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Sandstastic!

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Vileman, Feb 5, 2013.

  1. Vileman

    Vileman

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2010
    Messages:
    513
    Hello everyone and welcome to what its supposed to be my first good rate my team thread! This team has been working well lately but i feel i could use some tips from all of you so that's why i'm making this. This team its, as you might have deduced from the tittle, a sand team. I just wanted to make a team that wasn't the boring "drizzle abuse" or "dragons abuse" thing, and i wanted it to shut down both of those strategys. This team was made to the sole purpose of doing well in the official smogon tournament, but sadly i lost to malkaviano (currently in round 6 of the tournament) due to him using in the 3rd battle, unfortunatly, the biggest threat i've found to this team who completly destroyed me. And that's where i want you to help me. anyways, here is the team!

    TEAM AT A GLANCE:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Show Hide
    Team building process:
    First, i decided to make a sand team, because rain is so common this days thats its almost boring to use the same things everyone uses, and i had 2 options; ttar or hippowdon. I've never used hippowdon before, so i decided to start my team with it
    [​IMG]

    Next, i needed to cover hippowdons weaknesses, mainly special attacks. Thats where blissey came in as imo the premier special wall of OU
    [​IMG][​IMG]

    After having these 2 pokes, i needed something to have some offense, and i also needed something to hurt ferrothorn, so i decided to go with specstran
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Now, i needed something to set up entry hazards because, they are always useful no matter the team you're using. So i decided to go with ferrothorn, because it could also help by having a water resistance, "countering" rain teams and a steel type it's always usefull with all the dragons lurking around.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Now, i needed something to be able to hurts the plenthora of dragons in the tier, while being somewhat bulky to take some fighting attacks, and i decided to go with an underated threat that its calm mind latias
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    The typing coverage was looking good, and all i needed was something to take off hazards and could works as a revenge killer, and altho it doesnt gets too quick with sand i decided to go with sandslash, a pokemon who in this team has proven thats not just a niche poke
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Things were looking good, but i still had a big problem; mamoswine oculd hit everything for supperefective damege with his STABs+superpower, and also breloom kept sending to sleep my only good switch in to it (latias), so i needed something to help against those two, and i dont remember quite yet who it was (probably phoopes iirc) recomended me bronzong, who had all the requirements to fullfil those weaknesses so i took it out for specstran, who wasnt doing very well in the matches i had with him
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    So, that its the team! Lets go to the in-depth analisys of each of them:

    [​IMG]
    Hippowdon(the boss)
    Hippowdon@leftovers
    Trait: Sand stream
    Nature:Impish
    EVs: 252HP/4Atk/252Def
    -Earthquake
    -Whirlwind
    -Stealth Rocks
    -Slack Off

    This guy, has a phisical bulk that you wouldnt imagine. I can switch into pretty much any physical attack that its not super effective against it. Due to this, it's pretty easy to just recover the damage with slack off and then set up rocks in the face of physical attackers, and also whirlwinding away those who try to set up against him. Also, earthqueake its the obligatory STAB attack that's just there to hurt things weak to it. It's good to note how awsome its to have recovery on the weather inducer becuase this helps winning the weather war, and not being torn don by entry hazards like the other weather inducers do.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    [​IMG]
    BLissey (the bitch)
    Blissey@leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    Nature: Bold
    Evs: 4 HP/252Def/252 Spc def
    -Seismic Toss
    -Protect
    -Wish
    -Heal Bell

    This annoying special wall helps this team with something very important: Heal Bell. This prevents sandslash from being useless if its burned, from latias to be able to attempt a sweep if it was paralised/toxic'ed. IT pretty much helps covering all the annoying status that could screw up any member of my team. I also gives Wish support, although its only appreciated by ferrothorn and bronzong due to being the only ones without reliable recovery. Protect its to skip the turn to get the wish on her and seismic toss its there to not be a complete set up bait.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    [​IMG]
    Bronzong(the back up wall)
    Bronzong@leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    Nature:Relaxed
    EVs: 252 HP / 84 Atk / 80 Def / 92 SpD
    -Gyro Ball
    -HP ice
    -Earthquake
    -Toxic
    Ah bronzong, you might not be the best member of this team but you do are good at the thing you're ment to do, mamoswine cant do anything to it while brozong hits back hardly with gyro ball. OH wait, there's more? dragons are harcordly covered by this guy and ferrothorn, its good to have backup in case one theese two fall, so i wont be getting swept by any dragon spamming outrages anytime soon. Gyro ball its to hurt mamoswine, and frail fast pokes like gengar, alakazam etc. HP ice its to hurt dragons and grass types (although im not sure if it makes much more damage than gyro ball...)And psychic...im not really sure why its there, suggestions anyone? Toxic its to
    cripple other walls who think bronzong wont do anything to them. EV spread changed as suggested and it works very well; can take a couple of hits while being able to hit back.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    [​IMG]
    Ferrothorn(the hated)
    Ferrothrorn@leftovers
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    Nature: Careful
    EVs: 252 HP/4atk/252Spc def
    -Power Whip
    -Leech Seed
    -Protect
    -Spikes
    Ferrothorn its so good...when im using it. It pretty much shuts down most rain teams, which its really nice. Also, along with bronzong, by being steel type it walls most of the dragons runing in the tier, which is very nice. Power Whip it's the obligatory STAB move of choice, Leech Seed its to have a way of recovering part of my health, and with protect it will be having his life back and stacking up damage in the opponent with the sandstorm and leech seed damage. Spikes it's there because its always nice to have entry hazards on the opponent team, and let me say that its quite easy to set them up with the bulk of this thing.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    [​IMG]
    Latias(The tanking sweeper)
    Latias @leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    Nature: Timid
    Evs: 252 HP/ 4 Satk/252Spd
    -Dragon Pulse
    -HP fire
    -Calm Mind
    -Roost
    Latias its an amazing pokemon in this tier; his typing gives her a lot of useful resistances most notably fighting, and with levitate its immune to ground types and entry hazards which is nice. Also, its the fastest dragon in the tier along with latios so it wins most of the 1 vs 1 situations vs other non-scarfed dragons. The moves are pretty straight forward; she sets up calm minds ad attempts a sweep. Dragon pulse is for STAB, HP fire gives good coverage to Steel types who resists dragon (also, only move in my team that hurts ferrothorn) and roost its for recovery. Leftovers are for negating the sandstorm damage and the EVs maximise speed, the 70 HP evs are pretty random but helps improving a bit the special bulk and the rest its in Def. EVs spread changed as suggested; 252 HP evs lets it take resisted hits (and even some neutral ones) nicely, and maximised speed lets it be the fastest nonscarfed dragon type poke.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    [​IMG]
    Sandslash (the niche)
    Sandslash@leftovers
    Trait: Sand Rush
    Nature:Jolly
    EVs: 4HP/252Atk/252Spd
    -Earthquake
    -Stone edge
    -Rapid Spin
    -Swords Dance
    Sandslash has been very useful in this team due to being fast with the help on sand rush and being able to hit with the StoneQuake combo a lot of pokes,Although it has a hard time switching in. Also, its very common for it to make a late game sweep once the opponent team its weakened by my hazards and the sandstorm damage, after a Swords dance it will be able to easily pull of a sweep. The Evs are pretty straight forward and leftovers help recovering a little health from the hazards its meant to spin. ​

    The biggest threats to this team are SUBCM jirachi, which can set up on pretty much all my team except hippowdown and sandslash, but the have a very bad special bulk so a +1 water pulse wont be taken very well(destroyed my team in the OST). Also, Breloom, with latias gone, can be a problem due to sporing bronzong and just hurting all the rest of my team with suppereffective STABs. Also, as mentioned, latias its the only poke that has a fire move, so ferrothorn its a problem with her gone, and it can even paralise latias while she cant 2HKO (sometimes doesn't 3HKOes) back. If you find my team weak to something else please make me note it, any suggestions will be appreciated :D

    AS A NOTE: i apologise from now if my descriptions aren't very complete and if there are any grammar/spelling/whatever mistakes, english its not my first language but i made an efford trying to write this as good as i could.


    THANKS FOR WATCHING
  2. Mr. Green

    Mr. Green

    Joined:
    May 14, 2011
    Messages:
    143
    Hi, there

    Nice team. I read that Bronzong is primarily for Mamoswine and Dragons that would otherwise cause problems for the team, but considering that Bronzong has no recovery move and therefore is one of those Pokemon in the long run is knocked to the sound of attacks against the dragons and Mamoswine seconds me is much better to use Skarmory who owns Roost to recover HP, it can also place the Spikes, and wipe out the most dangerous enemies using Whirlwind.
    .
    By placing Spikes Skarmory so I would say that you can remove Ferrothorn for Amoonguss that recovers HP more easily thanks to Regenerator, Amoonguss also gives you the important opportunity to sleep an opposing pokemon like Ferrothorn and Rotom-W can come up with any move has the advantage that even if it takes a Will-o-Wisp can attack however with Giga Drain without the degradation of power, also has a switch for more Keldeo and the moves Water in general, Amoonguss is also an excellent switch for Keldeo Subcmind that would give problems, Amoonguss with 28 Evs in special attack is able to break his Substitute with Giga Drain, and is a Pokemon with which most suffer the Fight moves.
    Amoonguss is also a good Pokemon against Breloom in every set, thanks to HP Ice can kill him with some attacks, and with the evs in HP and defense and typing resist his moves and Grass Fight.

    Other important things I notice is that your Hippowdon is not at all able to also undergo special moves, so there are no differences between defense and special defense, I always use this evs spread thelatest whom I am well: 252 HP / 124 def / 132 SDef Impish nature with.
    This way you get at least a solid defense and a decent special defense, able to collect quite well special moves as well as individuals, with the first evs spread of any special move was a nightmare for that Hippowdon.
    To suggest this Latias evs spread: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd with more evs in HP becomes stronger.
    Blissey recommend it Calm> Bold, the better to resist Rock Polish Landorus special with a little 'of residual damage on the switch with two Focus Blast you would send most if not KO KO, while with his Focus Blast Calm especially take them better.
    Good luck, with your team!

    Sets
    Show Hide

    Skarmory (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Brave Bird
    - Spikes
    - Roost
    - Whirlwind

    Amoonguss (M) @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 252 HP / 96 Def / 28 SAtk / 124 SDef / 8 Spd
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Spore
    - Stun Spore
    - Giga Drain
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    28: destroy the Substitute on Cmind Keldeo
    96: to withstand an attack Qualcunque Cb Terrakion and send a new Pokemon in better understanding what stops
    8: for outrun other Amoonguss
    252: max HP
    124 SDef: the rest in SDef
  3. Cinco Diablo

    Cinco Diablo

    Joined:
    Jun 16, 2012
    Messages:
    1,282
    Hello vileman, cool team.

    This is a really solid and unorthodox sand team, I like it, so kudos to you for using it. Anyways, I see some flaws that this team has, and hopefully my rate can help improve it and iron out those aftermentioned flaws. With that said, let's get to the rate. Alright, first up, I would recommend changing your Bronzong's EV spread to one of 252 HP / 84 Atk / 80 Def / 92 SpD over your current spread. Now, while at first glance, this may seem weird, it allows Bronzong to be an effective Mixed Wall, beating most of the offensive threats in OU. Now, staying on Bronzong, I would suggest Earthquake over your current choice of Psychic. Earthquake is to prevent Bronzong from becoming setup fodder for opposing Magnezone, which love to switch-in to him. Up next, I would like suggest a change of your current Latias set to a slightly better one of 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe. The aftermentioned EV spread allows Latias to be an effective Boosting Tank, while outspeeding some of the threats in OU, which is basically crucial for a setup sweeper. Finally, I would like to suggest running a Life Orb on your Sandslash in place of your current choice of Leftovers. Life Orb helps Sandslash muscle past the premier defensive Pokemon of the OU metagame. Well, that's all I have to say for now. I hope my advice helped. Have fun and good luck in your future endeavours!



    TL;DR (open)

    • Bronzong[​IMG]:
    • 252 HP / 216 Def / 36 SpA -> 252 HP / 84 Atk / 80 Def / 92 SpD
    • Psychic -> Earthquake
    • Latias [​IMG]: 70 HP / 186Def / 252 Spd -> 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
    • Sandslash [​IMG]: Leftovers -> Life Orb



    ~Dr Ciel~ (The doctor is OUT)
  4. Vileman

    Vileman

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2010
    Messages:
    513
    Thanks to both for the help, I'll start testing Mr.Greens changes and then Dr Ciel changes and ill decide which works better.
    More suggestions about countering SUBCMraichi or anything else is appreciated.
  5. Milos

    Milos

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2008
    Messages:
    404
    hey there, nice team vileman. let me see if i could help you out with your subcm jirachi problem, among other things.

    first off, i suggest changing hippowdon's spread to 252 HP/ 252 SpD/ 4 Def with an impish nature. this lets it do neat things such as survive draco meteor from specs latios (79.29% - 93.57%) while being able to recover the damage with slack off. in addition, it solves one of your biggest problems: subcm jirachi. a +1 water pulse from 252 HP/ 0 SpA jirachi will be a 3HKO at best, meaning you have time to break its sub and KO it or force it out with whirlwind.

    your sandslash is misplaced on this team, imo. the bulky ground type role is done way better by hippowdon, and the rapid spinner has trouble getting past jellicent and gengar. furthermore, it leaves you weaker to breloom. to help patch up all of these weaknesses, i suggest you replace sandslash with a bulky starmie. it gives you another fighting resistance, a fool proof way to beat gengar, terrakion, keldeo and breloom, and to top it all off you get to keep a fast rapid spinner on your team (although starmie's speed is nowhere near the speed of sandslash in the sand, it is equally fast in all weathers, something that sandslash can only dream of). here is the set i recommend you use:

    Show Hide
    Starmie @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 HP / 20 Def / 12 SpA / 224 Spe
    Timid Nature

    -Scald
    -Rapid Spin
    -Psyshock
    -Recover


    lastly, your bronzong's set needs to be fixed. to have better mixed defenses, i suggest you use an EV spread of 252 HP / 84 Atk / 80 Def / 92 SpD. since stealth rock is already being used by hippo, you have a free moveslot so bronzong can run gyro ball/ hp ice/ toxic/ and earthquake. here's the full set:

    Show Hide
    Bronzong @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 HP / 84 Atk / 80 Def / 92 SpD
    Sassy Nature
    IVs: 2 Spe

    -Gyro Ball
    -Hidden Power Ice
    -Toxic
    -Earthquake


    that's all for now, good luck with the team in the future!
  6. Vileman

    Vileman

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2010
    Messages:
    513
    The Changes made so far that had been working well:
    Bronzong:
    252 HP / 216 Def / 36 SpA -> 252 HP / 84 Atk / 80 Def / 92 SpD
    Psychic -> Earthquake
    Latias : 70 HP / 186Def / 252 Spd -> 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
    The Team has been working very well lately, thats for the help!

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