Salamence

If I had to guess why DD nite is used more than DD mence its because nite has a safer set up due to multiscale. Yes stealth rock can negate this, but thats why rapid spin is there. Lum DD nite is stupidly easy to set up. Does it have the same raw power as mence, no. However you can't just burn/para/toxic it, which seems to be a common response.

Mixed sets, eh mence is pretty evil here. Nite can stick around longer.

Choiced sets, nite. Extreme speed just picks off too many things. Specs in the rain is awesome.

Thats my two cents.
 
So i havent been playing for a while but i started again so hows this for a set:

Salamence @ choice scarf/life orb
Intimidate
Naughty nature
Evs: 252 speed/100 attack/52 sp. Attack
Dragon claw
Fire blast
Hydro pump
Earthquake

Honestly i just wanted to make a set with hydro pump...
 
So i havent been playing for a while but i started again so hows this for a set:

Salamence @ choice scarf/life orb
Intimidate
Naughty nature
Evs: 252 speed/100 attack/52 sp. Attack
Dragon claw
Fire blast
Hydro pump
Earthquake

Honestly i just wanted to make a set with hydro pump...
You're missing 100 EVs.
And, even though Hydro Pump is awesome, it serves no real purpose coverage-wise...
 
Hydropump isn't bad, there's just better options. Fire and EQ pretty much take care of general coverage so hydropump is only really better for hitting things like hyppodon harder. You may as well go Draco Meteor there just for the big stabbed hit, the SpA drop isn't too bad on a mixed set.
 
well the only think i can see hydro pump doing is killing gliscor and balloon heatran. but i think draco meteor is a good alternative.
 
Draco Meteor already destroys Hippowdon and Gliscor. As for Balloon Heatran, it can't switch in on you anyway (if it does, you just EQ it next turn). If you really hate it that much, then just run Brick Break to laugh at Tyranitar and Blissey.
 
And to think people before were all dragonite sucks compared to salamence! for over 2 generations, and even then people were like "its okay" and now look at it...



Anyways, has anyone found an effective set for salamence for a mixed offense/defensive team?
 

soul_survivor

VGCPL Champion
I ran mence on my SS offense team in round 3(and got a rating of 1427, didn't know i can vote), And roost goes along way. Lifeorb will kill you, as people switch steels into your dm. Thats 10%, then they switch to something that resist fb, thats another 10%. And -2 fb aint even ohkoing ferrathorn. recovery is vital. 4 attacking sets always to me seem useless bar choice sets.
 
I'd rather use Dragonite for DD sweeping. Multiscale just makes it ridiculous, taking 70% from CB mamo's ice shard with no investment on hp/defense. However, mence is, imo, a better mixed attacker.
 
Lol I took a 5 month break from this game because I broke my ds. It is funny how people are still argueing the SAME EXACT POINTS they were 5 months ago. And its not the good ole mence/nite arguement... But pretty much everything (outside of the chomp fiasco).

Bottom line, it all comes down to preference and team make up.
 

alphatron

Volt turn in every tier! I'm in despair!
Roost is fine on mixed sets. I mean, arcanine can get away with running morning sun and he doesn't get nearly as many chances to do so.

I hate draco meteor on Mence.
 
well the problem is i cant get fourth gen moves or i would put roost or outrage....
but yea thanks for the help i think i'll go with eq/fireblast/draco meteor/brick break and fix the evs
 
brick break for dragon claw, earthquake and brick break serve practically the same purpose(exception of bliss and t-tar, a dragon claw and eq respectively should do lots of damage as well). besides, a -2 spa move isn't too reliable as STAB
 
While I see Mence > Nite on offensive DD sets, I strongly disagree that MixMence outclasses MixNite. Hell, because he can run so many more variants (rain mixed anyone?) of the mixed set, I'd even say MixNite is better than MixMence. Multiscale is obviously not something you can ignore either.

For me, I always felt like Mence died to quickly (this gen) esp compared to Nite

edit for below: i find it easier to run mixnite even without rain than mixmence for its survivability
 

His Eminence Lord Poppington II

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mixmence has better speed and pseudo stab hydro pump in rain, in addition to 10 points more of sp.a, however, mix dnite has stab hurricane and thunder, making it arguably better in rain.

out of rain mixmence is better though.
 
Rain can't fully stop mixmence because most of the pokemon that mence would carry fire attacks for still take rediculous damage from them. also, many of the steels that rain relys on to stop dragons are all demolished by EQ
 

New World Order

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While I see Mence > Nite on offensive DD sets, I strongly disagree that MixMence outclasses MixNite. Hell, because he can run so many more variants (rain mixed anyone?) of the mixed set, I'd even say MixNite is better than MixMence. Multiscale is obviously not something you can ignore either.

For me, I always felt like Mence died to quickly (this gen) esp compared to Nite

edit for below: i find it easier to run mixnite even without rain than mixmence for its survivability
Disagree, MixNite is useful only in the rain, so it's pretty much a cripple during the early stages of a weather war. Salamence on the other hand, basically gets a STAB Hydro Pump, which actually hits harder than Dragonite's Hurricane due to Salamence's superior SpA, not to mention water is just plain a better offensive type than flying. Hydro Pump is also doesn't miss like every time outside of the rain. Furthermore, Hurricane doesn't provide very good coverage with Draco Meteor (which is why no rain abuser Dnites run it), and I'd definately rather be spamming Meteors than Hurricanes. As for the survivability argument, Mence gets Intimidate, so although it doesn't have Dragonite's bulk, its not like its a glass cannon.
 
Disagree, MixNite is useful only in the rain, so it's pretty much a cripple during the early stages of a weather war. Salamence on the other hand, basically gets a STAB Hydro Pump, which actually hits harder than Dragonite's Hurricane due to Salamence's superior SpA, not to mention water is just plain a better offensive type than flying. Hydro Pump is also doesn't miss like every time outside of the rain. Furthermore, Hurricane doesn't provide very good coverage with Draco Meteor (which is why no rain abuser Dnites run it), and I'd definately rather be spamming Meteors than Hurricanes. As for the survivability argument, Mence gets Intimidate, so although it doesn't have Dragonite's bulk, its not like its a glass cannon.
It should be noted that Dragonite still has Surf, which is just a less power Hyrdo Pump with 20% more accuracy. It still gets "stab" from rain
Plus, Dragonite is the only poke with Thunder, Hurricane and a water-type move except Smeargle, making him a good abuser
 

New World Order

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It should be noted that Dragonite still has Surf, which is just a less power Hyrdo Pump with 20% more accuracy. It still gets "stab" from rain
Plus, Dragonite is the only poke with Thunder, Hurricane and a water-type move except Smeargle, making him a good abuser
Which makes it no longer a MixNite unless you run Aqua Tail/ Waterfall. MixNite wishes its coverage was half as good using three moves than what MixMence can accomplish with two.
 
i guess hydro pump in rain can be quite decent
however, i disagree with your statements regarding mixnite overall as well as hence's intimidate. it's true intimidate can come quite handle sometimes however as somebody has mentioned before it's really nice for switching into physical attacks while multiscale is handy both on the switch and during nit's stay on the battlefield. It is true that certainn factors in the game can make it quite hard for nite to kee pin tact. Mence is by no means a glass gannon but it's not exactly all that bulky esp in gen 5. Due to that as well as it being very offensively oriented mon, dragonite is more used (obviously) on different teams (dragonite being the more versatile mon is by no means a surprise I'm sure).
Personally, hence is just not bulky enough for me most of the time but that is most likely due to the fact that I prefer bulky offensive and balanced as well as semi stall styles (RARELY do I see successfully built HO teams), though the whole metagame is like that.
 

New World Order

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I agree, with the state of the metagame, Dragonite definately deserves more usage than Salamence. But I just have to facepalm when people attempt to run offensive DDNites or Draco Meteor MixNites just because they see that Dragonite is higher in the usage stats than Salamence.
 

AccidentalGreed

Sweet and bitter as chocolate.
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Not to mention Life Orb 4/0 Hydro Pump Salamence tends to be a more offensive and substantial choice than any kind of Rain-based Dragonite, despite the options Dragonite has. It all comes down to which kind of offensive Pokemon you need, especially when you're trying to consider something to work with on Drizzle teams.
 

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