1. Welcome to the Orange Islands! Please remember to read the rules. Come chat with us on our IRC channel and enjoy your stay!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.
  3. Click here to ensure that you never miss a new SmogonU video upload!

Some sort of Egg 'RNG' Abuse (Read the first post!)

Discussion in 'Orange Islands' started by Fennekin, Nov 1, 2013.

  1. Larkas

    Larkas

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2011
    Messages:
    39
    Hmmmm, very interesting... A couple of questions, since I'm away from my game and will be for some time:

    1) How does this interact with items that force an IV to be inherited? Say you got a male 31/31/31/x/x/x and a female x/x/x/x/31/31. You go through with the method and come out with a 31/31/31/x/31/x baby. If you equip the fmeale with Power Anklet, can you force the baby to go 31/31/31/x/31/31?

    2) Does this method set the nature in stone if not using an everstone? What if you use it for the "dummy" pair but not the intended pair?

    3) Reading previous posts, it seems that the non-inherited stat always has a random value. If you come out with a desired 5IV spread, can you keep soft-resetting to get a perfect 6IV spread?

    I had another question, but forgot it while I was writing this. :P I'll post it later if I remember it.
  2. Dane

    Dane

    Joined:
    Feb 20, 2006
    Messages:
    941
    It's not guaranteed, no. I was trying it last night with a perfect father and random mothers, changing up the power item on the father. By changing it (mother had destiny knot), one of the other IVs he had been passing down got removed from his pass-down list.

    Of course, this was with him already having one power item equipped prior to checking IVs. I'm not sure how it'd work if he wasn't holding one and then you equipped it.
  3. Eijiken

    Eijiken

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Messages:
    24
    So digging deeper,

    That randomized stat, is it randomly chose and set when the egg is rejected or upon recieving/egg is produced?

    Reason being, that if the inherited IVs are picked when the egg is rejected (which seems to be the case) and the random stat is rolled at a different point or separately, then....breeding 6 IV babies could be dropped down to a 1/32 chance it seems.

    EDIT: seems i'm not the only one who wants to know this, but If you saved at the right time, you could reset, take a small amount of steps and get the egg that way?
  4. Agonist

    Agonist The day the world went away
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    4,644
    It's set at the same time the IVs that are inherited is decided.
  5. DarkLynx

    DarkLynx

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2009
    Messages:
    737
    I'm using a Vivillon with Compound Eyes and a Ditto as the 'spread test group'. I got a Father/Mother/Mother/Random/Mother/Mother spread and swapped to a Gale Wings Talonflame, the offspring was a Fletchling with Gale Winds, so the abilities really aren't locked.
  6. nimbosa

    nimbosa

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2013
    Messages:
    187
    maybe the inheritence isn't gender-dependent at all, but PID-dependent? it would explain the gender correlation with pokemon that have the same gender ratio and the odd results with different gender ratios and genderless mons.
  7. Eijiken

    Eijiken

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Messages:
    24
    so then the best bet to get a 6 IV baby would be to save BEFORE you reject the egg, then go through if the process, pending that the randomized stat roll is determined after.
  8. zukirin

    zukirin

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2007
    Messages:
    1,203
    I read that if Ditto is bred with a Male, Ditto assumes the female role. So if it breeds with a female, it assumes the male role? Just wanted to make sure because I tried it out yesterday with a female pokemon + ditto and it looked like it was not working.

    EDIT:
    It was kangaskan but I just read about the issue someone else had wherein it may have to do with the 100% female ratio thing so that may be a thing.
  9. goomy pls

    goomy pls

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2013
    Messages:
    279
    That would completely defeat the point of doing this. If you do that, and run into a favourable spread, you will be unable to reset and still have that spread.
  10. Eijiken

    Eijiken

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Messages:
    24
    well if you're going for a 6 iv that is, then you'd go for that way. I feel like the current method benefits 5 IV spreads.
  11. Agonist

    Agonist The day the world went away
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    4,644
    If you;re going for hex 31, then reset until you find one that gives the 6th stat a 31, then get your egg.
  12. goomy pls

    goomy pls

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2013
    Messages:
    279
    Saving before you reject the egg means that you have a different result generated each time. If you want that, you might as well just do 5 eggs at a time the normal way, much faster.

    Unless I'm missing something here and that saving before rejecting the egg keeps the same RNG results.
  13. Eijiken

    Eijiken

    Joined:
    May 9, 2010
    Messages:
    24
    It does as far as I've tested, but the question is, (which I haven't tested) does it randomize the 6th stat when you do it that way?
  14. VCrowe

    VCrowe

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2013
    Messages:
    504
    To me, it just seems like this method isn't saving us anymore time. All it's really done has increased our understanding of IV inheritance this Gen, and I guess that this could be the gateway to cracking the RNG this Gen, but ultimately I won't be using this method because it doesn't save enough time to warrant doing so.
    ryan likes this.
  15. blasphemy1

    blasphemy1

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2007
    Messages:
    3,736
    It saves a lot of time if you have decent - perfect parents (easy to come by with the Friend Safari). There's no guesswork once you find the inheritance pattern. Even with some of the garbage results (i.e. randomized IV is HP) I can still breed a 4 IV Pokemon and then finish it off with this process. I must say that PokeMiles make this much easier: Rare Candies are a must to know the exact IVs (avoids ambiguity of the judge).

    By the way, I don't think the game retains its RNG roll if you save BEFORE rejecting the egg. I've tried it multiple times and received inconsistent results (any error at all shows this isn't the proper way to proceed).
  16. VCrowe

    VCrowe

    Joined:
    Aug 30, 2013
    Messages:
    504
    I understand how it CAN save time, but when you already have a box of male pokes in every egg-group with four to five 31's, then you might as well just breed the old fashioned way since its just a matter of swapping the female parent once or twice before reaching the 1/10 chance of hatching perfect 'mons.

    Yes, but then you lose out on spitbacks to trade for others spitbacks. I guess to me, it's just less fun this way, and so it's just a matter of preference. Anyway, I feel that this is slightly off topic so I'll leave you guys to discuss things. Have a good day everyone.
    Last edited: Nov 4, 2013
    Derpylink and Sprocket like this.
  17. blasphemy1

    blasphemy1

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2007
    Messages:
    3,736
    I disagree, mainly due to the additional time of hatching + releasing unwanted Pokemon. This method is convenient, reliable, and in almost all situations faster than traditional breeding.
  18. Agonist

    Agonist The day the world went away
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    May 22, 2010
    Messages:
    4,644
    ^ this.
  19. Sprocket

    Sprocket P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,735
    Having done a few rounds of this, I can confirm it works as described.

    Still I stand by my original statement that there isn't much value in doing this (in terms of real life time saved), other than not having to deal with a bunch of spit-back eggs (which you can Wonder Trade away, something you want to do for PokeMiles). This could be useful for certain harder-to-breed Pokemon like Togekiss and Lucario, so its useful as a supplemental tool of sorts.
    VCrowe likes this.
  20. Phadunk

    Phadunk

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2007
    Messages:
    3,557
    This is at least better than having a quad and tri perfect IV spread parents and constantly getting junk. Pinpointing and at least progressing in the road to 6-flawless is a bit easier.
    Mario With Lasers likes this.
  21. Shinryu

    Shinryu

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2006
    Messages:
    4,666
    You know you can also drop by the battle institute and start a single battle, it doesn't make you save and you can check the stats at Lv 50, which almost always narrows it down to within 2 IVs. Then just reset if you don't like.

    Assuming you're like me, and don't have high IV breeding parent mons to start with, you'll still have a few spitbacks trying to find the right IV parents so you can get a given inheritance spread to work (unless you keep resetting till you find the exact one that works for 2 specific parents without perfect IVs, which is just as time consuming). Think I had several 3 and 4 IV Heracross before I finally got a right combo for quint flawless since the game hates me.
  22. graymonkey0

    graymonkey0

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2010
    Messages:
    221
    So is this how I would like to start breeding a Goodra?

    1. Catch Sliggoo and Ditto in the friend safari
    2. Find out what stats will be passed down and put in the respective Pokemon that will best fit that bill.
    3. Get a bunch of these and then repeat the method with two quad-flawless Goomies with the desired nature and such.

    Is it that simple or am I missing something?
  23. Sprocket

    Sprocket P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,735
    It works best when you have a large pool of potential parents to work with, so yeah this sounds about right.
  24. Aura Creeper

    Aura Creeper

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2013
    Messages:
    5
    So, with the Destiny Knot, it takes IVs of either parent and gives it to the baby, or combine from both parents? I keep reading different things.
  25. Sprocket

    Sprocket P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    1,735
    It takes 5 different IVs from both parents. for example you could get HP, Speed from the father and Attack, Defense, Special Defense from the mother, leaving Special Attack uninherited.
    Aura Creeper likes this.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 1)