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Sceptile (Analysis)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by bugmaniacbob, Oct 16, 2010.

  1. bugmaniacbob

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    [Overview]

    <p>Ah, Sceptile, the infamous lord of the forest. Fast, frail, and dangerous. Most Grass-types are often looked down upon competitively, either because of the sheer number of common weaknesses, or due to competition with Ferrothorn, Breloom, and others. Sceptile, though, stands out from the crowd thanks not only to its impressive Speed stat, but also its very diverse movepool in both offense and support. Now that Shaymin-S has been declared Uber, Sceptile is once again the fastest user of Substitute + Leech Seed in OU, and unlike Whimsicott, who admittedly has the advantage in this area with its Prankster ability and larger support movepool, Sceptile actually has the stats to present a coherent offensive threat. This makes it more useful for situations where one cannot simply annoy the opponent to death.</p>

    <p>However, in competitive terms the competition from Whimsicott and other fast Grass-types is the least of Sceptile's worries. While Sceptile's base 120 Speed stat still allows it to outpace just about the entirety of the unboosted OU metagame, its base 105 Special Attack stat is suddenly underwhelming, and its base 85 Attack stat is more or less useless. Hence, it is a much less threatening presence than it was even in DPP, and thus is relegated to the sad and lonely realms of the niche and the gimmick once more. Still, if you want a fast, powerful special attacker and revenge killer, or an annoyer who can actually hit back, Sceptile is always there to be used.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Life Orb
    move 1: Leaf Storm
    move 2: Focus Blast / Earthquake
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice / Hidden Power Fire
    move 4: Dragon Pulse / Earthquake
    item: Life Orb
    nature: Timid / Hasty
    evs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This is Sceptile's most powerful attacking set, which takes full advantage of both its special attacking prowess and large offensive movepool. Leaf Storm is Sceptile's most powerful STAB attack, and powerful it is indeed—for reference, it does 44% minimum to Choice Scarf Hydreigon. However, there are a grand total of seven types resistant to Grass, so you will need plenty of coverage options in your other moveslots. For your first coverage move, you will want a way to stop Steel-types. Focus Blast is the strongest option here, easily OHKOing Magnezone, Hydreigon, and Heatran with Stealth Rock, as well as getting the 2HKO on Ferrothorn. However, it is very unreliable due to its 70% accuracy. On the other hand, Earthquake is a reliable attack that deals good damage, especially to Heatran, and also helps against Fire- and Poison-types. However, it runs into difficulties especially against those carrying Air Balloon as their item, and the lower power can be fatal at times. It also leaves you much more vulnerable to Ferrothorn, Scizor, and Skarmory.</p>

    <p>If you choose to use Focus Blast, an option to get rid of the Flying-types that resist Grass-, Fighting-, and Ground-type attacks is recommended in the third moveslot. Sceptile's best option here is Hidden Power Ice, which is particularly helpful as it lets Sceptile outspeed and OHKO both Thundurus and Tornadus with Stealth Rock. This makes it a useful revenge killer should the situation arise. It is also useful if you want to hit Dragonite and Salamence harder. However, particularly if you have chosen Earthquake, Hidden Power Fire is also worth consideration, if only for the necessity of reliably beating Ferrothorn, Scizor, and Skarmory. The last slot is more up to personal preference than anything else, as Sceptile has a multitude of potential targets. Dragon Pulse is more or less necessary if you are using Hidden Power Fire, in order to defeat Dragon-types. Even if you are using Hidden Power Ice, you can still use Dragon Pulse for Hydreigon, Latias, and Latios. However, in this situation you may want to look at some alternatives. Rather than running one or the other of Focus Blast and Earthquake, you can elect to run both and drop Dragon Pulse, solving quite a few coverage issues. Rock Slide is also an option, preventing Quiver Dance Volcarona from using Sceptile as set-up fodder, and also hitting other Bug-, Fire-, and Flying-types super effectively.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Because Sceptile is a frail hit-and-run attacker, the only two stats that will really matter are Speed and Special Attack, and thus both should be maximized. The remaining EVs can be shoved into HP or Attack, should you be running a physical attack as a coverage move. In the same way, a Hasty nature should be used over Timid if you are using a physical attack. If you wish, you could run a 29 HP IV in order to minimize Life Orb recoil, but this means you slightly weaken the power of Hidden Power, and also have less survivability due to the lower HP, though the difference in both cases is usually negligible. In terms of other options, most of Sceptile's best options have already been covered, though you could have Giga Drain as your main STAB attack. This helps offset Life Orb recoil, but this gives you a massive, massive reduction in power.</p>

    <p>As a Grass-type, Sceptile is weak to Ice-, Fire-, Bug-, Flying-, and Poison-type attacks. The first four of these are all weak to Stealth Rock, so you can get some rather helpful damage on all of them, making them easier to take down. Sceptile also has a knack for forcing switches, thanks to its ability to threaten almost anything slower than it. Unfortunately, Sceptile's biggest threat comes from its STAB Leaf Storm, and with seven types resistant to it, considerable offensive synergy with its partners is required to pull out Sceptile's best. On that note, Fire-types are a good idea in order to scare off Ferrothorn and Scizor, as well as other Bug-, Grass-, and Steel-types, while Rock-types are also a good idea to beat such threats as Volcarona and Zapdos. Thus, Heatran and Terrakion make good partners. In order to guarantee the removal of Steel-types, Magnezone support can be useful as well. And, of course, a way to beat common special walls such as Blissey, Chansey, and Porygon2 is always nice, as, despite Sceptile's access to Focus Blast, a Conkeldurr in tow can really help to keep the fat nasties in check. Sceptile itself can break bulky Ground- and Water-types and can lure out and weaken Steel-types with smart prediction, making it a good partner to sweepers who dislike having to deal with these Pokemon, such as Tyranitar and Salamence.</p>

    [SET]
    name: SubSeed
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Leech Seed
    move 3: Giga Drain
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Timid
    evs: 252 SpA / 28 SpD / 228 Spe
    ivs: 7 HP

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With the removal of Shaymin-S from OU, Sceptile returns to the 5th generation still holding its crown as the fastest natural user of Substitute + Leech Seed in the game, despite the best attempts of Whimsicott, and to a lesser extent Cottonee, to ruin everything. Unlike the cotton balls, Sceptile actually has some kind of offensive prowess to go along with it, which allows it to muscle through most conventional responses to this strategy.</p>

    <p>Substitute and Leech Seed make up the core combination on this set, where the idea behind the strategy is to first set up Leech Seed on an unsuspecting enemy, and then to create a never-ending chain of Substitutes to stall out the opponent, with healing provided by Leftovers and Leech Seed to negate the HP loss. For your STAB move, Giga Drain is generally the best choice as it boasts both reliable power and the potential to get back HP lost from Substitute. The coverage move is important to deal with those who are immune to Leech Seed. Hidden Power Fire can easily 2HKO the standard Ferrothorn while having a chance to OHKO Scizor and non-bulky Breloom as well after Stealth Rock.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Maximum Special Attack is a must in order to make the most of its biggest advantage over Whimsicott: its significantly higher offensive power and ability to hit hard. After this, 228 Speed EVs gives just enough Speed to outrun Jolly Scarftar, as nothing else is really worth aiming for. An HP IV of 7 gives the maximum possible Leech Seed recovery, and the remaining EVs are dumped into Special Defense. In terms of other options, Hidden Power Ice is an alternative coverage move, but the Fire-type attack is really necessary to deal with your biggest threat—Ferrothorn—so it is not recommended. Leaf Storm could be used over Giga Drain, but is generally a lesser option due to its undesirable side-effect, especially as Sceptile does not intend to be switching often.</p>

    <p>As with the Life Orb set, Sceptile will be forcing switches pretty often, not only because of the threat it presents but also because of opponents attempting to negate Leech Seed. Hence, entry hazard support is immensely helpful with this set, as it has a real potential to accumulate a lot of damage. Deoxys-S, Ferrothorn, and Skarmory can set up both Stealth Rock and Spikes, while Forretress has access to all three entry hazards, so you can pick and choose what you want. As for what Sceptile can set up on, generally the easiest way of setting up early-game is to bluff an attacking set and set up Leech Seed while your opponent has their guard down. If this is too unreliable an option, Sceptile can generally set up fairly easily on bulky Water-types. Just watch out for Jellicent, who can Taunt you before you can get your strategy going. Ground-types such as Hippowdon (without Roar) are also notable. In order to lure them in, you could use a Fire-type such as Chandelure or Heatran. As for specific threats, Sceptile may have difficulties with Conkeldurr, who can use Drain Punch to break its Substitute and then Mach Punch away. Be sure to find some way to deal with it, such as by using Gliscor or Tentacruel.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Sceptile has a pretty impressive physical movepool, most importantly containing Leaf Blade, Earthquake, Rock Slide, X-Scissor, Crunch, Dragon Claw, Bullet Seed, Acrobatics, Brick Break, Drain Punch, ThunderPunch, Low Kick, Pursuit, and Quick Attack, and it also has Swords Dance to set up. However, its low base 85 Attack stat means that it can rarely do enough damage to be considered viable. Most special options have already been discussed in the Life Orb set. Sceptile also gets Endeavor, so it can abuse a strategy with Focus Sash and Quick Attack to take down at least one Pokemon. Sceptile has about a million gimmick sets it could potentially run, with various items or moves, but for the most part these are inferior to the sets given, and as they rely almost solely on surprise factor, listing them here would remove their effectiveness. Don't be afraid to experiment, though.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Special walls, such as Blissey, Chansey, and specially defensive Porygon2 can easily take a Leaf Storm and recover off the damage. All three can also use Thunder Wave to make Sceptile useless while Porygon2 can attack back with Ice Beam. Bronzong and Skarmory can take just about any attack should Sceptile lack Hidden Power Fire, and Skarmory can OHKO back with Brave Bird, while Bronzong can do whatever the hell it likes. To a lesser extent, Ferrothorn and Scizor also fall under this label, though neither enjoy taking a Focus Blast.</p>

    <p>Defensive Flying-types such as Dragonite and Zapdos can take on and defeat Sceptile as well, although if they don't invest in their defensive stats, Hidden Power Ice will sting. Dragonite's Multiscale ability does allow it to take Hidden Power Ice with relative ease, though. As far as Poison-types go, Roserade can easily take a Leaf Storm but dislikes either Hidden Power, while most other specially defensive Poison-types also do relatively well. As far as Grass-types go, Celebi has impressive defensive stats and can wall Sceptile reasonably well. Lastly, for Fire-types, both Heatran and Volcarona have 4x resistances to Grass and, although Heatran is weak to Earthquake and Volcarona to Rock Slide, both can OHKO with their STAB Fire-type moves.</p>

    [Dream World]

    <p>Sceptile gets the impressive ability Unburden from the Dream World, which would be a blessing for almost any other Pokemon, but is a bit wasted on Sceptile. Essentially, the way it works is that, when Sceptile loses an item, its Speed doubles, so if Sceptile were to consume a Petaya Berry, Focus Sash, or Grass Jewel, it would become faster than just about anything. Unfortunately, Sceptile's already immense Speed stat means that Unburden is more often than not a waste of time. Even when running a pinch Berry set (which are illegal in OU since these Berries are unobtainable in the 5th generation), Overgrow is usually the better option thanks to the boost to Sceptile's STAB attacks.</p>

    -------------------

    Post-critique changes:

    - Removed SubSeed and Swords Dance
    - Added mentions of different Hidden Powers to Life Orb
    - Removed Uber Pokemon
    - English names + new format
    - Re-added SubSeed
    - Wrote the analysis
    - Grammar check 1, thanks to elDino
    - GP Grammar-Prose Check #1, thanks to TelamonianAjax
    - GP Grammar-Prose Check #2, thanks to wekhter
    - Removed Garchomp
  2. cim

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    I don't really think SubSeed is worth listing when Shaymin-S exists and Sceptile can run viable sets that Shaymin-S cannot, mainly that cool mixed sweeper set.
  3. bugmaniacbob

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    Yeah, in retrospect Erufuun is pretty much the best SubSeeder that exists thanks to Mischievous Heart, Taunt, and Encore, and even then Shaymin-S is generally a better Subseeder anyway, so I've put SubSeed into optional changes. Although the rules state that sets should be put in regardless of whether they are outclassed or not, I still feel that Sceptile cannot really be expected to run SubSeed effectively any more. I also removed Swords Dance for similar reasons.

    I've also made some comments in the Mixed set regarding different Hidden Powers on recommendation from chicobo329, so thanks for that.

    Anyway, this is pretty much done now.
  4. Rising_Dusk

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    Fixed some spacing errors, marked as done.
  5. Setsuna

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    Everything looks pretty good to me, bob. Good work!

    QC APPROVED (1/2)
  6. Bloo

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    Good work, as expected. Everything here is explained thoroughly and I have absolutely no problems with the content listed in your OP. Though, remove all mentions of Ubers since this is being written for the OU metagame. Additionally, remove the mention of Genosekuto as well, since I was that unreleased event 'mons shouldn't be mentioned in other Pokemon's analyses.

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  7. BubaOReally?

    BubaOReally?

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    if sub seed is no good, maybe try a sub peyata berry set?

    Name: Over Sub
    Move 1: energy ball
    Move 2: Focus Blast
    Move 3: Hidden power Ice/Fire/Dragon Pulse
    Move 4: Substitute
    Item: Peyata Berry
    Ability: Overgrow

    you sub down to over grow HP, activate Peyata berry and sweep. With Peyata berry boosting his already good special attack and Overgrow activated he can make some dents in some Pokemon. Makes for a good late game sweeper to clean up the battle.
  8. Axa

    Axa

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    In retrospect with Unburden, would it be possible to create an Acrobat set? Sceptile's physical movepool isn't half bad and it gets Swords Dance at any rate.

    I was thinking

    Sceptile@Grass Jewel/Sky Jewel
    252Att/160Spd/96HP
    Jolly
    Unburden
    ~Leaf Blade
    ~Acrobat
    ~Earthquake
    ~Crunch/Rock Slide/Swords Dance

    160Spd with Jolly means you outspeed +2 Terakion/Kobaruon after Unburden. The last move is either used for coverage or to boost Sceptile's otherwise mehish Attack.
  9. Jaroda

    Jaroda

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    Now this I like. Grass Jewel gives you a powerful attack right off the bat even before you SD, and after you do you will be fearsome indeed. Acrobat is a great move.

    Also, it's really gimmicky but this is one of my favorite Sceptile sets that makes a good lead.

    Secptile@Focus Sash
    Overgrow
    Hasty 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spd
    ~Counter
    ~Endeavor
    ~Leaf Storm
    ~Quick Attack

    Depending on the team you take one opponent out with Counter, Overgrow Leaf Storm the second if they don't resist grass, and Endeavor the third. It obviously requires a shit load of luck as well as no hazards or sand/hail and great prediction, but it is fun when it works.
  10. Karutemo

    Karutemo

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    Is this the OU analysis? Cuz I was going to do it and Im almost done.
  11. SmileZ

    SmileZ

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    Just a quick heads up. You meantioned Scizor, Nattorei and Skarmory resist Focus Blast and Earthquake. While Skarmory is immune to Earthquake, the other are hit Neutrally by both. Just a little mention.
  12. Banryu

    Banryu

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    Uh, yeah dude, this has been up for like 2 months. :0 If there's anything in your write-up that's not in this one, feel free to mention it, though. (Keep in mind that older Sceptile sets like SubSeed and Choice Specs might be purposely not listed, due to their being outclassed by Jalorda and Erufuun and such now.)
  13. Karutemo

    Karutemo

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    Well Im kinda amazed that protect is not listed in the set. It gives great scouting purpous. If the opponent sends in a Wobbufett you can just simply spam Protect until he switches out. Or if he decides to stay in you can start a guessing mind game with the opponent. Also, Protect lets you scout if the opponent will use Trick, try to status you or what move will be used. You can also scout if a newly sent in Scizor will use U-Turn or Bullet Punch, and then counter accordingly with HP Fire or a switch.

    Would recommend Protect over EQ/FB since Protect has more merits, since EQ is weak due to below average attack stat and FB has a shaky accuracy. Leaf Storm, HP Fire and Dragon Pulse already give a decent coverage. Just give another pokemon in your team EQ or another fighting move. You are better of with Protect as its a life saver in some instances.
  14. Banryu

    Banryu

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    Ditching EQ/FB leaves you walled by Heatran. :0 And a sweeper set like this can't really afford to be walled by anything. :\ It's what makes Sceptile a good choice over a lot of other sweepers... Come to think of it, Focus Blast should really be the primary slash on that slot, due to most Heatran carrying Balloon.

    If you're gonna run Protect on a set, Leaf Storm/EQ/HP Ice/Protect is the way to go, since HP Ice and EQ have great neutral coverage together, so that'd be the best way to justify its use (although you're still walled by Heatran that carry Balloon, which most do). All the same, its pretty inferior to having 4 attacks, since Heatran runs a high risk of walling you, and you also can't OHKO the 4x weak Steels anymore without HP Fire. Protect could have an OC mention, but IMO it isn't worth mentioning on the set.

    I think that's a pretty good idea, however, it's mostly not as good as the current set for the same reasons as Protect. Still, it functions differently from the last one, and it might be worth its own set.

    I also think this is a cool idea, but is there any reason (besides Sceptile's higher Speed) to use this over Gliscor, who gets STAB on EQ and Acrobat, Poison Heal, and is bulkier?

    Sounds like a decent idea to me. Shouldn't Unburden be an option, though? ...or does Focus Sash not activate Unburden?

    Hehe, I like Sceptile. <3 Just wanted to toss my own 2 cents~ I will stolidly defend that LO set, as I used it myself in 4th Gen OU with great success.
  15. BubaOReally?

    BubaOReally?

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    lets not forget a choice specs set.
  16. Jaroda

    Jaroda

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    It would, but Sceptile is pretty fast enough. The whole point is with Focus Sash you will be in Overgrow range so your Leaf Storm will benefit from it. You won't be doing much with the unburden speed boost.
  17. Axa

    Axa

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    Type coverage would likely be the major thing. If Gliscor is running Toxic Orb Fling (which most will to make the best use of Acrobat), then it either foregoes SD or a coverage move. Also consider the widespread use of Balloon, especially on things like Dory. Gliscor is bulky enough to handle Dory within 2 turns, but not without likely taking some damage from Rock Slide, especially considering Dory will outspeed in the sand. On the other hand, Sceps can outspeed and hit hard with a neutral STAB Leaf Blade. Of course if Sceps hasn't Unburdened it will probably lose to X-Scissor though. I haven't seen Balloon T-tar much, but a similiar scenario occurs, except Sceptile can handle it usually without any problems.

    That said, Leaf Blade allows Sceptile to hit Swampert, Rotom-W, Starmie, Burungeru, and quite a few other bulky waters. Gliscor loses out against most of them because either he loses in terms of speed, like Starmie, or EQ and Acrobat just aren't up to snuff, like Rotom-W.

    Still, Sceptile becomes much less effective when he's forced to switch, since Unburden won't reactivate as far as I know. Gliscor on the other hand can keep healing and being a solid check.
  18. Banryu

    Banryu

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    True. Point well taken.

    Let's get a few things straight here. For one thing, Ground + Flying have excellent neutral coverage, hitting pretty much everything but Skarmory (and barring Ballooned pokes). Now just considering this so far, Gliscor looks like a much better user of the EQ + Acrobat coverage combo, considering he can also SD, and doesn't really need any other coverage moves (although he would miss out on stuff like Taunt and Protect, which are still useful). Using the example you used, Doryuuzu, Gliscor is undoubtedly the better of the two for handling it, as well as nearly all other Ballooned Pokes, seeing as it has Fling for breaking Balloons (one per match, of course, assuming proper prediction and whatnot) without hugely wasting a turn. Now think of it this way... Sceptile and Gliscor are both neutral to SR. Sceptile will go first if Unburden is activated and hit Doryuuzu with Leaf Blade. Gliscor will fling its Orb and, assuming no switch, break the Balloon. Assuming neither KOs... the next turn, let's assume Dory has no X-Scissor and just uses Rock Slide. Guess who takes more damage from it? Yep, it's the guy with lower defenses. :0 Also, Unburden Sceptile would lose to Heatran with Balloon, whereas Gliscor Flings its Orb to pop the Balloon, is not OHKO'd by anything un-Specsed, and KOs with Earthquake on the next turn.

    Of course, if Sceptile can OHKO Dory with boosted or even unboosted Leaf Blade, that's the real difference that would make it worth using.

    Ah, now this is a much more convincing point to me. Sceptile handles bulky waters much better than Gliscor does, that's very true. So I think it's safe to say that Gliscor isn't outright better, it and Sceptile merely have different uses with these sets.
  19. Axa

    Axa

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    252Att Jolly Sceptile vs. 4/0 Dory: 64.1% - 75.6%

    A +2 Sceptile will OHKO it, and if you're still holding onto the Grass Jewel you'll OHKO regardless, but you'll be losing speed-wise if you're still holding onto it.

    That makes me wonder if it'd be better to pump Speed so it can outrun base 115s even without Unburden, so it can handle the likes of say Starmie without needing to lose its item. If it's forced to switch out it can't handle them since it won't be as fast. It makes the extra Speed a bit of a waste afterward, though, though you'll end up outspeeding just about everything except for Unburden Ariguiaada or +3 Kingdra.

    Ah, if only Sceptile learned Taunt...
  20. Banryu

    Banryu

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    Being fast enough to outspeed stuff before the boost, even if the extra speed after Unburden is useless, would be worth it to me. Sceptile isn't gonna be taking that many hits, even with HP investment anyway. :0
  21. Farewell

    Farewell

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    Giga Drain over Energy Ball on the sets suggested, also Sceptile can use a set like this?

    Sceptile: @ Grass Jewel
    Unburden
    252 Attack, 252 Speed
    Adamant

    Hone Claws
    Grasswhistle
    Leaf Blade
    Earthquake / Acrobat

    Boost initial power with Grass Jewel, then Unburden activates doubling your speed. Hone Claws increases Attack and accuracy, which empowers Grasswhistle to sleep and outspeed a counter. Leaf Blade and Earthquake/Acrobat offer decent coverage.
  22. PooF

    PooF

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    On the topic of unburden, here's another (somewhat gimmicky :)) idea. Since Sceptile resists both water and electric, he could use Bulb (for special sets) or Rechargeable battery (for physical sets). Afaik those items are consumed once holder gets hit by that type of move, so it would activate unburden, meaning sceptile would be at +1 SpA/Atk and +2 Spe just by switching into appropriate attack.
    Since Sceptile is already extremenly fast, he can afford to put some EVs into bulk to make it easier to switch into that one attack (even though it's resisted, Sceptile's defenses still suck) as well as run modest/adamant nature (instead of timid/jolly) to ensure enough power. Since this set should just switch in once and sweep, Spe stat before Unburden boost doesn't matter.
  23. bugmaniacbob

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    OK I'm not going to bother going through all the suggestions here, if I ignored you then I either didn't feel the point was worth contesting or I have added it into the analysis already. That being said, I'd like to just go through these sets and comment briefly on them.

    Firstly, it's 'Petaya Berry'. Second, I don't see this working at all. In the fourth generation, Substitute Pinch Berry sets have been deemed 'bad' because with a few notable exceptions (ie. Petaya Empoleon) they are all complete priority bait and essentially never work. Also Sceptile's type coverage is pretty limited, Energy Ball is weak for a STAB move, and 105 base SpA isn't winning any awards offensively. Hence why it's a bad idea to deliberately lower your own HP. Making dents in Pokemon doesn't matter when you're on low HP and will be ended by anything.

    That's great and all except that Sceptile is absolutely nothing like Gliscor, whom you were doubtless thinking of when you made this set. The difference is that Gliscor can actually stick around for longer, doesn't mind losing its item, and can actually use Acrobat as its main STAB move, and that's necessary when you consider that it doesn't have any better Flying-type STAB moves. It also has STAB on Earthquake. In contrast, with Sceptile you have a Pokemon that is using a nonSTAB 110 BP attack off 85 base Attack. You are not going to be denting much with that when you could just fire off LO STAB attacks rather than going to the trouble of customising an entire set around an essentially useless move. Acrobat and Unburden are great, don't get me wrong, but they're pretty much wasted on Sceptile.

    I've already mentioned Endeavor + Counter leads in the Optional Changes section, which is where gimmicks belong. Anyway, if this was a standard it would be no fun to use, would it?

    Protect is good as a scouting tool but not much else. Essentially all you will be using it for is working out whether xyz choiced Pokemon is going to use a certain move or not, and all other times you are just pointlessly wasting time. Also, why the hell would Protect help at all against Wobbuffet? It can just wait for Protect to fail, then Encore you and then you're essentially useless. I'd much rather use a coverage move - Sceptile has horrible 4 moveslot syndrome, I have no idea why that should be compromised even further on an offensive set of all things.

    Yes, let's forget it.

    See above. Grasswhistle's accuracy is pathetic even after a Claw Sharpen boost (something like 73% IIRC), and then you have only two weak moves for sweeping, where something like Breloom could just Spore and Swords Dance for a more pronounced effect.

    You aren't going to be able to switch Sceptile into an Electric-type move every time, and if you don't then Sceptile is essentially worthless, since he's lost the one thing that actually makes him moderately usable - his Speed.

    Okay, a couple of things I just want to impress on everybody:

    1. Stop suggesting gimmick sets. This isn't Uncharted Territory. If it's a gimmick set even slightly then by definition it shouldn't be on an analysis. Similarly, I really don't want to see people suggesting untested sets.
    2. This analysis has already been QC approved. If you guys had really wanted to put some input in, you should probably have done so in the two or so months this has been active rather than right after all the content in it has been approved. Seriously, that's just annoying for everybody.
    3. I'm not even working on this analysis right now, since the QC members have decided that Sceptile should not get an OU analysis yet. And before some wise guy decides that he should set up his own Sceptile thread, can I just point out that I still have this analysis reserved for UU whenever it rolls round, so that's the purpose this thread serves now.

    Sorry if this comes off as harsh but I'm slightly annoyed at the lack of common sense in this thread.
  24. bugmaniacbob

    bugmaniacbob Floats like a Butterfree, stings like a Metapod
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    Sorry for the double post.

    I meant to get around to this a while back. Now that Shaymin-S is gone and Sceptile is listed as competitive again, I think that a SubSeed set is in order. I have added a very rough, basic set outline to the OP already. The only thing is, since this analysis has been approved already, I'll probably need more QC checks on that set alone. Sceptile's SubSeed set is reasonably effective, in my opinion, and I'd appreciate some comments on it, even though I don't have much down at the moment.

    Thanks. I'll get around to writing this up if/when it is approved.
  25. SquirtCano

    SquirtCano

    Joined:
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    As far as the Dream World ability is concerned. If you use a White Herb with Leaf Storm you won't lose your Sp. Atk (the first time) and you get a speed boost. Potentially setting up a sweep. It also sets up the use of Acrobat which can be potentially lethal to common Fighting types. I also think this can partner well with BP Venomoth or Ninjask/Blaziken provided you can switch into a non threat or pass a substitute along. If it gets a safe entry boosted Earthquakes (Physical BP) or Dragon Pulse (Butteryfly Dance BP) can do serious bodily harm to most threats.

    I'd personally run
    Hasty White Herb
    Leaf Storm
    Acrobat
    Earthquake
    Dragon Pulse/HP Fire/HP Fighting

    Bronzor and Skarmory resist Dragon Pulse set, The Fire Rotom and Ballooned Heatran resist the HP Fire set although you can pop the balloon with acrobat, and Electric/Flying types resist the HP Fighting set.

    I don't know what I'd do for EV spread yet, gotta think on it, Its obviously meant to be a mixsweeper though.

    Even without BP support it can be a contender. You know ... once we can start doing sets for Dream World abilities

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