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Slow & Steady Wins the Race (UU Bulky Offense)

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by PTJon7, Mar 30, 2013.

  1. PTJon7

    PTJon7

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    553
    Got a new team here I just made, and so far I'm really happy with it. I've recently been intrigued by the idea of bulky offense, how it requires a lot of synergy and typing advantages. I decided to whip up a team and after a few test games I think its pretty solid. I'm just interested to see if anyone has input on ways to improve it before I use it further. So without further ado:

    THE TEAM

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]


    EDIT: I think I have made enough changes to justify reviving this thread, I'd appreciate any further input on it. I've noticed the biggest threat to my team is NP Togekiss, which can pretty much sweep my team after setting up.

    Roserade

    [​IMG]
    Roserade @ Life Orb
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 168 HP / 252 SAtk / 88 Spd
    Modest Nature
    • Giga Drain
    • Sludge Bomb
    • Spikes
    • Synthesis
    **This change was suggested by Silvershadow234. As much as I like Nidoqueen, I needed a reliable way to beat bulky water types. Roserade packs a huge punch with a Life Orb, and can also help support the team through placing Spikes. I initially had Sleep Powder over Spikes but I changed it due to my dislike of low accuracy moves. The speed EVs are to be able to outspeed uninvested base 100 pokemon, which I'll admit are fairly uncommon. Even though Roserade has two attacking moves they cover a pretty good portion of the tier, with Sludge Bomb hitting a whole lot of things very hard. I think this change has been for the best, though I do miss Nidoqueen at times.


    Cofagrigus

    [​IMG]
    Cofagrigus @ Leftovers
    Trait: Mummy
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SAtk
    Quiet Nature
    • Shadow Ball
    • Hidden Power [Fighting]
    • Trick Room
    • Nasty Plot
    Offensive Trick Room Cofagrigus is a very interesting pokemon in my opinion. It often catches team completely off guard, but the majority of the time it won't sweep significant portions of opposing teams. The common problems I run into when using OTR Cofagrigus are Toxic and special walls (and the combination of the two). Even after multiple Nasty Plots things like Umbreon can stall Cofagrigus out, and since Cofagrigus gets Toxiced often, Cofagrigus is usually stalled to death. This isn't necessarily bad however, as even if Cofagrigus dies, there are plenty of slow things on this team to take advantage of the remaining Trick Room turns. Cofagrigus is also a great counter to Fighting types, and having a Ghost type helps deter opposing Hi Jump Kicks from getting spammed.


    Piloswine

    [​IMG]
    Piloswine @ Eviolite
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
    Adamant Nature
    • Icicle Spear
    • Earthquake
    • Ice Shard
    • Stealth Rock
    Piloswine is one of the most underrated and under used threats in UU. It can tank hits extremely well and still be able to get kills. Piloswine is also an amazing counter to the Electric types of the tier. Sub CM Raikou can not touch Piloswine and Piloswine can even take a Specs Aura Sphere and OHKO with an Earthquake. The only move that Zapdos runs that threatens Piloswine is HP Grass, which Piloswine can take pretty well then KO with a combination of Icicle Spear and Ice Shard. Piloswine also nabs a lot of cheap kills on Fire types, as people often do not realize (until its too late) that Piloswine is neutral to Fire. Piloswine also serves the important job of the teams Stealth Rocker.


    Scrafty

    [​IMG]
    Scrafty @ Leftovers
    Trait: Shed Skin
    EVs: 232 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SDef / 20 Spd
    Careful Nature
    • Drain Punch
    • Crunch
    • Substitute
    • Bulk Up
    **I ended up changing CB Scrafty to Bulk Up after using this set on another team and loving it. Scrafty can set up so easily against walls, and they can most often not do anything to stop it. Scrafty is also my 100% counter to Umbreon, as Foul Play does rediculously low damage, regardless of how many boosts Scrafty gets. Scrafty's surprising bulk also helps out in general with getting kills. I do find that Scrafty really lacks power even after a boost or two, but I think that bulk it more important in the long run.


    Snorlax

    [​IMG]
    Snorlax @ Leftovers
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 80 HP / 252 Atk / 172 SDef / 4 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    • Body Slam
    • Earthquake
    • Crunch
    • Pursuit
    **Druddigon ended up replacing Snorlax due to Snorlax's general awesomeness in UU. Snorlax serves an my main Chandelure counter and can tank all special hits very well. I opted Leftovers instead of Choice Band because I didn't like the idea of getting choice locked into Pursuit or Body Slam, as both can be taken advantage of easily. This is also one of the only things on the team that can stand up to a Rotom-H, a Specs varient one destroyed my entire team with Overheat and Thunderbolt.


    Slowbro

    [​IMG]
    Slowbro @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 SAtk / 8 Spd
    Modest Nature
    • Scald
    • Psyshock
    • Grass Knot
    • Trick
    **I finally ended up finding a good replacement for Suicune: Choice Specs Slowbro. Slowbro is my go to pokemon to take on Fire types like Victini and Darmanitan, and a good backup for dealing with Fighting types if Cofagrigus can't. Grass Knot is mostly just for other bulky Water types, but it often doesn't do very much. Its presence is still quite useful however, and can also let Slowbro get an easy kill on Swampert. Trick is also very useful for crippling walls or physical attackers on the opposing team, and can help give me opportunities to set up with Cofagrigus or Scrafty.


    Alright, thanks for reading and I'd really appreciate any input or advice on how to make this team better.
  2. dcae

    dcae naughty list

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    Hey there this seems like a really fun team. I'm on my phone so I can't put in fancy stuff, but looking at it the synergy seems to be top notch. Regarding the Suicune set, I've never something quite like that, so I can't judge its effectiveness, but since it seems to be the thing on your team that can absorb boosted water attacks, I propose going for a Crocune set. Also, I can see Mienshao being thorn in the side for this team, especially with Cofragrigus having no recovery. Without testing I cannot be sure, but I would also try out a more defensive variant of Cofragrigus to combat that threat. Hope I helped and good luck!
  3. NfskMjmMal

    NfskMjmMal

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    Messages:
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    Your team looks great. It makes a little more sense to me to switch the items on Scrafty and Druddigon. Druddigon's attack is a bit higher, and Scrafty has access to Dragon Dance and Bulk Up, both of which are great. If you do end up doing that, I think your Druddigon doesn't really have to change, and you could use perhaps Bulk Up to replace Zen Headbutt on Scrafty. That kind of leaves you with two problems: Psychic coverage and your Suicune, if you're unsure about it. I think having a specially defensive Suicune works well for your team, but I also think I could solve both of those problems at the same time with this:

    Slowbro @ Leftovers
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 248 HP / 244 Def / 16 SpA
    Bold Nature

    -Calm Mind
    -Scald
    -Psyshock
    -Slack Off

    Hope I helped!
  4. PTJon7

    PTJon7

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    553
    Hey thanks for the advice guys, I really appreciate it!

    Mienshao could definitely be a threat to this team Dcae, which is why I'm thinking replacing Suicune with Nfsk's CM Slowbro.

    I've noticed this team is pretty weak to Chandelure, so I'm thinking about adding Snorlax. Any idea on what to replace?
    Edit: Ended up replacing Druddigon, working pretty well so far.
  5. Godsend

    Godsend

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    Oct 1, 2009
    Messages:
    369
    Snorlax seems like a good addition. LO Roserade also seems like it would be a pain in the ass too. Nice team, I like Piloswine.
  6. BrokenMusicBox

    BrokenMusicBox

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    Mar 4, 2013
    Messages:
    31
    Snorlax or Porygon2 would be good choices to counter Chandelure. I think Porgyon2 would be a better choice, as Snorlax would be 1HKO'd by Darmanitan when using Superpower. Porygon2, however is 2HKO with nearly half its health left. Plus, you have a chance of paralyzing him with Discharge.

    Porygon2
    Item: Eviolite
    Ability: Download/Analytic
    Nature: Modest/Quiet
    EVs: 252 HP/4 Def/252 SpA
    Moveset:
    -Tri-Attack
    -Ice Beam
    -Discharge
    -Recover
  7. PTJon7

    PTJon7

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    Hell yea Godsend Piloswines awesome.

    Oh yea P2 didn't occur to me, thanks I'll check it out.
  8. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    Mentor

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    Hi there! This looks like a pretty cool team you have here, I especially like the use of piloswine and CB scrafty. Also, don't use Download P2 to counter chandy, as it is 2HKO'd by specs fire blast. Cofagrigus is also one of the best counter to mienshao in the tier, so I don't know why you'd struggle against it at all.

    The biggest weakness IMO is to bulky water types, as well as grass types. Slowbro and Suicune especially can tank almost everything from your team(apart from CB crunch in slowbro's case). As godsend pointed out, roserade also looks like a rather big problem, as STAB Leaf Storm and Sludge Bomb gets excellent coverage against everything on your team, and it has the bulk to tank hits from suicune for days(this is considering you use Snorlax over Druddigon).

    Therefore, I recommend running an offensive roserade of your own to help deal with grass types as well as help out against bulky water types. Rade 4X resists grass attacks, giving you a solid switch in to gdrain and leaf storm, while defensive sets are wrecked by snorlax anyway. I'd use it over nidoqueen, as with cofagrigus and slowbro you have more than enough methods to deal with fighting types, and you already have a bulky ground and sr'er in piloswine.

    If you find that your team is too slow, you could also try using Scarf Mienshao or Scarf Heracross over Scrafty. If you're running CB lax you won't have any troubles with cofagrigus anyway, and rade + lax also deals with slowbro nicely as well, which means that scrafty's secondary STAB isn't that useful. Both give you a solid win condition as well and an answer to threats that have somehow got a boost and you can't deal with it(like Bisharp).

    Here is the roserade set:
    Show Hide
    Roserade @ Life Orb
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Leaf Storm
    - Sludge Bomb
    - Sleep Powder
    - Rest

    Mienshao @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Reckless
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
    Jolly Nature
    - Hi Jump Kick
    - U-turn
    - Stone Edge
    - Aerial Ace

    GL with the team and I hope I helped. I fully support using Snorlax over druddigon and slowbro over suicune as well, as with cofag and roserade and piloswine you have a core that becomes incredibly difficult to break and otherwise subsplit chandelure would rape your team and slowbro is also much more reliable at beating fire types, thanks to regenerator.
  9. PTJon7

    PTJon7

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    You have a good point about the Water types, I'll be sure to try Roserade out. I do however think that Scarf Mienshao (though excellent) goes against the over all theme of bulky offense for the team. Thanks though!
  10. silenced

    silenced

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    Aug 30, 2012
    Messages:
    245
    Interesting team.

    I'd like to offer some more simple fixes for this, since I think the team has a good defense, though like silvershadow, I am concerned about the water/grass weakness.

    Firstly, for CB scrafty, please drop zen headbutt for Dragon tail. This may seem like a weird choice, but it at least gives you some phazing. Zen headbutt IMO seems redundant on your scrafty since with intimidate, players should realise you're not a DD scrafty which would otherwise attract mienshao. Fight + Dark + Ice already gives you perfect neutral coverage so doing this may help slightly against slower set-up sweepers like crocune, and more dangerous ones such as kingdra.

    For Druddigon, same suggestion, except replace superpower. EQ and Outrage provide perfect neutral coverage already courtesy of mold breaker, and especially with the stat drops, superpower doesn't seem like a good idea here. Although both scrafty and Druddigon would hate scald burns from stuff such as crocune, the phazing you now bring hits hard (CB and/or STAB) and helps deter set-up pokes.

    Fire blast over flamethrower on Nidoqueen I would like to see as well.

    To tank stuff better, and be an interesting win condition, I'd like to see your suicine become

    Crocune @ Leftovers
    Bold Nature
    252HP, 252 Def, 4 SpD
    -scald
    -rest
    -sleep talk
    -calm mind
  11. PTJon7

    PTJon7

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    Hey thanks, the idea of Dragon Tail on Scrafty is interesting, I'll test it out.

    And my apologies, I need to make some changes on the team description, I've replaced Druddigon for Snorlax and Suicune for Slowbro. I still really appreciate the input.
  12. Pikabuster

    Pikabuster

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    If you kept Druddigon you could've tried out for the UU research thread thing
  13. PTJon7

    PTJon7

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    Bumping this, all new stuff has red indicators.
  14. Purple Grind

    Purple Grind

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    Weavile literally can OHKO your entire team after a sword dance. That's huge. I'd recommend scarf heracross over scrafty but you already said you don't want to.


    To keep with the bulky offense theme maybe you could try putting a hitmontop over scrafty? It can run bulk up too, has very similar stats, intimidate, and suckerpunch to give a set similar to the one you have. Maybe something like substitute, HJK, suckerpunch, bulk up? You could also go for an offensive tank with or without rapid spin. Hitmontop has quite a few usable moves and EV spreads you could try so I'd experiment.
  15. PTJon7

    PTJon7

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    Weavile can definitely be a threat to this team, but getting up a Swords Dance wouldn't be very easy considering how frail Weavile is. If it isn't holding a Life Orb its also a whole lot easier to deal with.

    I feel Hitmontop wouldn't work out very well as a replacement for Scrafty, Sucker Punch is not a realible way to sweep at all, especially if it isn't STAB and Scrafty has much better typing. I might try replacing Shed Skin with Intimidate however, as that is a good way to meet half way.
  16. NfskMjmMal

    NfskMjmMal

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    For your Slowbro, I think you should switch Scald with Surf and replace Grass Knot with Fire Blast. I think the latter is a must because you already have Roserade for a strong Grass-type attack and your team has no Fire-type attacks. Since you're Modest, max Special Attack, and Choice Specs, it makes more sense to use as strong of a Water-type attack as possible, as Scald is more useful for utility variants. I suppose Slowbro is bulky enough, has Regenerator, and your team has no other status or pseudostatus besides Sludge Bomb to justify the use of Scald, especially if you Trick your item away, but again, you're investing in as much power as possible.
  17. PTJon7

    PTJon7

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    Yea I really find Scald's burn chance to outweight the increase in power of Surf. I will try out Fire Blast however, as its pretty rare to use Grass Knot in most battles.
  18. Purple Grind

    Purple Grind

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    I like the idea of intimidate on scrafty since you already carry substitute for status. This would also somewhat help the weavile weakness.

    Also, I'd suggest switching out icicle spear for icicle crash on piloswine since it's more reliable. Unlike rhyperior's rock blast, ice spear doesn't really hit many common sash users hard enough. Icicle spear is still usable for perfect accuracy and potential but it's inconsistency can be disappointing.
  19. Mew72

    Mew72

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    This is a pretty well-built team. It caught my attention with the use of Choice Specs Slowbro, a huge threat I've been using on the PO UU ladder for a while. I suggest Fire Blast > Grass Knot, as you have other things to effectively deal with Swampert and Rhyperior, so Grass Knot will not end up aiding you much. Fire Blast allows you to nail Shaymin on switch ins, which is typically enough to OHKO Offensive Shaymin w/ or w/o Rocks.

    All I really have to say, as a solid team is solid.

    Good luck. [:
  20. Laga

    Laga Drinking is borrowing happiness from tomorrow
    is a Tutoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributor
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    Since you are using a specs Slowbro, why are you running scald? I know the burn chance is nifty, but the extra damage is nicer in my opinion. I really think you should run Surf Also, I think Flamethrower/Fire Blast would be a better choice than Grass Knot for the third moveslot. I think this is a good idea, because all it really helps with is Swampert and Blastoise, which can't really do much in return. Here is how I think your Slowbro should look like:

    Slowbro @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 SAtk / 8 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Surf
    - Psyshock
    - Flamethrower / Fire Blast
    - Trick

    I also think that your Scrafty is better off with the ability Intimidate. This is because your scrafty has ridiculous special bulk, and intimidate just makes you that buch bulkier until your opponent switches out, giving you a higher chance to set up a Substitute. And once a Substitute is up, Shed Skin is no longer needed to cure that nasty burn / poison / paralyze, as you cannot be inflicted with it anymore.

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