Scolipede [QC 0/3]

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Shelmet, Jun 4, 2012.

  1. Shelmet

    Shelmet

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    [​IMG]

    Scolipede


    [Overview]


    • Mediocre Bug/Poison typing
    • Great base speed allows it to outrun a lot of popular Pokemon
    • Access to both Spikes and Toxic Spikes, fastest user of the latter in UU.
    • 90 base attack is workable in conjunction with Swords Dance and a strong Megahorn. 60/89/69 Defenses are poor, but enough to make use of Scolipede’s resistances.
    • Scolipede is vulnerable to Spikes and possesses a Stealth Rock weakness, but absorbs Toxic Spikes. He still greatly appreciates Rapid Spin support, however.
    • Has a 4x Resistance to Mienshao's Hi Jump Kick, and outspeeds it to deal heavy damage.


    [SET]
    name: Spikes
    move 1: Spikes
    move 2: Megahorn
    move 3: Earthquake
    move 4: Toxic Spikes / Rock Slide
    item: Life Orb / Leftovers
    ability: Swarm
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 172 HP / 96 Atk / 240 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • With 96 Atk, you always OHKO 4 HP Mew and Shaymin without hazard support, doing a minimum of exactly 100%, you always OHKO Chandelure after SR, Darmanitan after Spikes, 4 HP Roserade, 2HKO Mismagius with any prior damage at all, doing 49% minimum, 2HKO Cobalion with a layer of Spikes so it can't set up, 2HKO the bulkiest Slowbro with Megahorn, do enough damage to Honchkrow to prevent it substituting about 50% of the time (if it lives it does so by the skin of its teeth), OHKO 4/0 Raikou with EQ 100% of the time if Spikes and SR are on the field, although you shouldn't stay in on it since Tbolt does a ton, and 2HKO offensive Kingdra with Megahorn.
    • 188 HP, on the other hand, means that offensive Rose cannot 2HKO with Sludge Bomb without hazards, Jolly Choice Band or Guts-boosted Heracross Close Combat cannot 3HKO you without the same support, and must roll effectively max damage all three times to KO after 1 layer of Spikes, defensive Hitmontop will sometimes fail to 2HKO with Stone Edge, bulky Empoleon Scald cannot 2HKO unless it burns you and Claydol cannot 2HKO with Earth Power even with a couple of layers of Spikes and often even with Stealth Rock, while Megahorn easily 2HKOs even the most physically bulky of Claydol.
    • Primarily uses 4x resistances to Grass and Fighting-type attacks to switch in and lay hazards. Makes a relatively good switch for Roserade because it resists Grass and Poison, but should watch out for sleep. Likewise, choiced fighting attacks allow it to easily set up spikes, but it should watch out for the rock-type coverage moves that often accompany them.
    • Megahorn is very powerful even with limited investment, 2HKOing walls such as Slowbro and Tangrowth that are weak to it and hitting more fragile neutral targets hard – OHKOing offensive Roserade, for example.
    • Earthquake is coverage, and will OHKO Chandelure after Stealth Rock and Darmanitan after a single layer of Spikes. Earthquake also allows Scolipede to always 2HKO 4/0 Cobalion after one layer of Spikes, preventing setup. Scolipede survives anything unboosted Cobalion can do as long as it does not have a Life Orb.
    • Toxic Spikes is the primary option in the fourth slot to cripple defensive teams, but it can be replaced by Rock Slide if this support is not needed to allow Scolipede to hit flying-types. However, it is quite weak with only 96 Atk EVs, sometimes failing to 2HKO 4/0 Zapdos without hazard support.

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • Life Orb is preferred to allow Scolipede to hit reasonably hard and prevent it from becoming setup bait, but Leftovers can be used for more bulk.
    • Hazard support is Scolipede’s primary role, so it appreciates Ghost-types that can prevent its hazards from being spun.
    • Even with Rock Slide, bulkier Flying and Ghost-types can easily take any of Scolipede’s blows as long as they are not weak to Earthquake. Sableye in particular can use priority Taunt to bypass Scolipede’s speed and prevent him from setting spikes.
    • Chandelure is a great partner, because it can switch into Will-o-Wisp from defensive Ghosts for a Flash Fire boost and obliterate them with its STAB Ghost-type moves. It also prevents Spikes from being spun and abuses them itself, often forcing switches with its strong attacks.
    • If using Toxic Spikes, grounded Poison-types should be removed beforehand. Strong Earthquake users such as Flygon or Krookodile can do this, and also appreciate Scolipede’s hazard support to wear down checks and counters.
    • Fast Taunt users such as Crobat and Azelf can outrun Scolipede and prevent it from setting Spikes. Choice Scarf users such as Krookodile, Heracross and Flygon can outrun and KO these Pokemon, and enjoy having Spikes to weaken opposing walls for a lategame sweep.
    • A Focus Sash can be used with maximum speed and attack for a dedicated lead set. However, Scolipede is much easier to set up on without a Life Orb and less able to abuse its useful 4x resistances without Leftovers.

    [SET]

    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Megahorn
    move 3: Earthquake
    move 4: Rock Slide / Baton Pass
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Swarm
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 16 HP / 252 Atk / 240 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • Swords Dance boosts Scolipede’s mediocre attack stat to a whopping 558.
    • 240 Speed is used to outrun Froslass, the fastest common UU mon that is slower than Scolipede. Attack is maximised for power, and the remaining EVs are dumped in HP to maximise bulk.
    • Megahorn is remarkably strong, and will OHKO almost anything that does not resist it after a Swords Dance.
    • Earthquake is Scolipede’s primary coverage option, easily KOing steel types such as Cobalion, who this spread just outruns. It also allows Scolipede to dispose of the multitude of slower UU Fire-types even without a boost.
    • Rock Slide is primarily for Flying-types that resist Scolipede’s other two moves. After a boost, it will do significant damage despite its low base power. However, Baton Pass can be used to give the attack boost to another Pokemon once Scolipede encounters something like Gligar that in cannot beat.
    • A Life Orb is used to give Scolipede as much power as possible. It won’t be taking hits uninvested anyway, so a different item would be a waste.

    [ADDTIONAL COMMENTS]

    • Gligar laughs at anything Scolipede can do, even after multiple boosts, and will hit back with Earthquake to gradually KO Scolipede while keeping itself healthy with Roost.
    • Strong Water and Ice-types such as Azumarill, Kingdra and Weavile can switch into Gligar and force it out with the threat of heavy damage.
    • Appreciates entry hazard support to help its mediocre 90 base attack go the extra mile; Froslass can force Gligar out with the threat of a super-effective Ice Beam and set up Spikes.
    • Choice Scarfed Fire-type revenge killers such as Darmanitan and Victini can easily OHKO Scolipede with their STAB moves, so a teammate such as Qwilfish or Suicune that can take them on is a good choice. Qwilfish can also provide Spikes support, making it easier for Scolipede to get KOs.
    • Also has a weakness to Flying, Psychic and Rock-type moves. Bulky Steel-types such as Bronzong can easily take all three of these types thanks to a resistance to all three; however, they share a fire-type weakness with Scolipede.

    [Other Options]

    • Dedicated Baton Pass set with Agility, Swords Dance and Iron Defense.
    • However, Mew does this much better.
    • Can make use of its Poison STAB with Poison Jab, but this does not offer any useful coverage.
    • X-Scissor can be used if Megahorn’s accuracy is unappealing; however, it is much weaker, and misses out on many KOs, so it is not recommended.
    • Double-Edge can be used to hit Gligar harder, but offers no notable advantages aside from this and makes it much easier to wall Scolipede with bulky Flying-types.
    • Screech is mostly outclassed by Swords Dance, but can be used to abuse hazards by forcing switches, or with Pursuit to trap the opponent.

    [Checks and Counters]

    • Many faster Pokemon can prey on Scolipede’s middling defences. Fire-types such as Victini, Chandelure and Darmanitan are especially effective thanks to their super-effective STAB moves. However, all will take heavy damage from an Earthquake, so they should be careful switching in.
    • Similarly, naturally faster Pokemon can often easily outrun and KO Scolipede. Crobat and Azelf will easily OHKO Scolipede with their STAB moves, although Crobat needs support from a layer of hazards or a round of Life Orb strecoil to ensure it will KO. Raikou does not want to take an Earthquake, but can easily pick off a Scolipede that has been weakened with Thunderbolt.
    • Bulky Ghost-types such as Dusclops can tank Scolipede’s attacks with ease and burn it with Will-o-Wisp to prevent it achieving much. However, it can easily set up Spikes on them.
    • Similarly, nothing Scolipede does will scratch Gligar, but even if Gligar packs Taunt, Scolipede’s much greater speed will allow it to set a layer or two of Spikes.
    • Physically bulky Pokemon such as Blastiose can take even a boosted Megahorn and retaliate, though Scolipede is bulky enough to live an uninvested attack with ease as long as it is not hit super-effectively.
    • Any relatively bulky Pokemon that resists Megahorn and is not weak to either coverage attack is a good choice. Hitmontop can also spin away Scolipede's Spikes and weaken it with Intimidate.

    [Unreleased]

    • Quick Feet is bad.
    • Scolipede is fast enough and immune to Poison. A Burn halves its useful attack, so paralysis is the only good option to raise speed. However, this is situational, and Quick Feet does not ignore the 25% chance for immobilization from paralysis, so Quick Feet is mostly useless.



    Should be ready for QC. Apologies in advance if I made any stupid mistakes; this is the first piece of CC work I've done. At the moment I'm not sure if Baton Pass is worth a slash on the SD set; I need to do more testing.

    --

    Kokoloko told me to post here because I'm taking over Scolipede's analysis, so uh yeah.
  2. kokoloko

    kokoloko I fill the bag.
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    Excellent work so far, especially for your first analysis.

    I'll leave the Baton Pass mention completely up to you--either AC or a slash seems fine to me. I do need you to explain the EV and nature choices a little more in detail at the beginning of the AC sections for both sets. Should be easy for you since I was there when you talked about it on IRC.

    Once that's done, consider this stamped.

    Quality Control Approved 1/3
  3. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    Why are you using 96 Atk evs in the first set? Are there some specific ohkoes that you get, or does the bulk investment matter, because i think max Atk is the way to go, since Scolipede is very fast and can act as a very good revenge killer, so it will need as much Atk as possible.
  4. FastFlygon

    FastFlygon

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    96 Attack is a pretty crucial point IMO. With it, you always OHKO 4 HP Mew and Shaymin without hazard support, doing a minimum of exactly 100%, you always OHKO Chandelure after SR, Darmanitan after Spikes, 4 HP Roserade, 2HKO Mismagius with any prior damage at all, doing 49% minimum, 2HKO Cobalion with a layer of Spikes so it can't set up, 2HKO the bulkiest Slowbro with Megahorn, do enough damage to Honchkrow to prevent it substituting about 50% of the time (if it lives it does so by the skin of its teeth), OHKO 4/0 Raikou with EQ 100% of the time if Spikes and SR are on the field, although you shouldn't stay in on it since Tbolt does a ton, and 2HKO offensive Kingdra with Megahorn.

    188 HP, on the other hand, means that offensive Rose cannot 2HKO with Sludge Bomb without hazards, Jolly Choice Band or Guts-boosted Heracross Close Combat cannot 3HKO you without the same support, and must roll effectively max damage all three times to KO after 1 layer of Spikes, defensive Hitmontop will sometimes fail to 2HKO with Stone Edge, bulky Empoleon Scald cannot 2HKO unless it burns you and Claydol cannot 2HKO with Earth Power even with a couple of layers of Spikes and often even with Stealth Rock, while Megahorn easily 2HKOs even the most physically bulky of Claydol.

    There could be a better defensive spread, I'm not sure, once I found the "magic" attack point I just dumped everything else in HP. Leftovers doesn't get the same KOs though (obviously) so I think and alternative spread might be better for that. It's worth noting that even with maximised attack, Leftovers has significantly lower damage figures, a spread that just emphasises bulk (perhaps the same speed with a HP/spdef split?) might be a better option.
    I calced everything I imagined Solipede might want to revenge kill, but I may have missed something. Let me know if I did. Also, perhaps it would be a good idea to put some of these calcs in the analysis? For someone unfamiliar with Scolipede, Life Orb might seem like a strange choice on a Spiker, although I should put more emphasis on the fact that Scolipede is an offensive Spiker and not intended for more defensive teams.
  5. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
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    With a 144 HP / 140 Atk / 224 Spe spread, you do all the things you mentioned while having more attack, which is useful on an offensive mon. Also Mismagius very frequently runs Lefties, which means that with your spread you don't 2hko 35,5% of the time, while with 140 Atk evs, you 2hko 94% of the time, while also having ~35% chance to ohko Raikou after SR.
  6. FastFlygon

    FastFlygon

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    Updated OP with more details on both EV spreads. I'll wait for QC weigh-in on my spread vs Alexwolf's for now.
  7. Chou Toshio

    Chou Toshio @Fighting Necktie
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    What koko said.

    QC APPROVED 2/3

    edit: mmm... I can do some testing if you want, but I don't mind leaving it up to the OP in this case.
  8. FlareBlitz

    FlareBlitz This was never a story that would have a happy end
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    My favorite set for Scolipede when I used it in the deo-d meta was 240 HP / 28 Atk / 240 Spe, primarily because it helped you against the things Scolipede was likely to come up against (i.e. Defensive Hitmontop's Stone Edge doesn't 2hko, so you are free to set up in its face if you have Swords Dance (more on this later)). You also avoid a 2hko from Scarfgon's Earthquake, an ohko from Machamp's Stone Edge, and a few other nifty calcs. This can mean the difference between getting down another layer of spikes / slamming something with a Swarm Megahorn or losing your centipede, so it's worth considering / testing.

    SD set looks fine. Baton Pass should probably the primary option over Rock Slide, mostly because of your ability to swiftly force Gligar's head up its ass. The ability to beat Zapdos is nice if that's important to your team though.
  9. kokoloko

    kokoloko I fill the bag.
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    Even though Scolipede didn't change much due to BW2, it's environment might, so let's hold off on this until we're a week or two into the new metagame.
  10. kokoloko

    kokoloko I fill the bag.
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    Since FastFlygon hasn't been on since the 17th, I'm going to have to reassign this.

    His skeleton is pretty well put together, so it only needs a couple of mentions about BW2 stuff (like how it 4x resists Mienshao's HJK and outspeeds to deal heavy damage).

    Would anyone like to take this over and write it up? Just post saying so and I'll give you the OP.
  11. Shelmet

    Shelmet

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    Ok, time for this to go through QC again.

    Sorry for the delay.
  12. kokoloko

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    You should probably actually read and edit the skeleton before trying to get this through QC again...

    It's pretty obvious you haven't when the first thing I see when I begin reading the first set is "With 96 Atk, you always OHKO 4 HP Mew"

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