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Small cracks lead to Major weaknesses

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by TheGreatMilenko, Dec 24, 2011.

  1. TheGreatMilenko

    TheGreatMilenko

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
    Messages:
    108
    Introduction
    Hello and Welcome to my RMT. this team is a team based on hitting the enemy teams walls and pokemon with strong hard attacks fast while keeping momentum going, allowing one of the teams members at the end to clean up. The name comes from the teams general plan to repeatedly hit one of the opponents walls or crucial pokemon and have it weakened or die so one of my team members can start inflicting some massive damage.

    Changes are in Bold

    This team has just started on the Smogon University PO Server, after day 1, the team is ranked 183rd In Standard OU Battles.

    Team Building Process

    [​IMG]
    I started this team off with Rotom-W, the best bulky water in the metagame and let me build a team around him. He offered a great start to a FWG core and really let me get my hard hitters in faster while causing damage via volt switch.

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    The next member of the team was Scizor. Scizor was selected because he had really good synergy with Rotom. The U-Turn, Volt Switch damage and momentum is a welcome addition to any team. Scizor also let me worry less about pokemon such as Reuniclus and have priority when times get tough.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Specially Defensive heatran was selected as the third member of the team. Heatran offered great walling abilities, access to stealth rocks, great resistances and is all around a great member of the team. Heatran works realy well with scizor covering his only weakness while being able to phase and spread burns, it was a no brainer.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Breloom was the fourth member of the team added. Breloom has replaced Celebi as the teams main grass type pokemon. While Breloom might not be as specially defensive as Celebi the Bulk up set puts heavy pressure on the opposing player's physical wall's, can break stall, take pokemon out of the battle with spore and all around do a lot of damage with it's STABs. Overall Breloom's resistance to dark and rock unlike Celebi have been key to improving this team.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Terrakion really added some immediate offensive presence to this team. Having a Strong STAB fighting attack on your team has never been better. This team has had other fighting types in this place but his rock typing has been of great help. Terrakion was chosen solely on his ability to smash holes through the apposing team's walls.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Latias, is truly the gravy on the mash potatoes for this team. Latias has resistances to water, grass, fire, fighting and electric which really takes a lot of heat off the other team members. Latias was chosen over Latios because of her superior defensive and set up abilities.

    In Depth Look at the Team

    [​IMG]
    Spin Cycle
    Rotom-W@Leftovers
    Ability:Levitate
    Nature:Bold
    EVS:248HP/152Def/100SpA/8Spe
    Moveset:
    -Hydro Pump
    -Volt Switch
    -Hidden Power(Grass)
    -Pain Split

    Rotom-W is in charge of handling physical threats while keeping the offensive momentum going. Not many people see a physically defensive Rotom-W and it really pays off, being able to take on threats such as Gyrados, Mamoswine, Landorus and really any pokemon who thinks throwing a neutral attack at Rotom-W will cause a lot of damage. I am not interested in running a scarfed rotom, not being able to use this moveset and having to choose one move is not how Rotom-W best fits onto the team.

    Rotom-W's main task for the team is to take ice, water,flying and the odd fire attack. Rotom-W also gives me a change against pokemon who are more uncommon that some teams do not even think twice about. Pokemon such as infernape are suddenly not as dangerous and easier to manage with Rotom-W's bulk and surprisingly effective special attacks. Hidden Power Grass is to give a nasty supprise to any Gastrodons or Quagsires who my opponent is using as a wall. This EV spread is used to give me a possible 2HKO with HP Grass on 252HP/252SpD Gastrodon, taking any previous damage or a couple of stealth rock switch ins will result in a 2HKO. HP grass is overall much more useful, my opponent being able to send in gastrodon whenever my Rotom-W is on the field COMPLETELY ruins all my momentum, and literally loses me the entire game on the spot. Think I am over reacting? I tried a scarf set, thunderbolt, Will-O-Wisp, and it was alright, but everytime I saw a gastrodon which was decently common I 80% of the time lost the battle.

    Dealing with gyrados is slightly more annoying but after stealth rocks, volt switch and stone edge from terrakion, quick attack from scizor and the possibility to use Breloom solves that problem good enough.

    [​IMG]
    Tech N9ne
    Scizor@Choice Band
    Ability:Technician
    Nature:Adamant
    EVS:248HP/252Atk/8Spe
    Moveset:
    -Bullet Punch
    -U-Turn
    -Superpower
    -Quick Attack

    Scizor is tasked with the job of being a constant source of damage while also checking threats such as Reuniclus, terrakion and other low hp pokemon looking to do anything. Scizor is often used throughout the game and can also pursuit any annoying ghost or psychic type pokemon. Superpower lets me slam pokemon such as Heatran, Ferrothorn and opposing Scizor looking to come into a U-Turn. Scizor is really one of the most effective pokemon and revenge killers in the metagame right now. Scizor, Heatran and Rotom-W cause many opponents annoyances because they cover each other so well while causing damage, add some stealth rock on top of that and the damage really adds up fast.

    Quick attack is used over pursuit because killing Latias and Gengar is not really the situations Scizor wants to be in unless he is using bullet punch. Quick attack is used to hit Volcarona who is quite an annoyance to the team if carrying HP Ground.

    Scizor is truly an irreplaceable member of this team who has done his job time and time again. The choice band set is the only set that works for this team, trying to set up or get fancy simply does not work.

    [​IMG]
    Firebat
    Heatran@Leftovers
    Ability:Flash Fire
    Nature:Calm
    EVS:252HP/252SpD/4SpA
    Moveset:
    -Lava PLume
    -Stealth Rocks
    -Roar
    -Earth Power

    Heatran is a very valuable member to this team. His quad resistances to bug, grass and ice are extremely valuable and make him take very little from a majority of attacks aimed his way. Heatran is one of the few people who can take STAB dragon attacks for the team. Heatran sets up stealth rock and comes into pokemon such as ferrothorn and causes switches, either setting up stealth rock, or attempting to burn something with lava plumes impressive 30% burn rate. This moveset is slightly weird but so far it is doing what it really has to. Earth power is to hit opposing heatran looking to come in for free and not get walled by tyranitar if it comes down to the wire.

    Roar is great for racking up stealth rock damage and causing an annoyance. Heatran's main job for the team is to prevent hazards from being set up, causing burns and being the specially defensive wall tasked with countering certain threats. Heatran's more defensive spread has helped me a LOT more than the previous set, living Surf's, Earth powers and super effective moves is very impressive and often supprises opponents allowing heatran to get a kill, set up rocks or phase them out if they are attempting to sweep. Heatran is my main answer to Volcarona, he can live a single hidden power ground if unboosted, usually stealth rocks are up and heatran can phase or lava plume, followed by a quick attack from scizor doing around 51% it gets the job done.

    [​IMG]
    JoeyTomato
    Breloom@Toxic Orb
    Ability:Poison Heal
    Nature:Careful
    EVS:236HP/212SpD/60Spe
    Moveset:
    -Spore
    -Bulk Up
    -Drain Punch
    -Seed Bomb

    Breloom has replaced celebi and has been a very welcome addition to the team. Breloom is using the less used Bulk up set which really helps out the team and actually has a potential to sweep if the opportunity arrises. The opponents physical wall's take an absolute beating from the team and Breloom makes sure that beating keeps on coming. Taking hits from scizor, terrakion and breloom chips away at the opponents main physical wall's HP and opens up a space for either Breloom, Terrakion or Latias to set up and win the game. Breloom's always rage inducing move, Spore, is a really welcome addition to the team, allowing any one pokemon to be basically out of the game or used as set up fodder. Breloom does not need to set up to also be effective on the team, coming in on threats that it resists with it's great type coverage and firing off an attack or spore has proved useful on many occasions.

    Overall Breloom has helped the team a lot more and after fighting several conkeldurr's on PO I can safely say my team really is not that conkeldurr weak. This set is used over the classic subpunching breloom because It works better for the team and helps the purpose a lot more. Breloom having the possibility to sweep, put a pokemon to sleep, and constantly hit the opponents physical walls as they switch in is really a good mixture that the grass type pokemon of this team needs.

    The nickname I really do not know why I chose it, I just looked at breloom's face and it screamed joey tomato. Thanks for the idea and set Snorlaxe and Joeyboy.

    [​IMG]
    Balrog
    Terrakion@Life Orb
    Ability:Justified
    Nature:Jolly
    EVS:252Atk/252Spe/4HP
    Moveset:
    -Close Combat
    -Stone Edge
    -Swords Dance
    -Rock Polish

    Terrakion doesn't really bring a whole lot of resistances or fancy abilities to help the team but he does bring one thing, raw power. Terrakion has been changed from a choice band set to a double boosting set. Terrakion is used throughout the match to kill threats and when my opponents main physical wall or the team has a crack in it where terrakion can set up and do damage to the opposing team he is used to set up. Terrakion also makes dealing with tyranitar a lot easier, taking crunches and specially based attacks from him. Terrakion or Latias are the main set up sweepers for the team and exploit the weakness of the enemies special and physical wall. Most teams pack only one Latias counter in the form of Tyranitar, Terrakion kills tyranitar and provides really nice synergy with Latias. Terrakion has really tied Latias for total kills, half way through the match I look at the opponents team and say to myself, can Breloom, Latias or Terrakion set up right now and win me the game. Usually the answer is yes, if not Terrakion can come in and actually do very impressive damage to anything with a Life orbed attack.

    Double boosting terrakion is really what the team revolves around, providing him support and helping him get a sweep. This set has proved to be more useful than the Choice band set.

    Terrakion also can take a decent amount of punishment if the opponent throws up a nice 1.5x boost to his special defense.

    [​IMG]
    DatLatiass
    Latias@Leftovers
    Ability:Levitate
    Nature:Timid
    EVS:252HP/252Spe/4SpA
    Moveset:
    -Dragon Pulse
    -Hidden Power(Fire)
    -Calm Mind
    -Recover

    Latias, the true glue of the team. Latias is really the pokemon who just sits back and relaxes all game until the opponents Latias counter has died or been weakned, (EX.Tyranitar). Dragon pulse and hidden power provides some surprisingly good coverage besides Heatran. Specially defensive heatran only beats latias if it has roar though, and if it comes down to a 1v1 situation, latias can win. Latias has great special defense though and if it is needed it will be used. Celebi and Latias share many of the same resistances and weaknesses, celebi being more offensive and physically defensive while Latias is more specially and a set up sweeper. In the end Latias is an excellent revenge killer, who can be extremely deadly if left alone, the ability to resist many common types including fighting is exceptional for the team. Latias's superior bulk lets dealing with scizor a lot easier, Latias is not OHKO'd or even 2HKO'd at full HP by bullet punch, hidden power fire OHKO's after two stealth rock switch in from's scizor or one calm mind obviously.

    Latias is chosen over Latios because of her superb defensive abilities. Latias just runs a better defensive set up and if you ask me, she is a very underrated threat in the metagame many people forget about when making a team.

    Pokemon Online
    Like at the beginning of the RMT says I just started using this team on PO, it is having a very high success rate and I am positive I can get very high into the ranks.

    Threats to the team

    Terrakion is currently not a major threat but is fairly annoying, he can hit a lot of my team for neutral or big damage so playing around him and predicting good is always needed.

    Choice Banded Tyranitar, have they gone up in usage? Choice band tyranitar can hit most of my team members for big damage and it is a really big annoyance. Any other tyranitar is not really a problem.

    Thanks for Reading my RMT

    If you have any comments or suggestions please post them, you need to tell me who to replace or what to change if you are suggesting a pokemon or move slot change.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
  2. tomtom5858

    tomtom5858

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2010
    Messages:
    425
    One suggestion, as your Celebi is mainly a hit-and-run attacker, test Rest over Recover. Rest capitalizes on Natural Cure, and cures status that you might have picked up.
  3. Thundur

    Thundur

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2011
    Messages:
    435
    Just a quick suggestion, make you Terrakion Choice Scarfed. You already have a banded Scizor. Although you lose the power of CB you get the ability to revenge kill many threats. With this change I would put EQ over Quick Attack to hit Toxicroak.
  4. TheGreatMilenko

    TheGreatMilenko

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
    Messages:
    108
    Ah yes choice scarf terrakion is a good suggestion, I will probably try it out if I find that my teams revenge killing abilities are not as good as they should be.

    I never really thought about rest it is an interesting suggestion, I will have to try it out although it will lose me some offensive momentum
  5. truedrew

    truedrew

    Joined:
    May 14, 2011
    Messages:
    103
    YOU have a weakness to DD nite as it can set up on You're celebi or you're terrakion locked into CC. To fix this use scarf terrakion over You're banded one.
  6. ZoroDark

    ZoroDark

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2011
    Messages:
    264
    Really nice team you have there, THeGreatMilenko;
    TO fix the few problems you have I would recommend scarf Terrakion.
  7. Snorlaxe

    Snorlaxe 2 kawaii 4 u
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
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    Messages:
    2,230
    nice team here, but it seems that at the moment youre sporting a rather large weakness to the extremely popular switch-turn combo of rotom-w and scizor. you lack a pokemon who can break this combo, so with entry hazards up and the damage caused by the aforementioned pokes, your team isnt gonna be surviving long. what you really need is a pokemon who can break rotom-w and scizor cores, and i have just the thing for that: bulk up breloom. use a set of bulk up / spore / seed bomb / drain punch, an ev spread of 236 HP / 212 SpD / 60 Spe, and a careful nature with the ability poison heal and the item toxic orb. it may look like a gimmicky set, but i assure you that it's not. it will allow you to break past switch-turn combos, as well as catch many foes off guard with its mix of bulk and power. i think that you should use it in place of celebi simply because celebi doesn't seem too important on your team; it mainly dispatches bulky waters and deals with rain, two things breloom can do well. more information about the set can be found here.

    i agree with other raters about the scarf terrakion suggestion. while it isn't really too necessary because you aren't crazy weak to set-up sweepers like DD haxorus and dragonite, it never helps to have a back up check to set-up sweepers, especially because they are so dangerous and common. terrakion still hits plenty hard without a choice band, so it isn't a big loss. just use the same set that you're currently using, but with rock slide over quick attack. you can also use earthquake over quick attack if youre really concerned about toxicroak and jirachi, but aside from that, it doesn't have any great utility.

    as far as minor changes go, why don't you try will-o-wisp over hidden power grass on rotom-w? this will allow you to deal with physical attackers more easily, and it's not like you really need HP grass since water-types are already handled by celebi (or, if you use my suggestion, breloom).

    summary of changes (open)
    replace celebi with bulk up breloom
    on terrakion, use a choice scarf instead of a choice band, and replace quick attack with rock slide
    on rotom-w, use will-o-wisp over hidden power grass


    great team, and good luck dude! merry christmas!
  8. Jayde

    Jayde
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winner

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2011
    Messages:
    558
    IMO HP Fire Latias is good enough for switchturn, but idk if Scizor is OHKO'ed, I'll have to calc it.

    Will edit in an actual rate later
  9. New World Order

    New World Order Licks Toads
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jul 15, 2009
    Messages:
    2,170
    Hi, nice team. First of all, I would advise against using Choice Scarf Terrakion over Choice Band Terrakion. First of all, it doesn't actually help you against anything. Volcarona is already handled by Heatran, while Salamence can be revenge killed by Scizor. Furthermore, Dragonite quite honestly has incredible difficulty setting up. Rotom-W can Volt Switch out, Scizor can Bullet Punch, Heatran can Roar it out, Celebi can status it, Terrakion can Stone Edge it, and Latias can Dragon Pulse. The only situation where Dragonite could possibly to set up is DD Lum Dragonite vs Celebi. I do, however, suggest swapping Terrakion to a Double Booster variant. Currently, your team has difficulty against stall, as the only Pokemon on your team that can stallbreak is Latias, who gets shut down hard by Tyranitar, a common sight on stall teams, and Ferrothorn or Jirachi for Rain stall. Swords Dance Terrakion gives you another valuable asset for dealing with these types of teams. Rock Polish can be used against more offensively oriented teams, namely Sun teams.

    You should consider a more defensive 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD spread on Heatran. The extra Speed isn't particularly helpful, but that extra Special Defense allows you to take numerous more hits, be them Draco Meteors, Bug Buzzes, Blizzards, or whatever other common move Heatran is required to take. It would be a shame if Heatran succumbed to the onslaught of Dragons because of a lack of recovery, wouldn't it?

    Finally, Life Orb Starmie can rampage through your team if Celebi or Latias have taken any prior damage. A quick fix for this is to swap Rotom-W to a Choice Scarf variant. This also allows Rotom-W to outspeed and KO the likes of Choice Specs Tornadus before it can even move, which is always helpful. Since you're not using Will-o-Wisp anyways, the ability to change moves isn't as much of a necessity. Rather than Hidden Power Grass and Pain Split, I suggest going with Thunderbolt and Trick instead. You already have Celebi to come in on the likes of Gastrodon all day long, especially with Natural Cure, so no problem there. SubDD Gyarados can just Sub up, every time you Volt Switch, KO your switch-in, and rinse and repeat until either Rotom-W is the last Pokes standing, or it is powerful enough to power through Rotom-W. Thunderbolt should patch up this problem. Trick allows you to cripple annoying Pokemon such as Blissey and Gastrodon.

    GL
    TLDR version (open)

    Double Booster Terrakion>Choice Band Terrakion
    pros: helps vs stall teams, can change moves
    cons: lacks a little bit of initial power (only 13%)

    New EV spread for Heatran
    pros: take all those Special hits Heatran is expected to endure better
    cons: none, no need for the Speed

    Choice Scarf Rotom-W>Tank Rotom-W
    pros: better for dealing with Starmie, Tornadus, SubDD Gyarados, and other common Rain sweepers, can cripple opposing walls
    cons: lose the ability to switch moves, lose Leftovers recovery

    Sets (open)

    Terrakion @ Life Orb
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature (+Spe, -SpA)
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge
    - X-Scissor
    - Earthquake

    Heatran @ Leftovers
    Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
    Calm Nature (+SpD, -Atk)
    - Lava Plume¬ł
    - Stealth Rock
    - Roar
    - Protect

    Rotom-W @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Leftovers
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature (+Spe, -Atk)
    - Volt Switch
    - Hydro Pump
    - Thunderbolt
    - Trick
  10. New World Order

    New World Order Licks Toads
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    Jul 15, 2009
    Messages:
    2,170
    Oh and yeah, double post, but CM HP Fire Latias is guaranteed to OHKO Scizor with HP Fire unboosted after 2 Stealth Rock switch-ins (77% - 91%). Celebi IMO is necessary to take out Fighting-types, namely Conkeldurr and, well, Breloom.
  11. TheGreatMilenko

    TheGreatMilenko

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
    Messages:
    108
    Really great suggestions guys. I was actually debating putting a double boost terrakion when this team was in the making but just settled on choice band. I really like the suggestion for double boosting terrakion, if that doesn't work out I will try the scarf set and see what differences it makes for the team.

    Dragonite really is no problem for anyone on the team, if they run earthquake it makes it a bit harder but a psychic from celebi gets dnite to around 50% when he has multiscale on, add rocks and he is done.

    About scarf rotom, it really hasn't been that much of a problem, your point about hidden power grass is pretty good though, I will most likely add thunderbolt over hidden power grass. The set I am running now has really been helping me out.

    I will also try that heatran set out, I am probably going to put earth power on heatran somewhere because opposing heatran are pretty annoying switching in on mine all night for free.

    Starmie doesn't really do much to the team honestly, Rotom can handle it nice, Celebi can resist it's STAB's and live an ice beam to leaf storm. Latias can calm mind and use starmie as set up fodder, ice beam starts doing nothing after a calm mind or two.
  12. Sayonara

    Sayonara don't forget

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2011
    Messages:
    764
    Quick suggestion; try Earth Power over Protect on Heatran. That way, you can take care of opposing Heatrans.​
  13. TheGreatMilenko

    TheGreatMilenko

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
    Messages:
    108
    That change I was heavily thinking of implementing for a while now. I will make that change. Looking for any more rates.
  14. TheGreatMilenko

    TheGreatMilenko

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
    Messages:
    108
    Bump. edited main post, made changes.
  15. Joeyboy

    Joeyboy Check out my Youtube channel! JoeyboyGames!
    is a Smogon Media Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnus

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    Nov 30, 2010
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    1,416
    Great team man! Your synergy is really quite something. I enjoy the mini-cores you have for dealing with enemy team styles. (Heatran/Latias for Sun, Celebi/Rotom for Rain etc)

    First thing I see though is that Hidden Power Ground Volcarona takes this team to the cleaners. In the sun it can set-up on Rotom-W and also Scizor trapped into a lame move. The unfortunate thing is that not much counters HP Ground Volcarona(unless you want to switch 'mons, which I believe would be detrimental). So I recommend running Quick Attack on Scizor. This would let you sufficiently check Volcarona no matter what. You would run Quick Attack over either Superpower or Pursuit.

    Now the choice is really up to you, and I suggest you test both options out to get a feel for both. On my Scizor I run Quick Attack over Superpower; I do this because my team has a lot more trouble with Lati@s as opposed to Heatran/Ferrothorn. Pursuit can be a pain to be locked into, but getting rid of Latios can obviously be beneficial, as Heatran is your only resist. Though without Superpower you will not be able to hit those Steels as hard. Though I think Superpower is the weaker option as your team can handle those 'mons it would hit hard, quite well (Rotom and Heatran for opposing Heatran; Celebi and Heatran for Ferrothorns.

    Quick Attack would also give you more insurance against SubBounce DD Gyarados, who again sets-up on Scizor and can't be touched by your Rotom's Volt Switch.

    I would also like to second Snorlaxe's suggestion of Bulk Up Breloom for the reasons already stated.

    I know it's a small change but your team really seems pretty solid(will keep looking for other threats though :), hope you try it out, and let me know how it goes.

    Good Luck!
  16. TheGreatMilenko

    TheGreatMilenko

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
    Messages:
    108
    I am a fan of the idea of quick attack on scizor. I will use it over pursuit though because hitting heatran and magnezone is too valuable to the team.

    I would use the bulk up breloom but my team would develop a weakness to conkeldurr and be more weak to fighting types.

    If I could somehow handle fighting types better I would love to use breloom but currently I can't afford it
  17. Joeyboy

    Joeyboy Check out my Youtube channel! JoeyboyGames!
    is a Smogon Media Contributoris a Team Rater Alumnus

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    Hm, well have you tried the Breloom set Snorlaxe recommended? It really shouldn't ever lose to a standard BU Conkeldurr. Also Latias is a pretty solid fighting-type check, atm Celebi really can't counter many of the OU fighting-types anyway.

    Conkeldurr:(which imo should always have SpDef bulk, but might be the only fighting-type your Celebi could beat) will be able to do massive damage with Payback.

    Now the rest of the OU Fighting-types are all going to be faster than your Celebi

    Lucario: has Ice Punch a lot and does a number to your slower Celebi.

    Terrakion: has X-Scissor

    Scrafty: has Stab Crunch and access to Ice Punch

    Infernape: has all of his Fire moves.

    Toxicroak: has Ice Punch and Sucker-Punch

    Virizion: Forget about it, all you can do is Thunder-Wave :)

    Your slow Celebi really can't defend from the OU fighting-types, its only there to give a resist to their fighting stabs. Between the rest of your 'mons though you should be able to handle them.

    TL;DR Version: Please try Breloom, he won't disappoint

    Also somthing I just noticed; in your Rotom-W's description, the types you say he likes switching into tend, a lot of the time, to be special. Have you ever considered running Special Bulk on him? I wouldn't be able to give examples because I've never even thought of running SpBulk on Rotom but it's something to think of now that Excadrill is gone, and Rotom doesn't need the bulk to beat him.
  18. TheGreatMilenko

    TheGreatMilenko

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
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    108
    I will try Breloom right now, celebii was honestly just for Conkeldurr but I see his usage has dropped I am pretty sure. I'll get back to you and also try quick attack on scizor.

    Celebi can beat virizion and has a useful fighting type resist, I will see what breloom offers and update the RMT accordingly, really appreciate the rate.
  19. Shurtugal

    Shurtugal The Enterpriser.

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2011
    Messages:
    1,303
    Volcarona and dragonite are not a problem, Stealth Rocks people. Tram is running it. On iod, so proper rate later.
  20. TheGreatMilenko

    TheGreatMilenko

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
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    108
    ^Stealth rocks does help, but spinners can be annoying.

    Bump, updated my OP, updated descriptions, sets, EVS, and team members.
  21. Downf4ll

    Downf4ll

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
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    I like the team, and I'm quite rusty but here's my rate (my input is in red):

    Show Hide
  22. TheGreatMilenko

    TheGreatMilenko

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
    Messages:
    108
    Hey man thanks for the rate I appreciate it a lot. I think you also take the cake for most strange music references in a single rate.

    For Scizor superpower is an absolute must, magnezone is a common sight on teams who want to abuse dragon type STAB and is all around an annoying douche of a pokemon whos presence on a team would be even more scary knowing if I do not U-Turn I am out. Quick attack is also a very valuable move for killing pokemon who resist Bullet Punch first and most importanty, HP Ground Volcarona.

    Rotom-W really has gone through quite a few sets on the team and HP grass i can honestly say is MUCH more useful than getting a burn off. If you want, try the team out anyone can if they want and don't use hp grass on rotom.

    The day I see a gastrodon is terrible, as rotom is such an important pokemon to the team he is THE main momentum getter and a constant source of damage. As soon as I have rotom-w on the field I can do nothing, not hydro pump, volt switch, thunder bolt, or pain split 99% of the time. This stops all offensive momentum for the team and I have seen increased results for the team.

    Changing his set to special of a mixed defensive set is an interesting opinion, I will most likely try it out and get back to you. However taking U-Turns, Stone edges and neutral hits on the physical side I value over taking resisted hits on the special size.

    As for the nickname I sat down for about 3 hours thinking a name for Rotom-W and just went with this, not original, not creative but in the next week I will have a better one for sure.

    I appreciate the rate and that terrakion set is actually devestating without setting up. Terrakion is honestly just used as a constant revenge killer, heavy hitter and when he can set up, he sweeps entire teams.
  23. TheGreatMilenko

    TheGreatMilenko

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2011
    Messages:
    108
  24. Bugdomking

    Bugdomking

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2010
    Messages:
    91
    You should consider Mach Punch instead of Drain Punch on Breloom. Even without technician, I can imagine being outsped is a hassle, and your Poison Heal should be giving you enough. Just a thought.
  25. Ninja Dewott

    Ninja Dewott

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2011
    Messages:
    71
    However, if Volcarona carries HP Ground, as many now do, then he's screwed. A scarf Terrakion, is in my opinion, by far the best set. Terrakion already has a great Base Attack Stat, along with 2 brilliant and powerful STABs, so power from SD/CB isn't all that neccessary. Scarf Terrakion, however, allows you to check numerous threats such as Volcarona, Dragonite and Salamence, the latter, if it is mixed, is also a large threat to your team. A double booster set, imo, lacks many great coverage moves, such as X-scissor, which leave it walled by the likes of Celebi.

    However, the rest of your team is fine (athough I do reccomed a Scarf Rotom-W, but you argue a good case against that, so that's cool), good job. (Opposing Scizor's look like they could be a bit of a problem though, so watch out)

    Everyone's using Bulk Up Breloom now -.-

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