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Scolipede [QC 3/3] [GP 2/2]

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Hollywood, Jun 21, 2013.

  1. Hollywood

    Hollywood time to pay!
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    [​IMG]

    the human scolipede

    [Overview]

    <p>Since its arrival in the NU tier, Scolipede has single-handedly defined Spikes-stacking offensive teams thanks to its combination of fantastic Speed, above average Attack, and a high Base Power STAB move. What makes it even more fearsome is its versatility; Scolipede has a wide variety of viable moves to utilize, and it can even run a bulkier spread or a boosting sweeper set. In fact, one of Scolipede's only drawbacks—its typing—can also be played to its advantage. Despite some weaknesses to common attacking types, Scolipede also boasts a 4x resistance to Fighting- and Grass-type moves that can help it set up against many of the tier's common threats.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Offensive Spikes
    move 1: Spikes
    move 2: Megahorn
    move 3: Aqua Tail
    move 4: Rock Slide / Swords Dance
    item: Life Orb / Focus Sash
    ability: Swarm
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This is Scolipede's most popular set, and for good reason: its combination of great Speed, power, and coverage makes it both a great Spikes user and a great attacker. Spikes is the first move on this set, and it's by far the most important one. Scolipede's ability to get up Spikes quickly is what makes it so effective. Megahorn is the best STAB Scolipede has, and it's used to compensate a bit for Scolipede's Attack stat, which is decent at best. Aqua Tail hits Pokemon that Scolipede otherwise struggles to defeat, such as Golurk, and has great neutral coverage alongside its Bug-type STAB. Rock Slide hits Flying-types for super effective damage, and it has a nice chance to flinch which works well in congruence with Scolipede's fantastic Speed. However, Swords Dance can be used instead, further increasing Scolipede's offensive potential and allowing it to set up Spikes on free turns caused by forced switches. It's worth noting that either Swords Dance or Rock Slide works fine with Life Orb, but as Rock Slide isn't very strong without a boost, only Swords Dance should be used with Focus Sash.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Basically the only moves that should always be on this set are Megahorn and Spikes; anything else can be changed to fit your team's needs. Pursuit works well on Life Orb sets to pick off Pokemon such as Jynx, but it doesn't have much use otherwise. Earthquake is in a very similar boat, as it can hit Poison-types, such as Garbodor, for super effective damage, but it doesn't serve much use outside of this. Finally, Toxic Spikes are fantastic on Scolipede, but it often struggles to find a slot for it. The choice in item is also very reliant upon your team's needs; Life Orb allows Scolipede to pack an immediate punch, but if setting Spikes is more important for your team, you're better off running Focus Sash for a nearly guaranteed two layers. You can also run Bug Gem on this set in order to OHKO Musharna after it has taken two layers of Spikes damage. Perhaps the only thing that you shouldn't ever really change is the ability. Swarm is almost always the clear choice, as the added power that Megahorn receives is notable when it is in range of getting a boost, while Poison Point is unreliable and Quick Feet is only really beneficial in case of paralysis.</p>

    <p>Finding partners for Scolipede isn't exactly a difficult task; Spikes are appreciated on almost every team. However, some Pokemon work exceptionally well with it. Seismitoad, for example, has access to the only hazard Scolipede doesn't—Stealth Rock—and can take on Fire- and Rock-type attacks, while Scolipede can take Grass-type attacks. Strong special attackers can also muscle past most of the tier's physical walls, which tend to give Scolipede problems. Good examples of these include Samurott, Eelektross, and Ludicolo. Offensive sweepers that appreciate their checks and counters weakened work well alongside this set, as the Spikes that Scolipede sets can help accomplish just that. For this reason, many different Pokemon, including Swellow, Choice Scarf Jynx, and Calm Mind Serperior, appreciate the support that Scolipede provides. Finally, because this set has troubles setting hazards multiple times throughout a match, a Ghost-type can be helpful to block Rapid Spin and keep entry hazards up on your opponent's side of the field. Misdreavus is a great defensive spinblocker, and SubDisable Haunter and Destiny Bond Drifblim make good offensive spinblockers.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Bulky Spikes
    move 1: Spikes
    move 2: Toxic Spikes
    move 3: Megahorn
    move 4: Aqua Tail / Toxic
    item: Black Sludge
    ability: Swarm
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 248 HP / 36 Atk / 56 Def / 168 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>While it might seem outclassed by other Spikes users, such as Garbodor and Roselia, a bulkier spread also works well on Scolipede, sacrificing some of the immediate power of the offensive set in exchange for more chances to set up hazards. What sets bulky Scolipede apart from other Spikes users is its greater offensive presence and Speed. This set plays best on balanced offensive teams that prefer more consistent hazards over getting them set up more quickly. Both Spikes and Toxic Spikes are used on this set, as they can both be helpful in different situations. Megahorn is used for a STAB move, and it still hits fairly hard even with minimal investment. The choice in the last slot is between Aqua Tail and Toxic. The former has the best two-move coverage alongside Megahorn, while the latter can be used to poison Flying-types and Pokemon with Levitate. It also comes in handle during the times when your opponent has a Poison-type to absorb Toxic Spikes, but you still need a means of poisoning the opposing Pokemon.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs on this set serve a few purposes. The Speed EVs allow Scolipede to outspeed up to base 101 Speed Pokemon, including Simisage, Simipour, Simisear, and Charizard, and hit them for heavy damage or set up more hazards before they can attack. The Attack EVs allow Scolipede a chance to 2HKO Musharna with Megahorn and Golurk with Aqua Tail. The remaining EVs are placed in HP and Defense to help it take on opposing attackers. With no reliable recovery, this set appreciates Wish support from bulky Pokemon, such as Alomomola, Lickilicky, and Audino. The last two can also provide Heal Bell support in case Scolipede is hit with an untimely burn or paralysis. Seismitoad has great defensive synergy with Scolipede and can provide Stealth Rock support. Spinblockers make for decent partners, however none of them share much synergy with Scolipede, and this set is able to set hazards multiple times if necessary, making spinblockers less of a necessity. Finally, many NU sweepers appreciate the support from Toxic Spikes in particular to take out certain Pokemon that they would otherwise struggle to beat. Bulk Up Braviary has issues with Rock-type Pokemon; Shell Smash Carracosta with Alomomola, Tangela, and Seismitoad; and Klang with Ground- and Fighting-types.</p>

    [SET]
    name: SubSalac
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Substitute
    move 3: Megahorn
    move 4: Aqua Tail / Baton Pass
    item: Salac Berry
    nature: Adamant / Jolly
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    ivs: 30 HP

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Scolipede's SubSalac set completely forgoes the utility of Spikes in exchange for the ability to play as a setup sweeper and a stallbreaker. This set is very powerful; even Alomomola, one of the tier's bulkiest physical walls, cannot stomach two Megahorns from a +2 Scolipede. Swords Dance is used as it's Scolipede's best boosting move, propelling its Attack to 612 after one boost. Substitute is used for many reasons—to ease prediction for Scolipede, help it get down to Salac Berry range, and even to be passed on variants with Baton Pass. Megahorn is once again used as Scolipede's most powerful STAB move. Finally, Aqua Tail can be used to round out Scolipede's coverage if you're keen on Scolipede's sweeping ability. However, if you would rather help another teammate sweep, you can use Baton Pass to make sure its Swords Dance and Salac Berry boosts don't go to waste.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>An Adamant nature is used to help Scolipede reach its full sweeping potential, but more importantly, after a Salac Berry boost, the only common Choice Scarf user it fails to outspeed with an Adamant nature is Charizard. If you would feel more comfortable being able to outspeed Choice Scarf Charizard, a Jolly nature is still a viable alternative. 30 HP IVs are needed to activate Salac Berry after three Substitutes. If you plan to use Baton Pass on this set, you should bring along teammates that appreciate the boosts. Practically any physical attacker with respectable Speed appreciates the boosts; examples include Tauros, Sawk, Sawsbuck, and Kangaskhan. Because of the immense power of this set after it sets up a Swords Dance, it can be difficult to wall. Even so, a few Pokemon are able to take it on well, and having Pokemon to defeat them is always appreciated. Misdreavus is able to take any hit from Scolipede and break its Substitutes with either Foul Play or Shadow Ball, making Dark-type Pokemon, such as Skuntank and mixed Shiftry, good partners to help defeat it. Bastiodon and Weezing can take a hit from even +2 Scolipede and either Roar or Haze away its boosts. Strong special attackers, such as Jynx, can be used to defeat these Pokemon.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>While Scolipede has many different options for some of its sets, it doesn't have much potential outside of that. Still, there are some additional options you might be considering. A Choice Scarf or Choice Band set might seem appealing, but other Pokemon typically perform these roles better. Iron Defense and Agility seem like interesting options for a dedicated Baton Pass set, but Scolipede's bulk makes it difficult to set up multiple boosts. More importantly, Scolipede typically has much better things to be doing. Endeavor is an option on sets wielding a Focus Sash, bringing the opposing Pokemon down to one HP in many instances. Superpower is an interesting choice, as Fighting-type coverage is rarely a bad thing. However, it really doesn't add much in terms of coverage, and the Attack drop can force you to switch out, losing any offensive momentum you might have gained. Poison Jab is an interesting choice for a secondary STAB to hit Fighting- and Flying-type Pokemon that resist its Bug-type STAB, but outside of this, it's not worth using. Finally, Sunny Day is an interesting option that works well on sun teams with Scolipede's high base Speed, though it is already pressed for moveslots as it is.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>There are few Pokemon that can stop Scolipede from setting at least one layer of Spikes without sacrificing themselves. Golem is one of few, as it is able to Rock Blast Scolipede, ignoring the possibility of a Focus Sash saving it. Misdreavus can handle most Scolipede well, as it can take any unboosted hit easily, break Scolipede's Substitutes, burn it, and Taunt it to keep it from setting up Spikes or boosting with Swords Dance. Golbat can tank multiple Rock Slides from Scolipede, use Roost to recover the damage, Taunt to prevent it from setting up, and retaliate with Brave Bird. Alomomola can take any hit from Scolipede's Spikes sets, but it can't do much to keep it from setting up. Weezing can also take any hit from Scolipede, Haze its boosts away, and attack it with Flamethrower or Fire Blast. Frillish, although a rare sight in NU, can wall almost any move Scolipede has to hit it with and burn it in return. If all else fails, faster Pokemon and those wielding a Choice Scarf can revenge kill it. Jynx, Primeape, Charizard, and Zebstrika all have moves that can OHKO offensive Scolipede, and they all outspeed it with a Choice Scarf, while Swellow can outspeed it without a Choice Scarf and OHKO it with Brave Bird.</p>

    Skeleton: http://pastebin.com/amEvCtZ5
  2. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent Yeah, well. The Dude abides
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    Scolipede doesn't really fear jynx that much, as it beats every jynx except scarf 1o1.

    I haven't ised the first set much, but from theorymon I... don't really like it. When I think offensive spiker i immediately think sash, with swords dance over rock slide. With swords dance for example, you can boost as a golurk/armaldo/seismitoad w/e stealth rocks, follow up with an aqua tail or megahorn which ohkos, and the opponent is left facing a speedy +2 mon with an intact sash which is terrifying. From there scolipede can either sstart setting up hazards if the opponent brings in something like missy, or go straight for another ko if the opponent brings out an offensive pokemon. When its knocked down to sash it gets swarm boosted as well. This is a set that not only sets hazards but can cheerfully also knock out two pokemon straight up, and is what i believe to be scolipede's absolute best set.
  3. ScraftyIsTheBest

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    I despise the existence of this analysis; Scolipede does not deserve to be in this pit of crappy Pokemon.

    Anyways, a Focus Sash should probably get a slash, since Scolipede is a very viable (and overly powerful) suicide lead, and guaranteeing at least a layer of Spikes is pretty useful. You should also take Cherub's post into account, SD could also be very useful to let Scolipede sweep down a couple of Pokemon; MegaTail coverage is not resisted by many things, so yeah.

    Why is there not a SD+3 attacks Scolipede? Scolipede is perfectly capable of running an all out Swords Dance set, with a Life Orb. Scolipede can run Swords Dance, with Megahorn, Poison Jab, and Aqua Tail as three move coverage, since Poison Jab also allows Scolipede to give a harder blow to Sawk, which is something. Haven't used it in NU yet, but given my experiences with SD+3 Attacks Scolipede in RU, I'd consider giving this a consideration for a set.

    Also, call the SubSD set either SubSalac or Substitute+Swords Dance. I also think Aqua Tail should get the slash over BP, since Scolipede has a lot of sweeping potential with that set (since it's OP as hell, lol), and yeah.

    Also, mention in C&C that Alomomola is setup bait for the SubSalac set, since Scolipede can grab the boosts easily behind the Sub and just smash it with Megahorn (part of why Scolipede is too good to be in this tier, but eh).

    Just my two cents.

    Also make the link "Manly Scolipede"
  4. JoshuaMunoz

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    If Focus Sash gets to be in the set analysis, i would consider running Endeavor on AC. I had lots of success with it against the likes of Piloswine and Alomomola.
  5. Hollywood

    Hollywood time to pay!
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    which would be why it says "Faster Pokemon/Choice Scarf users can revenge" :P
    That's all I noticed for talk of Jynx outside of using it as a partner and a reason to run Pursuit. If I missed something else let me know.

    I really don't like Sash Scolipede, and here's why. In my experiences playing with it, Scolipede has always been WAY too useful to ditch early in the match. It's fast, it hits hard, it can set up Spikes on certain mons w/o sacrificing itself. I originally intended to have it slashed on the first set, but ebeast pretty much pointed out to me exactly what I just said, and I totally agree with him on the matter. It's something I'll leave up to other QC members in the end, but I feel like Sash just totally shits on its potential outside of setting up Spikes. On that note, I actually wanted to have bulky Spikes as the first set, but ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

    I've also tried SD Spikes and didn't care for it. On offensive sets, you're already hardpressed enough to set up Spikes; adding SD to that doesn't seem like the most effective way of playing with it. But these are just from my personal experiences with it, and I definitely respect both of your opinions. I'll leave that up to QC as well.

    I was told to slash BPass first, so for now, I'll leave it in this order. I see the utility in Baton Pass as well as the great coverage with Aqua Tail, so I get where you're coming from on this.

    0 Atk Alomomola Waterfall vs 0 HP/0 Def Scolipede: 29.12% - 34.48% (3-4 hits to KO)

    makes me hesitant, however:

    252 +2 Atk Scolipede (+Atk) Megahorn vs 252 HP/252 Def Alomomola (+Def) : 52.25% - 61.42% (2-3 hits to KO)

    so I'll throw a mention out that if Alomomola switches in, it's going to lose (assuming you hit of course), but that Scolipede can't expect to come in and set up on Alomomola.

    ikr

    mad @ nasty movie


    Anyways, I definitely appreciate all the feedback. Just a bit tentative with making most of the changes at the moment, since a. this is obviously a big analysis and b. many of the changes suggested are either huge changes (an extra set) or things that I talked with QC about before posting.

    Thanks again for the input~
  6. WhiteDMist

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    I'd like to see a mention of Bug Gem in the AC of the first set to boost Megahorn without recoil. I also agree that a SD + 3 Attacks set should be in OO, if not a set of its own. Oh, and add Golbat to CC as a counter since it can take anything Scolipede throws at it except +2 Rock Slides. For now, just mention Swords Dance in the AC of the offensive spikes set. It may distract from setting up Spikes, but there are a few situations where having a choice between setting up Spikes or SD have been useful for me (depending mostly on whether or not Spikes affects enough of the opposing team to be worth it). I'll come back and look at this when I get home from work, or else look at it at work. :)
  7. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent Yeah, well. The Dude abides
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    I meant in the overview, where it says "common weaknesses like jonx" but thats unimportant.

    I really cannot agree however that Sash is a waste of Scolipede's potential. Scolipede is simply not a bulky Pokemon when taking its pure base stats into consideration, as well as its stealth rock weakness and the fire and flying ones. I have always found offensive scolipede to shine the most right at the beginning of the game, and your LO set also has less survivabilty than the focus sash one. Sash also lets pede get into swarm range for free, and is the item which damn near guarantees two levels of hazards. Scolipede's Speed and Swords Dance mean that the sash set can often go on a minisweep right an the beginning of the game: if you see in team preview that that is not the case, then you use your sash to set up hazards. How to explain it... it's sorta similar double dance terrakion, in that from TP you can foresee what move you should use: swords dance or spikes.

    Scolipede is still a fine user of Life Orb, but I personally prefer using that with Swords Dance and not Spikes. LO with spikes practically never sets up more than one layer because itll just get killed off; I'd rather the set was dedicated to pure offensive power with LO and SD

    tl;dr

    In my opinion the first set ought to have Swords Dance over Spikes, as ScraftyIsTheBest said, and an additional sash set with spikes/megahorn/aqua tail/swords dance needs to be added. top players like hotncold also regard it as scolipede's best set
  8. tennisace

    tennisace brock you like a hurricane
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    I had a long bit here written up agreeing with EBeast and Treecko, but then I deleted it because I realized something.

    Honestly, the problem with the first set is that you can run about oh, I don't know, 10 different variations of it and they're all effective in their own way. The only constants should be Megahorn and Spikes, as they're the two most commonly used moves on Scolipede. Hell, I've used at least 4 different variations of the first set and they're all good. As long as in the writeup, it's emphasized that there is no wrong way to use the set as long as you use Megahorn and Spikes, then you can throw whatever you want into AC. Life Orb should be the first option though, but Focus Sash should be slashed, and Swords Dance should be Slashed on the 4th move instead of Pursuit (Pursuit isn't even listed in the !usage move thingy, it's under other).

    On the SubSalac Set, Baton Pass should be the primary option because a +2 Swarm Megahorn does cool things like OHKOing Golurk anyway, the coverage isn't really needed.

    Haven't played with the bulky set yet but that looks fine.

    NOW CAN WE PLEASE ALL GET ALONG.
  9. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent Yeah, well. The Dude abides
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    name: Offensive Spikes
    move 1: Spikes
    move 2: Megahorn
    move 3: Aqua Tail
    move 4: Rock Slide / Swords Dance
    item: Life Orb / Focus Sash
    ability: Swarm
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe

    so this? sounds like a compromise. i'd still push for sash and SD getting the primary slashes, but as long as they're there on the actual set i'm content. and we're getting along man :> debating and arguing about sets is the most fun part of C&C
  10. tennisace

    tennisace brock you like a hurricane
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    Yep, there you go :> I'll give this a formal stamp once everyone comes to some sort of an agreement on other stuff being debated itt.
  11. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
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    The compromise set is good, just make sure to add Pursuit to AC and say that it's a good option for the last slot when using Life Orb. I would also make sure that Set Comments has a point saying that Rock Slide and Swords Dance can go with Life Orb but only Swords Dance should go along with Sash.

    As for Life Orb Spikes it definitely does not have less survivability than Sash. I have never had trouble getting up at least 2 layers of Spikes while still being able to pose as an offensive threat. I've had my tutee tell me that he often finds himself too busy attacking to set up Spikes often, but maybe it's just how I play that I get it to work idk.

    In the Overview you should also add that Scolipede is very versatile, its Offensive Spikes set by itself a bunch of variations and it can still pull off Bulky Spikes and SubSD successfully. There is an extra space between [SET] and Offensive Spikes that should be removed too.
  12. Punchshroom

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    Mono-attacking sets can use Bug Gem well, in the event that they aren't Subbing, Spiking or stuff and actually need to attack.

    Edit: Bug Gem could go on OO I guess, outlining both its pros and its cons.
  13. ebeast

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    SubSD needs its Salac Berry to make it worthwhile, otherwise it's being outsped by common Scarf Pokemon. BulkySD has no use of Bug Gem either when Black Sludge is much more useful and its main objective is not to deal damage anyways. I don't see the reason to have Bug Gem anywhere at all. The Offensive Spikes set can just use Swords Dance if it wants to hit hard and while Life Orb has that recoil, it's worth having consistent power with all of its attacks.
  14. Aasgier

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    I use Bug Gem on offensive Spikes Scolipede with quite a bit of success. Scolipede won't attack often anyway (too busy setting Spikes), and in many matches it only attacks once, in which case the extra power of the Bug Gem is really appreciated at times, while Life Orb really cuts in Scolipede's (already short) lifespan, which is not always appreciated. Ofcourse that shortened lifespan does not matter against Braviary, for example, but it does against things that cannot OHKO Scolipede.
  15. ebeast

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    For Bulky SD's AC mention that all of those Pokemon especially love Toxic Spikes because it lets them own their counters (Rock mons for SubBU Brav, Seis and Tang for Costa, Tang, Alomomola, insert klang counters here for Klang)

    Rename SubSalac to: CrashinBoomBang (SubSalac) <- most important thing in this post (serious)

    me gusta
    [qc]1/3[/qc]
  16. tennisace

    tennisace brock you like a hurricane
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    [​IMG]

    2/3

    seconding all of ebeasts changes

    all of them.
  17. Hollywood

    Hollywood time to pay!
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    ALL
    OF
    THEM

    done and done will write this up I guess

















    n_n
  18. Worldtour

    Worldtour left: Hitmonchan right: rest of RU
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    erm... why would you change the SubSalac's name? It's not really exclusively his set either and I don't think other people would get it. RU didn't name it anything fancy either.
  19. Hollywood

    Hollywood time to pay!
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    QC TOLD ME TO
  20. Ginku

    Ginku Farbenprächtig
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    lol cbb is shit
  21. MMF

    MMF Give me the strength to part this sea

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    Suck it
  22. Hollywood

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    this is written and ready for its third QC check
  23. Raseri

    Raseri musharna fan
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    pls dont list all its weaknesses in the overview that doesnt tell me anything other than it has a lot of them
    bug gem AC in offensive set, i think it lets you OHKO mush for sure so move it out of OO
    also the last set isnt called crashinboombang sorry thats a bad name

    3/3 gj treecko
  24. col49

    col49 unpolished
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    Hey, not really a big deal, but in the AC of the Bulky Spikes set I think this
    might want to be rephrased in a manner that doesn't seem to insinuate that Charizard has a base Speed of 101 '~' Also I don't know if arbitrary chance to KO a 'mon is standard process, would it be out of the question to bump up the Atk investment to 52 EVs in order to make it a guaranteed 2HKO after SR? The defense investment seems to not be aiming for surviving any particular attack, so I'd imagine the extra 16 EVs could be taken from there, though if it is and I'm just misinterpreting a spread of 200 HP / 52 Atk / 88 Def / 168 Spe yields the same physical bulk and minimizes hazard damage. Sorry for hassle :x
  25. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
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    What do you mean? Get a guaranteed 2HKO on what after SR? 36 Atk gets 51% min damage on Charizard for the KO after SR while the extra 16 EVs don't help Scolipede KO either Simipour or Simisage any easier. I do agree however that that sentence needs to be rephrased. I would like it to be rephrased to: The Speed EVs allow Scolipede to outspeed base 101 and lower Speed Pokemon, including Simisage, Simipour, Simisear, and Charizard, and hit them for heavy damage or set up more extra hazards before they can attack.

    Then the following sentence should include Charizard as a mon that 36 Atk helps KO. Also don't worry about Raseri, CrashinBoomBang is a great name for a set. :koko:

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