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Reflecting on BW and Looking Ahead to Gen VI - SEE POST #508

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Huntofthelion, Jan 8, 2013.

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  1. Gary2346

    Gary2346 Random
    is a Community Contributoris a Contributor Alumnus

    Aug 5, 2011
    Well, Alakazam is not broken with Magic Guard. Zam has a lot of things going for it that makes it quite a dangerous threat, however without Magic Guard Zam was easier to revenge kill and hazards completely fucked it up. It has terrible defenses, and even resisted priority after Spikes and Stealth Rocks can KO it. If you don't remember, Zam was actually UU in DPP. Even with powerful offensive moves and speed, Zam's failure to KO certain Pokemon easily leads to it's downfall. Also, a simple prediction from the opponent can leave Alakazam paralyzed by a T-Wave, also rendering it almost useless late game. Magic Guard is just what Zam needed to bump it back to OU. Most people would agree with me in saying, Zam is far from broken in OU. Now if it were Magic Bounce, that would be a different story.

    Also, Stealth Rocks is NOT broken. Without Stealth Rocks, extreme offensive threats like Volcarona would be pretty close to being broken unless every scarfer could out speed it at +1 and OHKO it back, or Heatran prays that it's not carrying HP Ground. Ice types would be much more dangerous, Dragonite would also be borderline broken since it would almost always be able to take a free it with Multiscale. So... no. Stealth Rocks should not be nerfed. It's essential for balancing out the already extremely offensive meta game. God forbid we make offense even more powerful.
  2. ginganinja

    ginganinja How do I live? How do I breathe?
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Apr 13, 2009
    Ironically enough this is something I actually DON'T want to see. Having a Ghost / Steel with Levitate would be utter shit to deal with in a metagame where spikes are already rampant. Sure, it might be nice to see but from a practical and competitive standpoint, it would be immensely frustrating to handle.

    Can we get more Gravity abusers pls :(
  3. Milos


    Jul 22, 2008
    i'm hoping xy balances the current metagame. obviously, everything is gunna change with the addition of a bunch of new pokemon but OU-wise, adding some more defensive pokemon/defensive abilities would be great.

    i'd like to second what alexwolf said about the buff to the lesser weathers such as hail/sand/sun. not necessarily giving them new sweepers or stronger mons, but for example a spinner that is suited well to play in sun. right now the list of spinners used for sun is pretty terrible. forry gets his 4x weakness enlarged, starmie and tentacruel get their STABs nerfed and donphan is donphan.

    new creative typings are also welcome, for example i as well as others would love to see a steel/ghost or steel/water. there are so many unexplored typings that gamefreak really has a lot of options for this one.
  4. Deck Knight

    Deck Knight PillowmaGod
    is a Forum Moderatoris a CAP Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    May 27, 2005
    If we want bulkier mons in XY all we have to hope for is that Skarmory evolution you'd think would have come by now, given Skarmory is the only Fully Evolved Pokemon with neither Giga Impact nor Hyper Beam. Eviolite Skarmory is going to be hilariously fun.
  5. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Champion

    Aug 18, 2009
    I think the BW generation ended up teaching us a few important things about Pokemon!

    A Pokemon with Too Much Speed And Ridiculous Offense Is Broken

    Look at Blaziken, Excadrill and Tornadus-T (if it gets banned*). All of these Pokemon are powerful threats with very few counters on their own, but its really their Speed that pushes them over the edge. I'm pointing this out because BW has shown us that Pokemon without any counters aren't inherently broken. Hydreigon is literally the best example of this; it has no counters, but its low Speed tier makes it susceptible to revenge killing (Kyurem-B to a lesser extent). The point i'm trying to make is simple.If a Pokemon lacks any counters AND is ridiculously fast, its probably going to be broken. Pokemon that exist in that category cannot be countered and they can't be reliably revenged killed either.

    I feel like Terrakion is at the tipping point of being in the same category as the aforementioned threats. At base 108 Speed, Terrakion has to contend with the Latis, Gengar, Tornadus, opposing 108ers and several gimmick Pokemon. IMO If it had 115 Speed or even 112 Speed it might have been broken. This also explains why Pokemon like Shaymin-S or Darkrai would never work in an OU tier. Even if you disregard their bullshit, they're simply way too fast for the metagame.

    DW Abilities (in general) Were A Good Idea

    Despite a few stinkers (Speed boost Blaziken) DW abilities were a tremendous way of "closing the gap" between Pokemon in a unique way. Before Gen V, I didn't think there was a way you could make Pokemon like Ditto, Xatu, Espeon, Ninetales, Politoed, Alakazam, Sharpedo, Nidoking, Charizard, Sableye etc, viable in OU and below. I didn't think there was you could make already powerful Pokemon like Breloom, Landorus, Dragonite, Tentacruel and Salamence, etc even stronger I think GF should invest in giving increasingly more powerful/unique abilities to shit Pokemon. There has to be a way of making something like Pidgeot viable. If they can turn something like Sableye into a (unique!)superstar, i'm sure they can do the same to Pokemon that are competitively irrelevant.

    There's More Of An Attempt At Making Everything Viable

    This is mostly an extension of the previous point, but yeah GF's conscious attempt at making every Pokemon viable is much appreciated. Either via DW abilities (Ditto & Eccentric, Politoed & Drizzle, Ninetales and Drought) or moveset additions (Venomoth & Quiver Dance, Cloyster & Shell Smash, etc) and the various ability buffs (Sturdy). GF has at least attempted to make previously shitty Pokemon decent. It's a huge departure from previous gens, where if you were a throwaway Pokemon it was like "haha you suck, better pray you're decent in the lower tiers!"

    Scald was a dumb move

    Scald is a REALLY dumb move. Anyone who says otherwise hasn't played this game enough...

    Ice-types Need A Buff

    They suck too much. Case in point; we have an obviously Uber Pokemon hanging out in OU because of its awful ice sub-typing. Something needs to be done to this type. On TOP of having a SR weakness and several natural weaknesses, Ice only resists ONE TYPE (itself). Can I get a Dragon-resist up in here??? Or something??? The only other OU Ice-type is Mamoswine, and that's largely due to the fact that it has its SR weakness nullified.
  6. Gehenna


    Jul 14, 2010
    1. Better offensive Ice-types. (Ice/Fighting, also Ice/Steel would be interesting, would have to have great stats though to make up for the 4x Fighting weakness)

    2. LESS DAMN OFFENSE. Seriously, it's getting old.

    3. Better spinners

    4. Better spinblockers

    5. Water nerf (I agree with PK, Scald is stupid as hell)

    6. Dragon nerf

    Are we seriously arguing about Stealth Rock? What is this, Gen IV? Stealth Rock is broken, but we're kind of stuck with it. So, yeah...

    Seriously this, can you people imagine how stupid a Ghost/Steel type with Levitate would be IN THE RAIN? Ugh it doesn't need to have Levitate, just give it Intimidate or something.
  7. Qwertyaaaaaa


    Dec 27, 2012
    I don't get it. Why do you people like stall so much? No other thing has been requested in this thread besides "hurrrrr moar stall, less offense, we want skarmbliss on setroids" It's a pretty boring way to play the game. I persoanlly didn't enjoy the 3rd generation days when ludicolo and skarmbliss could easily take down ubers and when matches dragged out for hundereds of turns. I didn't get back into pokemon until after HG/SS came out for that reason. A lot of stall Pokemon are lame too. Can anyone here seriously say with a straight face that Chansey and Ferrothorn are among their favorite Pokemon?
  8. HabibsHotDogs


    Apr 21, 2009
    I would love to see new abilities for all the "forgotten" fragile sweepers. For example Weavile or Sceptile with an useful ability would be absolutely awesome! After seeing Alakazam go from unuseable to a regular in OU due to the significance of its ability, it'd be fun to see other fragile sweepers OU viable.

    Reflex -> Gives full evasion against priority attacks from slower opponents
    OR -> Ignores priority modifiers from opponents (has some perks such as Weavile beating E-Speed Dragonite with her ice shard)

    First Strike -> 1.5x power boost if the Pokemon attacks first (This would be a pseudo technician for Weavile/Sceptile etc, considering they have low powered moves in general, should still be balanced whilst making them viable. Obviously won't get the boost on a switch out unless pursuit is used)

    For Aerodactyl, I'd like to see it learn Head Smash and/or Brave Bird, I'm assuming either will rocket Aero into OU at least initially with a band set!

    I'll go ahead and say this is "speculation" rather then a "suggestion" so if GF happens to see this idea, they implement it without worrying about legal issues :P.

    It'd also be awesome to see how GF goes about balancing weather, which is of course the biggest issue right now. Could be as simple as adding a new type with drought (ie grass/ground) and drizzle (ie grass/electric) or as complex as adding new features to defog, grass/ice types in their weathers and implementing viable cloud nine or air lock pokemon. Grass pokemon getting passive healing in rain won't hurt as well, and will balance all the swift swimmers overpowering the meta (albeit arguably boot ferro to ubers without some other additions to balancing weather) It'd also be great to see air lock buffed to something like this:

    Air Lock -> Prevents the weather from being changed, opponent cannot benefit from the current weather (i.e. a "master of the skies" ability)

    Going by flavour, this would obviously be a suitable ability for flying types such as the flying legendary trio (Moltres would rocket to OU with an unreduced Fire Blast and a 100% Hurricane in rain) or perhaps even for Salamence.

    I'd also like to see some new type and ability/movepool combos! specifically:

    Grass/Ghost - Either bulky or fast with leech seed
    Grass/Dragon - Would make a fitting 600 BST pokemon
    Ground/Fire - An actual offensive pokemon, not Camerupt, immunity to thunderwave and will-o-wisp? yes please
    Ghost/Psychic - This would be so cool if it had a 145 speed tier, I can imagine this pokemon being a combination of Alakazam and Gengar, except Dragonite immune
    Ice/Fighting - Double STAB priority would be a mixed bag of fun
    Rock Dual types - Terrakion shows just how viable rock can be, Aerodactyl almost did
    Water/Bug - A viable one, not surskit! compound eyes hydro pump - hnnnnnnng
    Psychic/Fire with magic guard - Would probably stomp through OU with the right movepool and stats
    Stun Spore buff to 85% accuracy - Could potentially bring bulky grasses into OU
    Compound eyes + will-o-wisp - Would really bring a lot of lols
    An ability that grants immunity to stealth rock (such as the mountaineer ability in CAP).

    I'd also like to see evolutions for the following pokemon (notice the gen/type pattern)

    Gen 1 - grass type evo: Parasect-> Parapod (or something similar, rain tank or agility sweeper)
    Gen 2 - fire type evo: Houndoom -> Something (Slightly more speed and offensive stats mainly, such as 110+ base speed to pursuit some psychics)
    Gen 3 - water type evo: Quagsire > Mudpror (or something similar, basically focus on special defence and special attack and not buff defence/hp too much!)

    Finally I'd like to see the obscure types in OU be buffed either directly or indirectly, here's to seeing dark/rock/ice/etc types in OU!
  9. Wizarus


    Apr 2, 2011
    Honestly, some moves need to be nerfed.

    120 Base Moves need more restrictions; spamming moves like CC, Fire Blast, Hydro Pump, Megahorn etc. should not be viable.

    Nerf 140 base moves like Draco Meteor, Leaf Storm and Overheat down to 120.

    Scald was a horribly designed move, and should be nerfed.

    I'd like to see either a new entry hazard this generation to balance out SR, or SR nerfed. A new way of removing entry hazards would be appreciated.

    More priority moves from the special side would be nice. Viable special rock type moves and physical ghost type moves would be nice as well. Bump Crunch up to 90 Base power.
  10. HabibsHotDogs


    Apr 21, 2009
    I just thought about what GameFreak would do about the current "levitate" dilemma.

    Gengar, Spiritomb, Weezing etc are basically denied the chance for other abilities because it wouldn't make sense if they didm't have levitate.

    Assuming GF recognises this as a problem, does this mean dual abilities?? Starters having alternate abilities for the first time in gen V somewhat alludes to this.

    Also some items that can deal with weather would be lovely :)
  11. EtherDrive


    Mar 15, 2011
    I am literally praying for a BULKY FIRE TYPE WITH RELIABLE RECOVERY. Like, I want a pokemon like this so bad that it isn't even funny.

    Weather inducers with beneficial typing, and more perks to hail/Sun

    I want an OU worthy support meta. Lets bring new roles to competitive play

    Intimidate, Tickle, a variation of tickle that lowers Special attack, something that can give underrated mons a niche as a switch in crippler or something. I've had moderate success with tickle over swords dance on leafeon, I wish more useable pokemon had access to moves/ abilities like it

    I would also love pokemon with more balanced stats and possibly a fire type entry hazard
  12. flea


    Oct 19, 2012
    Ice-type stealth rock. Saw the idea in an old Smogon article. I....I....can't even. That would literally change everything. Mind blown.

    But yeah, buff hail and give more DW abilities to bad pokemon. I long for the day that really cool pokemon like banette and unfezant can actually be usable in OU.

    Some better physical Ice-type moves for Weavile and Mamo would be cool as well. Icicle crash and Ice punch ain't quite cuttin' it.
  13. Lavos Spawn

    Lavos Spawn a e s t h e t i c
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Champion

    Mar 17, 2012
    if there's one thing i pray to god they keep in gen 6 it's team preview...seriously, try playing dream world, you'll see what i mean, with such a massive amount of threats in bw trying to play around them without a beforehand glance at the opponent's team is impossible. man, you think the metagame is offensive now? imagine how it would be if we didn't have team preview. sounds horrible.

    other hopes:

    - increase the number of viable threats in ou and reduce how strong those threats are
    - more ghosts
    - more spinners
    - less high base power moves
    - nerf weather super hard
    - basically just return to the more balanced and competitive metagames of gens 3 and 4

    i've had success in bw and i enjoy the tier because i'm more of an offensive player, but as i've dabbled in earlier gens and played around a bit with stall i've come to realize just how god awful this bw metagame turned out to be. gen 6 better bring about some quality changes
  14. Sacaen


    Oct 4, 2012
    More than anything I want to see better spinners and spinblockers (as already mentioned).

    I'd like to see some more good poison types (maybe even a pseudo-legend poison type) that could be a check to all the fighting type nonsense going on. Not that I particularly like poison as a type in general, but it doesn't get enough love and maybe GF could turn it into a more functioning and prominent type outside of Tentacruel and Toxicroak.

    Ice needs a buff, or at the very least other ice types with better secondary typings, like ice/steel (maybe a cryogonal evo?). Or give it something else it can resist or remove a weakness or two or four.

    Different weather inducers. If I want to make a rain, sun, or god forbid, hail team I want to have more than 1 choice for a weather starter. Sand gets 2 of them, sun/rain/hail should each get another as well, or at the very least, sun, I really hate ninetales with a passion. Maybe even adding a new weather or field effect would be nice, if they did it right.

    Undoing the sleep mechanic changes.
    Buffing Will-O-Wisp accuracy.
    Reducing Scald burn chance.

    A dragon/fighting type. Yes I realize how overpowered it would be, and I don't care if it would get banned to ubers, I still want to see it done.

    I think the sentiment about having more bulk and less offensive is less that people want to play full blown stall, and more that the powercreep needs to end. Just look at all the pokemon in GenV with 128-145 or higher base attack/special attack and compare that number to those in GenI.

    (Not counting ubers)
    In gen1 there was 2: Alakazam(135), Gengar(130), Dragonite(134), Machamp(130), Kingler(130), Rhydon(130), and Flareon(130),

    In Gen5 there was : Keldeo(129), Meloetta(128), Chandelure(145), Volcarona(135), Darmanitan(140), thundurus-T(145), Kyurem and forms(130-170!), Landorus-T(145), Conkeldurr(140), archeops (lol, but still 140), gigalith(135), excadrill(135, I know it's an uber here, but not ingame), haxorus(147), Terrakion(129), Escavalier(135)

    That's a very large portion of the bw dex that are all offensive powerhouses, especially compared to gen1, some of which weren't all that great (flareon, kingler) Heck, outside of Mewtwo, having more than 135 attack/SpA was never even heard of until genIII.

    I would also like to see some new attacks for some types that don't have many STAB attacking options, such as ghost, which basically is forced into Shadow Ball as the only viable attack. Some new dark (something higher than base 80!), poison (something other than toxic and toxic spikes and sludge bomb), bug(bug bite, bug buzz, u-turn... something more?), ground(earthquake is all you really see, bulldoze was a step in the right direction, but the base attack fell short), Rock would love a 100% acc attack, even if lower base power.
  15. Super Mario Bro

    Super Mario Bro All we ever look for

    Jan 2, 2010
    The idea of a Skarmory evolution makes me drool. It's epic with a measly 465 BST, so imagine what it would be like with a 535 BST (going by the Magneton --> Magnezone change).

    I probably wouldn't bother with Eviolite on the old Skarm if it has an evolution that's OU, especially if its speed, attack, and HP are buffed. An Eviolite Skarm would be scary in the lower tiers though.
  16. Qwertyaaaaaa


    Dec 27, 2012
    A skamory evolution? Really guys? Skarmory is a good enough wall. Why are you people, so obsessed with stall walling everything to death? Believe it or not, stall turns away a shitload of new and aspiring players.

    Skarmory with eviolite...just wow. Now the thing will be damn near impossible to kill phsyically and specially. 70 base defese boosted with evioloite and EV investments is a lot of special defense. Oh god. Please. NO.
  17. Princess Bubblegum

    Princess Bubblegum

    Mar 2, 2011
    From looking around a majority of people here seemed to have preferred a metagame with less offensive threats. I have a question then, then why on god's green Earth did we not just ban them. We were given the option to ban dragonite and latios and we turned it down. Couldn't we have just decided as a community that if these pokemon are detrimental to the metagame, then we should just ban them. Or is the metagame a force which not even the tiering contributors can truly control and manage?

    Also quertyman, the metagame is ass, matches come down to almost a rock paper scissors game of I have more dangerous threats than you, thus I win. The only way to fix this is to add more defensive threats to create a more balanced metagame (or ban them whatever). A metagame should reward skill and experience in play, we really don't particularly care if it makes it harder to play and less fun for noobies.
  18. Qwertyaaaaaa


    Dec 27, 2012
    But skarmory evolution? Skarmory with eviolite? Really? Really?

    Do you guys have any idea of the insane walling potential the latter could have with investments in special defense? What the fuck would be able to 2HKO it? Seriosuly. IT could spam roost until its PP ran out. Defensive threats can be broken too.
  19. UltiMario


    Aug 11, 2009
    For as much shit that was thrown at us in Gen V the metagame didn't turn out that bad. Better than the snorefest left over after Latias and Mence were banned from Gen IV at least.

    Hopefully Gen VI will bring something on par with the Gen IV Latias metagame though. That shit was perfect.
  20. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Live Chat Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Past SPL Champion

    Aug 18, 2009
    Neither Latios or Dragonite are significantly overpowered to point of being detrimental to the metagame imo. You could argue that the heavy offensive pace of the metagame can be attributed Drizzle(Tornadus-T & Keldeo especially), Drought, and Deoxys-D. It's kind of hard to keep up with Rain Boosted STAB moves or sun sweepers that are either really fast or really strong(or both). If you wanted to, you could say that Terrakion is close to impossible to wall and fairly common, but I think the biggest issue with defensive teams right now is the inability for them to wall every single threat that exists thus far. We keep getting more and more threats, its getting harder and harder to check everyone of them. I don't think we should selectively ban threats just to give defensive teams an easier time. It's just an unfortunate side-effect.

    PS: If its any consolation, I feel like stall would return to BW1 viability if Tornadus-T and Keldeo were banned. (Note this does not mean I support the banning of Keldeo).
  21. RabidChipmunk


    Jul 18, 2012
    I'm going to echo what some people behind me have said (less ridiculously offensive Pokemon, some more defensive Pokemon, better Ghost-types). Furthermore:

    Give Ghost-types and Dark-types better STAB moves (Crunch and Shadow Ball kind of lol suck)
    Give Psychic-types some more love (Psyshock was a big step forward, but they could still use some more buffing)
    Retcon the Ice-types' resistance profile (seriously why doesn't Ice resist Grass I don't even)
    Nerf Water-types
    Give us a Fighting/Flying-type and a Dark/Psychic-type already
  22. Sorawing


    Aug 14, 2012
    A lot can still happen in ten months so I think it’s a little to early to be reflecting, we’ve only just gotten use to BW2 around now…

    Every Generation has a completely new system that changes the way we battle; Gen II introduced Special stats completely with the addition of Special Defense. Gen III introduced Natures, IVs, EVs and many other mechanics that completely changed the metagame, Gen IV introduced the Physical/ Special Split which made a huge differences in creating movesets, and our current Generation introduced the Dream World, giving some old Pokemon a second chance at life.

    So now that we’re anticipating Gen VI, what new mechanics do you think they’ll introduce? I’m personally hoping for optional retyping of some Pokemon, like giving you a choice of having a different type while still being able to keep its original type, for example, Blaziken might be a Flying/ Fighting type or giving Flygon Dragon/ Bug (Yes I know that’s terrible but it does look like a bug).

    In terms of new Pokemon, MORE SPINNERS, I am sick of having to use Starmie, Donphan, Tentacruel or Espeon (OU-wise) in every single team I make. Or at least make a non-attacking move that gets rid of Hazards, even though it’s Tauntable, it’ll be much easier without Jellicent or Dusclops coming in when you’re desperate to remove them.
    I doubt they’ll make a Skarmory evolution, but I think they should make a pre-evo like Scyther to Scizor. Same BST but a more offensive Normal/ Flying which needs a Metal Coat to evolve to Skarmory.

    I agree with nerfing weather but I also like the idea of new weathers, possibly remaking and being able to have Fog in battle, I personally like the idea of “Acid Rain” weather, giving Poison types a major boost and giving you a reason to use it other than absorbing Toxic Spikes. They should also un-nerf Explosion etc.

    Gen V was really interesting, although some people may have said it was shit, but I think everyone should try to enjoy the last 10 months of BW and hope next gen will be better.
  23. alkinesthetase

    alkinesthetase <@dtc> every day with alk is a bad day
    is a Live Chat Contributor Alumnus

    Nov 8, 2010
    i'm going to agree with lavos that i'd actually like to keep team preview. screams of "it's going to ruin the game!" at the start of bw1 were clearly unjustified - a lot of dpp era concepts are gone (eg scouting unknown mons) but a lot of other options arise as a result. moreover there are so many threats to account for and i think team preview really alleviates the pressure to be aware of them all from a teambuilding standpoint. of course if we take it away, it's not that the game will get worse, so much as the skills and concepts required to play well will change. but frankly i like team preview and i think when even more mons are introduced, it's going to be even more important.

    as for "defensive threats being broken", there are two strong examples of that ever happening: cresselia in RU and chansey in UU (heh have fun with it now UU). both of them are actually quite bulky even by OU standards. yet they don't see much usage at all in the tier. you need a LOT of bulk relative to the pokemon around you to be defensively overpowered. there aren't a lot of things in OU that can 2hko cresselia with a neutral stab (standard cresselia fully counters banded x-scissor terrak), but it's still not tough enough. we aren't even close to that yet. there are dragons 2hkoing skarmory in this meta and blissey's getting 2hkoed by specs pumps. times change.

    for what it's worth though, i wouldn't mind some broken ass defensive threats. the only people who complain about the boringness of stall are the ones who lack the patience to play it out to the end (even in GSC, longass matches at a high level involve thought throughout; go read borat's giant warstory if you don't believe me). if you don't have enough patience to ladder with it, then don't - i gladly will though.... if i had the pokemon to make it work, which is what i'd like the next gen to give me lol

    oh and pk i agree with you about BW1 stall, but let's be frank - if you banned weather, offense would just be fighting spam + dragon spam and stall would still suck. there aren't enough gliscors and skarmories in this game to hold up in a weatherless metagame; you still have to contend with terrakion and a crapton of dragons
  24. breh

    breh 強いだね

    Feb 6, 2010
    Honestly, removing IVs (and making some sort of weird training system for them, I guess) would make the games infinitely more enjoyable for younger players. Same goes for unlocking an item that quadruples EV gain from Pokemon (making it impossible to get stats that are indivisible by 4). Getting rid of the extremely stupid 255 cap on EVs and the extra 2 you can have is also a step in the right direction and takes little to no time to program. IVs are a stupid and archaic system and EVs are tolerable but not overwhelmingly conducive to the creation of a large fanbase.
    This isn't exactly surprising; a lot of good mons in previous gens were banned at least, in some part, due to their speed tiers. Chomp was set over the edge by Sand Veil, but base 102 didn't hurt at all. Same goes for Lati twins, which both enjoyed base 110. It is no surprise that Thundurus got banned so goddamn early; taking a look at its stats shows that it is, flat out, made to be a special sweeper with the most perfect speed tier possible (without being excessive). You're right that Terrakion is also an amazing experiment in the same way - because it is checked by Latios (in other words, can be outsped) (and, I guess, Gengar as well) it has not been banned (yes, it is counterable, but it would make a really neat revenge killer with that amazing speed tier). It is an extremely strong Pokemon and I'm fairly confident when I say that the difference between Thundurus and Terrakion is nothing but 3 points of speed.

    I got a laugh out of this

    I can agree with the top two; ghost types are largely shit and so are spinners (especially in lower tiers); Starmie's continued appearance in OU is solely the result of Rapid Spin (Water-typing, a good speed tier, and a good movepool help, but I can't help but feel that it'd be solidly UU without Rapid Spin). I have to disagree with the last bit, though. Power creep is making boosts in power really necessary for a lot of mons, actually. Weavile is a great example - in spite of having perfect sweeper stats, it's relegated to UU and was noob OU last gen, only because it has no STAB on one side because it's a Dark-type (no STAB over 80) and no STAB on the other because physical Ice requires Icicle Crash (which could also use a 5 or 10 BP boost). I'm not saying we should bust out the STAB close combats and power whips for everything, but some mons would really appreciate some power to help them catch up.
  25. Thirteen Rabbits

    Thirteen Rabbits

    Aug 28, 2012
    Wish list of gen VI GO!

    1. New auto inducers of things besides weather. For example what if a pokemon had an auto trick room "weather" when it enters the battle? I personally think that this will really shake up the meta and give slow pokes a new life. A gravity auto inducer would be great as well. Hell, maybe even a magic room one would be interesting.

    2. New weathers. Something like Sorawing's acid rain idea.

    3. New "clone" attacks. For example, an electric type rapid spin, fire type aqua jet, etc.

    4. A hail boost and ice type boost.

    5. New type combinations. I'm in favor of a ghost/steel type in the meta too.

    I'm excited to see what gen VI will bring. There is also that chance the gamefreak will give us something completely unexpected! Time will tell...
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