OU RoA Speed CCAT 2 - Step 3: Teammates - Muk


Poliwrath @ Leftovers
- Belly Drum
- Lovely Kiss
- Hydro Pump
- Submission/Body Slam

Poliwrath would be an odd check for snorlax. It has a decent dual typing. Also with lovely kiss, it is able to set up belly drum on anything without sleep talk. It gets access to hydro pump which will hit anything that doesn't resist decently. Although submission has recoil, after belly drum you can KO Snorlax at +1. If you want to use this thing as a sweeper, although I wouldn't advise it. Body Slam can be used in place of Submission. That won't give it as much to deal with Snorlax though. It will hit around 50% on an unboosted Snorlax. But yeah, that's my set. Please take it with a grain of salt though because i'm fairly inexperienced when it comes to GSC. I've always liked poliwrath though and thought this might be fun:)
+6 Poliwrath Submission vs. +1 Snorlax: 505-594 (96.5 - 113.5%) -- 79.5% chance to OHKO
 

MoxieInfinite

Banned deucer.
please never use poliwrath outside of agipass.


Most of the shit previously mentioned are stuff that technically works, but they have literally no defensive utility and you will feel like you play 5v6 most of the game just to set up that one cool set that might have a shitty matchup anyway. What everyone will suggest anyway are gonna be the 20th and lower best GSC mons that have a niche, so I'll save y'all from the work and write up whatever needs a shoutout in the metagame. Shoot me.




Heracross @ Leftovers
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
- Megahorn
- Curse

lol dis nigga. It's pretty neat now that you look at how many of todays builds that forego a flying (Skarm, Zapdos) and how hard some of them get smacked by this thing. Once mainly Skarm and Steelix are gone, this shit can wreck some real havoc, while unlike Scizor, also performs defensively as a sleep absorber that comes in and sets up on non-FB Nidoking. Of course there's the more common Seismic Toss variant, but that shit's dull, and not something you really can build around, but more of a last-second addition for most teams, that wants something that chips decently on Skarmory. ProTip: user Endeby tends to be weak to this.





Tentacruel @ Leftovers
- Swords Dance
- Sludge Bomb
- Hydro Pump/Surf
- Substitute

God damn this thing's great, don't know why it's not used more. Sets up on non-AA Vap (BORAT?) easily, non-HP Electric Cloyster (which unfortunately is everywhere, but Cloy dies fast anyway), and ravages through a lot of the common mons on offense. Steelix is 2HKOed, Tyranitar is 2HKOed with H-Pump, Eggy is almost OHKOed by 476 (+2) Sludge Bomb (but Eggy often takes a lot of irrecoverable damage anyway), and even electrics dislike the poison that potentially comes from Sludge Bomb. Pretty sure Lax takes about ~40-ish percent from +2 Sludge Bomb which is pretty reasonable damage. And seeing as many as up to six of those Pokemon on the same team, isn't unreasonable at all.





Jynx @ Leftovers
- Lovely Kiss
- Psychic
- Ice Beam
- Substitute

Jynx is pretty neat, because it threatens the main Sleep Talker on offense; Zapdos. Substitute eases prediction, and also is used because Jynx doesn't really have all that many options that will do much in the long run. Main issues are as always the other fat sleep absorbers, and the main special walls, Raikou (ST?), Snorlax (ST?), Vaporeon and Suicune. You can try to pass some Growth's to it but you need Roar Cune and Raikou gone first, before Vap can pass reliably. Or you can try the next mon on my list...





Jolteon @ Leftovers
- Thunder/Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power Water
- Growth
- Baton Pass

GrowthPass Jolteon always looked cool in my eyes but I never had the courage to try it out. One of the few Pokemon that actually benefits from Raikou being a Sleep Talk variant, and thus I had high hopes for it. Probably the eeveelution that has the easier time Baton Passing boosts, though as mentioned has a hard-stop in Roar Raikou. 999 Jolteon is also probably the most dangerous of the eeveelutions, but it's a bit too slow to get there. I'm running out of shit to say now. There's also Bite (lol) as an attacking option if you wan't to sweep, as you hit Exeggutor and probably nothing else, but I don't have the balls to do that.





Venusaur @ Leftovers
- Growth
- Sludge Bomb
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Leech Seed

I believe I ran into Conflict on the PO ladder when he was running this, and god damn it pissed me off. My memory might be hella bad, and for all I know it might've been an illusion, but I'm pretty sure he used something like this and it was quite an annoyance. Sludge Bomb poison in conjunction with Leech Seed is quite a bitch, and Venusaur is fast and pulls of LS very well. Also hits Exeggutor I guess. HP Fire for general coverage. I don't remember the rest of his team, but seeing a nice build with this mon included would be quite sexy (though if you're gonna min-max the teams, you're probably skipping the non-top 20 mons anyway).


Disgregard this, memory was shitty.






I believe a lot of the other viable-but-never-used Pokemon you can find hanging in the BL list are mostly mons you slot in later, and can't really build around, so I won't go ahead and suggest whole sets for them, but the noteworthy ones are probably Golem, Donphan, Houndoom, Alakazam, Raichu, Jumpluff, etc. There's also Clefable which is quite cool because of it's neat speed and one-turn recovery. also wtf does moltres do lol.





I don't wanna see anyone ever build around(?) this next set anyway, but it's so dumb I just have to showcase it.



Umbreon @ Leftovers
- Mean Look
- Rest
- Screech
- Swagger

Confusion mayhem. Shoutout to Thiago Rios for this gay piece of aids that drove me and probably more people nuts. Hilariously effective though, and I need to give props to Thiago for coming up with this lol. You either make it out as a powerhouse (assuming you're a physical attacker), or you die a brutal death looking at the face of a sleeping cat of doom. Rest outstalls Thunder's from the electrics, which is quite nice, so don't send those in for whatever reason. If you ever use it, nickname it Cased cuz I know he loves to play against this set.
 
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MoxieInfinite

Banned deucer.
subbing every 2nd turn still takes a big toll on tenta which does have a hard time recovering the health it loses, but i guess thats a fair point.

regarding the umby, i checked and i have several logs of him using rest. guess hes changing it up :o

edit: then again surf breaks sub in two shots anyway most of the time so eh i guess that was a shitty example.
 
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Jorgen

World's Strongest Fairy
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Clefable @ Leftovers
-Frustration
-Flamethrower
-Moonlight
-Belly Drum


Gengar @ Leftovers
-Thunder
-Ice Punch
-Confuse Ray
-Explosion


I've never been able to get Fable to work, mostly because it's work to find chances for it to switch in and set up. As a result, most Fable teams I see are kinda forced, like Clefable is just there because the 6th mon is kinda flexible, and not because it's legitimately the best thing to use there. Cray on Gengar is a goofy 4th move but not outright terrible, and might just be the goofy solution this problem needs. Fable can come directly in on a confused Lax or Raikou to play for the 50%, and Moonlight means it's not totally punishing if you fail, unlike the case for other drummers. Such a core would need something like Machamp and Spikes support to deal with Ttar, obviously. FT > FB on Fable might let you play for burns if need be, heh.

I figure Fable needs to be coming in a bunch to make full use of its talents, this concept is entirely intended to maximize that via RNG abuse. If another luck abuse mon (e.g., Octazooka Kingdra???) strikes peoples' fancy, then that can obviously be used. I figured Gengar is probably best because it's really good at forcing plays, and has other goals in mind (e.g., Exploding on Raikou) to avoid shoe-horning the team into single-mindedly supporting a sometimes-great, sometimes-mediocre Pokemon.

EDIT: Dual screens Zapper would also work well. Because of how open-ended this can be, consider the Gengar/Zapdos bits as mere suggestions, and make Fable the primary nomination.
 
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Lavos

Banned deucer.
Regarding Thiago's Umbreon, I have logs of him using both Body Slam and Rest (separately, of course). Played him 3 hours ago on ladder and he was using Body Slam though.

Also, why Growth on Venusaur? HP Fire isn't hitting anything that normally abuses RestTalk or one-turn recovery mechanics, and something like Synthesis seems far better for what it's trying to do. Or simply a Grass STAB.
 
QUAGOD

Quagsire (M) @ Leftovers
- Belly Drum
- Rest
- Earthquake
- Hidden Power [Rock]

Could maybe go Return in that 4th slot? idk, I'm no gsc veteran. You all know what it does- switches in on Zap/Kou and threatens to go on a BD rampage. Most notable issues this set has are Skarm and Egg, so teammates that remove those are appreciated. Also appreciates agipass if you're into that
 

MoxieInfinite

Banned deucer.
Sludge Bomb Venu was an April Fools joke....no?

As I said memory was sloppy, and I went purely off theorymon. I'll look up the logs and post the right set later.
 
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Houndoom @Leftovers/Miracleberry
Sunny Day
Fire Blast
Solarbeam
Pursuit

The Hellhound itself. This guy has the charm of being arguably the best option to Pursuit-trap Exeggutor. Sun boosted Fire Blasts hurt and even put a dent in Snorlax who usually absorbs special hits well. Just get Blissey and maybe Suicune out of the way first. Houndoom also traps and snipes ghosts, which helps on a team that appreciates Spikes being removed and/or teams that use, for example, mono-Lax. Being frail, proper team support is needed.
 

Mr.E

unban me from Discord
is a Two-Time Past SPL Champion
While it's unfortunate Tiba chose to pack HP-less Marowak against me, I'm not dissatisfied with having brought Venusaur to my Finals match instead. Eggy is better overall because Ground resist and actual offensive capability, yeah, but Venusaur still packs the Fighting resist (because fuck Machamp) without being vulnerable to Pursuit, getting the dick from HP Bug (from Machamp or Marowak) and having much better special bulk for pivoting around Electrics. Trying to make it an offensive threat seems like a lost cause though, when your strongest attack is base 60 STAB with 8 PP, but it's a legit if not rarely used supporter. It's like Meganium except you trade in the Ground resist for Fighting resist plus Sleep Powder.

I had other shit to add to Moxie's post myself anyway, I think. I don't really care much for this kind of activity but that was hardly an exhaustive list of "sub-top 20" mons to deserve some consideration.

Quick list of random mons/ideas:
Porygon2, preferably a PAR-inducer (T-Wave, Double-Edge, Ice Beam, Recover) over Cursegon setting the stage for a PAR-based team to open up a Marowak/Machamp rampage.

Smeargle, especially non-BP (because that's too easy). Spikes lead is the most obvious alternative, Spore being the big advantage Cloyster/Forry don't have. Other notable moves include Super Fang for damage, Counter/MCoat/DBond to get a trade, and Encore to punish boosting.

Something with Dragonite, some of that hyperdefensive shit from the SPL dump thread seemed kinda interesting. I don't know what direction this might take us though.

Something with Espeon or Zam, the former making a good Growth passer where Zam can threaten Encore or perhaps do something with Counter (sadly they're illegal together). On that note, MC Suicune or some such would be cool too. Reflective moves, man.

Also seconding any of Kangaskhan, Muk or Growth/BP Jolteon. Jolteon has enough defensive utility against its fellow Electrics (except Roar Raikou ruins Baton Pass) and scaring Electric-weak shit. Muk is pretty bulky, sadly the typing doesn't do it any favors but threatening Explosion sure can.
 
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Sapientia

Wir knutschen
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Articuno @ Leftovers
- Curse
- Hidden Power [Flying]
- Roar
- Substitute(/Rest)

"Andicuno", a slight variation of Bedschibaer's Kangaskhan. Speed can be set to 236 in order to avoid outrunning Steelix after a curse.

While being less immediately powerful (262 Atk vs. 288, 70 Base Power vs. 102) and about als physically bulky as Kangaskhan, it is much more capable of taking non-Electric special attacks and immune to Spikes and Earthquake, allowing it to fulfil some defensive roles.

Even with the loss of HP due to Hidden Power IVs, most weaker neutral special attacks struggle to break its Substitutes. Suicune's Surf has a chance of 36%, Cloyster's just 16%.

Suicune Surf vs. Articuno: 82-97 (22.3 - 26.4%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery
Cloyster Surf vs. Articuno: 79-94 (21.5 - 25.6%) -- possible 5HKO after Leftovers recovery

The usual Steelix has to resort to Explosion in order to touch it, thus shielding more valuable Pokemon, and even without Ice Beam, it still has the upper hand against Exeggutor.

Articuno Hidden Power Flying vs. Exeggutor: 149-176 (37.9 - 44.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
Exeggutor Psychic vs. Articuno: 97-115 (26.4 - 31.3%) -- 20.4% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery
Exeggutor Hidden Power Fire vs. Articuno: 102-120 (27.7 - 32.6%) -- 81.8% chance to 4HKO after Leftovers recovery

Unlike Kangaskhan, it does neither need Rapid Spin to come in multiple times, nor Pursuit to hit the ghosts. However, Pursuit/Charme/BatonPass/Rest Umbreon might still be a good partner for its ability to take out Gengar and grant it some Leftovers regeneration with a slow Baton Pass.

More synergy comes from Gengar and Exeggutor, since they lure Raikou and Zapdos into their Explosions, and Vaporeon and Tentacruel, as they tend to draw Thunders as well, thus reducing its PP. Raikou itself might be a good partner, being capable of taking the Thunders aimed at Andicuno and luring in Steelix.

The Thunder/Hidden Power Electric fad is a blessing for Articuno due to Thunder's low PP and accuracy and the reduced usage of physically bulky Rock Slide users.
 

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