Research Week - USUM Edition [Week 2]

#1
Shoutouts to Mazz, Kitten Milk and Kink for hosting the previous editions of this project, and for big parts of the OP!
Hosted by Ark and eht

Once again, we are back with Research Week: USUM edition! In this project, participants research suggested Pokemon every week and share their experience. Whoever has the highest ladder score at the end of the week will be declared the winner. For details, see below.



Keep the following things in mind during every Research Week:

  • Be open-minded. Don't just say something is terrible and walk away; look at its stats, typing and movepool and think something up!
  • Feel free to theorymon early in the research period, but make it clear you're doing so. Later in the period, however, you will be expected to back up your posts with hard evidence like logs, actual sets, perhaps even teams.
  • Just because an analysis has been done for a Pokemon doesn't mean there isn't more to explore; it's very likely that something has gone unnoticed.
  • Do not post in this thread complaining about the Pokemon or movesets I choose and / or suggesting ones we should do for future weeks. Feel free to VM / PM me these suggestions, but don't expect me to always listen to you.


A few things to clarify:

  • Sign-ups can be as late as you want, but the week will always end on Sunday.
  • Early period means the first three days of the Research Week, so let's keep the theorymoning to a minimum after this period. The late period refers to the last four days of the research week, where raw evidence and discussion should become the basis of the thread.
  • Discussion is mandatory in order to be considered as a winner of Research Week. If you do not post one somewhat-coherent post that describes the Pokemon that you're using, their roles, and their niche in the metagame, you will be disqualified from winning this week. Please post about your experiences regardless of whether you think you've got a chance to win or not, we appreciate it!
  • Finally, I'd like to implore you to all please remember to post and save your replays. Often, these replays are the most informative sources of information about RW Pokemon - you can write a full two paragraphs about the role of a Pokemon, but often that can all be summed up with a video and an explanation of it. How useful are these Pokemon in SMUU? What gives them trouble? What advantages do they have over other Pokemon? How well do they work in the metagame? If you have anything to say about any of these Pokemon, please post about them! Remember, discussion is not limited to this topic, you are encouraged to talk about these Pokemon in the UU chat on Pokemon Showdown, in the official UU Discord, and in the Viability Ranking Thread.



This Week's Selection

Barbaracle @ Rockium Z
Ability:
EVs:
filler Nature
- Stone Edge
- Shell Smash
-
-

Tornadus @ filler item
Ability: Prankster
EVs:
filler nature
- Defog
-
-
-

Gastrodon @ filler item
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs:
filler Nature
-
-
-
-

In order to participate you must do the following:

  • Post here with a fresh (USM) RW alt (such as USM RW eht or RW King UU) and the name(s) of the Pokemon you will be using.
  • Use at least one of the Pokemon being researched.
  • Post your experiences with the Pokemon you're using, participate in the discussion!
  • Post logs of this Pokemon in action against other teams - don't just tell us, show us
  • The winner of the challenge will be the person who has the highest ladder ranking on the Pokemon Showdown UU ladder with their RW alt at the time the challenge ends. Winners will also receive a permanent spot in the SMUU Hall of Fame.

Week 2 deadline: Sunday, Dec 10th at 11:59pm GMT+1
 
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#2
Reserved for archive

Archive:

Bewear @ filler item
Ability: Fluffy
EVs:
filler Nature
- Drain Punch
-
-
-

Araquanid @ filler item
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs:
filler nature
-
-
-
-

Moltres @ filler item
Ability:
EVs:
filler Nature
-
-
-
-
 
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Ark

is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributor
Moderator
#3
Welcome back everyone to Research Week! With the new games released, several Pokemon have received new moves, be it through level up, egg or tutor. Many drops occured in the past couple of months, shaking up the tier. We are now in a completely new metagame with new options to explore, and that is just what we will do.

For the first week, the selection is:

Bewear @ filler item
Ability: Fluffy
EVs:
filler Nature
- Drain Punch
-
-
-

Araquanid @ filler item
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs:
filler nature
-
-
-
-

Moltres @ filler item
Ability:
EVs:
filler Nature
-
-
-
-


Bewear has been occasionally used as a wallbreaker during the SM meta. Beyond a good Attack stat, it boasted good bulk for an offensive Pokemon and its ability Fluffy allowed it to take on many physical threats reliably. In SM, it has been bestowed with Drain Punch; while weaker than its other Fighting STAB options of Superpower and Hammer Arm, it allows Bewear to recover its HP back. A set we are particularly interested in is the SD Z-Double Edge set to see how it performs against current meta stall teams, but any set you use is fine so long it has Drain Punch.

While it has seen no real usage before, Araquanid has got an interesting addition in Sticky Web. Whether or not it is a reliable hazard setter remains to be seen but its strength should allow it to keep up Webs and have some use outside of setting Sticky Web should it be impossible to get up. While not new, balanced and stall teams are on the rise again with the introduction of more defoggers, so the Spider Web set might work as a way to break these teams apart.

And while Bewear and Araquanid can probably do damage to stall teams, Moltres is currently seen on stall. Dual Defog stall with Moltres and Mega Altaria is increasing in usage. Moltres is more versatile than this, though, as its STAB combination allows it to deal damage to many common bulky offense and balance teams. Flynium Z can be a nifty tool to not just deal massive damage but also avoid missing Hurricane. Beyond this, sets utilizing Substitute to pressure stall might have some use.

As with past editions, sign up with a fresh (USM) RW alt, and post your results, as well as your own thoughts on the Pokemon in question. You are free to edit your signup post if your post count is a concern. For the first week, the deadline will be Sunday, Dec 3rd, at 11:59 pm GMT+1. My co-host eht or I will check everyone's ladder scores then and decide the winner. Good luck everyone and happy researching!
 
#4
was planning on testing bewear anyway so let's do this (RW1 Cake)

So, the first set I tested out was this:

Bewear @ Leftovers
Ability: Fluffy
EVs: 252 HP / 212 SpD / 44 Spe
Careful Nature
- Substitute
- Bulk Up
- Drain Punch
- Return

I found it to be pretty inconsistent, even with dark-type and pursuit support. It occasionally cleaned up or tanked hits when it got the rare opportunity to do so, but usually it just ended up doing nothing most games due to its low speed investment for a setup pkmn. The EV spread could probably be tweaked a bit to make this more suited to the current meta, but I don't have the will to hammer one out to be entirely honest. I do have at least one replay of this set working though.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7uu-665288321

I also tested this set:

Bewear @ Normalium,Z
Ability: Fluffy
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Drain Punch
- Double-Edge
- Earthquake


This set actually worked quite well. While it could only actually set up SD versus fatter teams, it still usually got at least one kill per game due to its ability to easily take a hit from most phsyical attackers and OHKO back with Breakneck Blitz. It was a pretty solid wallbreaker and it definitely stands out from the CB set. Breakneck Blitz could OHKO stuff like Serperior, Celebi, Latias, and Kommo-O (while that was still a thing) after Stealth Rock damage. It was also helped significantly at doing its job thanks to Sticky Web, which I also ran...

Araquanid @ Splash Plate
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 68 HP / 252 Atk / 188 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Liquidation
- Leech Life
- Sticky Web
- Magic Coat

This set for Araquanid puts in way more work than that weird 0 speed Red Card set which shouldn't have even become a thing. The speed investment allows for Araquanid to outspeed and 2HKO bulky Scizor. Araquanid, rather than being a dedicated webs lead, functions as a wallbreaker and sticky web setter. Its primary goal, as it turned out in my games, was to just click liquidation until the opposing team was very much weakened or KOd, with setting webs just being a secondary thing it could do if it found the opportunity. The HP investment actually lets Araquanid avoid a few OHKOs from full like Mega Sharpedo Crunch or Mega Manectric Thunderbolt, which is nice. Araquanid's typing also lets it act as a pretty nifty check to some stuff like Mamoswine, Infernape, and Cobalion. Overall I think this thing is the best webber in the tier at the moment for Sticky Web offense, partially because i don't really like using suicide leads right now as a whole.

some Araq replays (Also ft bewear)
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7uu-665560295

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7uu-665563244
 
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#5
RW Wabbit is my account name now lets get into the research!

Moltres in my opinion is an amazing pokemon particularly because of its typing:

Moltres (ignoring abilities):
Weaknesses: Electric, Rock, Water
Resistances: Bug, Fairy, Fighting, Fire, Grass, Steel
Immunities: Ground

In the meta right now there are next to no rock type sweepers and very few pokemon with rock type moves giving moltres little resistance. The rock, water, and electric pokemon and moves that threaten moltres can easily be countered by seismitoad who I have paired with moltres. Because moltres is four times weak to rocks hazard removal is a must which why I supported moltres with two defoggers.

Moltres @ Life Orb
Ability: Flame Body
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast
- Hurricane
- Hidden Power [Grass]
- Roost


This first replay was low ladder and was not a difficult match but it shows the power and utility of moltres:

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7uu-665309924

Notice how I brought in moltres on beedrill knowing that I take a poison jab and he has no choice but to u-turn. But when he u-turns flame body catches beedrill burning it making it no longer a threat. With moltres' two 110 power stab moves not much can switch in to it. He switches in feraligatr which is KO'd by a hurricane after rocks. Moltres' typing gives it opportunities to come in forcing a switch and weakening the opponents defensive core. It is a great wall breaker and with roost it can't be easily worn down.


The second replay shows how two defoggers can help moltres stay healthy and be able to switch in on resisted attacks. Moltres again was able to switch in on beedrill burning it. It also was able to switch in on dhelmise and tank an attack if necessary and get the KO.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7uu-666176816
 
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#6
Alright, this looks interesting. I think I will be throwing my own hat into this one. Already have been running Webs araq for the last week or so, and was going to make bewear my new test subject. Will be using my alt RW Mr.L for research!
 
#8
Account: RW Neckboi

Alright so this mon is highkey flames... shoutout Count Bleck

RED CARD STICKY WEBS

Araquanid @ Red Card
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Sticky Web
- Liquidation
- Lunge
- Magic Coat

Aight so like if Serperior wasnt a thing that existed, and if every mon in the meta didnt have defog, then this mon could definitely work, ESPECIALLY with Kommo-o running around everywhere, it eats Clangorous Soulblaze without difficulty, and forces the omni-boosted Kommo-o out with Red Card, bye bitch. With its bulk, it can tank pretty much any special attack, including shit like Hurricane from a Mega Pidgeot... Theres other great stuff about this pokemon and this set in particular, but I think its big downfall is the fact that, like I said, Serperior exists, and so does Defog. This is NOT the meta to be using webs in unless you deadass are that fuckin good with webs... but yeah this set is super nice shoutout Count Bleck.



SPIDER WEBS TRAPPER

Araquanid @ Poisonium Z / Leftovers
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Spider Web
- Toxic
- Rest
- Liquidation


This set is actually beyond fun... no one expects it in UU and you can lowkey trap a whole lotta stuff with it. Low ladder, you can trap anything for the most part, considering they usually dont know wtf Araquanid does and just switch into something random that they think beats it. I have Poisonium Z on it cause of the +1 Defense boost you get with Z Toxic to make this thing pretty much unkillable with it's absurd SpDef stat and +1 Defense. I suppose the main thing this thing is good at is trapping Water types because people get all hyphy and think they can survive Liquidation with fuckin ease just to be hit with the Spider Webs, which, to be completely fuckin honest, I did not know this move existed before using this lmfao. That's when you just click toxic and outstall your opponent with Rest and Liquidation. Now obviously outside of trapping things this thing does a ton of damage still with Liquidation because of Water Bubble, which is cool. Now the reason I don't see this set being 100% viable is because well... first off its pretty matchup dependent, its somewhat inconsistent, and pokemon like Serperior can click Substitute and its a fuckin wrap lmao. Super cool set tho.



Idk what set is next... might just do splash plate webs
 
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#16
probably done laddering for now thanks to school, but i got enough games in to get some kind of an opinion on bewear

http://pokepast.es/9f59dc53a09f0819 - the team i used, finished 27-3 which is p decent. i built around bewear and bulky band scizor as they help break for each other and scizor can trap shit that threatens out bewear. muk could maybe go in over sciz if u want to trap stuff more consistently but i like the additional offensive presence you get with sciz.

my opinion from using it in the (few) games i played vs stall is that it doesnt break nearly as easy as something like hera or LO nape, but it offers more to a team defensively (consistently checking stuff on offense/balance like mbee, muk, superpower-less sciz, etc). drain punch helps in this regard as it makes it less prone to being worn down by what it checks. setting up vs stall isnt too difficult as the threat of band usually forces out what you come in on like aggron, doublade, or defog sciz. with perfect play i could see it functioning as a more or less standalone stallbreaker, but due to it needing the z-move to break stuff like quag/mola its not as straightforward as something like hera and needs more support because of it.

vs offense and balance i found that its bulk helps it not be deadweight, and thanks to how common muk and scizor are it isn’t difficult to find an opportunity to set up / kill something with z-dedge. it also works well against teams that rely on gliscor as a fighting resist which i ran into a lot when i was laddering

replays:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7uu-665512625 - vs lower ladder stall, once dhelmise is trapped bewear can go in freely, tspikes being up gives it a little more lenience with breaking thru quag

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7uu-665502880 - vs pyuku stall, i play pretty poorly w/ bewear but get bailed out by an EQ crit vs a spdef focused amoong

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7uu-665687356 - vs gliscor bo, im able to set up vs a choice locked krook and break thru gliscor w/ z-dedge
 
#19
I used Moltres. I am assuming most users here are going to talk about either Flyinium Z or defensive Moltres so I will only cover Grassium Z, which is a cool underrated tech I have used.

Z-Solar Beam, obviously, lets Moltres lure and OHKO bulky Water-type Pokémon, mainly Rotom-W, which makes it a great partner for things like Scizor and Azumarill. Though, other than OHKO-ing Rotom-W, Z-Hurricane is usually the better option as it lets it OHKO other things it struggles against and still hit bulky waters not named Rotom-W. This is why I feel that Z-Solar Beam should only used on specific teams that are quite Rotom-W weak.

Something noteworthy, other than the obvious x4 Stealth Rock weakness, is that its good moves are innacurate. Relying on Hurricane and Fire Blast to hit isn't something really great and makes Moltres not as consistent as you'd want it to be.

Other than that, Moltres is a really good, underrated Pokémon - with two high power STAB moves, good typing and good offensive and defensive stats.


(hint: click on the sprites for importable)

That's the main team I was using. Scolipede is banned, unfortunately, but this shows you an example of a team that really likes the removal of Rotom-W, a team that appreciates Z-Solar Beam over Z-Hurricane (although both items work).
 
#21
For W1 I used webs Araquanid because I was already planning to build Hoopa on a webs team. Overall just a fun team, but weak to a lot and loses to a lot in my testing of it, including opposing Sciz. (I'd recommend not using Nidok I started testing that mon around the end of my run)

Araquanid's possibly the best web setter in this tier. Before using it, I played around with Slurpuff and Smeargle to get a feel of what the other webbers had to offer, and I have to say that I enjoy Araquanid's defensive utility the most. The fact that it beats most rockers in this tier is a p refreshing feeling when using a web setter, and magic coat really completes the set as a safe lead. I'm actually going to continue testing for now, I kind of regret starting W1 late but I'm glad I decided to test this mon.

(This team's ass)


Araquanid @ Red Card
Ability: Water Bubble
EVs: 188 HP / 252 Atk / 68 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Liquidation
- Magic Coat
- Sticky Web
- Lunge
 
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#22
I decided to test out semi-defensive moltres with grassium z ^^
https://pokepast.es/5e4c5c29ea3700d4 this is the team i decided to use i went 22-6

I didn't really feel like moltres did much tbh. I barely even went against rotom-w or bulky waters in general i would like to lure in :/
But i found that moltres was working really well as a wall for me alot of the games especially against the more bulky type of teams.(might start using it as a wall :D)

After testing this i would probs go either full tank or offensive and then use flyinium z since it does more dmg on most of the meta. I still think that grassium z is a nice tech if u want a bait for certain mons. I really like moltres it does alot of damage and its has great stabs^^

This is my first time doing a post about a mon so hope its decent aha xd
 
#23
And with that, the first USUM Research Week is over. Congratulations to Amane Misa for winning!

Bewear functioned pretty much as expected. It worked as a great check to many threats against offensive teams, while the SD Z-Double-Edge sets could pressure stall teams. Notily notes that Drain Punch helps in preventing Bewear from being worn down easily, which is useful against offense and balance teams due to Bewear taking on roles beyond being a wallbreaker. As a standalone wallbreaker, Bewear is outclassed by the likes of Heracross and Infernape, but its niche comes from the defensive utility it has over either of those Pokemon. A Cake Wearing A Hat also tested Sub Bulk Up Bewear, but came to the conclusion it is an inconsistent set, while he found the SD set to be effective.

Araquanid has seen three different sets in use this week: a Splash Plate Sticky Web hazard setter/wallbreaker hybrid, a more defensive Red Card Sticky Web setter, and as a Spider Web Trapper. The trapping set seemed to work quite decently for SuperVegeta20, who ran a fully defensive set. He managed to trap a good deal of Pokemon people switched in, mainly Water-types, but due to not running anything that applies offensive pressure, he struggled with Pokemon like Substitute Serprior.

For the Sticky Web sets, SuperVegeta20 used a defensive Red Card build. This one didn't work out much as a hazard setter, but acted as a way to force Kommo-o to switch out due to its Red Card rather. Due to not running any offensive investment, it had a hard time dealing with hazard removal, though. Meanwhile, A Cake Wearing A Hat was using an offensive variant with Splash Plate that primarily acted as a wallbreaker and tank. It usually served as an answer to Mamoswine, Infernape and Cobalion, and pressured the opposing team using its strong Water Bubble Liquidation. Sticky Webs were more of a second thought that were only used occasionally, but they did come into play. Interestingly enough, Lunge was used over Leech Life in the replays, but it didn't seem to change much.

The last Pokemon being tested was Moltres, which has seen an increase in usage recently with the new Defoggers around. Wascally Wabbit used an offensive Life Orb set with Hidden Power Grass, which let Moltres act as a wallbreaker. Meanwhile, Amane Misa and TobyyRL both used variants of Grassium Z Solar Beam Moltres to try and lure in bulky Water-types such as Rotom-W and OHKO them, allowing Pokemon like Scizor and Azumarill more breathing room. Both found Grassium to be generally outclassed by the Flyinium Z set, though, as Z-Hurricane hits a wider array of targets, including every Water-type bar Rotom-w. However, while it was a fearsome Pokemon, Amane Misa does note that relying on two STAB moves with less than perfect accuracy caused Moltres to be a bit inconsistent at times.

Sadly, no one seems to have tested a more defensive variant, but there is more than enough double Defog stall around to know it's a great Pokemon on those kind of teams. With that over and done with, the new week shall consist of:

Barbaracle @ Rockium Z
Ability:
EVs:
filler Nature
- Stone Edge
- Shell Smash
-
-

Tornadus @ filler item
Ability: Prankster
EVs:
filler nature
- Defog
-
-
-

Gastrodon @ filler item
Ability: Storm Drain
EVs:
filler Nature
-
-
-
-


A rather odd selection of Pokemon, starting off with Barbaracle; near the end of SM, a few people have noted that they found success with Barbaracle. While not all of them ran the exact same set, they found it to be a terrifying Shell Smash sweeper and wallbreaker. While it is not mandatory on this set, it's worth noting that Barbaracle has gained Liquidation to use over Razor Shell in USUM.

The second Pokemon of the bunch is Tornadus, with a twist. In the new games, Tornadus has become able to learn Defog via move tutor. This seems like an odd choice on such a Pokemon, since it has absolutely no defensive utility whatsoever. It does get Prankster as an ability, though. While we are doubtful that this will work, we are interested in seeing whether or not the priority Defog can be useful in any way.

With that, we're at Gastrodon. It may share a typing with Swampert and Seismitoad, but unlike either of them, it does not get access to Stealth Rock. It is slow and its strength is lacking. It does, however, get a recovery move and, just like Seismitoad, completely shuts down most Rotom-Wash variants. Toxic variants can still be a hassle to deal with, but those have been quite uncommon recently.

We are aware that the selection of Pokemon this time is a bit strange, but that is precisely why they belong here. As always, sign up with a fresh (USM) RW alt, and post your results, as well as your own thoughts on the Pokemon in question. Please report back by Sunday, Dec 10th, 11:59 pm GMT+1. Week 2 will end then, and either my co-host Ark or I will check your ladder scores to see who won. We're really looking forward to your research this time. Best of Luck!
 
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