1. Welcome to the Orange Islands! Please remember to read the rules. Come chat with us on Discord and enjoy your stay!
  2. The moderators of this forum are DHR-107, Codraroll, and NoCheese.
  3. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.
  4. Click here to ensure that you never miss a new SmogonU video upload!

Some sort of Egg 'RNG' Abuse (Read the first post!)

Discussion in 'Orange Islands' started by Fennekin, Nov 1, 2013.

  1. DDKz

    DDKz

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2010
    Messages:
    2
    So when exactly are the 5 inherited IVs determined? If it's when you put the parents in the day-care, why doesn't changing the parents reset them?
  2. farranpoison

    farranpoison

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    885

    It's not exactly when you put the parents in the day-care.

    You put two in, wait until they make an egg, then reject it. Save. Then try to generate another egg. By this time, the inheritances have been generated, and thus when you hatch the next egg you can see what was being passed down, then reset to go before the egg was generated, switch the parents, and get another egg with exactly the same inheritances as before.
  3. Manitary

    Manitary

    Joined:
    Jun 29, 2012
    Messages:
    262
    I think I'm missing something...I don't see how you save time by choosing a) over b):
    a) use this method until your random parents pass down the IVs you want then use the good parents and breed the offspring you need
    b) keep hatching eggs until the good parents pass down the IVs you want
  4. farranpoison

    farranpoison

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2011
    Messages:
    885
    You save time only if the first few inheritances could benefit two pokemon parents you already have. Otherwise, it's better to just do it the old fashioned way. Basically, the method helps people who have lots of viable parent pokemon.

    Edit: I have another question. What happens in the case of Ditto+Ungendered mon like Klink?
    Last edited: Nov 1, 2013
  5. thelaytonmobile

    thelaytonmobile

    Joined:
    Jan 26, 2010
    Messages:
    349
    Thank you farran, I understood the method of this, but not why anyone would do it. Now you summed it up perfectly - you choose the parents based on the stat spread.

    Fortunately, the Friend Safari and the fact that certain Pokemon have 3ivs make this quite useful! I may use this if I can get over my aversion to rejecting eggs...
    T.U.C. likes this.
  6. Kadabrium

    Kadabrium

    Joined:
    Jan 13, 2013
    Messages:
    644
    am I understanding this correctly or

    1.make sure the previous pair in the daycare has produced more than 1 egg, in order for the rng to refresh.
    2.put in a new pair that have no same iv in the same stat, save.
    3.get the first egg and determine which ivs are inherited from which parent.
    4.reset and find a new pair where each has ivs in the stats that was found inherited.
    5.the first egg will now have perfect ivs.

    It's nevertheless quite difficult to find suitable parents (unless you have a lot of wild ditto, maybe), since when in normal breeding you can't inherit one stat's iv from another stat and you'll have been getting eggs that all have ivs in the same stat.
  7. KabutoeX

    KabutoeX

    Joined:
    Oct 26, 2013
    Messages:
    1
    What happens in the case of Ditto+Ungendered mon like Klink?

    i'd like to know that very much too!
  8. x42bn6

    x42bn6

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2011
    Messages:
    38
    T.U.C. likes this.
  9. Sprocket

    Sprocket P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,735
    This doesn't really save all that much time from normal. You still need to produce eggs, you still need to bike around until they hatch, and you still need to check their IVs. Just instead of 4-5 eggs at a time, its 1 egg at a time.
  10. ApathyandToast

    ApathyandToast

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2013
    Messages:
    180
    God forbid you still need to produce eggs and cycle around. This benefits people who have already been breeding and have a large pool of parents to choose from.

    I'm not sure how this interacts with a Ditto parent, but as Dittos are so flexible, it would really speed up the initial process of generating tri-flawless parents using Ditto.

    So am I right in saying that I should find something like two Magikarp with vastly varying IVs between them to use as 'inheritance scouts' due to their fast hatch rate?
    Mario With Lasers likes this.
  11. Hamstern

    Hamstern

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2007
    Messages:
    4,011
    Is the gender, ability (don't matter if you use everstone) and ability locked when using this method? If so, I assuming the gender might chance if you using another specie with different gender ratio?
  12. sunshinesan

    sunshinesan

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2009
    Messages:
    64
    Can someone explain why a first egg must be rejected before saving? Can't you just save, then generate an egg, hatch it, look at its iv's then reset/keep accordingly? Notice in my example, no initial egg had to be discarded.
  13. iruchii

    iruchii

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2007
    Messages:
    674
    Tested this just for you. Ditto assumes the father role, an the Ungendered mon is interpreted as female.

    Because then you couldn't change the parents. If you save before getting the first egg, the inheritances will keep being randomized every time you change parents. If you reject the first egg and then save, you can then make use of this method. I know that's not a good "explanation" of the facts, but it's how RNG works I guess.

    Yes, your best friends in this method are high level, 0 EVs Magikarps whom you can easily identify the IVs.

    Ability seems to be locked, I'm not sure about gender. (I'll have to revise my notes when I get home, but I believe gender is locked too)
  14. Diancie

    Diancie

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2013
    Messages:
    15
    So can this work for shiny Pokemon? I really hope it does! :)
  15. ApathyandToast

    ApathyandToast

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2013
    Messages:
    180
    But you have to change the parents after you find out which IVs are being passed down?
  16. iruchii

    iruchii

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2007
    Messages:
    674
    You don't have to, but it's the main advantage of this method. Surely you can keep the same parents, but then you're better off just accepting every single egg and hatching them the usual way if those are the Pokémon you want to breed. The main usefulness of this method is, for example, breeding two shitty IVs Magikarp, knowing which IVs the father and mother will pass down, then change the Magikarps to two Pokémon you want to breed with the corresponding IVs, meaning you'll get a good offspring right away. This is extremely time saving for anyone who has lots of different 3 IV combination Dittos, you see.
  17. ApathyandToast

    ApathyandToast

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2013
    Messages:
    180
    Yes I know that. Read the post I quoted.
  18. iruchii

    iruchii

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2007
    Messages:
    674
    I answered you in the first sentence of my last post: you don't have to change the parents. The rest was just rambling. Maybe I'm misunderstanding what you mean.
  19. ApathyandToast

    ApathyandToast

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2013
    Messages:
    180
    Yes you are. I know perfectly well you don't have to change the parents. Read the post I quoted and the posts before for context.
  20. Diancie

    Diancie

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2013
    Messages:
    15
    Can someone answer this please?
  21. iruchii

    iruchii

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2007
    Messages:
    674
    Okay, so let's see if I understand your question now: if you don't reject the first egg, then the inheritance will keep being randomized instead of locked when you change the parents. If you change the parents after rejecting the first egg and saving, you're keeping the inheritance RNG. Does that answer it?

    It's not know yet because no one has had the luck to get a shiny this way, but because we believed the PID remains the same, then yes, you'd be able to get any shiny of your choice this way if you have such luck.
  22. ApathyandToast

    ApathyandToast

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2013
    Messages:
    180
    Yes, it just makes little sense which is why I was asking.
  23. iruchii

    iruchii

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2007
    Messages:
    674
    Yeah, I know what you mean, but that's how RNG works. Gen 4 RNG made even less sense, at least this is quite simple. Sorry I can't provide the specific reasons, so please just take things as-is for now. ): I also wish I could know why it behaves like that.

    Regardless, I have some new information in regards to testing:
    So far, in all my experiments (six different Pokémon combinations), all have kept their Ability slot and gender. Which is actually pretty huge, considering you can now RNG for a female or male specific Pokémon you want. But even huger is the Ability slot -- if my assumptions are correct, it's possible to get any Hidden Ability on any Pokémon through this method. I'll be testing this right away and report my results.
  24. OmegaForte

    OmegaForte

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Messages:
    810
    Amazing. This should help me a lot with breeding Honedge, as getting one of the patent with at least 1 perfect IV is hard enough.
  25. iruchii

    iruchii

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2007
    Messages:
    674
    Hmm... I tried to get a HA Skrelp by RNGing a Hustle Nidoran (female) and, while the IVs passed down as expected, the Skrelp hatched male and with Poison Point (his ability in slot 1), so I think neither gender or ability are locked with this method. Will keep experimenting more.
    Mario With Lasers likes this.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)