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Simisage (Substitute + 3 Attacks)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Zebraiken, Nov 27, 2012.

  1. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken what's important
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    [​IMG][​IMG]

    Simisage

    qc'd: raz dongle mmerf
    gp'd: oglemi

    [SET]
    name: Substitute + 3 Attacks
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Superpower
    move 4: Hidden Power Rock
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Overgrow
    nature: Hasty
    evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set is built to force a Pokemon that Simisage threatens out and set up a Substitute, then to take advantage of Simisage's solid coverage and high Speed. With the release of Overgrow, Simisage pulls this set off much better than its only real competition, Serperior. It has extra coverage with Superpower and is significantly stronger than Serperior, flaunting the ability to OHKO 4/0 Samurott without needing Overgrow active. Unlike Serperior, Simisage is slower than Scolipede—which seems like it could be an issue, but Simisage can set up a Substitute on the switch-in and OHKO the incoming Scolipede with Hidden Power Rock after Stealth Rock damage. Simisage actually finds quite a number of opportunities to set up a Substitute despite its mediocre bulk, since many Rock-, Ground-, and Water-type Pokemon won't even bother trying to stay in on Simisage, giving you a free turn to do so. Using Substitute and Life Orb together might seem like a bad idea because they both rack up self inflicted damage, but it gives Simisage the ability to easily manipulate its remaining HP and push itself into Overgrow range if it needs the power for the next attack. Substitute also allows it to evade Sucker Punch from the likes of Skuntank and Cacturne, though you probably don't want to stay in on the former if you can avoid it.</p>

    <p>When in Overgrow range, Giga Drain packs a surprising amount of power and allows Simisage to make up for the recoil from Life Orb and Substitute. Superpower provides coverage on Steel-types as well as hitting most Grass- and Dragon-types neutrally. It also nails Skuntank, who is a pain in the rear to deal with when Simisage lacks Superpower. Superpower is used instead of Focus Blast because it allows Simisage to 2HKO Regice and Lickilicky on the switch and because it's actually accurate (after all, who actually likes using Focus Blast?). Hidden Power Rock OHKOes Scolipede after Stealth Rock damage, and covers pesky Fire- and Flying-types that resist Simisage's STAB. This set performs admirably mid- to late-game, especially once entry hazards have been set up, since Simisage can punch through nearly all of its checks after some hazard damage.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Simisage should always be running the above spread. Investing in bulk is simply not worth it because it isn't going to be taking any significant neutral hits, and going any slower means that it will lose out on tying with fellow monkeys Simisear and Simipour and outrunning dangerous Pokemon such as Charizard. Modest might be an enticing option, but it means that Simisage cannot outrun a ton of Pokemon, including Kangaskhan, Zangoose, Jynx, Primeape, Sawsbuck, and Swanna. The small boost in power isn't worth losing most of those match-ups, especially now that the base 95 Speed tier has become so prevalent in NU. If you're not a fan of stacking recoil damage, you can opt for Leftovers instead of Life Orb, but Simisage becomes significantly weaker and the recovery is somewhat redundant with Giga Drain. Leftovers can help if you're in a hole late-game and can't afford to take the extra recoil, but in most scenarios you'll want to stick to Life Orb.</p>

    <p>Stealth Rock support is necessary for this set to function effectively, as it allows Simisage to cleanly OHKO both Swellow and Scolipede upon switching in. Most common Stealth Rock users have a natural synergy with Simisage anyway, as they usually resist Fire-, Flying-, and Poison-type moves and help check the faster Pokemon that otherwise bother Simisage. Regirock is a particularly good teammate, as it can reliably switch in on essentially every Pokemon that threatens Simisage, and can paralyze them to make Simisage's job easier. Pokemon that can bust through Poison-types make for good teammates, since Simisage simply cannot do that on its own. Ground-types such as Golurk, Golem, and Piloswine are good options for this and can also help Simisage deal with the fast Electric-types that can otherwise get annoying such as Zebstrika and Choice Scarf Rotom-S. Piloswine is also a safe bet against Rotom-F, who beats the other two Ground-types and can hit Simisage super effectively with Hidden Power Ice or Blizzard. A Scolipede or Garbodor of your own can easily stack up Spikes on nearly every Poison-type in NU (be wary that they can easily do the same to Scolipede and Garbodor, though) and also absorb Toxic Spikes, which are really obnoxious for Simisage to deal with.</p>

    <p>Swellow and Braviary can U-turn out of incoming Rock-types and Alomomola and give Simisage free turns to set up Substitutes. Both Pokemon also ream Vileplume and Roselia, who can switch into Simisage incredibly easily and OHKO it with Sludge Bomb. Simisage also can't break through some of the bulkier Pokemon in the tier that are neutral to or resist its coverage moves; Musharna and Ludicolo are next to impossible for it to beat, as are most bulky Grass-types. Anything with a strong Bug-type move would be ideal, but since NU lacks good Bug-types outside of Pinsir and Scolipede, it's best to opt for powerful hitters like Life Orb Jynx or Choice Band Primeape as teammates. Jynx in particular appreciates Simisage's ability to lure in Lickilicky and Regice and deal heavy damage with Superpower, while Primeape can U-turn into Simisage when faced with Alomomola (and can use Earthquake to serve as an excellent Poison-type lure!).</p>
  2. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    maybe including a calc of what it does to Amoonguss is worth it?
    i think you have enough teammates listed, just make sure you explain what makes them good! :)
    [qc]1/3[/qc]
  3. Django

    Django
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    very nice how much

    [qc]2/3[/qc]
  4. MMF

    MMF Give me the strength to part this sea

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    QC approved 3/3


    TEE HEE
  5. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken what's important
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    this is written; i'd like another qc member to check over it and make sure it's relevant and updated to the current meta, as well as nitpick anything i've written in there (like if you want additional team member mentions, if you want me to specify anything, etc). after that i'll move it into GP and finally get it on-site.

    edit: shit it's MOSTLY written except for like one part where i couldn't figure out the wording but i'll address that before GP, please check it for quality anyway
  6. ebeast

    ebeast she's probably sexting nprtprt
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    If you're looking for a way to word this: Using Substitute and Life Orb together might seem like a bad idea because [stacking self inflicted damage]...

    how about: Using Substitute and Life Orb together might seem like a bad idea because they both rack up self inflicted damage

    In the second paragraph of AC: . Ground-types such as Golurk, Golem, and Piloswine are good options for this and can also help Simisage deal with the fast Electric-types, such as Zebstrika or Choice Scarf Rotom-F, that can otherwise get annoying.

    ~ Piloswine can take on Scarf Rotom-F, but Golurk and Golem definitely not since Rotom-F is more likely to go for its Ice-type STAB, be it HP Ice or Blizzard, against Simisage rather than Volt Switch. Probably changing the mention to Scarf Rotom-S instead would be fine. You can also add how Piloswine is also a safe bet vs Rotom-F unlike Golurk and Golem.

    Everything else looks fine to me.
  7. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken what's important
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    thanks a lot ebeast!! i'm putting it in gp now

    (be aware that it's probably riddled with many odd errors)
  8. Rohail

    Rohail Vaporeon <3
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    Amcheck :) (Hopefully GP will like this one) Yay my first stamped Amcheck! :)
    ADD
    REMOVE
    COMMENTS

    Diff Amcheck (open)
    [SET]
    name: Substitute + 3 Attacks
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Superpower
    move 4: Hidden Power Rock / Hidden Power Ice
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Overgrow
    nature: Hasty
    evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set is built to force a Pokemon that Simisage threatens out and set up a Substitute, then to take advantage of Simisage's solid coverage and high Speed. With the release of Overgrow, extra coverage, and noticeably more power, Simisage pulls this set off much better than its only real competition, Serperior. It has extra coverage with Superpower and is significantly stronger than Serperior (I'm not quite sure if this change is necessary, so I'll let the GP decide, only implement it if you think it fits better.), flaunting the ability to OHKO 4/0 Samurott without needing Overgrow to be active. Unlike Serperior, Simisage is slower than Scolipede—which seems like it could be an issue, but Simisage can set up a Substitute on the switch-in and OHKO the incoming Scolipede with Hidden Power Rock after Stealth Rock Ddamage. Despite its mediocre bulk, Simisage actually finds quite a number of opportunities to set up a Substitute despite its mediocre bulk, since many Rock-, Ground-, and Water-type Pokemon won't even bother trying to stay in on Simisage and will instead switch out, giving you a free turn to do so. Using Substitute and Life Orb together might seem like a bad idea because they both rack up self inflicted damage, but it gives Simisage the ability to easily manipulate its remaining HP and push itself into Overgrow range if it needs the power for the next attack. Substitute also allows it to evade Sucker Punch from the likes of Skuntank and Cacturne, though you probably don't want to stay in on the former if you can avoid it.</p>

    <p>When in Overgrow range, Giga Drain packs a surprising amount of power and allows Simisage to make up for the extra damagecoil from Life Orb and Substitute. Superpower provides coverage on Steel-types as well as hitting most Grass- and Dragon-types neutrally. It also nails Skuntank, who is a pain in the rear to deal with when Simisage lacks Superpower. Superpower is used instead of Focus Blast because it allows Simisage to 2HKO Regice and Lickilicky on the switch-in, and because it's actually accurate (after all, who actually likes using Focus Blast?). Hidden Power Rock OHKOes Scolipede after Stealth Rock damage, and covers pesky Fire- and Flying-types that resist Simisage's STAB. This set performs admirably mid- to late-game, especially once entry hazards have gonebeen set up, since Simisage can punch through nearly all of its checks after some hazard damage.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Simisage should always be running thise spread above. Investing in bulk is simply not worth it because it isn't going to be taking any significant neutral hits, and going any slower means that it will lose out on speed tying wits fellow monkeysh Simisear and Simipour and outrunning dangerous Pokemon such as Charizard. Modest might be an enticing option, but it means that Simisage cannot outrun a ton of Pokemon, including Kangaskhan, Zangoose, Jynx, Primeape, Sawsbuck, and Swanna. The small boost in power isn't worth losing most of those matchups, especially now that the base 95 Speed tier has become so prevalent in NU. If you're not a fan of stacking recoil damage, you can opt for Leftovers instead of Life Orb, but Simisage becomes significantly weaker and the recovery is somewhat redundant with Giga Drain. Lefto; howevers, can help if you're in a hole late-game and can't afford to take the extra recoil, but in most scenarios you'll want to stick to Life Orb.</p>

    <p>Stealth Rock support is necessary for this set to function effectively, as it allows Simisage to cleanly OHKO both Swellow and Scolipede upon the switch-in. Most common Stealth Rock users have a naturaldecenttyping synergy with Simisage anyway, asince they usually resist Fire-, Flying-, and Poison-type moves and help check the faster Pokemon that otherwise bother Simisage. Regirock is a particularly good teammate, asince it can reliably switch in on essentially every Pokemon that threatens Simisage, and can even paralyze switch-insthem to make Simisage's job easier. Pokemon that can bust through Poison-types make for good teammates, since Simisage simply cannot do that on its own. Ground-types such as Golurk, Golem, and Piloswine are good options for this and can also help Simisage deal with the fast Electric-types that can otherwise get annoying, such as Zebstrika or Choice Scarf Rotom-S, that can otherwise get annoying. Piloswine is also a safe bet against Rotom-F, who beats the other two Ground-types and can hit Simisage super effectively with Hidden Power Ice (Never use acronyms anywhere in the analysis unless its the set name.) or Blizzard. A Scolipede or Garbodor of your own can easily stack up Spikes on nearly every Poison-type in NU (be wary that they can easily do the same to Scolipede and Garbodor, though!) and also absorb Toxic Spikes, which are really obnoxious for Simisage to deal with.</p>

    <p>Swellow and Braviary can U-turn out of incoming Rock-types and Alomomola, and give Simisage free turns to set up Substitutes. Both Pokemon also reamdeal with Vileplume and Roselia, who can switch into Simisage incredibly easily and OHKO it with Sludge Bomb. Simisage also can't break through some of the bulkier Pokemon in the tier that are neutral to or resist its coverage moves; Musharna and Ludicolo are next to impossible for it to beat, as are most bulky Grass-types. Anything with a strong Bug-type move would be ideal, but since NU lacks good Bug-types outside of Pinsir and Scolipede, it's best to opt for powerful hitters like Life Orb Jynx or Choice Band Primeape as teammates. Jynx in particular appreciates Simisage's ability to lure in Lickilicky and Regice andfor Simisage to deal heavy damage with Superpower, while Primeape can U-turn into Simisage when faced with Alomomola (and can use Earthquake to serve as an excellent Poison-type lure!).</p>


    C/P (open)
    [SET]
    name: Substitute + 3 Attacks
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Superpower
    move 4: Hidden Power Rock / Hidden Power Ice
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Overgrow
    nature: Hasty
    evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set is built to force a Pokemon that Simisage threatens out and set up a Substitute, then to take advantage of Simisage's solid coverage and high Speed. With the release of Overgrow, extra coverage, and noticeably more power, Simisage pulls this set off much better than its only real competition, Serperior, flaunting the ability to OHKO 4/0 Samurott without needing Overgrow to be active. Unlike Serperior, Simisage is slower than Scolipede—which seems like it could be an issue, but Simisage can set up a Substitute on the switch-in and OHKO the incoming Scolipede with Hidden Power Rock after Stealth Rock damage. Despite its mediocre bulk, Simisage actually finds quite a number of opportunities to set up a Substitute, since many Rock-, Ground-, and Water-type Pokemon won't even bother trying to stay in on Simisage, giving you a free turn to do so. Using Substitute and Life Orb together might seem like a bad idea because they both rack up self inflicted damage, but it gives Simisage the ability to easily manipulate its remaining HP and push itself into Overgrow range if it needs the power for the next attack. Substitute also allows it to evade Sucker Punch from the likes of Skuntank and Cacturne, though you probably don't want to stay in on the former if you can avoid it.</p>

    <p>When in Overgrow range, Giga Drain packs a surprising amount of power and allows Simisage to make up for the recoil from Life Orb and Substitute. Superpower provides coverage on Steel-types as well as hitting most Grass- and Dragon-types neutrally. It also nails Skuntank, who is a pain in the rear to deal with when Simisage lacks Superpower. Superpower is used instead of Focus Blast because it allows Simisage to 2HKO Regice and Lickilicky on the switch, and it's actually accurate (after all, who actually likes using Focus Blast?). Hidden Power Rock OHKOes Scolipede after Stealth Rock damage, and covers pesky Fire- and Flying-types that resist Simisage's STAB. This set performs admirably mid- to late-game, especially once entry hazards have been set up, since Simisage can punch through nearly all of its checks after some hazard damage.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Simisage should always be running the spread above. Investing in bulk is simply not worth it because it isn't going to be taking any significant neutral hits, and going any slower means that it will lose out on speed tying with Simisear and Simipour and outrunning dangerous Pokemon such as Charizard. Modest might be an enticing option, but it means that Simisage cannot outrun a ton of Pokemon, including Kangaskhan, Zangoose, Jynx, Primeape, Sawsbuck, and Swanna. The small boost in power isn't worth losing most of those matchups, especially now that the base 95 Speed tier has become so prevalent in NU. If you're not a fan of stacking recoil damage, you can opt for Leftovers instead of Life Orb, but Simisage becomes significantly weaker and the recovery is somewhat redundant with Giga Drain; however, can help if you're in a hole late-game and can't afford to take the extra recoil, but in most scenarios you'll want to stick to Life Orb.</p>

    <p>Stealth Rock support is necessary for this set to function effectively, as it allows Simisage to cleanly OHKO both Swellow and Scolipede on the switch. Most common Stealth Rock users have decent synergy with Simisage anyway, as they usually resist Fire-, Flying-, and Poison-type moves and help check the faster Pokemon that otherwise bother Simisage. Regirock is a particularly good teammate, as it can reliably switch in on essentially every Pokemon that threatens Simisage, and can even paralyze them to make Simisage's job easier. Pokemon that can bust through Poison-types make for good teammates, since Simisage simply cannot do that on its own. Ground-types such as Golurk, Golem, and Piloswine are good options for this and can also help Simisage deal with fast Electric-types that can otherwise get annoying, such as Zebstrika or Choice Scarf Rotom-S. Piloswine is also a safe bet against Rotom-F, who beats the other two Ground-types and can hit Simisage super effectively with Hidden Power Ice or Blizzard. A Scolipede or Garbodor of your own can easily stack up Spikes on nearly every Poison-type in NU (be wary that they can easily do the same to Scolipede and Garbodor, though) and also absorb Toxic Spikes, which are really obnoxious for Simisage to deal with.</p>

    <p>Swellow and Braviary can U-turn out of incoming Rock-types and Alomomola, and give Simisage free turns to set up Substitutes. Both Pokemon also deal with Vileplume and Roselia, who can switch into Simisage incredibly easily and OHKO it with Sludge Bomb. Simisage also can't break through some of the bulkier Pokemon in the tier that are neutral to or resist its coverage moves; Musharna and Ludicolo are next to impossible for it to beat, as are most bulky Grass-types. Anything with a strong Bug-type move would be ideal, but since NU lacks good Bug-types outside of Pinsir and Scolipede, it's best to opt for powerful hitters like Life Orb Jynx or Choice Band Primeape as teammates. Jynx in particular appreciates Simisage's ability to lure in Lickilicky and Regice for Simisage to deal heavy damage with Superpower, while Primeape can U-turn into Simisage when faced with Alomomola (and can use Earthquake to serve as an excellent Poison-type lure).</p>
  9. SpareAacount

    SpareAacount

    Joined:
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    I just noticed that you have HP Ice as a slash on the main set, but you never mention it in the Set Comments section.
  10. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken what's important
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    I made the changes I liked and adjusted the set, thanks guys.
  11. Oglemi

    Oglemi We broke it. Yes, we were naughty. Completely naughty.
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    Show Hide
    [SET]
    name: Substitute + 3 Attacks
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Giga Drain
    move 3: Superpower
    move 4: Hidden Power Rock
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Overgrow
    nature: Hasty
    evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set is built to force a Pokemon that Simisage threatens out and set up a Substitute, then to take advantage of Simisage's solid coverage and high Speed. With the release of Overgrow, Simisage pulls this set off much better than its only real competition, Serperior. It has extra coverage with Superpower and is significantly stronger than Serperior, flaunting the ability to OHKO 4/0 Samurott without needing Overgrow active. Unlike Serperior, Simisage is slower than Scolipede—which seems like it could be an issue, but Simisage can set up a Substitute on the switch-in and OHKO the incoming Scolipede with Hidden Power Rock after Stealth Rock damage. Simisage actually finds quite a number of opportunities to set up a Substitute despite its mediocre bulk, since many Rock-, Ground-, and Water-type Pokemon won't even bother trying to stay in on Simisage, giving you a free turn to do so. Using Substitute and Life Orb together might seem like a bad idea because they both rack up self inflicted damage, but it gives Simisage the ability to easily manipulate its remaining HP and push itself into Overgrow range if it needs the power for the next attack. Substitute also allows it to evade Sucker Punch from the likes of Skuntank and Cacturne, though you probably don't want to stay in on the former if you can avoid it.</p>

    <p>When in Overgrow range, Giga Drain packs a surprising amount of power and allows Simisage to make up for the recoil from Life Orb and Substitute. Superpower provides coverage on Steel-types as well as hitting most Grass- and Dragon-types neutrally. It also nails Skuntank, who is a pain in the rear to deal with when Simisage lacks Superpower. Superpower is used instead of Focus Blast because it allows Simisage to 2HKO Regice and Lickilicky on the switch and because it's actually accurate (after all, who actually likes using Focus Blast?). Hidden Power Rock OHKOes Scolipede after Stealth Rock damage and covers pesky Fire- and Flying-types that resist Simisage's STAB. This set performs admirably mid- to late-game, especially once entry hazards have been set up, since Simisage can punch through nearly all of its checks after some hazard damage.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Simisage should always be running the above spread. Investing in bulk is simply not worth it because it isn't going to be taking any significant neutral hits, and going any slower means that it will lose out on tying with fellow monkeys Simisear and Simipour and outrunning dangerous Pokemon such as Charizard. Modest might be an enticing option, but it means that Simisage cannot outrun a ton of Pokemon, including Kangaskhan, Zangoose, Jynx, Primeape, Sawsbuck, and Swanna. The small boost in power isn't worth losing most of those match-ups, especially now that the base 95 Speed tier has become so prevalent in NU. If you're not a fan of stacking recoil damage, you can opt for Leftovers instead of Life Orb, but Simisage becomes significantly weaker and the recovery is somewhat redundant with Giga Drain. Leftovers can help if you're in a hole late-game and can't afford to take the extra recoil, but in most scenarios you'll want to stick to Life Orb.</p>

    <p>Stealth Rock support is necessary for this set to function effectively, as it allows Simisage to cleanly OHKO both Swellow and Scolipede upon switching in. Most common Stealth Rock users have a natural synergy with Simisage anyway, as they usually resist Fire-, Flying-, and Poison-type moves and help check the faster Pokemon that otherwise bother Simisage. Regirock is a particularly good teammate, as it can reliably switch in on essentially every Pokemon that threatens Simisage, and can paralyze them to make Simisage's job easier. Pokemon that can bust through Poison-types make for good teammates, since Simisage simply cannot do that on its own. Ground-types such as Golurk, Golem, and Piloswine are good options for this and can also help Simisage deal with the fast Electric-types that can otherwise get annoying such as Zebstrika and Choice Scarf Rotom-S. Piloswine is also a safe bet against Rotom-F, who beats the other two Ground-types and can hit Simisage super effectively with Hidden Power Ice or Blizzard. A Scolipede or Garbodor of your own can easily stack up Spikes on nearly every Poison-type in NU (be wary that they can easily do the same to Scolipede and Garbodor, though) and also absorb Toxic Spikes, which are really obnoxious for Simisage to deal with.</p>

    <p>Swellow and Braviary can U-turn out of incoming Rock-types and Alomomola and give Simisage free turns to set up Substitutes. Both Pokemon also ream Vileplume and Roselia, who can switch into Simisage incredibly easily and OHKO it with Sludge Bomb. Simisage also can't break through some of the bulkier Pokemon in the tier that are neutral to or resist its coverage moves; Musharna and Ludicolo are next to impossible for it to beat, as are most bulky Grass-types. Anything with a strong Bug-type move would be ideal, but since NU lacks good Bug-types outside of Pinsir and Scolipede, it's best to opt for powerful hitters like Life Orb Jynx or Choice Band Primeape as teammates. Jynx in particular appreciates Simisage's ability to lure in Lickilicky and Regice and deal heavy damage with Superpower, while Primeape can U-turn into Simisage when faced with Alomomola (and can use Earthquake to serve as an excellent Poison-type lure!).</p>


    i'm just gonna call this good

    [gp]2/2[/gp]
  12. Zebraiken

    Zebraiken what's important
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    Alrighty, thanks!

    This is ready to be uploaded, rizzlerazzle. :)
  13. Raseri

    Raseri here to help
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    rofl i was hoping this would take a whole year, Linoone time???

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