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Snowball in Rain

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Iluvkyogre, Jun 4, 2012.

  1. Iluvkyogre

    Iluvkyogre

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2012
    Messages:
    51
    Snowball in Rain (isn’t it supposed to melt??)

    Well this is my first official RMT (I totally F***ed up my first one) and it works pretty well even though it is rather unorthodox. Please, do NOT stop reading after you see the members of my team… Well, let’s get on to it.


    Builiding Process

    [​IMG][​IMG]

    Yeah, this is a Salamence. Don’t go see the doctor, your eyes are perfectly fine, I DO have a Salamence on a rain team. It is the star, the thing my team was named after. It actually works because rain provides perfect support to it, and all of the other members that go with him are also supported by rain more or less. So don’t go thinking I’m a noob, this thing DOES WORK!
    --

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Jirachi, the haxinator, the stealth rocker, the one who weakens a few pokes before letting Salamence coming in. Enough said, it does well.
    --

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    I started feeling that water types are giving me a few problems and would need more defensive synergy so I chose… CELEBI!!! Even though this thing didn’t make it till the end, I still put it here.
    --

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Tornadus is a Bawse, nothing less, Stab Hurricane, Hammer arm for Blissey, priority Taunt for Stallbreaking and Rain Dance to win the weather wars, this thing works. Before continuing, I tried Dragonite instead of Salamence but thing doesn’t do half as well as Salamence on this team so it got kicked out, just to say.
    --

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Both of my sweepers are weak to rocks so I needed a spinner, Starmie is too frail, Foretress is crap and Donphan is not my thing. And Tentacruel directly benefits from the Rain through the form of Rain Dish. And the ever useful Toxic Spikes is always a plus.
    --
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Celebi just doesn’t seem right on a team focused on constant pressure and paralysis is already spread by Jirachi. The only reason Celebi is there is the electric resistance and Jolteon does a WAY better job (Volt Absorb). Volt switch deals MASSIVE damage when super effective and buys momentum. So here it is, the final product.
    --


    Under a Microscope

    [​IMG]

    IMakeItRain! (Politoed) (F) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Surf
    - Ice Beam
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Grass]

    My usual lead, this thing packs a punch and summons weather; it can usually kill a thing or two. The moves are self explanatory, covers up the majority of the metagame. Surf is used over Hydro Pump because rather miss a kill than do no damage at all. How I use this thing, it requires prediction. If I see Gastrodon in team preview I will directly go for Hp Grass then switch out. If else, SURF THERE A**ES(or choose the right move)!!!

    [​IMG]

    Snowball (Salamence) (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naughty Nature (+Atk, -SDef)
    - Outrage
    - Dragon Claw
    - Fire Blast
    - Brick Break

    The MVP of the team, the snowball that never melts. He who can use Fire Blast to whoop Ferro a**es even in rain. I usually spin rocks away, kill the steels and send in Jolteon/Tornadus to hurt something, let it die and give Salamence a free switch-in. Usually, Salamence would weaken itself while taking out walls so Wish passing from Jirachi would make it healthy for Round Two of Snowball Sweep. I don’t really use Fire Blast that much due to the rain and I eliminate Steels before switching in.

    [​IMG]

    Lemon (Jirachi) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Wish
    - Stealth Rock
    - Iron Head
    - Thunder Wave

    I don’t know why I called this thing Lemon but whatever. This is definitely the best utility Pokemon in the metagame. Wish passing to my frail sweepers, stealth rock is always a boon on offense teams and Thunder Wave + Iron Head is horrible to face. Proof: An opponent forfeited seeing my Jirachi having Iron Head. An important aspect to Jirachi is its ability to eat Draco Meteors and Thunders for breakfast. The continuous spam of these moves can wreck my team. Luckily Cyclohm is not allowed in standard play yet.

    [​IMG]
    Jolteon (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Thunder
    - Volt Switch
    - Signal Beam
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    Jolteon, a wonderful but underrated Pokemon. It outspeeds Salamence without boosts, can kill (or hurt badly) the majority of OU Pokemon and is very effective on keeping the pressure on the opponent. It benefits from a fully accurate Thunder and is part 1A of my hurt-something, then die then go to Salamence strategy. Forgetting Salamence, Jolteon himself can sweep the opposing team! I don’t pass Wishes to it too often. Unlike Tornadus, it cannot really clean up due to its weaker defnse stats. Letting it die while paving the way for Salamence obtains more momentum in my favour.

    [​IMG]

    Irene (Tornadus) (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Prankster
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 Spa / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Hurricane
    - Hammer Arm
    - Rain Dance
    - Taunt

    A BAWSE! A BAWSE! A Bawse… That’s what it is. The two attacking moves can leave big marks on the whole metagame coming from its formidable stats. Taunt is extremely useful for stallbreaking and gains a handy priority, what else can we ask? If ever Politoed falls short, Rain Dance can turn the tides of a weather war and proceed to sweep itself. You’re just great Tornadus <3… It can benefit from wish passing a lot, and people would generally switch after seeing Jirachi.

    [​IMG]

    Sushi (Tentacruel) (M) @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Rain Dish
    EVs: 252 HP / 240 Def / 16 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Rapid Spin
    - Scald
    - Protect

    Spin-Burn-TSpikes… That’s it. Very defensive, I can keep it alive long enough to outlast Stealth Rockers, Scald in the rain can actually deal a big chunk to the metagame and the 30% burn is handy. Nothing to say, it is a good Pokemon with a better nickname from a better Trainer =).


    So that’s my team, hope you all enjoyed it.

    Importable (open)


    IMakeItRain! (Politoed) (F) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Surf
    - Ice Beam
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Grass]

    Sushi (Tentacruel) (M) @ Black Sludge
    Trait: Rain Dish
    EVs: 252 HP / 240 Def / 16 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Rapid Spin
    - Scald
    - Protect

    Snowball (Salamence) (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Moxie
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Naughty Nature (+Atk, -SDef)
    - Outrage
    - Dragon Claw
    - Fire Blast
    - Brick Break

    Lemon (Jirachi) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Wish
    - Stealth Rock
    - Iron Head
    - Thunder Wave

    Jolteon (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Thunder
    - Volt Switch
    - Signal Beam
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    Irene (Tornadus) (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Prankster
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 Def / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Hurricane
    - Hammer Arm
    - Rain Dance
    - Taunt



    THREAT(no S): I can get around everything but one…… PLEASE SOMEONE HELP ME KILL FERROTHORN…UGHGUHGUHGUHGUH!!!!!!!
  2. infinitetown

    infinitetown

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2012
    Messages:
    11
    Hello, i'm new to smogon too, i think i'll try to rate your team...
    anyway...
    really? i see more than just ferro:))(scarf terrakion came to mind). And ferro cannot take many hits from tornadus imo(have you ever tried spamming hurricane on it?)
    also, 252 def tornadus? i think you typed it wrong.
    i think you should add a priority attacker in your team, for example, scizor(which is a fabulous terrakion and ferrothorn check).you can look for a set on the site, cuz i'm too lazy too find and post it.(i recommend the choice band set, it is mainstream but effective)

  3. renzometal

    renzometal

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2012
    Messages:
    8
    I suggest to use expert belt over life orb on tornadus for baitkill tyranitar, also you can use protect over thunder wave on jirachi because you use also toxic spikes and this can generate a status confluct.
  4. LUST

    LUST
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Past WCoP Winneris a SPL Winner

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2011
    Messages:
    964
    Alright I took the time to fix your RMT; hopefully I got them all right, if not you can adjust them yourself. Please use the thread preview option before actually posting a new thread. If you are looking for a reliable sprite source use this. Lastly expand on your Politoed and Tentacruel, their descriptions are very minimum at the moment.
  5. Iluvkyogre

    Iluvkyogre

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2012
    Messages:
    51
    Oh... thank you mostwanted! Thank you really much for all the help =). I almost thought that my second RMT was f**ked up too. I wasn't aware of preview thread so i commit this grave error. I have the right sprites, it's because i typed this on word and i dont thiink they use the same system to recognize images
  6. Ninetale3

    Ninetale3

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2011
    Messages:
    154
    I don't see how salamence benefits from the rain. If it had hydro pump over fire blast than I could see it benefit the rain. Maybe the salamence could run a mix ddance moxie with a dragon gem in exchange for the choice scarf and outrage. It is risky but since you said it won't be coming in on steels to much, it shouldn't compromise the sweep too much. you would need to be careful of mamoswines though.
  7. Iluvkyogre

    Iluvkyogre

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2012
    Messages:
    51
    I could deal with mamo using jirachi and if i use your proposed salamence set i moght use celebi over jolteon

    Salamence is on a rain team because the pokes that supports him are supported by rain like 100% accuracy moves on jolt and tornadus. Jirachi has only one weakness and tent has rain dish so...

    My main problem is priority, i tried two scizor sets but there are simply to much checks to it and dies to quickly. I tried incorporating my own ferrothorn but it synergies poorly on a "pressure" team
  8. Ninetale3

    Ninetale3

    Joined:
    Dec 23, 2011
    Messages:
    154
    Okay here is the proposed set.

    Salamence@dragon gem
    Trait:moxie
    Nature:rash/naive
    Evs: 252 Spatk, 252 Speed, 4 hp or 4 atk
    Moves:
    Dragon dance
    Dragon claw
    Flamethrower/Fire blast
    brick break

    The set works something along these lines. Bring salamence in on a burned physical attacker or something it will scare off for a free setup turn. Once it sets up. The enemy can only watch in awe as it tears it apart. With dragon gem, dragon claw can act as a psuedo outrage with no confusion once. This can also prevent trick from ruining the sweep as well thanks to no item. Flamethrower and fire blast again power over accuracy. However, with the naive nature, fire blast is mandatory for a rain team. Brick break to round the coverage. You can also use hydro pump in exchange for brick break if you desire it to be less reliant on moxie.
  9. DoomTrain

    DoomTrain

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2011
    Messages:
    22
    You get brutally raped by Mamoswine, 5/6 pokemon in your team are weak to its STAB combination, however, you may put a Choice Scarf on Politoed to be able to revengekill him with Surf or maybe switch to a more defensive variant with Perish Song (this could be the best option as I can see a big weakness to SubDDGyarados in your team).
    You say your main problem is Ferrothorn, than why not switch Jolteon for Magnezone? You lose an Electric immunity but get many useful resistances and, over than that, a way to trap and kill those pesky Steel-types that can wall Salamence and Tornadus to no end.
    Put an Expert Belt on Tornadus and maybe get rid of the least useful between Rain Dance and Taunt for U-Turn.

    Sets:

    Politoed (F) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Hydro Pump / Surf
    - Ice Beam
    - Perish Song / Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Grass]

    or

    Politoed (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Protect
    - Toxic
    - Perish Song

    Magnezone @ Leftovers
    Trait: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 40 HP / 252 SAtk / 216 Spd --- IVs 2 Atk / 30 Def
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Charge Beam
    - Thunder
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    Tornadus (M) @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Prankster
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 Spa / 252 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Hurricane
    - Hammer Arm
    - Rain Dance / U-turn
    - Taunt / U-turn
  10. Iluvkyogre

    Iluvkyogre

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2012
    Messages:
    51
    Salamence w/ Hydro Pump is incompatible with moxie. i would try out magnezone over jolteon but i will keep the tornadus i have now, it does work. For the huge mamo problem i have a check against it, i usually let something dieee... then send in... never mind... scarf politoed scarfed would do good but wont hit as hard but oh welll...

    Originally posted by: Ninetale3
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Fat Iluvkyogre [​IMG]
    I could deal with mamo using jirachi and if i use your proposed salamence set i moght use celebi over jolteon

    Okay here is the proposed set.

    Salamence@dragon gem
    Trait:moxie
    Nature:rash/naive
    Evs: 252 Spatk, 252 Speed, 4 hp or 4 atk
    Moves:
    Dragon dance
    Dragon claw
    Flamethrower/Fire blast
    brick break/hydro pump

    The set works something along these lines. Bring salamence in on a burned physical attacker or something it will scare off for a free setup turn. Once it sets up. The enemy can only watch in awe as it tears it apart. With dragon gem, dragon claw can act as a psuedo outrage with no confusion once. This can also prevent trick from ruining the sweep as well thanks to no item. Flamethrower and fire blast again power over accuracy. However, with the naive nature, fire blast is mandatory for a rain team. Brick break to round the coverage. You can also use hydro pump in exchange for brick break if you desire it to be less reliant on moxie.

    This set looks not bad but i would rather use the standard DDmence set
    It puts more pressure

    To doomtrain: Gyarados gets raped by rocks and jolteon/magnezone
  11. DestinyUnknown

    DestinyUnknown in other words...
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2011
    Messages:
    1,448
    Hey,

    This team is pretty solid, but I have some ideas to make it slightly better. First, I don't really know why do you need Toxic Spikes on a team like this. In general, the only thing you will be doing when setting up Toxic Spikes is losing your momentum, only to get Toxic Spikes absorbed or spinned (as you lack an spinblocker). You could use a SubToxic Tentacruel set instead, as it allows you to spin more reliably when the opponent has Jellicent, and it can put pressure on defensive teams too. The Speed EVs allows you to outspeed Adamant Gyarados and Toxic it before it can set up a sub.

    Tentacruel@Leftovers | Rain Dish
    Bold Nature | 252 HP / 148 Def / 108 Spe
    Substitute / Toxic / Rapid Spin / Scald


    I think you should try a bulkier spread on Politoed, as max speed Modest doesn't outspeed too many important threats, and Politoed appreciates being bulkier when trying to win weather wars, especially if the opponent has Dugtrio. A spread of 160 HP / 252 SpA / 96 Spe should be fine (it allows you to outspeed uninvested base 80 speed pokemon). Oh, and you should use Earthquake over Brick Break on Salamence, as it hits most Steel-type pokemon harder.

    Finally, you should consider using Thunder on Jirachi (over Thunder Wave), along a Sassy nature, as it still has a high paralysis chance but it also lets Jirachi work as a Gyarados check if anything goes wrong.

    Good Luck!
  12. Iluvkyogre

    Iluvkyogre

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2012
    Messages:
    51
    Thanks DestinyUnknown, I will definitely use the proposed tentacruel set. I would keep brisck break for that fatass blissey and earthquake cant even touch skarmory. Someone already proposed me a Choice Scarf Politoed to outspeed certain pokes and i'm using it. And for the Thunder on jirachi... I would try it out
  13. ZoroDark

    ZoroDark

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2011
    Messages:
    243
    Definitely listen to DestinyUnknown, I don't see the problem you have with Ferro. Tenta can set up a sub, burn it and spin his hazards away, Tornadus 2HKO's most sets with Hurricane. I should stay with SpecsToad, but he doesn't need all the speed, it's up to you to see how much you want. SpecsToad is really needed because you have a little problem with Chansey/Blissey. Btw do you sometimes even use Signal Beam on Joltean? I suggest changing his item to Expert Belt/Wise Glasses to fake a Specs, set up a sub and Thunder everything. Good luck!
  14. Iluvkyogre

    Iluvkyogre

    Joined:
    Mar 31, 2012
    Messages:
    51
    i use signal beam for celebi and this jolteon works well
  15. Explorer

    Explorer

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2012
    Messages:
    684
    Your team is very nice, and I like the idea of a rain team being centered around ScarfMence. Perhaps to make better use of Fire Blast, you could lead with Salamence to just start destroying the opposing team, and possibly removing any of their weather starters early?

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