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Small Subjective Changes - Controversial Edits

Discussion in 'Sixth Generation Contributions' started by Oglemi, Oct 15, 2013.

  1. Oglemi

    Oglemi it's me heysup's gay friend, the legendary gaysup
    is a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
    C&C Leader

    Oct 13, 2009
    Post small subjective changes in this thread. This thread is for subjective changes only. If you find an error that is syntactical, grammatical, typographical, orthographical, or technical please use the Small changes thread.

    Subjective changes includes:
    • Removing excess move options from a move set.
    • Small additions to a move set.
    • A change in an EV Spread.
    • Any small additions or revisions to Other Options or Counters.
    • Any small change that is subjective in nature, but is too trivial to go in a peer edit.

    Notice: To those with SCMS access, you do not need to post here. Simply make the change yourself directly and provide your reasoning in the "Edit Reason" box. If you make a change suggested by another user on the SCMS, please list your reasoning as "Small Changes Thread" so one of us can come and delete the appropriate posts.

    Couple each post with a link to the relevant analysis or article you are requesting a change in. Most importantly, if you are suggesting something - back it up with reasoning. It doesn't help us to know that you think Farfetch'd should run 220 HP EVs; what helps us is knowing why you think Farfetch'd should run 220 HP EVs.
  2. Age of Kings

    Age of Kings

    Oct 14, 2007
    Hi, I wasn't sure where to put this but I think this is an appropriate place.

    Nature Power is blocked by Taunt but this is not mentioned on its move page or Taunt's page. (I can provide in-game Gen VI screenshot for proof.) I find this worthy of mentioning because several Pokemon use it for coverage and may find themselves unable to use an "attacking" move because of Taunt. In particular, I have an objection to it being listed as Aurorus' primary STAB in its analysis because it may find itself being locked out of its primary STAB due to Taunt. I do not propose any radical changes, merely:
    • mentioning on Nature Power's move page that it can be blocked by Taunt as a downside to the move
    • slashing in Ice Beam on Aurorus' analysis because for something so slow it can be easily taunted without repercussion
    I know these are situational and nitpicky, but it happened to me (not mad, I swear!) and I feel it should be mentioned to maintain optimality. tbh I'm not sure what else uses it anymore but I think that it can be helpful for future analysis writers. Thanks in advance.
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2013
    WhinoTheRhino likes this.
  3. ApplepieFTW


    Sep 27, 2013
    I would not slash it on the analysis, as nature power is much more powerful and having your Aurorus taunted is not the most likely scenario. Taunting it is a good way to deal with it, don't get me wrong but this is such a situational situation and I don't think it justifies slashing ice beam. It could be mentioned briefly in OO maybe.

    (we are allowed to discuss changes here right? if not I'm sorry feel free to delete this)
  4. Agent Gibbs

    Agent Gibbs Rule 51
    is a Community Contributor

    Dec 8, 2011
    I just have a quick nitpick for the Amoonguss analysis, which is already in the Preliminary Pokedex section. I'd like to recommend that 4 EVs be moved from Def to SpD on the main set as this will allow Amoonguss to always survive Timid Sheer Force Landorus's LO Psychic from full health so that it can paralyze Landorus, put it to sleep, or at least do a little damage with Giga Drain. It's a bit situational, but since it only requires moving a measly 4 EVs, I think it's worth it.
    Goddess Briyella likes this.
  5. blarajan

    blarajan i was born under the same star as shakeitup
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus
    Little Cup Leader

    Aug 29, 2010
    I edited the Gliscor analysis. I gave it one more speed point. The current spread tied with Mamoswine, which was unacceptable. I took 4 evs out of Defense and put them in Speed so it can outrun and KO weakened Mamoswine, something loads more important than Naughty Mega Garchomp lol.
  6. Unowninator


    Oct 12, 2008

    Flatter only gives +1 Sp. Atk, not 2.
  7. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

    Jul 3, 2009
    Heat Wave should be slashed with Focus Blast on Assault Vest Tornadus-T, probably before it. It OHKOes any Mega Scizor after SR, and 2HKOes Mega Mawile, two of the few MEvos that want to switch into Torn-T, and thus could absorb Knock Off, as well as check Torn-T. Heat Wave also lets Torn-T beat Aegislash 1 on 1 after you Knock Off its Leftovers, so you don't need another teammate to take Shadow Ball hits after Torn-T lures it and removes its item. Heat Wave also better handles Ferrothorn, Skarmory, and does 85% minimum to Bisharp, a OHKO with just a bit of previous damage. So without Focus Blast you only miss on 2HKOing Heatran (which is already crippled badly by Knock Off, as it relies a lot on its items), Tyranitar (hit by U-turn for decent damage + momentum), Mega Gyarados (will be at +1 by the time you switch into it), Mamoswine (bad 1 v 1 for Torn-T, and Hurricane, Knock Off, or U-turn are all great moves against Mamo anyway, if it ever tries to switch into Torn-T), Terrakion, and Diggersby (which OHKOes with Quick Attack at +2 and would never switch into Torn-T anyway). So you really only miss on hitting Heatran (still crippled by Knock Off), Terrakion, and Tyranitar, arguably easier Pokemon to deal with than Mega Mawile, Mega Scizor, and Aegislash. Not to mention that Heat Wave lets Torn-T threaten more MEvos and thus be a better Knock Off abuser.
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2014
    fleurdyleurse likes this.
  8. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

    Jul 3, 2009
    Stone Edge should be a first slash on Tyranitar's physically defensive set. It allows Tyranitar to OHKO Thundurus, Talonflame (even when burned), Kyurem-B, Mega and Pinsir, all Pokemon that Tyranitar checks, as well as hit Mega Charizard for huge damage, sometimes OHKOing it after SR or leaving it as easy picking for even the weakest of priority users. It' also his strongest option against some of its checks, namely Azumarill and Clefable. Stone Edge is just essential on Tyranitar, and idk why someone would use Tyranitar without it.

    I also question the slash of EQ alone on the last slot. The reason for EQ > Fire Blast seems to be to not lower your attack when hitting Aegislash, but Fire Blast already accomplishes this and hits more stuff, such as Skarmory, Ferrothorn, and Mega Scizor, in addition to other Steel-types that EQ also hits, such as Bisharp, Excadrill, and Mega Mawile. And 2HKOing two of the best defensive Defog users (Skarmory and Mega Scizor) is incredibly important for a SR setter. The only Pokemon you miss on hitting is Heatran, which is hit for decent damage by Stone Edge anyway. And Mega Tyranitar, but you are not even 2HKOing it with EQ even after SR the vast majority of the time, while it easily 2HKOes back at +1, so meh. Imo, the moveset should be this:

    name: Support
    move 1: Stealth Rock
    move 2: Stone Edge
    move 3: Fire Blast
    move 4: Crunch / Ice Beam

    With EQ mentioned in Moves, or maybe a slash after Fire Blast. Toxic is a handy move that can be used to cripple usual switch-ins (Hippo, Lando-T, Mandibuzz, Azumarill, Garchomp, Keldeo, Quagsire, Chesnaught) and could get a mention in Moves.
  9. Geo3456


    Jun 27, 2014
    Gliscor's page refers to its Special Defense base stat of 75 as "abysmal", while Scizor's page calls its Special Defense of 80 "mediocre special bulk". To top it off, Gliscor has better HP than Scizor, balancing the two in special bulk. Perhaps changing the wording of Gliscor's page would make it more likely to see use in competitive play.
    V4Victini likes this.
  10. LightningLuxray

    LightningLuxray is shocking!
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Aug 31, 2013
    Alright, this is really, really trivial, but DP Ubers Quagsire isn't running any attacking moves, so it should be running a Calm nature instead of a Careful nature to minimize confusion damage.
    Magnemite and Muk like this.
  11. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

    Jul 3, 2009
    On the revenge killer set of Talonflame, Fire Blast should be slashed after Flare Blitz, and WoW somewhere on the last slot. Fire Blast is a great option on Sharp Beak sets with a Naughty nature, allowing Talonflame to avoid the huge recoil that comes from KOing Ferrothorn and other Steel-types. It is also more effective than Flare Blitz against Skarmory, and in general covers most of what Flare Blitz covers, without the recoil. It even lets Talonflame bypass Intimidate from Pokemon such as Landorus-T and Mega Mawile, and actually hits max HP / max Def+ Lando-T a bit harder than Sharp Beak Brave Bird. Also, WoW is a great option on the last slot to cripple usual switch-ins (Tyranitar, Lando-T, Hippowdon, Rotom-W), and also cripple unsuspecting Sucker Punch users that think Talonflame is Band-locked after it KOes something, and in general giving it a way to avoid Sucker Punch while crippling the opponent back (unlike Roost). This is how the set should look like:

    Revenge Killer
    name: Revenge Killer
    move 1: Brave Bird
    move 2: Flare Blitz / Fire Blast
    move 3: U-turn
    move 4: Tailwind / Will-O-Wisp / Roost
    ability: Gale Wings
    item: Choice Band / Sharp Beak
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    nature: Adamant / Naughty

    Also, i think that Sharp Beak > CB, but this is more of a personal preference and minor thing, so whatever.

    Finally, Life Orb should get a Set Details mention when using Fire Blast, allowing Fire Blast to do ~41% damage to max HP Landorus-T and Hippowdon, ~47% to 252 HP / 184+ Def Gliscor, and almost always OHKO Mega Mawile after SR,.

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