Research Group #5 - Lairon, Simipour, Fraxure

Discussion in 'BW NU' started by DTC, Aug 23, 2012.

  1. DTC

    DTC ˢᵉʳᶦᵒᵘˢ
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    Introduction:
    NU is a tier where many Pokemon are usable, and there are a ton of different options. Research Group aids in helping explore the tier. Who knows, maybe in future tier changes one of these Pokemon can be incredibly useful, potentially being able to check the new threats well. Maybe one of these Pokemon may find uses in other tiers and is not just a simple throw-away Pokemon, unlike some unfortunate Pokemon in NU.

    Some rules:

    • Be open-minded. Don't just say something is terrible and walk away; at least look into them and see what options they may be able to utilize.
    • Feel free to theorymon, but make it clear that you are theorymon'ing. At the end of the week, however, I want discussion to move towards how useful the Pokemon actually are in NU, and what sets are effective on them.
    • Just because an analysis has been done for a Pokemon doesn't mean there isn't more to explore; it's quite possible that something might have gone unnoticed or is missing.
    • Do not post in this thread complaining about the Pokemon I choose and/or suggesting ones we should do for future weeks. I want discussion to stay on topic about the 3 Pokemon we are "researching". You'll be able to vote on what Pokemon you want the next Research Group right before it starts (out of a ballot that is determined by me)

    The 3 Pokemon that we will be looking into this Research Group are:

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    How useful are these Pokemon in NU? What sets can they run effectively? What gives them trouble? What advantages do they have over other Pokemon? How well do they work in the metagame? If you have anything to say about any of these Pokemon, please post about them! It doesn't matter if you've used them or have just faced them in battle, anything is fine (but please, do try them). Just be sure to back up your posts with good competitive reasoning. Remember, discussion is not limited to this topic, you are encouraged to talk about these Pokemon in #neverused/#pokemon as well!

    Please include more substance in your posts than just "in" and what Pokemon you're using. What sets are you planning on using? What interests you about whatever Pokemon you're using?
  2. DTC

    DTC ˢᵉʳᶦᵒᵘˢ
    is a Battle Server Administratoris a Forum Moderatoris a Smogon IRC SOPis a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
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    There will now be a point system in Research Group. Whoever has the most points at the end of 10 Research Group's will get a special prize. You can get points through the following methods:
    • Get one of these 5 awards for Research Group: "Best Forum Discusser" (this topic only), "Best IRC Discusser (#pokemon or #neverused)", "Most Innovative", "Most Interesting Set", and "Game-breaking discovery". Each of these will give you 5 points.
    • Win Pokemon challenges. These challenges would be something like "use Synthesis Simisage effectively". Each challenge you complete successfully you get 3 points for.
    • On Pokemon Showdown, if you ladder up to 1900, you get 6 points, 1750, 4 points, and 1600, 2 points.
    • Possibly some additional bonus points~

    Pokemon Challenges

    Rules:
    • You must test the sets that you post out
    • You must talk about what the sets do and your experiences with them
    • You may not use any slashes

    Note: this is a trial run, so there may be a lot of changes in future Research Group's.

    [​IMG]
    • Create and test a set that effectively uses a boosting move

    [​IMG]
    • Create and test a set that effectively uses Reversal

    [​IMG]
    • Create and test a set that effectively uses Work Up
    • Create and test a set that effectively uses either Liechi Berry or Petaya Berry

    Note: All moves must have some relevant use, and not just be filler choices.

    Points Leaderboard (open)

    1. CrashinBoomBang - 21 points
    2. FLCL - 13 points
    3. Annoyer - 12 points
    4. Tribute - 2 points
    5. Shovel - 1 point
  3. Raseri

    Raseri wut
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Researcher Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
    NU Leader

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    I'll use Fraxure, it strong :) alt: i7f or fraxuring NU


    Also a note to all potential Sweet Potatoes, this thread will be monitored closely, so make sure you discuss each of the pokemon!
  4. Yonko7

    Yonko7 Guns make you stupid. Duct tape makes you smart.
    is a Contributor Alumnus

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    Simipour is meh monkey. Under #pour
  5. Incon

    Incon

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    Yes!! Im so excited to use these three! Ill be using Fraxure and Lairon for sure, possible Simipour too.

    Alt: Freshman

    Will be updating post later with results.
  6. Shuckleking87

    Shuckleking87

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    Using lairon and simipour!

    Alt:Shuckleking55
  7. NuclearMedicineT

    NuclearMedicineT

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    Since I always use Fraxure I'm gonna try Lairon this time. Will be using the alt HeadSmack.
    I'm planning to use this set:

    Lairon @ Eviolite
    Trait: Rock Head
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 HP / 4 SDef
    Adamant Nature
    - Head Smash
    - Stealth Rock
    - Iron Head
    - Earthquake
  8. Annoyer

    Annoyer =)~
    is a Tiering Contributor

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    I will be using Fraxure under the alt "dun for". Since I have used DD and choices sets extensively, I will be posting a bulky SubDD set I made a while ago that has done well for me in the past.
  9. Himanattsu

    Himanattsu

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    I'm in, playing as Simipour. IRC name and PS! name is CirnoBangz. I might take the pinch Berry challenge, since it has Gluttony. Something like this...

    Simipour @ Petaya Berry
    Trait: Gluttony
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Naive Nature
    - Substitute
    - Surf
    - Ice Beam
    - Grass Knot
  10. Sweet Jesus

    Sweet Jesus Neal and Jack and me, absent lovers...

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    I usualy never participate in RW but I'm currently using Fraxure and I'm loving him.
  11. Xei Win Toh

    Xei Win Toh

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    Go for broke or go home.

    I'll use all three, on the alt Ruo.
  12. Bluwing

    Bluwing

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    Ill use Lairon.
  13. Shelmet

    Shelmet

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    I'll use all three though I'll focus on simipour.
  14. Wobble

    Wobble

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    Thank God the ladder is back.

    I think I'll use a physically defensive Lairon set.
  15. Django

    Django
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    Alright I'll be doing this as dragontamerjohn
  16. xJaiYT

    xJaiYT

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    Using Frax(t)ure. :D

    I've not played NU in so long.. I miss jynx :'(

    Laddering on showdown too. under Jai
  17. TROP

    TROP FUCK DRUDDIGON

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    Lairon and Fraxure as options...
    This will be easy as fuck
    Alt: Bobby Kotick
  18. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
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    Using Simipour, likely using NP with Salac

    [​IMG]
    Simipour (F) @ Salac Berry
    Trait: Gluttony
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Naive Nature
    - Nasty Plot
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - HP Grass

    Alt: Eiki Yamaxanadu

    EDIT: Been using Simipour and it's honestly not very good at all, imo. I'd rather be using Samurott or Ludicolo. Maybe it's just me set, but I'll be changing over to Fraxure. Going to try out Keiran's set, Endure Liechi Unburden Reversal Hitmonlee was cool in RU, so I feel like I HAVE to try out that set.
  19. Full2Half

    Full2Half

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    Ok I might try all 3, although i like simipour's challenges, so i'll probably focus on him. Might use fraxure because I already have and hes cool. I've tried lairon though and i'm a bit sceptical, so I might not try him.

    [​IMG]
    I'm probably going to attempt some kind of gluttony set with simipour. my prob with it is to decide if i should go phys or spc. If i go leichi, I can abuse acrobatics and maybe troll for flinches with waterfall. However, if i go for petaya then i can have more power and coverage with hydro pump/ice beam. If all fails, i can always use NP or use scarfed to troll DTC. :]

    [​IMG]

    As for fraxure, i've used it already and I already have an idea of what it's good at. I'll probably use CB or DD because they are cool and strong. The new additions of superpower and aqua tail as well as solid bulk with eviolite, usable speed, and great attack, not to mention dragon typing make him a very capable user of DD. It's no wonder it's been called NU's best dragon type! I like that it's getting exposure this RW, because it definately has potential to be a top tier threat.


    [​IMG]

    Lairon is the poke i'm the least enthusiastic about this week. Tbh, if I use it, it will just be because of SR and dragon/steel duo. However, it does have the potential to run a somewhat effective tank set, although it's a bit weak for my taste. Head smash is pretty awesome, I've got to admit that. But outside head smash and the steel typing, he has no recovery dispite his huge bulk, and therefore is a pretty bland pokemon imo.

    Btw my alt will be Full2TheWaterworks and i'll post any sets that i've tried later.
  20. Shelmet

    Shelmet

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    Kinda just theorymoning, will expand later...

    [​IMG]
    Fraxure @ Liechi Berry
    Trait: Mold Breaker
    Nature: Jolly
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    - Substitute
    - Dragon Dance
    - Reversal
    - Outrage
  21. Keiran

    Keiran

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    [​IMG] (M) @ Salac Berry
    Trait: Mold Breaker
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 HP
    Jolly Nature
    - Swords Dance / Dragon Dance
    - Dragon Claw / Outrage
    - Reversal
    - Endure

    So this Fraxure set is pretty strong, albeit gimmicky. The premise of the set is to set up a Swords Dance or a Dragon Dance, while hopefully surviving a hit. Then using Endure in order to get 1 HP, this does two things: Activate Fraxure's Salac Berry, giving it a much needed speed boost, while also maxing out Reversal's base power. However, this leaves Fraxure vulnerable to all kinds of priority moves, such as Sucker Punch or Mach Punch. While it sounds good on paper, it hasn't been so good in practice. Fraxure's poor defences often mean that it will either set up an Swords Dance, or use Endure to get its Salac Berry boost. Additionally, Fraxure's reliance on being low on HP means that it will often to fall to priority moves. However, when this set does manage to work, it is amazing. I have a short log that I remembered to save, from one of my battles earlier.

    Turn 11
    Fraxure used Endure!
    Fraxure braced itself!
    The foe's Floatzel used Ice Punch!
    It's super effective! Fraxure lost 100% of its health!
    Fraxure ate its Salac Berry!
    The Salac Berry raised Fraxure's Speed!
    Turn 12
    Fraxure used Dragon Claw!
    The foe's Floatzel lost 100% of its health!
    The foe's Floatzel fainted!
    lkjkh sent out Regice!
    Turn 13
    Fraxure used Reversal!
    It's super effective! The foe's Regice lost 100% of its health!
    The foe's Regice fainted!
    lkjkh sent out Ludicolo!
    Turn 14
    Fraxure used Dragon Claw!
    A critical hit! The foe's Ludicolo lost 100% of its health!
    The foe's Ludicolo fainted!
  22. xJaiYT

    xJaiYT

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    Oh mother of god Fraxure is so good! I'm not a fan of using superpower, but aqua tail is good coverage. Anyone else notice you can kinda build a Rain team around these 3 Pokes?

    Notable partners:
    Rotom-S
    Seaking.
    Electabuzz
    Garbodor
    Vileplume
  23. Full2Half

    Full2Half

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    I also forgot to mention it also got low kick which can be better than superpower on the DD set due to no drops etc.
  24. Wobble

    Wobble

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    [​IMG]


    Post about Physically Defensive Lairon coming up.
  25. ChaoticaMortis

    ChaoticaMortis

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    Alt: Mortis_Is_Testing

    I will attempt to build a successful team around Lairon. Knowing that investing in Speed would probably be useless (as Lairon is so slow), I decided to make a bulky attacking set with Hone Claws as the boosting move. I'm not sure whether I should use Eviolite or Life Orb, but for now I will be testing this set:

    Lairon @ Eviolite
    Trait: Rock Head
    Adamant Nature
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Def
    -Head Smash
    -Earthquake
    -Superpower
    -Hone Claws

    Head Smash is obvious STAB, while Rock Head keeps you from taking that horrid recoil. Earthquake is for perfect neutral coverage. Superpower is for coverage but it seems a little redundant with what I already have. It's not like Lairon has many other options though. Hone Claws is probably the most useful move on the set as it boosts Head Smash's accuracy to much more acceptable levels while also raising the power of all Lairon's other attacks. I'll also be testing this set with a Life Orb instead of Eviolite if I find the extra bulk to be unnecessary.

    EDIT: The more I think about it, the more I also like the idea of using this set with Life Orb in Trick Room. Lairon has the potential to make great use of the pseudo Speed boost.

    PROGRESS EDIT: So far Lairon is proving to be pretty good. I've paired it up with Drifblim as he lures Fighting and Ground attacks like mad, and the pair has been somewhat successful. Hone Claws has also been a great decision as I haven't missed a single Head Smash after boosting with it, and the extra power makes the move even more devastating. Definitely a good Pokemon when it gets a chance to set up.

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