CAP 1 Smogon's First "Create a Pokemon": Poll 13, part 2

What dex entry should we use for Syclant (PICK TWO)?

  • Entry 1

    Votes: 45 27.1%
  • Entry 2

    Votes: 44 26.5%
  • Entry 3

    Votes: 61 36.7%
  • Entry 4

    Votes: 45 27.1%
  • Entry 5

    Votes: 61 36.7%
  • Entry 6

    Votes: 65 39.2%

  • Total voters
    166
  • Poll closed .
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eric the espeon

maybe I just misunderstood
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finaly someone replys!!! ok i will copy my stuff from the previous thread.

ice shell (the ability that was voted for in this poll http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34050 ) gives imunity to spikes, SR and toxic spikes.

mountineer gives imunity too rock moves on the turn it switchis in, this includes SR.

in a previous poll ice shell won, but someone convinced cooper to change the effect and name off this ability, i do not think this is right. we should have a final short poll to see which ability people want. if they prefer mountineer this time i am fine with that, all i am disagreeing with is cooper changeing the ability after votes had been cast.

i think that mountineer is more powerfull than ice shell, a total imunity to a type that no other pokemon is imune to, and a type that is is normily 4x weak to even for 1 turn seams odd, and more powerful than imunity from spikes/toxic spikes which all flying pokemon and all levitators are imune to.

and in reply to mega mewtwos objection

ok i am sorry i did not say my objections sooner, i was on holaday. but you are wrong several people did complain about the late change, and i have a 3rd sujestion what about removeing the rock imunity and just makeing it imune to SR, as what cooper was trying to say is that he is weakening the ability, but imunity from rock is more usefull than imunity from SR.
 
i voteed 4 and 5, because i like defensive females:naughty:

i also like he gallade-like manners in fighting, manners everyone should have:pimp:
 

Mario With Lasers

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2 and 4.

I didn't like the Delibird jokes, 6 is too... absurd (like Blue Harvest pointed out), and 5 is too... I don't know, dull? Pretty much the majority of the D/P pokédex entries.

...And I'm still for the aggresive-but-courteous bug fighters.
 
If Syclant's spines are as hard as it says in #6, that means they could hold 7,500 4 ton vehicals.


Doesn't that sound like a lot? Stop voting #6!
 
You can't tell us what to vote for <_<. The Delibird ones arent that good. They are basically a rip of a Pokemon. If that wins, then that would just give Nintendo more the reason to NOT accept our Scylant. With #6 it works flavour-wise, and what kid is going to spend time trying to figure out how harda Scylant's Spike is? That's right, no one. Barely anyone pays attention to the Dex entries, so they wouldn't take time out to figure something out. Only # 4 and 6 really work. Mine, from the last poll also worked, but w/e it was dropped.

EDIT: I went back and read the other entries. #2 Definatly isnt really good. Im sorry to say. I realized #5 works well too. The presents thing would DEFINATLY not be used. Nintendo aims Pokemon at every age category, but mainly at younger kids. They wouldn't want a "Bully" in their games, unless it works with their story-line, kind of like the MD story with Team Meanies. But remember how it turned out? They turned nice and went out of their way to help the Protagonist. I mean, yes there are some Dex entries that are kind of gruesome, but they are on mainly UU/Bl Pokes that no one pays attention to. I mean, how many of you actually knew the Gorebyss entry? And if you look at prior entries, the whole ageing Pokemon and Physical changes during aging is VERY common. They tend to favor something to that effect.

Also, i just realized i have over 100 posts. How did that happen?
 

eric the espeon

maybe I just misunderstood
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If Syclant's spines are as hard as it says in #6, that means they could hold 7,500 4 ton vehicals.


Doesn't that sound like a lot? Stop voting #6!
lol that sound a bit too strong, though machop could lift, what was it.. 100 people.

come on people read my post at the top of this page and reply.
 
finaly someone replys!!! ok i will copy my stuff from the previous thread.

ice shell (the ability that was voted for in this poll http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=34050 ) gives imunity to spikes, SR and toxic spikes.

mountineer gives imunity too rock moves on the turn it switchis in, this includes SR.

in a previous poll ice shell won, but someone convinced cooper to change the effect and name off this ability, i do not think this is right. we should have a final short poll to see which ability people want. if they prefer mountineer this time i am fine with that, all i am disagreeing with is cooper changeing the ability after votes had been cast.

i think that mountineer is more powerfull than ice shell, a total imunity to a type that no other pokemon is imune to, and a type that is is normily 4x weak to even for 1 turn seams odd, and more powerful than imunity from spikes/toxic spikes which all flying pokemon and all levitators are imune to.

and in reply to mega mewtwos objection

ok i am sorry i did not say my objections sooner, i was on holaday. but you are wrong several people did complain about the late change, and i have a 3rd sujestion what about removeing the rock imunity and just makeing it imune to SR, as what cooper was trying to say is that he is weakening the ability, but imunity from rock is more usefull than imunity from SR.
Quite a few [meaning everyone, except for you] are fine with this choice. Think of it this wy, its not a fire resist, so its fine. It might have worked if the Dex entry that we choose has something to do with living on mountains, but that doesn't seem likely. And anyway, its not like its totally imune to Rock. Its just a switch thing. If you get a good Poke that sorta resits his attacks, and has rock, he is as good as dead.
 

eric the espeon

maybe I just misunderstood
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Quite a few [meaning everyone, except for you] (wrong. tawanesedude agreed with me, and several people on the thread i linked to disagreed with the last minet change) are fine with this choice. Think of it this wy, its not a fire resist, so its fine (whats this about? giveing it an imunity to one 4x weak it adout the same as another, also who sugested giveing it an imunity from fire?). It might have worked if the Dex entry that we choose has something to do with living on mountains, but that doesn't seem likely (true... but you are contradicting your own arguement there). And anyway, its not like its totally imune to Rock. Its just a switch thing (ok, its not as bad as a total imunity but it lets it switch in on a type that nothing else is imune to). If you get a good Poke that sorta resits his attacks, and has rock, he is as good as dead (sorta? what are you on about? i am not saying mountineer makes it overpowerd, i am saying that cooper changed the name and effect after most people had voted).
 
all of these choices seem to have some kind of "yum I eat ice pokemon for breakfast" thing going on, which is just pretty dumb. The only ones that are exempt from this are 6, which trades that in for big number syndrome, and 5, which I think is the only really good choice
 
Ok. Well i jumped in around Poll 7, so i missed that. Also, i forgot that bug was weak to rock, so I was saying that its better than it being resistant to a X4 weak, but that was wrong. Still, its nnot like it is a full imuntiy. And there is another ability. It really depends on what you are using. TBH, i can't really see this being used > than Compund Eyes. With Blizzard being so inaccurate, but basically its strongest move, because Ice Beam doesn't do much, Compund Eyes is def going to be used. And you know what? Maybe we can make the ability less common than Compund, just so its fair? Idk if that would work. TBH, i don't feel like arguing, cause ATm im really busy. But, I'd say you go out with a list of people's names on the forum that still want Icce Shell, an show it to Cooper. He might reject it if there isn't enough people, or say ok if there is a lot of people.
 
I agree with Eric the Espeon, I much preferred Ice Shell. Just because a couple people made a comment, Cooper changed it. How about all the people who voted for it as it was? I think we should at least have a poll to determine which one we REALLY like better.
 

eric the espeon

maybe I just misunderstood
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Ok. Well i jumped in around Poll 7, so i missed that (right). Also, i forgot that bug was weak to rock, so I was saying that its better than it being resistant to a X4 weak, but that was wrong (ok). Still, its nnot like it is a full imuntiy (no, but its a briliant ability). And there is another ability. It really depends on what you are using. TBH, i can't really see this being used > than Compund Eyes. With Blizzard being so inaccurate, but basically its strongest move, because Ice Beam doesn't do much, Compund Eyes is def going to be used (true it will probably be used less but you could always use ice beam over blizzard, and abomnasnow fixes the inacuricy). And you know what? Maybe we can make the ability less common than Compund, just so its fair? Idk if that would work (all pokemon abilitys are 50/50, people will get it anyway it would just take a bit longer. this will probably only go on shoddy battle). TBH, i don't feel like arguing, cause ATm im really busy (ok, fine). But, I'd say you go out with a list of people's names on the forum that still want Icce Shell, an show it to Cooper. He might reject it if there isn't enough people, or say ok if there is a lot of people (it would be FAR simpler to have 1 extra poll to see whitch ability people want).
hitit4three thank you for your support, we want to have the ability we vote for cooper. or atleast a poll to see if opinion has changed.
 

eric the espeon

maybe I just misunderstood
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cooper can you please reply to me and the people who think your change of the ability after most people had voted was wrong.

also 6 needs some work, it sais something twice and the ice spikes are to strong
 
Sorry, I try not to read really long posts when I think I can avoid it. Anyway, I gave plenty of advance warning about the change. It's not like Ice Shell had won part three, and in the next poll I suddenly sprang, "Hey guys, the ability you voted for doesn't exist!" No, I actually posted what I was doing, and changed the text in my original post. The people that you're referring to in your argument are the ones who didn't read the entire post before voting, meaning they either voted randomly (see Hyra's argument in Poll 11, I believe) or they hadn't been keeping up with things at all, which meant they were clearly unfit to make decisions like that anyway.
 
Yes, you did change the ability during the third poll. My point is, maybe people just saw it as better than the other choices and would prefer the original Ice Shell over Mountaineer. Lets remember, mountaineer is not a bad ability, it was better than other options, but we might prefer ice shell over mountaineer still.
 

eric the espeon

maybe I just misunderstood
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Sorry, I try not to read really long posts when I think I can avoid it. Anyway, I gave plenty of advance warning about the change (posting after the poll had started saying the ability is now.... is not advance warning, also even though you did edit you 1st post you did not say that you had edited it clearly in that post, i and many other people asumed that since the name was the same the effect was the same.). It's not like Ice Shell had won part three (it was 2), and in the next poll I suddenly sprang, "Hey guys, the ability you voted for doesn't exist!" No, I actually posted what I was doing, and changed the text in my original post (true, but not the name and you did not make it clear). The people that you're referring to in your argument are the ones who didn't read the entire post before voting (you mean asumed that the ability had not changed since part 1?), meaning they either voted randomly (see Hyra's argument in Poll 11, I believe) or they hadn't been keeping up with things at all (no. many people disagred with the changes simply because the new ability does not make sence), which meant they were clearly unfit to make decisions like that anyway.
some choice quotes from the poll

drakhun said:
The way you changed Ice Shell is dumb. Making it only avoid SR makes no sense, if it can avoid that it should stock all spikes. Second, why would it only be immune to rock for a brief second? Third, you shouldn't chage the ability halfway through the poll. Fourth: It makes no sense to be immune to rock when switching, but no other time.
hyra said:
Almost no one else likes the change to Ice Shell, meaning most of them want to repeal their votes.
Cooper said:
It's my program and I can do whatever the hell I want *crosses arms and sticks out tongue*.
Deucalion2 said:
That ability makes no sense. No damage from any Rocks on switching in? Why is switching in so special? Why not just give it Rock Absorb, and finish the job off. IMO, being able to switch into TTar, Gyara, Hippo, etc, without taking one bit of damage if you predict right, is shattered beyond belief.

Just make it no indirect damage on entry to battle, ie, SR, TS, Spikes. Simple, easy, isn't broken, and makes sense.
 
I will have another poll if you can explain to me why Ice Shell is not broken. Because you are insistent, I will bring up several arguments of mine from the past:

1) SR kills Syclant. That is a fact. However, Spikes kills everything. There is no logical reason for Syclant to have any advantage over other pokemon in that sense.

2) The reason for Ice Shell's creation was to protect it from coming in with 50% health. I should know, considering that I'm the one who created it. Protection from Spikes and TS were to make it more appealing flavor-wise. Mountaineer is just as flavorful.

3) It's my program and I can do whatever the hell I want.

Riddle me that!
 

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Eric, I understand your point about changes after the poll. However, this isn't like government legislation or a legal proceeding. There are no defined "rules" for how this thing is done.

We can't have a vote for every little thing that comes up. Many of these polls have required the mini-mod (that's Cooper) to make judgement calls along the way. Taken to the extreme, the mini-mod could be a tyrant through this whole process and do whatever he/she wants. That defeats the purpose of a voting system, and I hope the community would decline to participate in such an affair. However, in moderation, the mini-mod can streamline the process and keep this moving in a way that is generally positive for all of us.

Where do you draw the line? I don't know, and I really don't care. If the mini-mod starts getting too authoritarian, I'll just stop participating and he/she can fuck off for all I care. Otherwise, I'll voice my objections when they come up and see where it goes.

So, yes, we are placing some trust and faith in the mini-mod to behave logically, fair, and in the interest of the community as a whole. In that respect, I think Cooper has done a pretty darn good job. Do I agree with every single decision that he has made? No. But, on the whole, I think he has tried to be reasonable and fair. I can't ask for much more than that.

I really don't want another poll. Particularly for something like this. If we do that, we basically open up the whole ability discussion again. Ugh...

You've voiced your concern, and Cooper has responded. He's not going to do what you want. That sucks for you, but get over it. I don't think it's a very big pill to swallow.
 

eric the espeon

maybe I just misunderstood
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I will have another poll if you can explain to me why Ice Shell is not broken. Because you are insistent, I will bring up several arguments of mine from the past:

1) SR kills Syclant. That is a fact. However, Spikes kills everything.
flying/levitate pokemon are imune to spikes, it does not kill/hurt "everything"
There is no logical reason for Syclant to have any advantage over other pokemon in that sense.
while this is true, rock attacks (even just on the switch) are much more of a problam for syclant than spikes, especily as ice shell/mountineer will manly be used on hail teams, and on a hail team most pokemon are weak to rock greatly increceing the chance of am incomeing rock attack.

2) The reason for Ice Shell's creation was to protect it from coming in with 50% health.
both abilitys will do this.
I should know, considering that I'm the one who created it.
realy, i had forgoten who had the 1st idea, i remember i popularised it as a less broken alternitive to "shiver" (auto, unblockable rapid spin whenever it switches in).
Protection from Spikes and TS were to make it more appealing flavor-wise.
yes, that is true.
Mountaineer is just as flavorful.
now this i disagree with, just because you live in mountins does not mean that you can avoud all rocks that are in your way, it certinly does not provide justificaton to remove a 4x weakness even for 1 turn. an icey shell however would provide some protection.

3) It's my program and I can do whatever the hell I want.
i hope this is a joke, but its true you have the final choice however this is based on votes and you do need to take other peoples opinions into acount

if you do do a poll add a 3rd ability that only blocks SR, it would be less powerful than the other 2 options.

Riddle me that!
done
doug i posted this before i saw your post, am reading/replying now

dougjustdoug said:
Eric, I understand your point about changes after the poll. However, this isn't like government legislation or a legal proceeding. There are no defined "rules" for how this thing is done.
yes this is true, but cooper should listen if people disagree with something he does.

We can't have a vote for every little thing that comes up.
this is not little, many people disagreed at the time, i would have done more actively but i could not get on the internet much at that time.
Many of these polls have required the mini-mod (that's Cooper) to make judgement calls along the way. Taken to the extreme, the mini-mod could be a tyrant through this whole process and do whatever he/she wants. That defeats the purpose of a voting system, and I hope the community would decline to participate in such an affair. However, in moderation, the mini-mod can streamline the process and keep this moving in a way that is generally positive for all of us.
yes. i agree with that, cooper has generly been very fair, and removed only those options that are too stupid/broken to work, but this has been the one thing i seriosly disagree with.

Where do you draw the line? I don't know, and I really don't care. If the mini-mod starts getting too authoritarian, I'll just stop participating and he/she can fuck off for all I care. Otherwise, I'll voice my objections when they come up and see where it goes.
i like this program and want it to work, i will not back down untill someone convinces me i am wrong or their is masive opinion againt me.

So, yes, we are placing some trust and faith in the mini-mod to behave logically, fair, and in the interest of the community as a whole. In that respect, I think Cooper has done a pretty darn good job. Do I agree with every single decision that he has made? No. But, on the whole, I think he has tried to be reasonable and fair. I can't ask for much more than that.
i agree with most of that, but as i have said this needs to be looked at again.

I really don't want another poll. Particularly for something like this. If we do that, we basically open up the whole ability discussion again. Ugh...
it will be simple and probably short.

You've voiced your concern, and Cooper has responded. He's not going to do what you want. That sucks for you, but get over it. I don't think it's a very big pill to swallow.
you probably posted this before reading his last post, read it.
also in 10 mins will not be online for about 9 hours so dont expect me to reply soon
 
You have failed to provide me with an adequate reason to extend the polling, and therefore I will not. What you did was merely nitpick my reasoning, while failing to explain how an ability that allows switching in on Skarm, taking no damage, so you can kill it with Thunderpunch/Hidden Power Fire is not broken. however, I do respect your feelings regarding my mini-modding. But I don't plan to control the second "Create a Pokemon," so it doesn't particularly matter.

Now for something completely different. People have voiced opinions that we should take the top three dex entries and send them to Nintendo, instead of the top two. Does everyone think this is a good idea? I mean, it would make Poll 13, part 3 unnecessary, meaning we'd be done at 10 p.m. today, as opposed to 10 a.m Tuesday.
 
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