your ideas, I'm just trying to find the best combo before I update.
  10. dice

    dice infinite bliss flows but does not ebb
    is a Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Arcade Star

    Joined:
    Feb 24, 2012
    Messages:
    2,171
    Hello there!

    Damn, this is a freaking bossly team. I love it! First of all I see a weakness to a common Rain check, NP Celebi, who can in essence 6-0 you. Even with the proposed Dragonite suggestion which mostwanted divulged into, NP Celebi with HP Ice or Psychic still cause havok. A simple way to fix this would be to change Signal Beam > Shadow Ball on Jolteon. It provided the same coverage, while actually being able to OHKO the little pixie, and it's a much better option.

    Secondly, you seem to be very weak to CM Reuniclus when your Spore is gone. This is why I propose using Encore > Ice Beam on Poltioed. Ice Beam on a defensive Toed is just "meh" in my opinion, and Encore prevent you from becoming set-up bait, and also can hurt BP Teams a lot, which can cause damage to you, too. Perish Song doesn't stop BP because any decent BP team has a Mr. Mime or an attacking move on every member to hit Perish Song'rs hard.


    Thirdly, many of your EV spreads are not ideal. I have the proposed EV Spread changes listed below.

    Politoed (open)


    EVs: 248 HP / 232 Def / 28 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)

    This spread allows you to outspeed the "standard" Skarmory, and most Jellicent, allowing you to Scald the former and Toxic the latter before setting up hazards or Taunt'ing you respectively.


    loom (open)


    EVs: 236 HP / 212 SDef / 60 Spd
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)

    This spread allows you to have a Poison Heal Number (divisible by 8) and allows you to survive things like HP Fire Celebi and weak Reuniclus Psychic's. You also outspeed Minimum Speed SDef Heatran and everything slower.


    Forre (open)

    EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SDef
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)

    Standard.. takes on physical dragons much better. Run Minimum speed with 0 Speed IV's because the slower Forretress always wins.


    Also, follow mostwanted's Vaporeon EV's suggestion, because it hits like a TRUCK.

    Lastly, since you're weak to Sun, why not try a Rain Volcarona > Feraligatr?

    will post set later..

    Great team!
  11. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

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    In regards to the Mamoswine, I would probably go with the Life Orb set. This way, you could also put Stealth Rock on Mamo and open up a space on Forry for Spikes or something of that nature. Run Adamant, 252 Atk / 252 Spd, Stealth Rock | EQ | Icicle Spear | Ice Shard or Stone Edge.
  12. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
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    116
    I tested Mamo and kind of was meh. He didn't really hit with enough power for my liking but I was using a similar set with a jolly nature and life orb so maybe the plus Atk will help it out. To Princess Bri, I've been using Tornadus as a Hurricane abuser because he gets STAB and hits like a truck right off the bat and can Prankster a Rain Dance if he comes up against another weather inducer. That being said, I've been toying with the notion of switching them. The only problem with both of them is that they are both special sweepers and I really wanted a physical one, but I guess Loom can set up on special walls so I'll give it a go. I also like Ice Beam on Poli because he can hit dragons which no one else on this team can do but I have run into a LOT of BP teams recently so I will try that as well along with your EV suggestions (like I said, this is my first RMT so the EV spreads were kind of pulled out of my butt).

    On a related note, I'm going to update the team with definite changes and make a suggested changes area so others can see it more easily without having to find it in the thread. Also, I would like to thank you all for your suggestions and will credit you with any changes I make in my first post =)
  13. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

    Joined:
    Feb 27, 2012
    Messages:
    116
    Just a quick update.

    I used Rain Volcarona last night and he has been my favorite replacement to Gatr so far. I have yet to try out the Mamoswine suggested by Lavos Spawn or the Tornadus I've thought of using, but once I do, I will post the replacement in the original post.
  14. Heist

    Heist
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winneris a SPL Winner

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    try zap plate jolteon. you can bluff being locked into thunder / volt switch then ko pkmns like lati@s, gliscor and celebi who are annoying for breloom.

    good team
  15. Max212

    Max212

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    Jun 9, 2011
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    This is a beautiful team! Very excellent first post on Smogon, good job.
  16. Super Mario Bro

    Super Mario Bro All we ever look for

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2010
    Messages:
    1,158
    Yo, welcome to Smogon!

    Nice team, but I'm noticing a weakness to fighting type Pokemon, particularly SubSeed Breloom. I think that Feraligatr is pretty redundant with all of the water types on the rest of your team, and doesn't contribute much to type synergy. Sure, you can say the same thing about Vaporeon, but she helps you lure out and kill Gastrodon and provides another pivot to strong water attacks (which Gatr struggles with).

    One Pokemon I think you can try in place of Feraligatr is Gliscor, who would really help defend your team against onslaughts of powerful physical attacks like EQ, Focus Punch, Close Combat, etc.

    Try this set:

    Gliscor @ Toxic Orb
    Ability: Poison Heal
    EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 Spe
    Nature: Impish (+Def, -SAtk)
    -Earthquake
    -Toxic
    -Substitute
    -Protect

    You can also try the Swords Dance + Taunt set...it's up to you.

    Good luck!
  17. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

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    Just interested, has anyone else tried using this team. Recently I've been getting sub par results and I am stuck at about 1100 points on the ladder...
  18. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    Hey, J Bandit, this is a nice team.

    Forretress is rather shaky as a sole Steel-type imo, since its mediocre special defense prevents it from taking hits from the Special side, despite the special defense EVs. Ferrothorn is a much more balanced Steel-type that can not only check physical Dragon-types, but also Special dragons as well, especially in the Rain. It also tanks Water / Electric moves for the team, like Breloom, essentially 2 pokemon in one. I don't have a particular spread that I have in mind, though you may possibly want to invest more heavily in its special defense. You can avoid Rotom-W burning Ferrothorn by switching into Vaporeon, who in turn baits Volt Switch that Vaporeon can simply Hydra Rest.

    If you need a Rapid Spinner (since Ferro was replaced for Forry), Starmie is a viable choice for Rain. Rain Dance Starmie is particularly useful to such a weather-dependent team such as yours. It also provides your team a fast Pokemon to check fast threats like Tornadus and Terrakion without needing to bring out Jolteon. Natural Cure makes Starmie a good switch-in to Jellicent that may try to burn Ferrothorn.
    RD Starmie (open)
    Starmie @ Life Orb / Expert Belt
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Thunder
    - Rain Dance
    - Rapid Spin

    What I think your team lack is a reliable revenge-killer to mons like DDHaxorus, DDMence, and QD Volcarona. Hopefully Politoed and RD Starmie will let you win the weather war for Vaporeon to beat Volcarona. As for DDHaxorus and DDMence, Scizor can revenge them even after the boost with priority Bullet Punch. Scizor would also provide you the physical offense to wear down special tanks. It is also a solid check to SubCM Jirachi, which may prove to be annoying for this team.
    Scizor (open)
    Scizor @ Metal Coat
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 248 HP / 136 Atk / 124 SpD
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - U-turn
    - Bullet Punch
    - Swords Dance
    - Superpower

    Metal Coat and Atk EVs allows it to 2HKO Haxorus and Dragonite after Rocks. U-turn > Bug Bite for the switch advantage that pairs up well with Jolteon's Volt Switch, and possibly to bluff Scizor as a CBer. The SpD EVs will come in handy when facing special dragons, Grass-types, and Jirachi

    These are some options that you may want to consider if you are having trouble. Btw, Princess Bri's Politoed has 28 Spe EVs, not SpD EVs. mostwanted's Vaporeon also has 44 Spe EVs, NOT SpD. The Spe EVs are to outrun Skarmory.

    EDIT: ninja'd by OP update x_x;; some of the suggestions may not make sense anymore.
  19. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

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    Feb 27, 2012
    Messages:
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    Yeah sorry about the update Pocket lol. I wanted to try a super offense team and so I put two hurricane abusers on my team. I found that I wasn't using Forre very effectively because I tend to be an offense first kind of guy. I do think that having a revenge killer would be helpful though. I find that this team fits my playstyle better overall though but I'm thinking Scizor and Starmie could fit on this team. The only question is who to replace.
  20. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    Well, Tornadus does have Tailwind, which can help Jolteon revenge-kill faster mons. I don't see this team supporting Volcarona too well, since you lack a Rapid Spinner, but I may be wrong here. If I were to pick a POkemon to remove for 3-atk LO Starmie, it would be Volcarona. You don't need Rain Dance on Starmie anymore, so I would go with Ice Beam.
  21. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

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    I was going to say, now that I don't have a way to get rid of entry hazards, Volca gets really messed up by SR. And Starmie in rain can do major damage. And since it has LO and good speed its a good revenge killer in its own right. I guess its worth a shot. The only problem I foresee with using it is that I feel like it will be a faster, less bulky Vappy.

    I don't know how much everyone likes my new team, but with the old one I was struggling to stay at 1100 points on the ladder and this new team keeps me consistently right below 1300 (though I have never been able to achieve it -_-). So that's really my goal with this team is to finally exceed 1300.
  22. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
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    Your current team is weak to stall imo. Special walls will wall your Jolteon, Vaporeon, and Starmie; physical walls will wall your Breloom; Tornadus comes close, but cannot get past Jirachi and possibly Chansey.

    What this team needs are either entry hazards or stallbreakers.

    You could possibly try Rain Mixed Sweeper Dragonite over Tornadus. You still get that powerful Hurricane, but also ExtremeSpeed for revenge-killing. It pretty much 2HKOs everything in the Rain:

    Dragonite @ Life Orb | Inner Focus / MultiScale
    Rash / Quiet | 252 Atk / 252 SpA / 4 Spe
    ~ Hurricane
    ~ Aqua Tail
    ~ ExtremeSpeed
    ~ Superpower / Thunder


    Hurricane is its main spam move, being able to O-2HKO most things, including Hurricane (though Superpower may be needed), Scizor, and Skarmory. Aqua Tail 2HKOs Tyranitar in Sand and Jirachi and Blissey for the most part. Heatran loses to Aqua Tail of course. Hurricane followed by Superpower has a high chance in finishing off Gastrodon, whereas Thunder is useful for hitting Water-types harder. Superpower allows Dragonite to 2HKO even Chansey.

    Note that Superpower and MultiScale are incompatible, but MultiScale is really not that useful on a LO Nite without DD anyways.

    If you want to keep Tornadus, though, the best option may be replacing Breloom for Ferrothorn to set up Spikes.
  23. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    Wow I was just thinking of trying to use a similar Dnite but didn't know what set up I should use, very helpful Pocket thank you. As for the spikers and such, I was kind of thinking that I could take the team the complete opposite direction and go for a rain stall. I don't know, my team right now is fun but, again, kind of peaks and then won't do too well. And the stall teams that I have used have been pretty good, so I'll look into it. Thank you for your comments guys =)
  24. _AlexiS_

    _AlexiS_

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    I think now you are too much weak to SR...If you want to use Volcarona AND Tornadus, try a bulky Tentacruel over Vaporeon, you absorb the TS and you can easily spin the SR under Rain!

    I imagine what you are gonna tell me: you loose an important offensive member, so why don't you try instead a Bulky spread of Tenta, an offensive Ev Spread with rapid spin?
    Here is an idea:


    [​IMG]
    Tentacruel (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Rain Dish
    EVs: 80 Def / 176 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Sludge Bomb
    - Rapid Spin
  25. Jolteon Bandit

    Jolteon Bandit

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    116
    I will say that water poison is very good coverage and that a spinner would be very useful for this team. My playstyle, however, is very offense oriented. I find rapid spinning to be an oppurtunity for my opponent to catch a break or shift momentum. Since its an offensive set though I'll try it.

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