Salamence

I agree, with the state of the metagame, Dragonite definately deserves more usage than Salamence. But I just have to facepalm when people attempt to run offensive DDNites or Draco Meteor MixNites just because they see that Dragonite is higher in the usage stats than Salamence.
DD Offensive Nite has its uses like as a lead
But outside of very few occasions I also agree with you...that it really is not the offensive monter that DDMence is. MixNites are fine but I usually use it as a wall breaker rather than as a...well mixed sweeper, which MixMence is simply just better at.
 

Mario With Lasers

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It can't have Outrage AND Dragon Dance, apparently (both are "special moves" in Global Link, but a DW pokémon can't have both at the same time).
 

Sprocket

P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n
There's no way around it, it's impossible to get a Moxie Salamence with both Outrage and Dragon Dance. If you go with Outrage, you don't get egg moves, and if you go with Dragon Dance, you don't get Outrage.
 
Even with a DD set less useful, MixMence with Moxie seems formidable; it means if you mispredict and bring in the wrong check, you could very well lose the game right then and there. Bring in Ferrothorn to take the Outrage or expecting a DDer and eat a Fire Blast instead, and you are now staring down a +1 Mence that still has a DM up it's sleeve. Yet another boon to offensive teams, since it can both pull out a sweep and make mincemeat of stall. Funnily enough it will probably also prove tough for HO to face off against, since you don't dare sac anything lest it gets the +1 going.

Can't wait to see this thing in play.
 

UltiMario

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Screw MixMence. Base 108 is the new speed. It's too slow to wreck everything anymore.

SCARFMENCE OUTRAGE SPAM TIME IS GO.
 

Katakiri

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SCARF GREEDYMENCE IS THE WORST POKEMON IN THE GAME! It had to be said. It needs 2 KOs to be good and at that point you've probably already won the battle if your opponent lets you KO 2 Pokemon with that terrible-ass Pokemon.

The only Greedymence that I would ever use is Choice Band and, if Outrage + DD ever becomes legal, Dragon Dance and even then Intimidate's better.

It's worse than even Scarf Greedydos.

If you really want to give us free wins, that's awesome, but I've had more than my fair share of free wins from DW OU Greedymences trying the same thing. Keep bashing your head into my Steel-type. Keep it up. You'll KO yourself from confusion before you even get to +1. I don't even have to Ice Punch.
 
Overconfidence with a Mix DD Mence set will be fantastic after a +1 Speed and Attack boost it will be able to ko Physical walls then being able to sweep at +2/+3 attack raise after ko'ing a Physical wall with a special move. It's really an easy ko for an easier sweep. It's really going to bring this metagame a run for it's money.
 
the only problem are those base 100+ scarfers. they are everywhere. landorus ohkoes with hp ice (more reliable) and terrakion also ohkoes with stone edge.
 

BurningMan

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MixMence with Moxie could work pretty nice against stall teams, but i think its generally inferior to intimidate. IMO moxie was one of the most overhyped abilities and is often inferior to the other abilities the Pokemon has (exceptions are Scarf Krookodile and Murkrow in RU).
Moxie is only good against more defensive teams, because offensive teams don`t care if you are at +1 or +2 Atk they will outspeed and KO you anyway, its sometimes handy but simply not as reliable as Intimidate.
DD sets won`t work without Outrage, because Dragon Claw is weak shit and Mence has a hard time setting up without intimidate and also can be revenge killed by a lot of common Pokemon.
 
Screw MixMence. Base 108 is the new speed. It's too slow to wreck everything anymore.

SCARFMENCE OUTRAGE SPAM TIME IS GO.
There are few things with more speed than 100, 100 is still the most common speed tier, old-fashioned, but still...

That common things in OU with more 100 base spd are the three musketeers bar Cobalion, Gengar, Infernape, Latios twins, Landorus and Starmie. And these things, the only common seen as Scarfers are Landorus, Terrakion, Infernape and few Latios.

Deoxys-S also and Chrollophyllers, but they outspeed almost anything.


I think Moxie Salamence could be a beast with Hazard support and/or Lategame.
 
Then again, most things are beast with hazard support and lategame. Moxie relies on the fact that poor players tend to send in their counter after saccing fodder, which makes their counter not as solid as it was when Mence was at +0. It's great lower on the ladder, not necessarily higher up.
 

Lee

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in theory, moxie is breathtakingly well suited to Salamence. I cannot count the amount of times over the past few generations where I have been forced to sac something to limit the amount of damage Salamence can do to me - but now that plays right into the opponent's hands.

on paper, i'm not so sure. Scarf Outrage is dumb because you'll just end up confused after two turns. Dragon Dance/Dragon Claw with Moxie seems like a good set but you're still hard countered by Gliscor unless you run Draco Meteor or Hydro Pump, in which case you're hard countered by Skarmory and Ferrothorn. there's also the fact that saccing is still perfectly viable (or as viable as letting something die can possibly be heh) - pretty sure Terrakion and CBScizor DGAF if Mence has +1 Atk.

very interested to see what the standard set will be.

and don't write off Intimidate - i imagine it will be preferable to Moxie on balanced teams and maybe bulky offense too.
 
Can I post a little suggestion? Why not Dragon Rush? Same power as Earthquake without STAB (it isn't an Outrage, but it's better than Dragon Claw), doesn't lock the user as Outrage, the downside is its 75% Base Accuracy - but hey, don't we use Stone Edge? Personally, however, I'd use DRush with Hone Claws (I don't like low-accuracy moves, but that's me).

(I'm waiting for the rocks.)
 

Pocket

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At first I liked By Myself's suggestion of abusing Moxie - the best way to utilize MoxieMence is to net a surprise kill on physical tank with Draco Meteor on your DDMence, so you have +2 Atk and +1 Spe after a DD and DM. That means DDMence would have to lose out on Fire Blast or Earthquake to make room for the surprise Draco Meteor.

Unfortunately that requires splitting EVs, which means losing out on its Atk. DD MoxieMence also lacks Outrage, and +1 Outrage > +2 Dragon Claw.

If GreedMence is to work, it will probably have to go the Choice Band route. It gains access to Outrage, and a Moxie Atk boost combined with CB boost is equivalent to a +3 Atk Salamence! It can certainly act as a wall-breaker and a late-game sweeper, imo.
 
also, many of the steels that rain relys on to stop dragons are all demolished by EQ
I have a problem with that statement.
The most used Steel-types, that is to say Ferrothorn, Scizor and Forretress, are neutral to EQ, and hella tough to boot (yeah, you carry Fire Blast for those, but still). The odd Bronzong is outright immune to it, as well as a number of more common rain abusers.
That leaves Jirachi. I'd gladly say this spawn of hell alone justifies carrying something to take it down, but I might be overreacting here.

and a Moxie Atk boost combined with CB boost is equivalent to a +3 Atk Salamence!
Nitpicking a bit, that's just a bit more than +2 if I'm not mistaken.
CB is 50%, stacking multiplicatively with stat boost : 1.5*1.5=2.25

Yeah, MoxieMence looks smexy. I'm thinking a DD set could make its way with Fire Blast/Fang for coverage and Draco Meteor for the surprise hit on the weak point (for massive damage™).
It all depends on its role in the team of course. Maybe this set would be a bit bastardized, but I'm going to try.

Alas, I see Speed definitely being a problem for a CB set.
 
At first I liked By Myself's suggestion of abusing Moxie - the best way to utilize MoxieMence is to net a surprise kill on physical tank with Draco Meteor on your DDMence, so you have +2 Atk and +1 Spe after a DD and DM. That means DDMence would have to lose out on Fire Blast or Earthquake to make room for the surprise Draco Meteor.

Unfortunately that requires splitting EVs, which means losing out on its Atk. DD MoxieMence also lacks Outrage, and +1 Outrage > +2 Dragon Claw.

If GreedMence is to work, it will probably have to go the Choice Band route. It gains access to Outrage, and a Moxie Atk boost combined with CB boost is equivalent to a +3 Atk Salamence! It can certainly act as a wall-breaker and a late-game sweeper, imo.
I'm also liking it.

Also, the split in Atk/SpAtk EVs may not be necessary. Maybe MixMoxieMence could be carrying Dragon Gem or Life Orb for that one shot Draco Meteor hit.

Naive/Hasty @ 252 Atk/252 Speed/4 SpAtk. If you're only looking to net one KO with Draco Meteor, that spread should be fine.
 

Pocket

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Maybe with Dragon Gem it can pull off to KO a generic defensive mon like Gliscor with Draco Meteor, but if you're going with Life Orb, you would need 136 SAtk EVs to take out Gliscor after SR, and Gliscor isn't even that specially-defensive. Salamence has to practically go all-special if it wants to OHKO physically-bulky Hippowdon with LO Draco Meteor after SR and a layer of Spikes.
 
Moxie is actually illegal with Outrage I believe. Outrage is a 4th gen move tutor.

Just do classic Dragon Dance or use Mixed. Outrage is just too good.
 
Moxie is actually illegal with Outrage I believe. Outrage is a 4th gen move tutor.

Just do classic Dragon Dance or use Mixed. Outrage is just too good.
Actually, Outrage is one of the two special moves Dream World Bagon can know (the other being Dragon Dance).

Unfortunately, Dream World Pokémon can't have more than one special move at a time, so DD+Outrage+Moxie is illegal.
 

shrang

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How about SubDD like what Gyarados runs? You can use Sub / DD / Dragon Claw / EQ or something like that. Just slap on Magnezone to get rid of Skarm and Bronzong and you're fine.
 
Actually, Outrage is one of the two special moves Dream World Bagon can know (the other being Dragon Dance).

Unfortunately, Dream World Pokémon can't have more than one special move at a time, so DD+Outrage+Moxie is illegal.
I see. I think Choice Scarf Salamence is viable with Moxie then. Might actually give a little more life to those dragon spam teams.

Also Shrang, that set looks pretty good.
 
Scarf Salamence with Moxie is a really good idea, sucks that Outrage + Dragon Dance + Moxie is illegal on him. The Sub DD variant also looks solid.
 

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