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Rainy Revenge of PU (peaked 4th)

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by Don Honchkrorleone, Nov 1, 2012.

  1. Don Honchkrorleone

    Don Honchkrorleone

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2010
    Messages:
    758
    RAINY REVENGE
    OF PU


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    Hello, Smogon!!! Here is Don Honchkrorleone again with another RMT, and my first NU one. After peaking 1st at monotype, I was searching for a new metagame to set myself and try to achieve the same success. I tried UU, but it's 4th Gen OU, and I hated that tier. I would try RU, but I promised myself that I'd never step there again since Blastoise got moved up (I actually played the first months of RU. How I miss Gligar and Blastoise ;~;). And in fact I tried NU in its earliest stage. I peaked 17th with a offensive Hail Team, but I abandoned because I hated Mesprit and it was everywhere (and I'll leave it if Mesprit fall again). Because of a very cherished friend of mine, I got back in this wonderful tier. I love NU, imo it's the least centralized metagame (although Alomomoonguss and Gurdurr/Musharna/Skuntank in every match is getting annoying) and ergo the funniest and most enjoyable. In NU, there are plenty of funny things that are considered bad but either people didn't try or are afraid to try. That's my job there, to test things like Carvanha, Fearow, Resttalk Shelgon, HC Heatmor, Perish Song Marowak, Krokorok, etc (I really use these gimmicks sometimes, and I suceed most of times O________O)

    This team I present you here is by far my most successful gimmick (Lie, it was my Krokorok team, but I lost the team and the screenshot :/). It all started with the Research Week #8. I became interested in testing both Ampharos and Basculin together in a rain team. Rain is a powerhouse in NU nowadays, with every team carrying a Ludicolo / Seismitoad / Floatzel / Mantine / Gorebyss / Lumineon (True story...) that sets up RD just for itself and then proceeds to demolish opponent's team. I then had an idea. If a single rain sweeper can easily destroy teams, an entire team dedicated to abuse Rain may work wonders. I REALLY liked this team, and after my part of the RW was done, I decided to ladder more with this team and make it better under the alt Gajo. The result was peaking 4th, which is incredible for a team that doesn't have the extremely common NU pokemon (Bar Ludicolo), and instead has a bunch of poorly used and "forgettable" pokemon. Don't believe in me? See this screenshot below:

    Proof (open)
    [​IMG]


    Now someone will blame ladder. Well, I was able to hold some powerful and well-played teams such as this one: http://pokemonshowdown.com/replay/nu3563986

    Now, pick your raincoats and umbrellas and have fun reading this RMT :D

    Teambuilding process (open)


    I was originally doing a research week challenge, and I picked two pokemon I never used: Basculin and Ampharos
    [​IMG][​IMG]

    I thought at first that those two would make a decent rain team, with Ampharos setting up Rain Dance and Basculin abusing extremely powerful Waterfalls. I would need more than just one rain abuser, and obviously Ludicolo was my first choice.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    I thought just two rain abusers would be bad. I wanted to add another Swift Swimmer to this team. I had the options of Mantine, Seismitoad and Floatzel. I ended up with the second because of his good typing.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    I then noticed that I'd still need rain (for some reason) and also something to take Fighting-type moves that are everywhere in NU. Instead of adding Mantine (which was my first option in fact), I remembered of Prankster Volbeat and his mighty Tail Glow + Baton Pass, which was his first moveset. He also brought a nice Ground resistance to this team.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Team almost done and for some reason I felt that Grass-types would screw me (yes, even though I had Volbeat...). Also, I needed SR because Shedinja walls my team entirely. I also needed a Flying resistor since Braviary and Swellow are nothing to laugh about, neither Jumpluff and Drifblim. I would ude Metang, but Metang is Metang. Doing a paradox with the reason I picked Volbeat, I added Mawile.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Team done, time to test and pursue at least the silver (Who am I to conquer the gold?). I reached silver without many complications bar AMOONGUSS. I loved this team and decided to ladder with it, but then I made some changes. I changed Ampharos' and Volbeat's set. The team worked, but a certain mushroom who I hate a lot always, ALWAYS was there causing me trouble. I realized that Basculin was the weak link (I ended my research anyway, gtfo fish). I swapped him at first for Mantine and then for Swanna, but then my team got eaten alive by Regice. I then wanted something that could KO (or at least try) both hellishroom and crystal robot. Beartic was there, waiting for me with his frosty beard ^_^

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    My team did surprisingly well. Really, for a more-than-half PU team, peaking at 5th is awesome (don't start complaining about how crappy NU ladder is). This is a pretty nice team composed of mainly underused and underrated threats and sets, since only Ludicolo is above the top 10 pokemon at the best official tier of smogon.



    THE TEAM:


    ~The Wall
    [​IMG]
    Dance, Darling (Mawile) (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def
    / 4 SDef
    Impish Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Pain Split
    - Toxic
    - Seismic Toss

    Mawile is a cute little pokemon that's often forgotten for...? Why would someone pick another pokemon for Mawile? Almost all defensive Steel-types in NU suck. Metang sucks, Bastiodon is powerless and Probopass an Klang are much better as all-out attackers. Mawile's usage seem to have increased, but they're either Baton Pass or SD set, no one cares anymore for the support set ;~; I chose a support set instead of a SD because I needed a wall, and Mawile is one of the best available. With resistances to Normal, Flying, Dark, Grass, Psychic, Ghost, Bug, and etc, she gives a big "SUCK MY DICK" to some of the most common threats in NU, most including Cinccino, Swellow, Skuntank, Haunter, Musharna (although Psychic can 3HKO sometimes) and in some cases Braviary (Defiant is still a dick). Stealth Rock is an obligatory move unless you run Natu, and in NU it's great due the lack of good spinners. It's also my chance of preventing Sawk and other Sturdy users from screwing this team before my team screw them. Taunt is such a valuable and important move in NU metagame nowadays. Whenever I lead with Mawile, it's against a Bastiodon / Armaldo / Shuckle / Cradily. All of them get severely crippled by Taunt, as do other pokemon like Ninjask, Musharna, Audino, Alomomola, BP Chains, etc. Toxic makes the hentai metallic carnivorous plant a nice stallbreaker. Alomomola / Musharna hate it, and Toxic isn't a move that Mawile commonly carries so it's hard for the opponent to predict. If battling against a Taunted SuBU Braviary, it lets me set the time for its death. Tangela and Sheinja also won't like Toxic. Iron Head is my last move. It is a moderately powerful STAB move that allows Mawile to bypass Taunt, and the most notable Taunt users DO NOT resist Steel (bar Electrode, that isn't the sturdiest thing around). Its nice flinch chance also helps sometimes. Mawile still have a base 85 Atk, and Iron Head can 2HKO some troublesome pokemon like Regice. EVs focused on Defense grant Mawile awesome physical buk, especially when factoring Intimidate. The rest 4 EVs go to Special Defense, but sometimes in the Atk is bettere since Mawile's Special Defense is already meh.

    MAWILE WILL BE ROTATED FOR METANG SINCE I CAN'T IGNORE JESUS' AND WHITE'S SUGGESTIONS THANK YOU BOTH :D



    ~The Supporter
    [​IMG]
    Tail Glow GenVI (Ampharos) (F) @ Damp Rock
    Trait: Static
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Rain Dance
    - Volt Switch
    - Heal Bell
    - Toxic

    Ampharos is one of the two pokemon that was the reason of making this team, and it's the only one remaining (Basculin had to leave), although I swapped her set from offensive to defensive. Thanks to her amazing special bulk and fantastic type, derpy the lamb is a vital part of this team. I used this argument in RW thread and I'll use it again: Ampharos is better to set up Rain Dance than her fellow Electric-types Electrode and Zebstrika in this role because they're too damn fast. They use Volt Switch to get the sweeper on the field, but no Rain sweeper bar Carracosta is particularly bulky, and the damage they take on the switch can be crucial. Ampharos by being slow and having Volt Switch can bring my sweepers most of times unharmed. Rain Dance is obvious since it's the theme of this team. Volt Switch was already explained, I think. Heal Bell is an extremely important move for this team, and it's incredible that Ampharos learns it, being another selling point. Rain sweepers HATE status, and Ampharos' role is to cure them from random paralyze, burn, poison and even some random freeeze / sleep that prejudice. I picked Toxic over Hidden Power Something because my team DOESN'T fear Ground-types, and a well-predicted Toxic can screw them as much as a Hidden Power, or even more. Evs are the opposite of the hentai metallic carnivorous plant, giving Ampharos a superb special bulk. 4 EVs in SpA gives its Volt Switch a little boost. Damp Rock is preferred for the rain duration, although sometimes derpy lamb really misses Leftovers. 0 Atk IVs because I hate Liepard and it "swept" me once :/​


    ~The Trapper
    [​IMG]
    James Dean (Volbeat) (M) @ Damp Rock
    Trait: Prankster
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
    Impish Nature
    - Rain Dance
    - Encore
    - Thunder Wave
    - U-turn / Roost

    In this team, every pokemon has a role. Mawile and Ampharos wall, while Ludicolo, Seismitoad and Beartic destroy stuff. Volbeat however has a slight different role on this team: besides being my resistor to most Fighting and Ground moves, he is my "trapper". I dare to say that Volbeat is my MVP, and say it again: VOLBEAT MAH BOI, YOU'RE THE COAL OF THIS LOCOMOTIVE!!! What makes the greaser bug awesome isn't simply the fact that he is a greaser, but also the fact that everybody knows what Volbeat does, or at least they think. Volbeat is so damn famous because of its priority Tail Glow + Baton pass that it generates an impulse on anyone facing it of assuming he is a Tail Glow BPer, and that is Volbeat's main advantage. Rain Dance, I won't explain it again. Encore and Thunder Wave are where the magic happens. Normally where Tail Glow and Baton Pass would be are one of the most effective combinations if the opponent is not prepared. Not to mention that Volbeat is a "great" set-up bait. People send their Musharna, Gurdurr, whatever that can set up something into Volbeat, just to be encored and forced to either switch or take a powerfu hit on Volbeat's switch. If Mawile layed SR, Encore gets extremely frustrating for the opponent. Thunder Wave, before you ask "WTF Don? You already use 2 pokemon with Toxic, why use Thunder Wave?" The answer is simple, I know which things need Toxic and which need Thunder Wave. Thanks to Prankster, Thunder Wave can always cripple that fast scarf user, or a potential switch after Encoring something using SR, Sub, etc. The last move is unusual but it gets its job done. I prefer U-Turn for 2 reasons: 1) Fuck Taunt; 2) If you manage to predict well U-Turn the momentum you'll gain will be decisive for the match. I'll exemplify with a match I had. Seismitoad 100% vs 100% Suntank, last turn of Rain. Opponent had full Braviary and Golurk, and SR on his fied; while I had full Volbeat and Mawile ~27%. The stupid here used Earth Power even though Hydro Miss could kill, but opponent was smart and picked Braviary. Braviary took SR damage, but Leftovers accused its set and Rain was over. I predicted it would either Sub or BU, since a Brave Bird can't KO Seismitoad, so I switched to Volbeat. BINGO, it used Sub. I then Encored Sub >:D (a proof that Volbeat is a nice check to things that use Sub and/or boosting move, AS LONG as you know what you're doing). I then worked with three hypotesis: A) Opponent would bring Skuntank to Taunt. B) Opponent would bring Golurk that maybe would use SR because I prevented him from doing it early in battle (It fled early battle because my lead was Ludicolo :3) or C) Opponent was stupid and would keep Braviary. At first I would set up Rain, but I ended up using U-Turn to keep with the momentum for me. Next turn, opponent brought Skuntank. Volbeat used U-Turn taking 29% of the stinky mammal's health (quite a bit, huh?) Back to Seismitoad. I knew it'd Sucker Punch, so I used Rain Dance. Sucker Punch hit, but didn't KO the frog but Seismitoad used Hydro Pump and killed it. Opponent brought Braviary, killed by Hydro Pump. For some reason, Hydro Pump hit 3 times in a row and Golurk was also KOed :D I've been testing Roost lately however, as it lacks Leftovers for more 3 turns of Rain with Damp Rock. I still prefer U-Turn, though. 248 HP makes Volbeat's HP 333, enough to enter in SR more than 4 times (assuming it doesn't take any damage). 252 in Defense because I need something to take Fighting moves and this bug does that well. The remaining EVs go to Special Defense.

    And before you start, yes I used Tail Glow + BP before, but this set is better for my team.

    VOLBEAT IS CURRENTLY DOWN. IN HIS PLACE, AMOONGUSS IS BEING TESTED. WILL BE UPDATED AFTER THE TEST ENDS (PROBABLY THE MUSHROOM WIL STAY). THANKS FLCL FOR THIS :D


    ~El Abusador #1
    [​IMG]
    Chespirito (Ludicolo) (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Swift Swim
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Giga Drain
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Rain Dance

    Do I really need to say anything about Ludicolo? If you play NU and never used it, then start to. The mexican vegetable is easily one of the most dangerous pokemon in NU right now, if not the most. I really, REALLY don't need to say anything about him, but if I don't say this thread will be locked :/ So Rain Dance sweeper, yadda yadda yadda, Hydro Miss in rain destroys things, yadda yadda yadda, Giga Drain for recovery and powerful STAB, yadda yadda yadda, Ice Beam for Grasses and Altaria, yadda yadda yadda, Timid for Samurott, yadda yadda yadda, 0 Atk IVs for Foul Play, yadda yadda yadda... Also a nice Ground resistance, can't be killed by Rotom-S' Air Slash, etc. There isn't really much to say about him, except maybe that he is a stereotype. And awesome. Oh, and before I forget, WHY PEOPLE THINK THAT ICE BEAM IS MORE EFFECTIVE AGAINST OPPOSITE LUDICOLO THAN GIGA DRAIN??? I bet it's because of the freeze hax but who knows...


    The Abuser #2
    [​IMG]

    SwInMajWhiDel (Seismitoad) (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Swift Swim
    EVs: 32 HP / 252 SAtk / 224 Spd
    Timid Nature

    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Rain Dance
    - Hydro Pump / Surf
    - Earth Power
    - Sludge Wave

    Seismitoad is a horrible pokemon. Aesthetically. Really it is horrible, that hideous pimples it has are gross, and its hands make Seismitoad seem like an onanist. However, like many other ugly pokemon such as Groudon and Kyurem, Seismitoad fares very well in battle (I'm not comparing him to Ubers, I'm comparing him to ugy Ubers). His excellent typing makes Electric-types much less toublesome, as few are the ones that run HP Grass or Grass Knot. He also has nice resistances such as Fire and Rock that sure helps my team. Too bad the frog is kinda low in usage, with Gorebyss and Floatzel offering a hard competition. Seismitoad is Ludicolo's partner in crime, as few things can take two rain-boosted Hydro Pumps. Although most of times I run Surf in Seismitoad because it's much more reliable, even though the lack of Hydro Miss hurts sometimes... Earth Power is its secondary STAB, excellent against Poison and Electric-types that are very common in NU. It also can 2HKO most Alomomola. Because Game Freak decided to not give it Ice Beam maybe for the same reason they gave Ludicolo Fire Punch, Sludge Wave is his best bet against Grass-types. It OHKOes Cacturne, Jumpluff, Exeggutor and Leafeon. Unortunately, there are lots of Grass/Poison pokemon in NU :( Rain Dance is, well, no need to explain right? EVs of a sweeper, and modest Nature because his base SpA is quite low. I coud run Timid to outspeed Timid Ludicolo in rain, but few are the people tht run Timid Ludicolo, and Sludge Wave can't KO the mexican vegetable if the acne-suffering frog is Timid. And because I REALLY hate Liepard, again 0 Atk IVs.


    ~The Lawnmower
    [​IMG]

    Vasco da Gama (Beartic) (M) @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Swift Swim
    EVs: 24 HP / 252 Atk / 232 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Swords Dance
    - Icicle Crash
    - Aqua Jet
    - Superpower

    Beartic, one of the most underrated sweepers of NU. Basculin was originally here, but because of its inability to beat the infamous accursed mushroom with ANY set, it had to leave. I tried Swanna and Mantine, but my weakness changed to Regice. I wanted a pokemon able to take both Regice and Amoonguss down. I never thought about Beartic to tell the truth. But then, a friend of mine challenged me and I had to use a different team. I used my team that featured this same Beartic, and my opponent used a rain team. I was so surprised with the result that I added to my team to test it and it is exactly what I was pursuing for. Before talking about the set, I want to thank Smogon for saying that this set isn't viable, so everybody that checks the analysis doesn't know what exactly they are facing (I forgot to print this, but someone I was battling said "Why using SD Beartic? Smogon said it was bad". Ironically s/he was a using an Acid Spray Muk). Swords Dance Beartic IS dangerous. After a Swords Dance, Beartic is a monster, especially since most of my team is specially based easing the destruction crusade of the polar bear. Icicle Crash is a scary move, since it hits hard and can flinch the opponent (provided it hits). Superpower beats Normal-, Rock-, Steel-, Ice-, and Dark-types mainly, while also giving a nice neutral coverage. Aqua Jet is great for picking weakened stuff, and in rain it acts as a pseudo-STAB. I picked Lum Berry with my first Beartic because I hated random status, and I also knew that this Beartic could never OHKO Amoonguss and Tangela because of my nature choice. Speaking of that, this Beartic outspeeds SD Mawile, that while not a mortal threat to my team it's troublesome if opponent predicts well. Beartic is still bulky even with 24 HP EVs, and the extreme speed creep helps it everytime.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    THREATS:

    Amoonguss - My most common counter, and I hate it. HATE HATE HATE HATE!!! Beartic is my best bet, but if it's down, well...

    Eelektross - I'll never take it out in one shot unless it's raining. Even then, specialy defensive variants give me trouble.

    Grumpig - Grumpig in NU is like Vaporeon in OU, it's not frequent but whenver it appears it causes trouble to me. Beartic can't KO, Ludicolo and Seismitoad can't 2HKO and if it has Heal Bell and Taunt, then Ampharos and Mawile can't touch without stalling Heal Bell. My best bet is Volbeat locking him and something TRIES to kill it.

    Shedinja -Almost walls my entire team. Whenever I see a Shedinja, my priority is to lay SR and save both Mawile and Ampharos.

    CB Sawk
    - Because my Fighting-types check is 2HKOed by Close Combat. I can deal with it if I'm faster and if Sturdy was broken, but if not it rips my team.

    Lickylicky -
    Too bulky... Beartic kills and Ludicolo 2HKOes, but Wish + Protect IS annoying a lot, and the difference between it and Audino is Body Slam.

    Toxic Spikes -
    Not bad if I end the match quickly, but if it lasts a lot it's an annoyance.

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I hope all you liked my team, even though it has a bunch of "outclassed" pokemon with weird sets. So rate it, hate it, love it, marry with it, just post your feedback, no matter if positive or negative. This is my first NU RMT, so any kind of criticism will be appreciated (although most of you will say "Yor team sux, go back to Battling 101 and if you're high it's because NU ladder sucks and you hax" for sure). Thanks for reading, and Luvdisc if you liked or hated :P

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------


    SHOUTOUTS:

    Majestic Electric - My NU mentor and master, also a very good friend. If it wasn't for her, I'd never rediscover this awesome tier. This RMT is for you :)

    SSRaditz -
    Nigga, I'm the worst mentor of all times, but you're my alumn for some reason <3 He is the single reason of Carvanha being on the ladder.

    Incon -
    Possibly the only person ever to be negative in ladder. Also a great friend and battler :)

    Agent Dell -
    The person against any gimmick I create, and I love him beause our personalities often clash nd that is awesome :D He lost to my carvanha team once although he'll deny till his 3rd reincarnation :P

    Sweet Jesus -
    Another great friend that complain about my gimmicks, especially Carvanha. He hates Carvanha for some reason, and I hate his Alomomola :P

    WhiteDMist -
    An awesome team rater, friend, and dragon ;)

    Syr Toxic - I forgot to add him, but he helped me to test and change this team. Thanks, Rick :D

    Poliwhirlz, Baloney, Louiss, Ashley11, Uxsee, EonADS -
    NU players that I talk often but a lot less frequent than the ones above. All excellent players, especially Ashley :)

    NU IRC -
    Yes, I'm in IRC as a silent lurker >:) All of you are awesome, and funny sometimes :D

    ----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    If someone wants (open)
    Mawile @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
    Impish Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Taunt
    - Toxic
    - Iron Head

    Ampharos @ Damp Rock
    Trait: Static
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Rain Dance
    - Volt Switch
    - Heal Bell
    - Toxic

    Volbeat @ Damp Rock
    Trait: Prankster
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
    Impish Nature
    - Rain Dance
    - Encore
    - Thunder Wave
    - U-turn

    Ludicolo @ Life Orb
    Trait: Swift Swim
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Giga Drain
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Rain Dance

    Seismitoad @ Life Orb
    Trait: Swift Swim
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Rain Dance
    - Hydro Pump
    - Earth Power
    - Sludge Wave

    Beartic @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Swift Swim
    EVs: 24 HP / 252 Atk / 232 Spd
    Jolly Nature
    - Swords Dance
    - Icicle Crash
    - Superpower
    - Aqua Jet
  2. ssraditz94

    ssraditz94

    Joined:
    Apr 19, 2012
    Messages:
    47
    Great team Don. I look forward to doing more projects like this with you in the future. i really love the flow of this team, as well as you bringing back Beartic for an Encore performance from the Natu team. My only question is, how does the team fare against the ever so popular GurSharTank core that's running amok nowadays? Also LickiLicki loves you ^_^ Awesome Job.
  3. Don Honchkrorleone

    Don Honchkrorleone

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2010
    Messages:
    758
    Thanks, Evan ^^

    About your Musharna + Gurdurr + Skuntank question, the answer is simple: Mind games against all three. Musharna isn't all that threatenning to my team. Although nothing on my team can immediately KO it, Rain cuts Moonlight's healing effect to half. Mawile can Taunt + Toxic, Volbeat can Encore if I manage to predict right and the 3 sweepers can keep attacking with their strong STAB moves.

    Skuntank can't touch Mawile unless it's mixed (People don't run MixTank very often, though ;~;). It can taunt, but Iron Head will hurt. If I predict right, Volbeat can also play around it. Skuntank's Sucker Punch can't OHKO Seismitoad and Ludicolo without SR and some layers of Spikes.

    Gurdurr is more complicated because the only thing I have to resist it is Volbeat. Ludicolo and Seismitoad can kill it in Rain if SR are up, but only if those conditions are met. My best bet is Volbeat Encore it in Bulk Up (or Knock Off) and bring something to wear it down while it's Encored.
  4. FLCL

    FLCL
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis Smogon Frontier's Salon Maidenis a Past SPL Winner

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2010
    Messages:
    2,300
    Using Rain Dance Amoonguss over Volbeat can help relieve your weakness to Fighting-types like Sawk and Gurdurr since Volbeat is not the most reliable answer to them. With Regenerator, Amoonguss can come in multiple times during a match to check the aforementioned Pokemon and set up rain.

    Seismitoad should be running a Timid nature to beat weakened variants of Ludicolo, a common check to rain teams. You don't lose any OHKO from what I know, so it's definitely something to consider.


    Summary of changes:

    Volbeat —> Amoonguss
    Timid nature of Seismitoad


    Set(s) (open)
    Amoonguss @ Damp Rock
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature
    - Giga Drain
    - Sludge Bomb
    - Spore
    - Rain Dance

    Seismitoad @ Life Orb
    Trait: Swift Swim
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Timid Nature
    - Earth Power
    - Sludge Wave
    - Hydro Pump
    - Rain Dance
  5. Sweet Jesus

    Sweet Jesus Neal and Jack and me, absent lovers...

    Joined:
    Apr 22, 2012
    Messages:
    516
    Hey don, cool team. There's a threat you haven't mentionned however that can cause huge damage to this team and it's braviary. CB variants outpseed your whole team when rain isn't up, and with defiant taking a boost from intimidate, it can simply spam return for big damage without even taking recoil. To remedy to this, I would suggest replacing mawile with an offensive metang. Metang will take on cb braviary much better and has enough bulk to invest in attack rather than defence, max hp is enough. Metang also takes on sawk and zangoose a little better and will tank gardy pretty well too since it traces and outspeeds all your sweepers to retaliate with a powerful psychic.

    I think you already know the set and if you don't it's in project neverused thread. Cool team, original stuff, keep going.
  6. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist PU! We don't stink though!
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnus
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2010
    Messages:
    1,158
    Hey Don Honkrorleone!! I'm sorry for forgetting to rate your previous incarnation of this team, but I was having the hardest time thinking for some reason (it didn't help that 1/3 of your team was pretty much set in stone at the time). As always, I love the fact that your gimmicks work so well in your skilled hands. Oddly enough, this team is much less gimmicky than you normally use. Anyways, it's been a while, but I'll give you a rate.

    I personally have enjoyed using defensive Mawile, so I know what I'm talking about when I ask about your choices of Iron Head and Taunt on it. I understand why you would use them, but I find that Seismic Toss is more reliable in most situations. Sure, you can't tough Ghosts anymore, but you couldn't really do so before either. Taunt is hard to justify on a Rain team, especially since Mawile is slower than most other Stealth Rock setters. The ones you listed are definitely not as common as stuff like Regirock and Golem, who basically set up on your face. Pain Split is a semi-reliable recovery move that can help...tenderize your opponent's team a little for the onslaught of Rain sweepers. Of course, you CAN use Taunt to stop Amoonguss from using Spore, so I'll leave that choice to you. Still, you'd be better off using Probopass or even Metang if you really just want a Steel type Stealth Rock setter.

    Seismitoad could possibly use a Timid nature as well so that it can outspeed all variants of Ludicolo and hit it with a Sludge Wave (though it needs to be around 60% to KO). I know you said that you need the power, but Timid Ludicolo is becoming extremely common and it never hurts to outspeed Adamant Absol outside of Rain. If that's the case, then you only need 224 Speed EVs with the rest going to HP to buffer Life Orb a bit.

    Honestly, I think that with some strategy, you can bump Sawk from your threatlist. You have Mawile to set up Rocks to break Sturdy, as well as Intimidate if you really don't need Mawile anymore. From there, if you have Rain up, you basically can take Sawk out with anu of your Special Rain sweepers. Shedinja isn't too problematic since you have Rocks and 2 Toxic users, and it really isn't that capable of damaging your team unless you switch in Ludicolo. Most Eelektross should run a fair bit of Speed EVs to outspeed standard Golurk and Alomomola, so in Rain you can easily one-shot it. The rare specially defensive variants would probably be Coil sets, so Seismitoad would be a safe choice to Hydro Pump it repeatedly.

    Amoonguss is a bit more of a problem, but you can always switch Beartic's nature to Adamant and gain the power to OHKO after Rocks. I'm not sure what you mean to outspeed with your EVs regardless, since in Rain you outspeed most non-Rain/Scarf Pokes. I would say that Beartic fulfills a wallbreaking role on your team, so you may as well make it as powerful as possible and leave the sweeping/revenge killing to your other sweepers. Of course, if you have a specific reason for the Speed EVs, i"d love to know what it is.

    Changes:

    Mawile: Seismic Toss>Iron Head; Pain Split>Taunt
    Seismitoad: Timid nature>Modest nature
    Beartic: Adamant>Jolly

    Set (open)
    Seismitoad (M) @ Damp Rock
    Trait: Swift Swim
    EVs: 32 HP / 252 SAtk / 224 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Rain Dance
    - Hydro Pump
    - Earth Power
    - Sludge Wave


    FLCL also mentioned Amoonguss over Volbeat to set up Rain. I think it's a good idea, but I also know that you like lesser used Pokes, so I'll just quietly encourage it. ;P Anyways, I've enjoyed your use of Beartic and encourage you to keep testing undervalued Pokemon in the tier. Thanks for the shout-out and I hope I managed to finally help you (after taking so long to do so). :heart: Luvdisc!
  7. Don Honchkrorleone

    Don Honchkrorleone

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    758
    Thank you all FLCL, Jesus and White for your suggestions :D Since your oppinions seem to "clash", I'll run both changes in separated times (Amoonguss with Metang and Amoonguss with Mawile, maybe even Metang with Volbeat) Thank you all, you're awesome!!!

    I actually used the old spread :/ The correct one is 12 HP / 252 Atk / 244 Spd with Jolly so I could kill all non-scarfed Rampardos and set up in Defensive Misdreavus' face. I'll try Adamant, but I'm not sure which EVs run since Smogon's one didn't work for me. Any suggestion?
  8. Tofu

    Tofu

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2011
    Messages:
    29
    Nice team mate!.
    Respect for using Beartic, i use Cubchoo in lc and love it, want to try beartic in NU too.
    While in rain 224 speed ev's means Beartic can outrun everything in NU bar electrode and ninjask (and some scarfed pokemon like zebstrika and cinccino aswell as faster swift swimmers such as floatzel), while still alowing you to go adamant over jolly.
  9. Machineae

    Machineae

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2011
    Messages:
    130
    Definitely a cool team. I enjoy using Beartic a lot. Don't you think Superpower is counter-intuitive to the whole idea behind a weather team? With weather teams you want to stay in and do as much damage as possible. Assuming you don't get a SD boost beforehand, you'll knock yourself down to -1 Atk, forcing you to switch unless you want weakened attacks. If you do get a SD boost then you use Superpower then you're just throwing your boost away. Common rocks and steels which you would be hitting all get the same damage from Low Kick and Superpower. A quick calc on a 252 HP/0 Def Regirock (I've been seeing a ton of these as opposed to a fully defensive one)

    Show Hide
    252Atk Beartic (+Atk) Low Kick vs 252HP/0Def Leftovers Sturdy Regirock (Neutral): 37% - 45% (138 - 164 HP). Guaranteed 3HKO.

    252Atk Beartic (+Atk) Superpower vs 252HP/0Def Leftovers Sturdy Regirock (Neutral): 37% - 45% (138 - 164 HP). Guaranteed 3HKO.


    Looking at the above calc then seeing the stat drops that SP gives, it seems like Low Kick is the better choice. I'm not really sure what other pokes you'd want to hit. I would think that with SR up, Icicle Crash/Low Kick would be enough to kill lighter pokes like Absol n such. If it doesn't OHKO, then it definitely brings in the range for Aqua Jet.
  10. Louiss

    Louiss

    Joined:
    Oct 7, 2012
    Messages:
    21
    Dammit, I wanna be as good as you Don xD.

    The changes have already been described above, I also think Seismitoad should have Timid Nature to outspeed Ludicolo and Beartic Adamant Nature for the power :)

    Also you might consider changing the EV Spread of Seismitoad, because as it is now you're wasting EV's. Timid Nature 252 Spd Ludicolo reaches 263 speed. So Seismitoad will only need 264 to outspeed Ludicolo. Since there's nothing else with Swift Swim and Base Speed between 70-75 (Except for Anorith but he isn't going to be a threat, and if you face a Swift Swimmer with a Base Spd of above 75, you wouldn't be able to outspeed it anyways), it won't be a problem if you change Seismitoads Spd EV from 252 to 224, which brings him to a Spd of 264.

    This leaves you 32 EV's which you can invest in HP.

    Furthermore just an awesome team Don!

    EDIT
    :

    Lol, I just saw that WhiteDMist ninja'd me, so just look at his post :)
  11. Oh jeeze

    Oh jeeze

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Messages:
    13
    Fuck.. I was making a serious rate for once and safari crashed -.-"
    Anyways since gardevoir can destroy your team (ampharos is 2hit ko'd when she's at +1)
    I'd suggest to run absol over Beartic to prevent this.
    Absol's set

    Absol @ Life Orb
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
    Adamant Nature
    - Zen Headbutt
    - Pursuit
    - Sucker Punch
    - Superpower

    Zen headbutt over psycho cut just for the 2hit ko against amoonguss.
    Anyways hope I helped and sorry for the short rate but I'm quite angry for the crash while I was rating xD!
    Luvdisc'd ;)
    Edit: Gardevoir can sweep just if she traces swift swim against ludicolo or seismitoad
  12. Don Honchkrorleone

    Don Honchkrorleone

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2010
    Messages:
    758
    Thank you all, I'll reply al in this sole post.

    @Tofu: I assume that is Adamant, right? I'll sure test it out.

    @Machinae: I understand your point. Superpower, besides those weak to Fighting, also hits light Pokemon that resist to Ice such as Floatzel, while also hits Vigoroth, Mawile and Miltank for the OHKO. I'll test Low Kick, tough :)

    @Louiss: I forgot to edit in main post. Thanks ^^

    @Oh jeeze: Strangely, Gardevoir has never been a trouble for me, and I've faced a lot. I understand you and will test, but Beartic is the star. It'll be hard to replace him, but I'll test :)
  13. EonADS

    EonADS

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2010
    Messages:
    490
    Awesome team, Don. I'd definitely have fun playing against this team. I'll have to try something similar sometime...

    Anyway, Gardevoir shouldn't be a problem. Only the CM set can really do respectable damage, and you can bring in Volbeat really easily and Encore it or T-Wave so you can finish it off with a rain sweeper. The Specially Defensive set won't be much more than a minor annoyance to this team, and the Scarf/Specs sets are checked by a combination of Ampharos, Mawile, and Volbeat. If you do use Amoonguss, it'll become much more worrisome, but I really wouldn't replace Beartic with Absol. Most Gardevoir are not the CM set, but Scarf or SpD instead.

    Also, if you're really planning on replacing Mawile with Metang (which I was leery of until I saw just how badly CB Braviary could potentially maul your team), Gardevoir is laughable anyway. Focus Blast can't 2HKO even with just Max HP, and with as bad as its accuracy is there's little chance they'll be able to pull it off before you land a KO in return with Meteor Mash or Iron Head.

    I'm also glad I'm not the only one who was disappointed by Basculin's lack of power on Ice Beam. Even off a Rain Team where such a thing isn't crucial, it's very irritating.
  14. -Landon-

    -Landon-

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2010
    Messages:
    5
    That's a very nice team, dude! E você ainda é brasileiro! Que nem eu :) hahahaha, anyway, I'll write in English for the sake of the community. Anyways, the only things that is bothering me a little is Volbeat. recently I've been using a set in every tier I try to play and been having a lot of success! This set is a Liepard one!
    Giovanni (Liepard) (M) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Prankster
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Taunt
    - Thunder Wave
    - Dark Pulse
    - Yawn

    I always lead with it, and normally use taunt on the first turn. Then I yawn no matter what, this way it's sure it's sure I can get a free switch, for you this means you can set up a rain dance with any other poke. If you want LIepard can also learn Rain dance. Also, this is a nice counter to shedinja, since you said it's posing a lot of problem. If it really bothers you, you can change Dark Pulse to pursuit. Anyway, that's just an advice and my opinion. Anyway, awesome team. É muito bom ver brasileiros jogando competitivamente! Parabéns aí e boa sorte!
  15. WhiteDMist

    WhiteDMist PU! We don't stink though!
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Team Rater Alumnus
    Moderator

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    @Landon: While Liepard wouldn't be a bad priority Rain setter, your set lacks Rain Dance at all. I don't see the point if that's the case, especially since you also recommended Yawn and Thunder Wave together.
  16. Alfalfa

    Alfalfa

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    Aug 31, 2012
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    I do not recommend U-Turn on Volbeat because it can die before that happens. If you predict a Taunt user coming in, just go Baton Pass > U-Turn. This allows Volbeat to switch out before something hammers it with a Stone Edge or Flare Blitz.
  17. Detective Dell

    Detective Dell Winter Hibernation of the Yarnasauruses
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Battle Server Moderatoris a Team Rater Alumnus
    Moderator

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    A dude, To be fair, getting a priority switch-out move like Prankster Baton Pass isn't all that great. I would much rather prefer a slow U-turn/Baton Pass/Volt Switch as you can get a sweeper in for free. That is much more important than getting Volbeat out without it taking damage (which you can always do by simply switching out). This will basically give you two options anyways; it allows Don Honchkrorleone to "slow" U-turn out so a sweeper or whatever can come in safely or he can just switch out so that Volbeat is not damaged.
  18. Majestic Electric

    Majestic Electric

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2012
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    'Sup Don! About time I got to rating this team! Seeing some lesser-used mons is a nice change of pace! :)

    As previously stated, changing Beartic's nature to Adamant would allow you to OHKO'S after rocks are set up. Speaking of rocks, pairing up Beartic with a Rapid Spinner would keep some of the pressure off his shoulders and keep hazards from threatening your team. Volbeat would also benefit from a spinner due to its 4X weakness to Rock. For these reasons, I'd like to suggest replacing Mawile with defensive Armaldo. Having a Rock-type on your team will lessen your weakness to Shedinja. Armaldo can also perform the job of setting up rocks.

    I agree with WhiteDMist and Sweet Jesus' changes so its good that your testing them out.

    Overall, this is a great team and I hope to see more like these in the future! Keep up the good work, man and Luvdisc'd! :D

    Changes &amp; Sets (open)
    Jolly on Beartic -> Adamant
    Mawile -> Armaldo

    Armaldo @Leftovers
    Trait: Battle Armor
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 Def
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SpA)
    -Stealth Rock
    -Rapid Spin
    -Rock Blast
    -X-Scissor
  19. Alfalfa

    Alfalfa

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    Aug 31, 2012
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    673
    No, make Armaldo's ability Swift Swim. Even if it cannot abuse Swift Swim as well as it can with an offensive set, Swift Swim is still a surprise factor so Armaldo can outrun more pokemon.
  20. EonADS

    EonADS

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2010
    Messages:
    490
    I disagree with Armaldo altogether. Since Don is likely swapping out Volbeat for Amoonguss, there's no need for the spin support; Beartic can manage without it. Secondly, Armaldo also keeps the Rock-type weakness at the same level as it would be with the current team, and in turn, the SR weakness. Finally, this team needs a Braviary check, specifically for CB Braviary. Since Mawile is already being replaced with Metang, that is had, while Armaldo doesn't help with that problem very much compared to the currently staffed Mawile replacement.

    Beartic wants Jolly because Adamant is too slow to outpace Scarf Base 80's, Braviary and Gardevoir in particular... although if Gardy is packing Trace, you're still up shit creek without a paddle, or a canoe for that matter.

    Speaking of which Don, you'll want at least 4 more EVs in Speed on Beartic so you can hit that mark, right now you simply tie with them.

    Finally, A dude, an uninvested Swift Swim Armaldo under rain is only going to hit 252 Speed. Not exactly a surprising or priority target; it doesn't even get Max Speed Base 70's. Not to mention that Armaldo isn't a great choice on this team to begin with.

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