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Discussion in 'VGC' started by GreySong, Aug 22, 2011.
play 60 matches over three days good luck
More like one thousand, depending on the cap :P. I'm interested to see what the cap is anyway. Maybe I can skip a couple of swiss rounds. Gotta win the reg again now...
See you there...........
Round robins too long. Im a pokemon freak but even i cant battle 60+ masters in 1 day, The only thing i wanted was more paid trips/travel allowance. Last year I couldn't make nats because i lost t8, 1 fn win away from ensuring nationals. And I want nats to be at least 7-10 rds of swiss. Basically remember the more wins u get the harder the foe, so we won't gt bs matchups towards the end. They'll be good battles, and the nubs will be fighting vs other nubs.
So to sum up Ize wants moar travel allowances, and more swiss.
I would imagine the number of rounds would be increased, as winners of regionals get a first and second round bye. A free 2 rounds out of seven is enourmous, also with more people because no invite is required, there should be more rounds. I would hope that because we will have so much more people that the paid trips will be extended to T8
Yeah, I'm fully expecting there to be at least 10 rounds of swiss with the massive increase of people. I don't know exactly how many TCG usually play but I assume we will be playing a similar number.
They'll count how many people show up, 2^x=y where x will be number of rounds and y is the number of people. And just because more people show up does not mean more paid trips. TCG has 4 paid trips, we had 4. TCG had a way bigger player base than us. Come on guys, this is pretty easy to grasp. We are mirroring the TCG, do not expect more paid trips.
That's the document used for the TCG to determine the number of Swiss Rounds.
3.1.3 Determining the Number of Rounds Needed
3.3.3 Using Flights for Large Events
Those two sections cover the number of Swiss Rounds used in events.
The US Nationals this year had 7 rounds of Swiss. If there are a lot more players, the players will start getting divided into different flights where the top ranking players in each flight advance to the single elimination tournament.
The 2 free byes is a pretty big advantage. This year you needed a 5-2 record and a non-terrible tiebreaker to make the Top 16 in Masters. With 2 byes, you only need to go 3-2 in the matches you play and you will almost certainly have the necessary tiebreaker to advance.
There were ~300 Masters at the US Nationals LCQ Masters division. If you put all of them into the Swiss Rounds you would have ~370 players which means 9 rounds of Swiss.
I'm not complaining about the Swiss. I'm complaining more about the open Nats where it will make every division more into the problems that the Senior Division had. I am saying that it is great that there is Swiss and don't see any trouble with mimicking TCG for the most part, but I was saying that if we have open invitations for Nationals, that will create problems as it will cause the same problem we had with Seniors division this year where there was a bunch of good and bad people and it all came down to how lucky you were with your match ups for the most part to begin with.
If the LCQ was somehow able to be made into Swiss with more people getting in that'd be great, but I honestly do not want to see open invitations.
Hmmm, let's see now. You guys asked for more locations and Canada, that's what you got. People complained about how a lot of skilled players got knocked out early at Regionals, they gave you open Nationals. I don't see a reason to complain. It seems people just want to find a reason to complain after TPCI worked hard to get you what you wanted.
TPCI will never get everything right, they haven't in the past, chances are they won't in the future either. Appreciate what you get guys.
Let's just give complaining a break until the rules come out.
I dislike that people are complaining about how some random guy/girl could get lucky and end up getting top 8 at Nationals when it could happen to anyone of us. I mean would you forfeit your spot if it happened to you and give it to someone you didn't know or had faced earlier that had one less win than you but their matches were harder than yours?
I am saying for the most part having the LCQ avoided that shitfest and my complaint is more that the example of how easily this can happen was the senior division in VGC 2011 a handful of good and bad people and when the "bad" people outnumber the "good" people then odds are that someone bad will get much farther than he/she should. At nationals with open invites something like the Senior division will happen in all, and while the more swiss rounds the less chance there is that the problem I mentioned will occur, but an LCQ followed up by the rest of our Nationals I don't see it happening if it wasn't going to happen anyways.
One final problem is that some people need to take more vacation days off of their job for this, if they have something going on they have to miss it. I don't have to worry about this, but I know that people like Huy do which is why I'm mentioning it.
Well hopefully as i stated earlier each vgc season has a spot near each location. Like for the fall season we can have vgc at either NY, NJ, PA, DC. Then in the spring season we have a area close to the NY-DC area.
Keep in mind failure to make it through the Regionals or LCQ also kept many great players out of the nationals.
More vacation days? As in having the Swiss portion of the VGC Nationals over two days? I don't think that would be necessary since going from 70 to 400 people in one age division only adds 2 more rounds. Also this is with Juniors/Seniors going before Masters. Having the Swiss portion of all three age divisions at the same time (if that's possible) would easily make things fit in a single day.
I don't think there's anything you can do about getting luck screwed by the schedule. If you want to force people to have to win through the LCQ or Regionals first, that just pushes the problem to another location. You can just as easily get schedule screwed at the LCQ or Regionals and not win the invitation. I don't think the changes this year really change this fact.
My thoughts exactly.
Still eagerly awaiting Canadian locations, times, and overall rules :)
we should be happy with what we've got here. this seems to be a better format and allows for more ways to play. who cares if some "bad" people get in? if you're good enough and they're bad enough you probably won't even play each other due to having different w/l ratios. you can lose to bad luck vs good players too.
open nats is great imo, november/april nats isnt the ~most~ ideal for people who have school the next day but it works out well enough anyway, and now all we need to see are some locations and most importantly the rules and this season really kicks off.
Yeah usually if people lose to 'bad' players, while there may have been some luck involved you can't have been sufficiently better than the opponent to win through the hax. I mean, unless there's stuff like a quick claw, multiple necessary crits, crucial flinches or 5% misses etc it's almost impossible to lose to your average tournamentgoer when you're using a good team.
Just have a solid team, play well, and don't be afraid of someone because you've heard of them and assumed they're really good because they're still definitely beatable and might even be terrible. Too many otherwise good players need to learn to not overpredict, and to use just a solid reliable team- save the prediction and fanciness for worlds.
they're probably going to stick with VGC11 rules until 2012 rolls over imo :/
Not exactly talking about the rules for the actual tournament but that's probably the case as the third version for generation 5 isn't out yet and probably won't be until spring 2012 at the earliest so ubers and pokemon from past generations are probably banned again.
back on topic of open Nationals. I think what they're gonna do is have it open this year and then next year they implement championship points like the TCG does as it expands adding local tournament events like how the TCG has battle roads and you have to be in the top x or x amount of points to get an invite to the Nationals LCQ. Its simple and keeps out some of the bad players from the actual tournament.
This could be interesting.
rules are out, and I'm actually a little bit discouraged by the everything goes minus Ubers format.
fantastic :D :D :D
new rules look great and dark void being banned is also great
Dark Void is now banned.
Edit: Oh, you got there first.
Rules are out? where?