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Solar Force II: An Ubers Offense Team

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by mewtwo15026, Sep 15, 2012.

  1. mewtwo15026

    mewtwo15026

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2009
    Messages:
    486
    Hey, everyone! I made this team a while ago for BW1 because OU bored me, I like my legendary Pokemon, and Kyogre is freaking boring. The idea is to rack up damage on things so Reshiram and Darkrai (and even Ghostceus, surprisingly often) can sweep under sunlight.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    This team has a couple of irksome issues.

    1) I have no Spikes-immune Pokemon and no TSpikes-immune damage-dealing Pokemon.
    2) I have only three physical moves, no dedicated physical attackers, and no priority attackers.
    3) I have only one competent special wall; my team tends to play by resistances (which is an issue with weather-magnified attacks).
    4) There is no Mewtwo on this team! (There was once, though.)


    Otherwise, it’s pretty solid, and I’ve maintained a solid 1302 rating on PO. There’s always room to improve, though, and that’s why I’m here!

    [​IMG]
    Behemoth (Groudon) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drought
    EVs: 252 HP / 32 Def / 224 SDef
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    - Stealth Rock
    - Roar

    I picked this particular spread to keep Groudon alive against the wealth of special-attacking behemoths in Ubers while maintaining a little physical bulk to force out things like ExtremeKillers.



    The set is fairly straightforward; Earthquake to Earthquake, Stone Edge to kill Ho-Oh, physical Rayquaza, and things like that. Stealth Rock comes up extremely easily with this spread; I sometimes lead with Don against Kyogre, which (as they are usually Scarfed) can’t OHKO even with Water Spout. I used to run Thunder Wave to paralyze things, but as my team is fairly quick as it is, I use Roar to force out ExtremeKillers and any other greedy physical sweepers (also, screw Substitute).

    I find that this Groudon gets speed trolled by a ton of things. However, I fear for its bulk; the current spread allows Groudon to survive 2 Scarf Spacial Rends, a MixKrom Draco Meteor, and even a Scarf Seed Flare; it can also tank a +1 LO Rayquaza’s Outrage with the physical investment.

    [​IMG]
    Night Crawler (Darkrai) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Bad Dreams
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Dark Void
    - Nasty Plot
    - Dark Pulse
    - Focus Blast

    Who needs a boosting item when you’re an NP Darkrai? Seriously, considering how bulky this thing is, Focus Sash doubles its survivability. Everything else is bog standard, with investment in Sp. Def to troll Downloaders (if that ever catches on in Ubers).

    I’ll usually switch Darkrai in on a hazard layer to preserve its Sash (and usually Reshiram), then neuter something with Dark Void. (Dark Void means this thing laughs hysterically at pink blobs, as Natural Cure means whatever they switch in gets DV’d.) Then I Nasty Plot up and sweep. Not even Lugia fares well against this guy.

    Really, the only ways to stop Darkrai are with entry hazards and Thunder Wave. (Revenge killing with Arceus or Ray works too, I guess.)

    [​IMG]
    The Truth (Reshiram) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Turboblaze
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def)
    - Flame Charge
    - Blue Flare
    - Draco Meteor
    - Outrage

    Reshiram’s sheer power is what led me to build this team in the first place. If it gets a Flame Charge in, at least 1 Pokemon is going to die. Even the mighty Kyogre dies after rocks to a Flame Charge and a Meteor. Outrage helps when Reshiram is about to die, it’s debuffed itself with Draco Meteor, or it can kill something with it and I don’t want to miss. Flame Charge makes for both an epic setup move and a handy finisher.

    Honestly, Reshiram doesn’t often die to direct damage. Residual damage absolutely murders the white dragon. E-Speed trolls it, too. I wonder what the merits of White Kyurem would be over this thing…?

    [​IMG]
    Actual Size (Palkia) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Spacial Rend
    - Hydro Pump
    - Thunder
    - Fire Blast

    Scarfkia, the rapist of Kyogre! Again, this is a little-explanation-required set. Fire Blast is actually the move I use most often on this behemoth; with the pseudo-STAB from sunlight, it’s stronger than Spacial Rend (which is still a good move to spam early-game). Thunder and Hydro Pump troll rain teams. Even though I play in the sun, I still like to have an umbrella handy.

    As good as it is, the phallic destroyer falls to STDs in the form of status and residual damage. Once again, priority attacks do it no favors, either.

    [​IMG]
    Styx (Arceus-Ghost) @ Spooky Plate
    Trait: Multitype
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Judgment
    - Flamethrower
    - Recover
    - Will-O-Wisp

    MVP of the team, right here. Styx is the only reason I don’t auto-lose to ExtremeKillers and all sorts of other things. PK Mewtwo? Dies to Judgment. Latias? I win the damage race. Lugia, Giratina, Ghostceus? Judgment strikes down their stalling and spinblocking ways. Ferrothorn being a pain in the ass? Torch the mother. Any physical sweeper ever? Good luck killing before I burn you into submission…aw, hell, I missed AGAIN.

    Griping about Will-O-Wisp aside, this thing wins stall wars like nothing (I count phasing as an informal surrender). Its utility is slightly less against special sweepers like Resh and Darkrai, but I can pivot to stall them for a bit.


    [​IMG]
    Ingot (Forretress) (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Spikes
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Volt Switch
    - Rapid Spin

    What to run when you have no Spikes immunities on your team? How about Forretress, absorber of Outrages and eater of Meteors, who’s practically guaranteed to get a spin off? Meanwhile, I can stack Spikes to assist with kills or Toxic Spikes to win stall wars. Volt Switch is a move I used once upon a time in OU (before OU sucked) to scout switch-ins and escape from magnetic fiends. I don’t see Zone in Ubers ever, but Wobb is still a threat. Besides, I love bouncing out to send in Darkrai on Giratinas and Ghostceuses.


    I have two issues with Forry. First, I have a hard time deciding which type of Spikes to layer. Either I TSpikes and my sweepers die, or I Spikes and Ghostceus loses a stall war. I feel like TSpikes has more general utility, as I spend quite a bit of time stalling and pivoting. More importantly, Forretress is setup bait for, oh, I dunno, EVERYTHING.


    - - -- --- ----- -------- ------------- -------- ----- --- -- - -



    Importable (open)
    Behemoth (Groudon) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drought
    EVs: 252 HP / 32 Def / 224 SDef
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Stone Edge
    - Stealth Rock
    - Roar


    Night Crawler (Darkrai) @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Bad Dreams
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Dark Void
    - Nasty Plot
    - Dark Pulse
    - Focus Blast


    The Truth (Reshiram) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Turboblaze
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def)
    - Flame Charge
    - Blue Flare
    - Draco Meteor
    - Outrage


    Actual Size (Palkia) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Spacial Rend
    - Hydro Pump
    - Thunder
    - Fire Blast


    Styx (Arceus-Ghost) @ Spooky Plate
    Trait: Multitype
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Judgment
    - Flamethrower
    - Recover
    - Will-O-Wisp


    Ingot (Forretress) (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Spikes
    - Toxic Spikes
    - Volt Switch
    - Rapid Spin



    That's my team! Rate, test, and fix away -- but keep the names!
  2. Alfalfa

    Alfalfa Banned deucer.

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2012
    Messages:
    383
    The first thing is to fix Foretress. Go Gyro Ball > Spikes, as you stated that Toxic Spikes has more utility. Gyro Ball allows it to put the hurt on really fast Pokemon. That being said, your nature should switch from Calm to Sassy to increase the attack, and decrease the speed. Also remove all Speed IVs to boost Gyro Ball even more.

    Once you make those changes, Foretress "should" be ready to go. As for the rest of your team, I dunno. Good luck with your new Foretress.
  3. mewtwo15026

    mewtwo15026

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2009
    Messages:
    486
    @A dude: Thanks for the suggestion, but this isn't OU (thank Arceus). Name me some Pokemon commonly seen in Ubers that Forretress can reliably 2-3HKO with Gyro Ball without dying, and I'll take your suggestion.
  4. mewtwo15026

    mewtwo15026

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2009
    Messages:
    486
    Bumping. Also some notes:

    1. Gyro Ball Forretress actually (kind of) saved me from a Sub Skymin and a Ditto. There I go, knocking things about which I know little. Sorry, A dude.

    2. Testing Tailwind Ho-oh over Reshiram. 252Atk/80Def/172Spe, Adamant, Life Orb. It smashes things and is awesome. Should it run Earthquake or Roost? (I feel the former.)
  5. lousy918

    lousy918

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2012
    Messages:
    325
    A (really!) quick rate:

    You may want to try Roost > Outrage on Reshiram, since it will keep losing health from entry hazards and losing 10% just to boost your speed by a stage sucks.
  6. Specs Wynaut

    Specs Wynaut

    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2012
    Messages:
    2
    With Groudon gone and another dude asleep, the best you can do to
    Chansey is .. set up with Forretress, or set up with Darkrai.
    But Snatch is standard on Chansey and Blissey in Ubers (It's true,
    search it up!) so yeah...

    I'm not the best when it comes to editing other's teams, but I might
    recommend Scarf Zekrom to replace Palkia? I know it
    can't take a Water Spout as well, but a Bolt Strike is an easy KO and
    it gives your team something that can safely 2HKO Chansey and Blissey.
    But the disadvantages are that it shares weaknesses with Reshiram
    and Groudon..

    It's OK if you reject this, because it may seem like a stupid idea to you.
  7. GRB1

    GRB1

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2012
    Messages:
    118
    @lousy918 roost maybe but how about switching outrage with dpulse in order to abuse that sky high SpA.
  8. ntiller

    ntiller

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2012
    Messages:
    113
    Have you considered Ho-Oh over Reshiram? Ho-oh has better defenses and much more staying power, while still packing a serious threat in the form of sun-boosted sacred fire.
  9. mewtwo15026

    mewtwo15026

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2009
    Messages:
    486
    lousy918: That's not a bad suggestion, actually. I'll try Roost out on FC Resh.

    Specs_Wynaut: Zekrom's cool and everything, and I need a physical attacker, but Earthquake still tears up my team enough as it is.

    GRB1: That's not a bad idea, actually. I might go that route on Tailwind Resh or when I don't feel like using Roost.

    ntiller: I've been running a few tests with Ho-oh, and I must admit: I'm impressed. Its physical defenses are actually worse than Resh's, and it has even more of a Stealth Rock problem, but the Tailwind set I've been running destroys things swiftly and painfully.

    Thanks for the rates, guys, and keep 'em coming!
  10. gookie

    gookie Adominnustrata
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

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    Careful Groudon / Flame Charge Reshiram / Choice Scarf Palkia / Sash Darkrai / Double Hazards Forretress / Flamethrower Support Ghostceus

    Now I don't feel special using my own format anymore....

    This team is weak to, in order of importance -

    Kyogre - Choice Scarf Palkia is a pretty poor check :<, somewhat offset by the hugely offensive nature of the team but I can easily see you getting run through by well played SDef and offensive sets with Toxic Spikes support.

    Darkrai - With nothing of your own to absorb the sleep, and Palkia being incapable of OHKOing it two pokemon are likely to be crippled by a simple Focus Sash set.

    Latias - CM versions are a pain, Darkrai can sleep it but Ghost Arceus loses and Palkia can't revenge kill it.

    Palkia - Murders everything in the rain.

    Between having a great mixed wall in Ghost Arceus and Darkrai to sleep troublesome things this team isn't weak to much on paper, but considering Darkrai is a shaky check to a lot of threats, and can only sleep one Pokemon this team's defensive backbone is very flimsy indeed.

    It just so happens that Darkrai is the odd ball out, offering 0 defensive benefits and not having the right kind of team to abuse its sleep and switches.

    I recommend using a Ho-Oh over Darkrai, as it allows you to still check the majority of CM Arceus, in addition to non-Psyshock Latias.

    Ho-Oh
    Show Hide

    move 1: Sacred Fire
    move 2: Brave Bird
    move 3: Roost
    move 4: Substitute
    item: Leftovers
    ability: Regenerator
    nature: Adamant
    evs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spe


    Speed creep at your own discretion, of course.

    Palkia's inability to check Kyogre properly is a problem, compounded by its lack of power (Draco Meteor > Spacial Rend is usable, but I have a better idea). Choice Scarf Genesect, while having been whored out a lot recently, patches a lot of holes (lol) such as Darkrai and Mewtwo, while still being able to revenge kill even SD Rayquaza, a variant Palkia struggles with.

    Genesect
    Show Hide

    move 1: U-Turn
    move 2: Ice Beam
    move 3: Iron Head
    move 4: Explosion
    item: Choice Scarf
    ability: Download
    nature: Hasty
    evs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe


    Unfortunately, this leaves you very Kyogre weak, and while I understand that Reshiram is your premier sun-abuser Ho-Oh can similarly abuse the weather and provides a special tank. This leaves me to suggest an All-Out Attacker Latias, keeping up with the offensive momentum of the team.

    Latias
    Show Hide

    move 1: HP Fire
    move 2: Draco Meteor
    move 3: Grass Knot
    move 4: Recover
    item: Soul Dew
    ability: Levitate
    nature: Timid
    evs: 168 HP / 144 SpA / 196 Spe


    Outspeed chomp with a 30 spe IV, 2HKO Sp.Def Giratina-A with Draco Meteor, rest into bulk. HP Fire destroys Ferrothorn in the sun, Grass Knot hits Kyogre and Groudon equally hard, Draco Meteor destroys Palkia and Giratina-O regardless of Stealth Rock, which Dragon Pulse can fail to do.

    Good luck.
  11. mewtwo15026

    mewtwo15026

    Joined:
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    Poppy: Thanks for the rate! Everything makes sense except for the Genesect set. Why not run more special attacks? Is it outclassed?
  12. gookie

    gookie Adominnustrata
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    The physical spread is required to get OHKOes on Latias / Mewtwo / Darkrai. When fully investing in Attack it is somewhat pointless to run any special attacks except Ice Beam, even Fire Blast is of limited use since you can't really revenge kill anything with that, rather threaten Ferrothorn and Forretress which aren't huge offensive threats lol (and can switch around a lot easier than Rayquaza).
  13. lousy918

    lousy918

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2012
    Messages:
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    Well Genesect doesn't get Fire Blast.

    Also if you want a mixed set instead of the physical one you could try:

    Genesect (open)

    Genesect @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Download
    EVs: 96 Atk / 188 SAtk / 224 Spd
    Nature: Naive / Hasty
    - U-turn
    - Iron Head
    - Flamethrower
    - Ice Beam

    U-turn is for scouting and doing damage at the same time, Flamethrower for Forry, Ferro and Skarm, Ice Beam for revenge-killing all Rayquazas and Iron Head for killing Kyurem-W (OHKO after Rocks). The EVs allow you to outspeed +1 DDRay, OHKO 52 HP Latias and OHKO 112 HP Latias and 4 HP Mewtwo after Stealth Rock. The rest is poured into SAtk.


    Also you can use Gen IV's Latias:
    Latias (open)

    Latias @ Soul Dew
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 112 HP / 204 SAtk / 192 Spd
    Nature: Timid
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Calm Mind
    - Recover / Roost (No difference lol)
    - Grass Knot / Thunder / HP Fire / Psyshock / Substitute / Refresh

    The EVs allow it to outspeed Garchomp, and OHKO Palkia, the rest dumped into HP to take on Kyogre better, which cannot 2HKO with Scarf anything and cannot OHKO with Specs anything. The last move is really up to you, Grass Knot 2HKO's the big 3 weather inducers, Thunder hits Kyogre and is more reliable in rain, plus it has better coverage. Psyshock allows you to beat CMOgre easier, HP Fire for Forry, Ferrothorn and generally Steels, Substitute allows you to avoid status and set up on Ferrothorn and Forry, while Refresh allows you to absorb status, such as Gliscor.

    Also Psyshock doesn't exist in Gen IV lol. If using HP Fire, use an EV spread of 104 HP / 208 SAtk / 196 Spd, to make up for the drop in SAtk and Spd due to IVs, and also lose 1 less HP to Stealth Rock.

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