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Slowbro (BW2 Revamp) [2/3 QC]

Discussion in 'Locked / Outdated Analyses' started by Lord of Bays, Feb 5, 2013.

  1. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

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    oh god what am i doing i can't write full analyses

    [​IMG]
    .................wut?

    [Overview]

    • The Bro to end all Bros
    • Seriously underrated physical wall, one of the best Fighting-type checks in the game, completely shuts down any Terrakion besides SD Rock Gem
    • Excellent physical Dragon check; Kyurem-B tops out at 88% with +1 252+ Atk Fusion Bolt
    • Gives less fucks about Pursuit than most Psychic-types thanks to insane physical bulk and Regenerator
    • Rather specially frail; can't take too many neutral hits, much less SE ones
    • Extremely slow, only outspeeds Ferrothorn, so it's taking several hits every time it switches, at least
    • If you're looking for team support/utility, almost every bulky water does that better, but Slowbro is a better wall than most of them
    • Offensive sets (Specs and Trick Room) appreciate rain support to boost his Water STAB

    [SET]

    name: Defensive Wall
    move 1: Scald
    move 2: Ice Beam
    move 3: Thunder Wave / Psyshock / Psychic
    move 4: Slack Off
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Bold
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
    ivs: 19 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • Poops all over almost every Fighting-type ever
    • There are very, very few physical attackers that can beat Slowbro without fear of reprisal. Breloom is the only OU Pokémon that can OHKO fully healthy Bro without set-up, but Scizor, Tyranitar, and Kyurem-B can KO with hazard support (all with Choice Band, of course)
    • Scald for that evil, evil 30% burn chance
    • Thunder Wave cripple opposing Pokémon
    • Ice Beam puts the hurt on Dragons, OHKOing Salamence, Dragonite after Rocks, and does a minimum of 88.3% to Garchomp
    • Psyshock hits Gyarados harder as well as is the most consistent option against Terrakion. Psychic hits harder on average, and specifically hits Conkeldurr and Cloyster hard
    • 19 Speed IVs allows it to always underspeed Conkeldurr so it never takes full damage from Payback, Conkeldurr's most powerful attack against Bro

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • Toxic to cripple opposing walls, though Ferrothorn and any Pokémon with Natural Cure won't care
    • 4 SpA Flamethrower 2HKOs Ferrothorn out of the rain and OHKOs 248/0 Scizor 81% of the time, and brings 252/0 Forretress down to Sturdy, Fire Blast does even more damage (I would give calcs but Kalashnikov is down and I don't know any other reliable calculators. Suffice to say that Ferro can be OHKOd with Spikes support and Scizor never survives)
    • Thanks to Regenerator, you can conceivably drop Slack Off for a third attacking move or a second status move
    • The pink blobs and Celebi are good teammates, providing Heal Bell/Aromatherapy support as well as sponging most special attacks. Celebi shares Bug, Dark, and Ghost weaknesses, so watch out for that
    • Amoonguss also has Regenerator and synergizes nicely as a Regenerating Core, Slowbro as a physical wall and Amoonguss as a special wall. Unfortunately, outside of status they don't offer much team support
    • Heatran and Amoongus complete a Fire-Water-Grass core, worth looking into

    [SET]

    name: Choice Specs
    move 1: Surf
    move 2: Fire Blast
    move 3: Psyshock / Psychic
    move 4: Trick / Ice Beam / Grass Knot
    item: Choice Specs
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Modest
    evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
    ivs: 19 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • Surprise your opponents with Slowbro's respectable base 100 SpA and Choice Specs
    • Received Trick in BW2, opening the ever popular strategy of tricking a Choice item to an opposing wall
    • Really doesn't give a damn about entry hazards with Regenerator, making him rather unique among Choice users
    • Fire Blast puts the hurt on Grass-types and Steels, especially Ferrothorn (fuck this guy)

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • Grass Knot for opposing Water-types
    • Ice Beam for Dragons; this is not a primary move because without that physical investment Bro is not such a good switch-in anymore
    • Anything that hates Ferrothorn (Choice Keldeo, Double Dance Thundurus-T, Kyurem-B) love to see it roasted on the lure so they can sweep more freely

    [SET]

    name: Offensive Trick Room
    move 1: Trick Room
    move 2: Surf
    move 3: Psyshock / Psychic
    move 4: Ice Beam / Shadow Ball
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Quiet
    evs: 232 HP / 24 Def / 252 SpA
    ivs: 0 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    • Trick Room, fuck yeah
    • Life Orb gives Slowbro just a little sweeping power
    • More than enough bulk to tank a hit, put Trick Room back up if it's gone, and then Regenerate the hell out of there, letting something like Guts Conkeldurr have his day
    • STABs for attacking, most bang for your buck
    • Ice Beam hits Dragons thinking to prey on you when setting up Trick Room, Shadow Ball hits opposing Psychics hard

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    • All other attacking options listed earlier are viable over Bro's STABs, just depends on what you need
    • Defensive spread (252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA) and Leftovers make Slowbro more of a pure Trick Room supporter. In this case, drop one of your attacking moves for Slack Off
    • Lots of Trick Room sweepers appreciate it if they can't put Trick Room up themselves or can't afford to spend the turn themselves: Conkeldurr, Reuniclus, Escavalier, Gigalith, Rhyperior, Magnezone, Tyranitar, Chandelure (honestly, I just threw a bunch of Pokémon with relatively low Speed stats and high attacking stats out here. This will be much cleaner in the final write-up)

    [OTHER OPTIONS]

    • Could run a straight-up LO tank set. Regenerator seriously adds to that viability, Slack Off + 3 Attacks and whatnot
    • Calm Mind is seriously outdone by other Pokémon, but if you make it work more power to you

    [CHECKS AND COUNTERS]
    • First and foremost: Special walls, barring Jirachi (SpDef Jirachi does dick for damage and risks Scald burns and T-Wave if it tries to stay in and flinch hax)
    • Powerful special attackers (so CM Jirachi with Thunder or Grass Knot, etc.)
    • Breloom HAS to watch out for Psyshock/Psychic and Scald Burns, but if it's in, Bullet Seed is going to shred Slowbro
    • Similar to Breloom, Scizor needs to beware Flamethrower/Fire Blast and Scald, but U-turn will tear Bro a new one
    • Bulky set-up attackers with Substitute; Gyarados' SubDD set is a prime example
    • CB Tyranitar does up to 88% with Pursuit on the switch, but that's really the only Pursuiter you should fear with Regenerator
  2. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    Good work on getting this up

    QC decided that the main set should look this:

    name: Physical Tank
    move 1: Scald
    move 2: Ice Beam
    move 3: Psychic / Thunder Wave
    move 4: Slack Off
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Bold
    evs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA

    Ice Beam was deemed non negotioable since you needed the immediate damage against things like +1 Salamence, +2 Garchomp, etc.

    The Choice Specs set should probably look like this:

    name: Specs
    move 1: Surf
    move 2: Fire Blast
    move 3: Psychic / Psyshock
    move 4: Trick / Ice Beam / Grass Knot
    item: Choice Specs
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Modest
    evs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA

    Fire Blast is too important to get slashed imo, and isn't as necessary since you're 2hkoing most of the dragons (sans Lati@s & Hydreigon)

    The TR set gets a yes from me, since Slowbro is basically almost identical to Slowking when it comes to TR sweeping.

    Feel free to use ScarfWynaut's original skeleton to beef up your AC and whatnot.
  3. dice

    dice RAP GAME GiTTARACKUR
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    AC mention the use of a status move > Slack Off on the tank set. I found that with Regenerator Slack Off wasn't necessarily a necessity and Toxic was a cool way of nailing things like Jellicent on the switch.
  4. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    Agreeing with Bri. I also approve of a TR set for Slowbro, even though that TR Slowking is a bit better due to it setting up easier against rain teams, which is Slowking's and Slowbro's best envireoment anyway.
  5. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

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    Working on making the changes right now. I'd like to keep Psychic and Psyshock slashed every time one of them is used, because they're mostly interchangeable. What do you think? Could it use some streamlining?

    EDIT: Changes made! What are you guys thinking, still no Calm Mind set?
  6. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    Overview

    • Mention that it is one of the best Terrakion counters around
    • Slow as balls, meaning it will almost always need to take 2 hits when switching in
    • Lack of utility moves, except for T-Wave which is very widespread anyway, making it a lesser choice compared to Pokemon that provide much better team support (Politoed provides rain, Jellicent spin-blocks and has Taunt, Tenta spins and has T-Spikes, you get the drill)

    Defensive Tank


    Set Comments:

    • Rename to Defensive Wall
    • Mention that Psyshock is mainly for Terrakion in sand, while Psychic handles better Gyarados, Conkeldurr, and Cloyster (OHKO after SR on Cloyster)
    Additional Comments:

    • Add Fire Blast
    • Celebi, Chansey, and Blissey are good teamates. They provide Heal Bell support and are good special wall

    Trick Room Tank

    Set Comments:

    • Rename to Offensive Trick Room
    • The moveset should be this:
    • [SET]
      name: Offensive Trick Room
      move 1: Trick Room
      move 2: Surf
      move 3: Psyshock
      move 4: Ice Beam / Shadow Ball
      item: Life Orb
      ability: Regenerator
      nature: Quiet
      evs: 232 HP / 24 Def / 252 SpA
      ivs: 0 Spe

    Add those for now and i will give more input later...
  7. Hemp Man

    Hemp Man

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    Gyarados has 79 Base Defense and 100 Base Special Defense, wouldn't Psyshock do more damage?
  8. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

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    OP updated! Mentioned Terrakion, didn't mention Gyarados, Conkeldurr, or Cloyster as they're just not that common anymore. Did mention physically defensive Tentacruel and how Psychic hits it harder.
  9. Jukain

    Jukain .leaf
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    yo Specs -> Choice Specs in the set name

    I would add some of the teammates in Scarfwynaut's thread that PK Gaming linked, as there really isn't much in the way of partners in this analysis.

    Checks and Counters needs SubCM Latias, SubDD Dragonite, SubDD Gyarados, Kyurem-B, Magnezone, Thundurus-T, HP Electric / Ghost Keldeo, Volcarona, and Tentacruel.

    The sets themselves look good, just remember to put space between slashes like / this / and / this.
  10. papai noel

    papai noel
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    I think it's valid to mention 19 Speed IVs because they ensure you'll be slower than Conkeldurr so that you can beat Payback variants easily. I'm not sure if it's good to mention, though, as most Conkeldurr I see nowadays are running Ice Punch / ThunderPunch.
  11. alexwolf

    alexwolf Rain Summoner
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    Don't mention Tentacruel when talking about Psychic, as both Psychic moves do exactly the same damage to it (46.15 - 54.94%).

    Hemp Man you are right Psyshock hits Gyarados slightly harder so mention this too. Gyarados stays for sure, as it still common enough, and very deadly if played right. I insist on mentioning Cloyster and Conkedlurr, as Slowbro is one of the best counters around for those, even if they are somewhat rare.

    Finally, i believe that papai noel is right, and 19 Speed IVs should be the standard on defensive Slowbro, as it loses nothing by doing so, while faring better against Payback Conk, however rare that may be...
  12. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

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    Gyarados, Conkeldurr, Cloyster mentioned, removed comment about Tentacruel. About teammates... I've been thinking about that, and I don't know if I want to emphasize that as I plan on writing how he is a much better wall than he is a supporter, better than just about any other bulky water, and how he's completely outshined by most of the other bulky waters in supporting. He doesn't so much serve as glue like P2 or Ferrothorn does as much as he's an immovable pillar. I've added some teammates, and I'll edit the Skeleton accordingly, as well as the final write-up, to what you want me to do. 19 Speed IVs will go on every set except Trick Room, which will continue to be 0 IVs.

    Show Hide
    but seriously you guys told me to take away emphasis on his support I need a line to follow here


    The above paragraph does not apply to Trick Room, as he is one of the best Trick Room setters in the game, bar none.
  13. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

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    Okay. I'm gonna be taking a break from Pokémon for a while. I just can't bring myself to play it right now, and I'd rather take a step back, possibly until XY, than force myself to have a shitty time.

    I'll stick around until this is done, unless the QC staff is seriously dissatisfied with my work in which case I'll pass it on to someone who knows what they're doing.
  14. Cygnis

    Cygnis

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    You should write that TR and Specs appreciate rain because of the extra power provided
  15. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    [qc]1/3[/qc]
  16. GatoDelFuego

    GatoDelFuego This is what is technically known as a Firecat
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    Mention heatran as a great partner, as it can "wall" specially while covering grass and bug weanesses with Slowbro taking fighting. Especially with Amoonguss, it makes THE FWG stall core. Amoonguss and Slowbro wall, Heatran sets up rocks and phazes. They all can status anything they want and Heatran and Slowbro can burn everything.
  17. ginganinja

    ginganinja Dating Haunter
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    I apologise if this is nitpicky in any way, but quite frankly, taking 80-88% from Kyurem-B is something that would reallly scare the shit outta me. By all means mention that it can tank that hit, but implying that Slowbro doesn't fear Kyurem-B is potentially a little misleading.

    Also potentially worth mentioning that Sub DD Gyarados (its only really mentioned as something Psyshock hits rather than something that gives Slowbro trouble) could potentially cause it problems if it lacks a Psychic attack, and I guess Tyrantiar are the other physical attacker thats a little worrying that Slowbro "potentially" fears.

    Assuming you fix that bit up a little bit

    [qc]2/3[/qc]
  18. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

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    @Gato: Got it, will mention that in AC of Defensive Wall.

    @Ginga: Okay, I see your point. I do feel like NOT being OHKOd by Kyurem-B's Banded Outrage is absolutely outstanding since Slowbro doesn't resist it. Assuming you come in fresh, you burn or cripple with Scald/Thunder Wave, and then Regenerate out only a little worse for wear. Bro truly is one of the best physical walls in the game. I guess what I was trying to say is that because of Slowbro's impeccable bulk and defensive typing, if you cannot OHKO with a physical attacker, you're probably wasting your time with Slowbro and should just hurry up and get Jolteon out there. I'll see if I can make sense of it in the skeleton, but I'll definitely reword that in the final write-up.

    I will mention SubDD Gyarados/RestTalk Gyarados (but probably just SubDD) in Checks and Counters.

    EDIT: Okay, Heatran/Amoongus FWG core mentioned in the Defensive Wall. Mentioned Tyranitar and Kyurem-B more properly.

    One more EDIT: Now I start writing up the full analysis?
  19. AccidentalGreed

    AccidentalGreed HOMERUN, CABRONES
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    Yeah, you can, go for it and finally do whatever you need.
  20. Lord of Bays

    Lord of Bays

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    I'm sorry, but I don't have the time to finish this, especially as I've already taken two weeks to write it up and haven't gotten jack shit done.
  21. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
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    ok Bays - who wants to take over where LoB left off?
  22. Fatecrashers

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