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RoA Speed CCAT - [DONE]
- Thread starter sandshrewz
- Start date
new version
Gengar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 216 Atk / 104 SAtk / 188 Spd
Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def)
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Punch
- Hypnosis
- Explosion
Celebi @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 12 Def / 92 SAtk / 152 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Giga Drain
- Baton Pass
- Hidden Power [Fire]
Moltres @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 28 HP / 252 SAtk / 228 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Sunny Day
- Will-O-Wisp
- Hidden Power [Ice]
Dugtrio (M) @ Choice Band
Trait: Arena Trap
EVs: 224 Atk / 32 SDef / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Aerial Ace
- Hidden Power [Bug]
Metagross @ Leftovers
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 196 HP / 176 Atk / 32 Def / 76 SAtk / 28 Spd
Naughty Nature (+Atk, -SDef)
- Psychic
- Meteor Mash
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Explosion
Jirachi @ Leftovers
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 96 SAtk / 48 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Wish
- Thunderbolt
- Psychic
i think it is better than the other one
Gengar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Levitate
EVs: 216 Atk / 104 SAtk / 188 Spd
Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def)
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Punch
- Hypnosis
- Explosion
Celebi @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 12 Def / 92 SAtk / 152 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Giga Drain
- Baton Pass
- Hidden Power [Fire]
Moltres @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 28 HP / 252 SAtk / 228 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Fire Blast
- Sunny Day
- Will-O-Wisp
- Hidden Power [Ice]
Dugtrio (M) @ Choice Band
Trait: Arena Trap
EVs: 224 Atk / 32 SDef / 252 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Aerial Ace
- Hidden Power [Bug]
Metagross @ Leftovers
Trait: Clear Body
EVs: 196 HP / 176 Atk / 32 Def / 76 SAtk / 28 Spd
Naughty Nature (+Atk, -SDef)
- Psychic
- Meteor Mash
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Explosion
Jirachi @ Leftovers
Trait: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 96 SAtk / 48 SDef
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Calm Mind
- Wish
- Thunderbolt
- Psychic
i think it is better than the other one
OK, I like this team much better. Jirachi should have a few speed EVs though, at least enough to outrun Breloom, a spore could really ruin your day.
Celebi should probably be more defensive as well. I propose we keep the 300 speed and 404 hp, but throw the remaining EVs into defense instead of sp.attk. You can calm mind on the switch instead of giga drain and if they swap in Dugtrio you can survive his HP bug (usually) and giga drain him and regain a lot of health, plus a random CM is better than a random giga drain.
EDIT: would Toxic on Moltres instead of WoW, and WoW instead of ice punch on Gengar be better? I played a few games with it and I never used ice punch (and rarely thunderbolt), I was generally statusing on the switch.
EDIT2: after more testing, this team really seems to struggle with strong electric attacks. One game I get worn down by a subpassing Jolteon (tbolt/twave/sub/bp), another game 5-0'd by sub cm Raikou (Dugtrio got revengekilled by another Dugtrio, 372 speed so I lost the coinflip) and a third game I lost to what I assume was a very offensive Zapdos (Celebi bp'd a CM to it, 6-0'd my team). Additionally, status is an absolute bitch to deal with - especially sleep and paralysis - the only real absorber of anything is Celebi with Natural Cure. We really need a way of dealing with this (or just strong special attacks in general).
Celebi should probably be more defensive as well. I propose we keep the 300 speed and 404 hp, but throw the remaining EVs into defense instead of sp.attk. You can calm mind on the switch instead of giga drain and if they swap in Dugtrio you can survive his HP bug (usually) and giga drain him and regain a lot of health, plus a random CM is better than a random giga drain.
EDIT: would Toxic on Moltres instead of WoW, and WoW instead of ice punch on Gengar be better? I played a few games with it and I never used ice punch (and rarely thunderbolt), I was generally statusing on the switch.
EDIT2: after more testing, this team really seems to struggle with strong electric attacks. One game I get worn down by a subpassing Jolteon (tbolt/twave/sub/bp), another game 5-0'd by sub cm Raikou (Dugtrio got revengekilled by another Dugtrio, 372 speed so I lost the coinflip) and a third game I lost to what I assume was a very offensive Zapdos (Celebi bp'd a CM to it, 6-0'd my team). Additionally, status is an absolute bitch to deal with - especially sleep and paralysis - the only real absorber of anything is Celebi with Natural Cure. We really need a way of dealing with this (or just strong special attacks in general).
No one uses Breloom. We dont need an ev spread to account for it. we're not weak to electric types. fast celebi walls them. we need spa on celebi or else we're weak to skarm. status isn't a huge problem. jirachi is the gengar switch. toxic on moltres is usable. dropping ice punch is bad. jolteon leads could be annoying so maybe lead meta
Would you rather have 16 EVs in speed to account for Breloom (which a lot of people seem to use, I don't know from where you got the idea that 'nobody uses Breloom', I see it all the time), or those 16 EVs in defense/sp.attk? It's only 16 EVs, we are not talking about a quarter of your EVs. It's. 16. EVs. Keep in mind that we do not have a sleep absorber (and as a bonus you are faster than Ludicolo as well, but I actually do think nobody uses that lol).
'We're not weak to electric types' seems like a useless comment. Why not? Yes, Raikou gets killed by Dugtrio in the majority of the situations, but Jolteon and Zapdos don't. Lets say the enemy BPs a CM to a Zapdos, what are you going to do?
Vote vote let's vote~~~
Yeah i like Jirachi too.
The team has as much Breloom coverage as it gets. Really, it's hard to think of an offensive team with better Breloom coverage than this one tbh.
Just wondering, what's the gameplan against Salamence? Let's say it comes in on Dugtrio after it kills something, then assuming the team is in full conditions, what's the Pokemon to go? Jirachi? It seems like things could get problematic against DD Mence/Dnite just saying. I doubt a 100% Gengar could survive a +1 HP Flying.
The team has as much Breloom coverage as it gets. Really, it's hard to think of an offensive team with better Breloom coverage than this one tbh.
Just wondering, what's the gameplan against Salamence? Let's say it comes in on Dugtrio after it kills something, then assuming the team is in full conditions, what's the Pokemon to go? Jirachi? It seems like things could get problematic against DD Mence/Dnite just saying. I doubt a 100% Gengar could survive a +1 HP Flying.
It's 16 EVs. You don't want Breloom to come in and spore Jirachi while you are +3/+3 CM and then still eat a fair amount of damage from focus punch (31-39% to Celebi, 45-53% to Moltres). 16 EVs can mean the difference between winning the game or having a pokemon put to sleep (with no cleric) + eating damage or being forced to switch out again (no spinner).
Salamence is why I suggested Jirachi in the first place, you can only really go to Metagross and Jirachi (or Moltres/Gar if you expect an EQ). FWIW Gengar can barely even survive a 405 attack stab hp flying (84%-99%).
All right lets wrap this up!!! And here's our final result~
Gengar @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 216 Atk / 104 SpA / 188 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Punch
- Hypnosis
- Explosion
Metagross @ Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 196 HP / 176 Atk / 32 Def / 76 SpA / 28 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Psychic
- Hidden Power Fire
- Meteor Mash
- Explosion
Moltres @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 28 HP / 252 SAtk / 228 Spd
Modest Nature
- Fire Blast
- Hidden Power Ice
- Sunny Day
- Will-O-Wisp
Dugtrio @ Choice Band
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 224 Atk / 32 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Hidden Power Bug
- Aerial Ace
Celebi @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 12 Def / 92 SpA / 152 Spe
Timid Nature
- Baton Pass
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power Fire
- Calm Mind
Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 96 SpA / 48 SpD
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Wish
- Thunderbolt
- Psychic
There are definitely some minor things eg small EV / move changes that can be made to this team; but ultimately, some of them are probably just up to the user who plays with it and goes with his/her preference. Variants of this team should work just as well. I'd like to everyone who participated in this CCAT, whether or not you've submitted things or voted, or simply just reading this thread. We've finally reached the completion of RoA Speed CCAT 1!! It has taken >1 month, more than what I've estimated it to take. I was hoping for less than 1 month lol! It's been great nevertheless! :)
And this thread will stay open to continue discussion regarding anything if there still is. Feel free to leave your feedback as well :)! RoA Speed CCAT 2 will be up soon; hang tight!
Gengar @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 216 Atk / 104 SpA / 188 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Punch
- Hypnosis
- Explosion
Metagross @ Leftovers
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 196 HP / 176 Atk / 32 Def / 76 SpA / 28 Spe
Naughty Nature
- Psychic
- Hidden Power Fire
- Meteor Mash
- Explosion
Moltres @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 28 HP / 252 SAtk / 228 Spd
Modest Nature
- Fire Blast
- Hidden Power Ice
- Sunny Day
- Will-O-Wisp
Dugtrio @ Choice Band
Ability: Arena Trap
EVs: 224 Atk / 32 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Hidden Power Bug
- Aerial Ace
Celebi @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 12 Def / 92 SpA / 152 Spe
Timid Nature
- Baton Pass
- Giga Drain
- Hidden Power Fire
- Calm Mind
Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 96 SpA / 48 SpD
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Wish
- Thunderbolt
- Psychic
There are definitely some minor things eg small EV / move changes that can be made to this team; but ultimately, some of them are probably just up to the user who plays with it and goes with his/her preference. Variants of this team should work just as well. I'd like to everyone who participated in this CCAT, whether or not you've submitted things or voted, or simply just reading this thread. We've finally reached the completion of RoA Speed CCAT 1!! It has taken >1 month, more than what I've estimated it to take. I was hoping for less than 1 month lol! It's been great nevertheless! :)
And this thread will stay open to continue discussion regarding anything if there still is. Feel free to leave your feedback as well :)! RoA Speed CCAT 2 will be up soon; hang tight!
I know this is the first one but I feel like it could be a little more organized, the simple bolding of certain things or categorizing would help a lot. Example, instead of:
"I really think we should [x] and [y]"
We could have:
SUGGESTION
"I really think we should [x] and [y]"
This would make the topic easier to read and faster to identify what is being suggested, modified etc. and what are just general thoughts.
"I really think we should [x] and [y]"
We could have:
SUGGESTION
"I really think we should [x] and [y]"
This would make the topic easier to read and faster to identify what is being suggested, modified etc. and what are just general thoughts.
I'm not going to standardize / enforce that :) it's up to the individual's posting habit etc lol. It's good to have bold etc to make it easier to read but I'm fine either way :) thanks though!
CCAT 2 will be up within 18 hours ~
CCAT 2 will be up within 18 hours ~
