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Salamence[QC 0/2]

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Dragonmaster123, Nov 28, 2011.

  1. Dragonmaster123

    Dragonmaster123

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    QC Stamps-
    GP Stamps-

    [​IMG]

    Hey guys, I just got Moxie

    [Overview]

    Pros
    - My Favorite Pokemon since 2003
    - 135 Attack, 110 Special Attack, 100 Base Speed, and a great offensive movepool gives it the ability to go physical or special.
    - One of the rare users of Intimidate, and of the the rarer viable users of the ability
    - Ability to work in any weather, thanks to it movepool
    - 95/80/80 Defenses, which is bolstered even more thanks to Intimidate
    - Can also support Tailwind, all it gets team supportwise other than Intimidate
    - 5 resistances, 1 Immunity

    Cons
    - 4x Ice Weakness, common Rock weakness, and average bulk make it's life difficult
    - 100 Base speed, at the mercy of pokemon like Garchomp, Latios, Latias, and even Weavile
    - Incredibly weak to Rain, as pokes swift swim abusers like Kingdra outspeed and KO in rain
    - Physical sets rely on weak Dragon Claw, crippled even more by Intimidate

    [SET]
    name: Special
    move 1: Draco Meteor
    move 2: Heat Wave
    move 3: Hydro Pump/Hidden Power [Flying]
    move 4: Protect/Tailwind
    item: Yache Berry/Dragon Gem
    nature: Modest
    ability: Intimidate
    evs: 140 HP/ 252 SpA / 116 Spd

    [SET COMMENTS]

    - Salamence's best set imo, thanks to the coverage it provides.
    - Draco Meteor can be used for more power, however, Mence will be at -2 SpA as long as he's in the battle.
    - Dragon Gem also increases the power of Draco Meteor, making it more destructive.
    - Heat Wave is a good Spread Move, htting things like Metagross and Scizor
    - Hydro Pump hits Fire Types and things like Excadrill, Tyranitar, Landorus, and numberous Fire Types
    - Hidden Power Flying can be used, as it gets STAB, and picks off pokemon like Hitmontop, Mienshao, and Scarfty
    - Tailwind can be used over protect to doubles his team's speed, further adding to support for the team


    [SET]
    name: Physical
    move 1: Dragon Claw
    move 2: Rock Slide
    move 3: Aqua Tail / Earthquake / Crunch
    move 4: Protect/ Tailwind
    item: Yache Berry
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Intimidate
    evs: 140 HP/ 252 Atk / 116 Spd


    [SET COMMENTS]

    - To be better than Garchomp, you have to abuse better attack and intimidate
    - Dragon Claw is the STAB move of this set, hitting for consistant damage, other than Outrage, who picks a random opponent every turn
    - Rock Slide is a great Spread Move, hitting things like Obamasnow Abomasnow, Volcarona, Zapdos, and Thundurus
    - Aqua Tail can be used to hit Ground types resistant to Rock Slide, as well as hitting Tyranitar, Krookodile, and other things weak to water.
    - Also, with Aqua Tail, it works better in Rain, as Aqua Tail gets a power boost while Intimidate offers team support.
    - Earthquake gets good coverage with Rock Slide, but if you dont have good team synergy (Ex - No Pokemon with Levitate and/or Flying types) then EQ isn't the best idea
    - Crunch can get that extra damage against bulky psychic/ghost type pokemon.
    - Tailwind can be used over protect to doubles his team's speed, further adding to support for the team


    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    - The given spread outspeeds Adamant 252 Speed Mamoswine, Modest 252 Speed Chandelure, and Jolly 252 Speed Metagross, while retaining some good bulk.
    - Dropping it down to 32 Speed EVs allows Zapdos to outspeed Max Speed Timid Abomasnow and 4 Speed Metagross and Politoed.
    - A Spread of 252 HP/ 252 Atk or SpA, depending on the set, and 4 Spd can be used for maximum bulk, and is viable in fastroom.
    - 4 HP/ 252 Atk or SpA/252 Spd with a speed boosting nature can be used to speed tie with other base 100's and outspeed things like Haxorus, Hydregion, Adamant Garchomp, and other threats that would outspeed the current set
    - However, the current EV Spreads provide maximum attack while giving great bulk.


    [Other Options]


    - There are alot of other items viable on Salamence, including Haban Berry, Sitrus Berry, Dragon Gem on the Special Set with Draco Meteor, however Yache works best in him surviving Common moves like Blizzard and ICe Beam
    - Dragon Pulse is STAB, unlike Draco Meteor, doesn't lower your special attack.
    - Fire Blast can be used to hit pokemon like Metagross harder if you want to
    - Physical Set can use Stone Edge over Rock Slide to hit one target harder
    - Could also use Brick Break and Zen Headbutt, though these aren't recommended unless you have a Synergy Problem
    - Moxie is a viable alternative to help sweep the opponent quickly, but is not recommended because it is not very reliable and Intimidate is a superior ability.


    [Checks and Counters]

    - Ice Types
    - Dragons that can outspeed and KO w/ STABs moves, unless using Haban Berry
    - Special Set - Gastro can take all attacks well, and hit back with Ice Beam
    - Cresselia also takes hits well, and also hits back with Ice Beam
    - Physical- Pokemon from Intimidate ruins it, as it already weak attacks get weaker thanks to Intimidate
    - Also, priority Will-O-Wisp from Sabelye, though rare, ruins it
    - Cress with Screens can just set up Reflect in it's face
    - Steels also deal with it, such as Metagross, Bronzong
  2. Fizz

    Fizz

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    It's spelled "Salamence", son!
  3. Dragonmaster123

    Dragonmaster123

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    whoops, sorry, did this in a rush, thanks
  4. Dragonmaster123

    Dragonmaster123

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  5. soul_survivor

    soul_survivor

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    Well looks pretty nice. Though in the special slot you can slash in tailwind with hydro pump, and hpflying. Sala is also usually stuck in sun which makes hydropump seem meh, and hp flying is nice, but when playing sala speed is pretty important especially non-haban variants who get oh so trolled by every dragon with the ev's you listed.


    Also in the special set Dragon gem Should be mentioned. Dragongem Draco meteor racks some nice ko's.


    Other than that its a good analysis. Though you should note the advantages it gets over latios like fireblast, intimidate, and tailwind which is probably the only reason to use em.
  6. muffinhead

    muffinhead b202 wifi vgc
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    dragon pulse doesnt hit hard enough, i prefer draco meteor as primary option :x move fire blast to OO, heat wave is more useful in almost every situation. im not sure about aqua tail's accuracy or damage output vs ttar and krookodile. add crunch as an option to get that extra damage against bulky psychic/ghost type pokemon.

    i would suggest slashing tailwind somewhere on both sets, but im not quite sure where O_o

    also remove mention of hp grass to check gastrodon. gastrodon nearly always have rindo berry, and its not worth the moveslot.

    @above latios learns tailwind
  7. Dragonmaster123

    Dragonmaster123

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    @ muffinhead, ok, though i dont like the fact that Draco Meteor leaves you at -2. meaning you have to switch out to set there weakened like a rock.

    HP Grass will be removed, and i guess Tailwind > Protect, though i like other pokemon to support Tailwind, i feel like Mence should just use those offenses, while using Intimidate to Support the team

    FB moved to OO, Crunch mentions, and for the calcs, i'll have some tommorow to test the efficiency of it and Aqua Tail

    @ soul idk, i like Hydro Pump because it hits things like rocks in Sand (Terrakion, T-Tar e.t.c) and like HP Flying because STAB, tho it's up to the user what's used

    Dragon Gem will be mentioned, tho i like covering his 4x Ice Weakness

    I've tested Mence in the rain,it actually works thanks to Intimidate and a great offensive movepool, that and he's also used in non-weather teams, so idk about replacing one of his coverage moves with it

    EDIT- DW Section done
  8. Infinity.Cypher

    Infinity.Cypher

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    If you can, I think you should mention a mix set with D meteor / d claws or other stuff (in other options or its own set) so mence can function even with a -2 SpA drop
  9. Solace

    Solace swing from the chandelier
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    Moxie is released, therefore it doesn't go in the Dream World section. I would mention it either in AC or OO

    I would take out mention of Special Landorus, I just don't think its common enough to warrant its own threat

    Cresselia rarely runs Ice Beam, and it's Salamence not Salamance.
  10. Dragonmaster123

    Dragonmaster123

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    @ solace, fixed, it's in OO

    Special Lando taken out

    and i've seen alot of Cress w/ Ice Beam (e.x Muffin's Team) so i'll keep it in there unless it gets really frowned upon
  11. lucariojr

    lucariojr goodra will hunting
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    Pretty much echoing what others have said, but I don't think a mixed set is entirely out of the question. That said, I haven't used a mixmence in VGC before, but it sounds interesting.
  12. Dragonmaster123

    Dragonmaster123

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    ^ yea, i took it off for now because im still testing its viability, other sets works really well in VGC
  13. Dragonmaster123

    Dragonmaster123

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    tested mix mence, it didnt work

    reasons, if i use Draco, all special attacks are weakened, meaning my move to use vs. steels, Heat Wave/Fire Blast, was to weak to do damage

    Dragon Claw was much to weak for most situations, even weaker after intimidate

    It looks like a good idea, but after testing, it's horrible, physical and special sets are all i'm posting
  14. cosmicexplorer

    cosmicexplorer pewpewpew
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    The author of this analysis plagiarized content on another one of his analyses, which is absolutely unacceptable behavior. He has been banned from this subforum for an unspecified amount of time. This analysis is now open for reservation.

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